The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Home / History  % width posts: 339

Communism fell 20 years ago, Poland led the fight since WW2


Paulina 17 | 4,469
5 Jun 2023 #271
The help provided to Ukraine is under PiS's leadership.

The state help that came later - yes, but all other help has been done by local authorities (like Warsaw authorities, for example - the effort led by Trzaskowski) and ordinary Poles. It was the ordinary Poles who were helping the Ukrainian refugees from the start - by taking them into their homes (my relatives did that too), by volunteering at the border, at temporary reception centres, at train stations, by transporting refugees to different locations in Poland (without any help from the government). I'm not even mentioning all the donations and transporting humanitarian help by ordinary people into Ukraine.

This march organised by Tusk sends the message to Ukraine that Poland are more interested in squabbling amongst themselves

This "squabbling" is called democracy. And it isn't any message for Ukraine - it's a message for PiS government :)

it makes him look like he lives in la la land

No, Luke, it's you who's clearly living in La La Land :))) I see that you live in the UK. Why don't you come to Poland and talk to Ukrainian refugees who got help from Poles? You could also ask them then if Tusk or other Poles are "completely unaware of seismic events happening across the border." ;D I would really like to see their reaction, because you honestly have no idea what you're talking about ;D
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #272
No need for personal attacks, I'm just telling you how I perceived the march at the weekend, I thought it was embarrassing for Poland.

And its great that Poland took in refugees, but you are talking as if Poland already did everything and can now feel proud. The war is still raging, soldiers are still dying and Poles are marching through the streets completely oblivious.
Lenka 5 | 3,532
5 Jun 2023 #273
Poles are marching through the streets completely oblivious.

Wtf? You know that being against PiS and being against war in Ukraine does not exclude each other?

Should Poland have no other political matters beside the war? That would be stupid, short-sighted and suicidal
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #274
Poles who were helping the Ukrainian refugees from the start

Helping refugees is not the same as helping Ukraine because removing women and kids allows Russia to bomb the hell out of Ukraine without that unpleasant feeling - Russians are humans, too - that they are baby killers. Without women and kids around, their husbands and fathers die in mind-boggling numbers.

Bottom line: By taking in the refugees, Poland prolonged the war.

"Good" people like you can be evil. We call it "unintended consequences"

The war is still raging, soldiers are still dying and Poles are marching through the streets completely oblivious.

Because Western "democracies" with the US scum in the lead and the Brits right behind are doing everything they can to keep it going.

Why did you cancel the meeting in April 2022?
jon357 74 | 22,480
5 Jun 2023 #275
, I thought it was embarrassing for Poland.

A pro-democracy rally? It was extremely positive; this shows that people care enough about the rule of law and a transparent and progressive civil society that they'll come out and defend it.

Name three things you are doing to "support" Ukraine.

You'll never know.
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #276
You'll never know.

Because you don't.
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #277
I think the war is by far and away the biggest political factor facing Poland, do you disagree with this? Tusk clearly does.

Imagine a Ukranian soldier seeing that march, they would think the world has forgotten about them, and the reason they would think that is because every single person on that march yesterday has!
Paulina 17 | 4,469
5 Jun 2023 #278
@Luke1410, how am I "personally attacking" you? :) By stating that you have no idea what you're talking about? That you're the one who's living in La La Land and not Tusk, as you claim? :)

Sorry, but that's the truth - you have no idea what you're talking about.

I'm just telling you how I perceived the march at the weekend

And I'm telling you how I perceive your comments. This is a public forum and you should realise that someone may disagree with your perception... coming all the way from the UK.

I thought it was embarrassing for Poland.

Then you're terribly wrong! Quite the contrary - this march has shown to everyone that Poles care about democracy in their country. This is really strange that you have a problem with that.

The war is still raging, soldiers are still dying and Poles are marching through the streets completely oblivious.

You must be either very ignorant or there's something seriously wrong with you if you really believe that. Poles, just like other neighbours of Ukraine and RuSSia, are defenitely very far from "oblivious" about what's going on in Ukraine. I'd say that we care about it much more than people in the West, including in the UK.

Btw, how is Boris Johnson doing? No longer the prime minister of the UK? But he was helping Ukraine so much... How "embarrassing" ;D
jon357 74 | 22,480
5 Jun 2023 #279
I think the war is by far and away the biggest political factor facing Poland

It's facing the world however as you very well know, it isn't a bipartisan issue in Poland.

Tusk

Premier Tusk? You're getting truly silly now. He's the pre-eminent international figure in Polish politics, the second most famous living apple, and someone who has always shown deep care for his country. He may well serve a term as President however Rafał Trzaskowski swill of course come next.

Because you don't

MYOB.
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #280
But he was helping Ukraine so much...

Like a referee who does not stop an uneven fight, Western warmongers will be judged harshly for pouring gasoline over the war Ukraine has zero chance of winning.

MYOB.

Translation: You did nothing.
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #281
Apologies for addressing your dear leader as just Tusk, I will refer to him as Premier Tusk from now on, apologies.

And I think it is more of an issue for Poland compared to other countries given how close it is.
jon357 74 | 22,480
5 Jun 2023 #282
your dear leader

Apology accepted however he's certainly been Poland's leader and may well be again. The 'dear leader' epithet suits Kaczynski (either) far better since their contempt for democracy and general narrow-mindedness is very well known.

And I think it is more of an issue for Poland

One that people are handling well and one which leaves room for plenty of other activities, shopping, cooking, attending churches or other places of worship, playing sport, vacations with sun, sand and sea, going to the theatre or cinema and yes, political campaigning too.

Translation: You did nothing

Translation: Mind your own business and take a hike, nomenklatura reject.
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #283
''this march has shown to everyone that Poles care about democracy in their country. This is really strange that you have a problem with that.''

I think this is quite revealing, you believe that you can control how your message is perceived by others. To me the march showed that Poles and 'Premier Tusk' have their heads in the sand with regards to Ukraine, and if it appears that way to me it wil appear that way to others aswell.
Paulina 17 | 4,469
5 Jun 2023 #284
@Luke1410, why aren't you complaining that the PiS government didn't organise such "solidarity with Ukraine march" if you think this would be so much more important than all the help that Ukraine and Ukrainians got and are still getting from Poland? :)))

I think the war is by far and away the biggest political factor facing Poland, do you disagree with this? Tusk clearly does.

Really? When did Tusk say that? Btw, there are also other important issues facing Poland - like PiS trying to dismantle democracy in Poland bit by bit, high inflation, etc. Helping Ukraine is already being taken care of, there is a wide consensus across the political scene in Poland about helping Ukraine, so there's no need for organising marches.

And I think it is more of an issue for Poland compared to other countries given how close it is.

Gee, really? You think? o_O 🤦 😂

Luke1410, who on Earth are you?? Are you a Brit or a Pole? It an Alien? ;D 👽
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #285
I'm just telling you this so you can help Premier Tusk with his PR. Take it or leave it.
jon357 74 | 22,480
5 Jun 2023 #286
I'm sure people can make up their mind about Poland's commitment to PL as well as the impressive Polish pro-democracy rally.

Of course what you pretend to 'find revealing' is neither here nor there. Have you seen any outside commentators suggesting that the rally detracts from support for the struggle against reactionary authoritarianism in r*SSia?
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #287
I don't rely on commentators to make my mind up about things, I stopped listening to them when they all started saying the same thing.
Paulina 17 | 4,469
5 Jun 2023 #288
if it appears that way to me it wil appear that way to others aswell.

No, Luke, the world doesn't revolve around you and everyone doesn't necessarily think the way you do and perceive things the way you do ;D

I'm just telling you this so you can help Premier Tusk with his PR.

Cool story bro ;D ;D

I don't rely on commentators to make my mind up about things.

But didn't it cross your mind that you may be wrong about something? :)))
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #289
I'm more than happy to be proved wrong about things, like I said I'm just telling you how I perceived it, I'm not saying my way of perceiving it is right. It is a warning to our dear leader Premier Tusk and his magnificent sidekick (can't spell his name).
jon357 74 | 22,480
5 Jun 2023 #290
I don't rely on commentators to make my mind up about things

So that's a no then.

Feel free to make your own mind up; others may agree or disagree with you. The crowds of thousands at the Polish pro-democracy rally evidently have made their own minds up too about how they choose to spend a day.
Paulina 17 | 4,469
5 Jun 2023 #291
I'm not saying my way of perceiving it is right.

But you wrote: "if it appears that way to me it wil appear that way to others aswell", which is an arrogant bullsh1t.

It is a warning to our dear leader Premier Tusk and his magnificent sidekick (can't spell his name).

I really doubt it's any warning and that you care about Tusk's "PR". I think you're simply attacking Tusk (and Poles), because you're either a PiS supporter or an anti-Polish troll.
Lenka 5 | 3,532
5 Jun 2023 #292
I must say I thing this antagonism : this march OR march for Ukraine baffling.

If the march was pro Russian or against a war in let's say Sudan that would make sense. But here?

Is Poland really supposedto act as there are no other issues?
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #293
Marches are nothing but feel-good crap for the benefit of the marching mob. No, those dead Ukrainians are not less dead because some Polish idiots went for a walk.

If anything, marches in support prolong wars. When people marched against it, Vietnam bs came to an end.
Lenka 5 | 3,532
5 Jun 2023 #294
It's lucky the march wasn't about a war then wasn't it?
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #295
That does not make my post any less valid.
Lenka 5 | 3,532
5 Jun 2023 #296
Yes, but random and pointless.
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #297
why aren't you complaining that the PiS government didn't organise such "solidarity with Ukraine march...

No, dear Lenka. Your buddy mentioned the subject first. This gives me the right to comment on what was posted and survived the mods.
Luke1410 - | 167
5 Jun 2023 #298
I'm a PiS supporter but also think it's healthy to have a strong opposition, so would prefer if Premier Tusk would act a bit more responsibly, given the critical time.

If I'm a Russian supporter seeing this march, it would give me heart seeing that Ukraine's main ally is divided.

Arrogant bs to assume that others might think the same?? I'm not saying everybody will think the same, but surely there will be a least a few others? I'm not such a unique thinker.
Lenka 5 | 3,532
5 Jun 2023 #299
Premier [quote=Luke1410]Premier Tusk would act a bit more responsibly, given the critical time.

In my opinion it's very responsible to take care of basic democratic systems.

would give me heart seeing that Ukraine's main ally is divided

There is no divisionwhen it comes to support for Ukraine so why would you rejoice?
Novichok 4 | 8,272
5 Jun 2023 #300
take care of basic democratic systems.

In the UK, you have as much control of your ruling class as Ivan had over his in the USSR.


Home / History / Communism fell 20 years ago, Poland led the fight since WW2