Life / NANNY STATE in POLANd vs RABBLE? [25]

The Nanny State, Polish or otherwise, can be oppressive, but its justification is grass-roots misconduct. Most laws could be done away with if more people acted decently, didn't look for loopholes and bend or break the law. But many people break or bend the law with few moral qualms, eg tax regulations, becuase they feel their tax money is basically bankrolling selfish, corrupt, nepotistic and high-living politicians. And since, as the Poles say, 'przykład idzie z góry' (the example flows down from above), politcians are not generally perceived as the epitome of morality and decency......

Language / THE -A or -U ENDING IN MASC. NOUNS DEFINED [7]

This more than 400-page book is the definitive study on where the -a or -u are used in the gen. sing of masculine nouns. I recall that Westfal had created myriad categories, some containing only 3-4 examples, such as one that said something like (I'm recreating from memory) the -a ending is used in relation to 17th-century Austrian coins....

The book is still available:
A Study in Polish Morphology. The genetive singular masculine. (Hardcover)
by Stanislaw. WESTFAL (Author)
Available from these sellers.
1 used from £30.00 1 collectible from £37.50
Product details:
Hardcover: 418 pages
Publisher: Mouton; First Edition edition (1 Jan 1956)
ASIN: B001CZKQHY

Food / POLISH HANGOVER PREVENTIVE? [7]

There are countless Polish hangover remedies as shown on this forum, but has anyone heard of a hangover preventive? My late uncle told me that in his area (Lublin voivodship) it was common for some of the menfolk to drink a glass of melted lard, rendered fatback (słonina), butter or oil before going to a wedding. Supposedly one could then drink all night without few ill after-effects. Of course, you'd need a cast-iron gall bladder to survive the cure. It would probably only clean out the uninitiated.

Life / DECENCY RATINGS FOR THE INTERNET? Would it work in Poland? [17]

In an interview in the Daily Telegraph British Culture Secretary Andy Burnham said he wanted a rating system for the Inernet like that applied to films (age of persmissibility). He said he was working with Obama to create higher decency standards to protect children against harmful content. The copy-cat Poles would probably introduce something of this sort only if some foreigners did so first. Little original initiative or innovative thinking along the Vistula? Any comment?

News / ENGLISH STILL PROFITABLE IN POLAND? [78]

In the early 1990s knwoign english or, betetr yet, beign a antvei sopeaker was a huge asset. Teaching English was a goldmine, and it was said that up to 10,000 native speakers of English had come to Warsaw alone. Obviously far more Poles know English at present and some of the novelty may have worn off, but can English still be a good livelihood in Poland? Would that be in teaching in schools or private courses, home tutoring or work in banks and other businesses? If someone is out of work in Leeds or Wilmington (Delaware), would you advise them to come to Poland based only on their native-speakership?

Food / ALMOST FREE BIGOS AND PASZTET? [2]

Obviously this will not work in a bachelor flat whose occupant mainly eats out or occasionally sends away for a pizza. But in Polish-American homes where leftovers are common, this is a good way to prepare a traditional bigos or pasztet at very low cost. Freeze solid-meat leftovers in a container labelled "4 bigos": cooked pork, veal, beef, poultry, game, kiełbasa, ham, smoked pork trotters, even frankfurters, etc. The one labelled "4 pasztet" would probably exclude* the sausage and smoked meat. When container is full, you'll need little more than the fairly inexpensive sauerkraut and cabbage for the bigos and some fresh liver for the pasztet.

* If your adventurous, why not try making pasztet also containing the sausage and/or other smoked meat. Maybe you'll come up with something new and nice?!

Life / DOES MUSIC SOOTH POLES' MORES? [2]

In Polish there is a saying "Muzyka łagodzi obyczaje" (music soothes/softens mores). In English it is said that "Music sooths the savage beast". But in Poland after leaving discos young people have been known to demolish cemeteries and engage in other vandalism, stab fellow-revellers and engage in other such highly unsoothing activity. You rarely see this amongst those leaving the philharmonic, a Mazowsze concert or church, where music is also played.

The question arises which of the following alternatives is true: is the saying alleging that music sooths mores false, or is rap-crap, rock-shlock, techno-crud, disco-porno and heavy muddle NOT REALLY MUSIC?

News / POLISH TV CHEF MACIEJ KUROŃ DEAD AT 48 [7]

Polish TV chef Maciej Kuroń has died at age 48. He was the son of the famous Polish dissident Jacek Kuroń, founder in the 1970s of the KOR (Workers Defence Committee) dissident group. The cause of death of the quite overweight Maciej was not initally announced.

UK, Ireland / POLES SUPERIOR TO BRITS? [260]

Cognisant of the fact that the English, Scots, Welsh and Irish are separate nations, both Poles and Brits of the above ethnic groups as well as observers of other nationaltiies can often be heard saying things like:

-- Polish women make better wives and mothers, are better cooks and homemakers in general;
-- Poles attach greater importance to the family which in surveys far outstrips careers, money, travel, etc. in terms of importance;
-- Polish food is far superior to the cotton-fluff stuff (white bread), bangers and other chemically treated substances which pass for food in the Isles;

-- Poles attach greater imporatnce to time-honoured traditions such as Wigilia;
-- Poles are far less mean and penny-pinching and more hospitable in line with the saying: "Gość w dom, Bóg w dom" -- when a guest enters the home, God enters the home;

-- Contrary to the colonial tradition of suibjugating nations regarded as inferior, Poles have always adhered to the maxim: "For your freedom and ours", -- the belief that a fight for freedom anywhere in the world is a struggle for a free Poland;

-- Unlike the bloody religious anonimosities between Catholics, Anglicans and Puritans (including quite recent Protestant-Catholic tension in Ulster), Poland has traditonally been a haven for dissenters, accounting for the large number of Jews who fled England and other countries of the "enligthened" West to settle in Poland;

-- By and large Poles in the Isles do not dance naked on pub tabletops, vomit on other customers, urinate on the walls of defecate in corners.....

Language / BERLiTZ -- QUICKEST WAY TO LEARN POLISH (SWAHILI, ARABIC, FRENCH, etc.) [3]

The quickest way to learn to speak Polish or any other language is through the total-immersion method as pursued by Berlitz and other schools using similar appoaches. It means 6-8 hours of exposure a day for a minimum of two weeks (two months is even better). There, at lunchtime you don't even get the salt unless you ask for it in Polish, and the question "Where's the nearest loo" will draw only a blank stare from teachers and management.

The downside: the cost and daily time budget which not everyone can afford.

Genealogy / PROBABLE ORIGIN OF: ADRIAŃSKI, SERWIN, BETLEJ, KULESZA [3]

Likely derivation: Adrian's son or the bloke from Adrian (Mazurian Lake District). Adryański would be an older (19th-century) spelling.

The ser (cheese) etymology does not seem too plausible. Probably it emerged as the Masurianised (sz pronounced as s) version of the Jewish name Sherwin.

Betlej from Bethlehem (in Polish: Betlejem). In Śląsk (Silesia), a Christmas crib is known as a betlejka.
Gębus from gęba (pejorative for mouth = mug, trap, yap) or toponym: Gębiny et al.

Zawitkowski from zawitka (bundle or unwed mother) or toponyms Zawitkowo, Zawitków; Kulesza from mush (cooked water and flour dish eaten by the poor); Karczewski toponym Karczew.

For more information on the above surnames please contact: research60@gmail

Moderator comment: Please, answer topics within the given thread.

UK, Ireland / ARE SCOTS INTOLERANT RELIGIOUS FANATICS? [5]

Dunno if this is true, but I have heard that Boruc triggered roars of disapproval and indigantion, almost sparking off a minor riot, when he made the sign of the cross before or during a match in Scotland. Many spotsmen world-wide do so and nobody makes a fuss. What's with this?

Life / POLISH "WIGLIA" -- NOT JUST ANOTHER BOOZE-UP [12]

Non-Poles who have experienced a Wigilia with a tradition-minded Polish family are usually amazed, surprised or even moved, since they rarely have anything in their own realm of celebration that even comes close in terms of symbolism. To many outsiders the 24th is only the day before Christmas. To Poles and Polonians, Wigilia IS the main event! Almost everything about Wigilia is different, special, unique and unlike any other Polish celebration. Some examples:

–emergency workers (police, fire brigade, power station, hospital employees) willing work on the 25th or 26th Dec. if only they can get off on Wigilia and be with their nearest of kin;

-- family members have made a clean breast of things at confession and are all scrubbed and dressed in their holiday best;
-- the celebration does not begin until the evening's first star appears in the sky;
-- there is hay beneath the pure-white table cloth and an extra place setting for Baby Jesus, a recently deceased family member or a road-weary traveller who might happen by;

-- the meal begins with grace before meals and the sharing of opłatek (Christmas wafer) accompanied by an exchange of best wishes, forgiveness for past wrongs and tender embraces- a moving, nostalgic moment in many families who recall late-lamented family members and the Wigilias of their youth;

-- the meal comprises 12 or an odd number of meatless dishes dominated by fish, mushrooms, sauerkraut, pierogi and other farinaceous things, compote, poppyseeds honey, gingerbread, etc. many dishes served only on this one night a year;

-- although Poles are known for their fondness for tipples, this is one festive meal at which alcoholic drinks are absent or used only in great moderation, the occasion regarded as too solemn for any serious libation;

-- Wigilia lore includes such now largely tongue-in-cheek beliefs as: if the first non-family member to enter the house on Christmas Eve is a male, that brings good luck. Also, how you are on Christmas Eve you will be the whole year (a child that has to be spanked, well.....)

-- the evening includes singing kolędy (carols), exchanging gifts and Shepherds' Mass at midnight.
Naturally, not every Polish household observes all the points of celebration, but according to surveys 95% of Polish families have preserved the Wigilia tradition as such and regard it as the highpoint of teh Yule season.

Language / SZCZ and ŚĆ HARD TO EXPLAIN [19]

Many English speakers cannot hear the differences between the harder szcz and the softer (palatalised) ść. In the English of many Americans (esp. midwesterners) the ś and ć sound close or even identical to teh sh in ship or ch in chap. On the US east coast and in British English those words are often pronounced to sound closer to Polish sz and cz respectively.

Anyone know a sure-fire way to explain the difference between szcz and ść?

Food / A HANDFUL OF EASY WIGILIA DISHES [3]

CHRISTMAS EVE CLEAR BEETROOT SOUP
1 kg beetroot
3 bay leaves
6 grains allspice
pinch salt
vinegar or citrc acid
Slice beetroot into strips or grate coarsely. Add bay leaves, allspice, salt and a little vinegar or pinch of citric acid. Drench with lukewarm, pre-boiled water to cover and let stand over night. Next morning, strain through sieve, season to taste and bring to the boil.

PASTIES TO ACCOMPANY BEETROOT SOUP
1 kg flour
200 g margarine
3 teaspoon baking powder
20 g yeast
4 egg yolks
sour cream
pinch salt
Pour flour on bread-board, add remaining ingredients and work them together with knife. Work into a dough and roll out into thin rectangles. Prepare filling with sauerkraut and mushrooms as well as fried onions. Spread filling over dough rectangles, roll up and cut at an angel into pasties. Transfer to baking sheet, brush with beaten egg and bake in oven. For non-meatless pasties, a filling of minced cooked meat of poultry pâté may be used.

CHRISTMAS EVE MUSHROOM SOUP
100 g dried wild mushrooms
300 g button mushrooms
2 carrots
1 parsley root
1 onion
slice of celeriac and leek
2/3 cup sour cream
1-2 teaspoons potato starch
salt, pepper
Soak dried mushrooms and slice into narrow strips. Wash button mushrooms and slice into sticks. Bring 2 l water to the boil, add mushrooms, whole vegetables and seasoning. Cook until mushrooms are tender. Remove vegetables and cream soup with sour cream fork-blended with potato starch, mix well and bring tzo the boil. Swerve with white noodles or puff-pastry pellets.

CHRISTMAS EVE SAUERKRAUT
300 g dried mushrooms
150 g prunes
100 g raisins
2 kg sauerkraut
200 sliced onions
1 large carrot
2-3 teaspoons chopped dill
salt, pepper
Soak mushrooms and prunes and slice. Rinse raisins. Combine all ingredients in pot, drench with hot water and cook on low until sauerkraut is tender. Add dill after cooking is completed.

BEETROOT & MUSHROOM SALAD
1 kg beetroot
1 onion
1/5 cup oil
4 buds garlic
250 g pickled wild mushrooms
2 tablespoons sugar
6 tablespoons vinegar
salt, pepper
Cook beetroot and grate coarsely. Dice onion and fry in oil until transparent. Slice mushrooms. Combine all ingredients, season to taste, cover and let stand 4 hours.

MUSHROOM CUTLETS
1 kg button mushrooms
1 small bread roll
½ litre milk
3 eggs
1 onion
200 bread crumbs
salt, pepper
Cook mushrooms in water 30 minutes, drain and chop or grate on grater. Add milk-soaked roll, fried onion, 2 egg yolks, 100 g bread crumbs and 2 beaten egg whites. Mix and season to taste with salt and pepper. Beat remaining egg. Form patties with mushroom mixture, dip in egg and bread crumbs and fry in oil.

CABBAGE-FILLED PIEROGI
Dough:
½ kg flour
3 eggs
1 cup milk
pinch salt
Filling:
½ head cabbage
1 onion
several dfried mushrooms
3 tablespoons oil
½ glass water wody
seasoning
To prepare filling: chop cabbage fine, slice onion and chop fine, soak mushrooms and slice thin. Combine cabbage, onion and mushrooms, add remaining ingredients and cook on low heat about 30 minutes.

Combine dough ingredients, knead, cut into small pieces and roll out into circles. Place a portion of filling on each and pinch ends together to seal. Cook in lightly salted boiling water. When they float up, cook several minutes longer. Serve not or cold.

SAUERKRAUT & MUSHROOM PIEROGI
Dough:
½ kg flour
1 egg
pinch salt
water
Filling:
1 kg sauerkraut
100 g dried mushrooms
onion
oil, for frying
To prepare filling: Cook cabbage, soak and cook mushrooms. Drain and squeeze moisture from cabbage and mushrooms and chop fine together. Transfer onion, cabbage and mushrooms to frying pan in which oil has been heated, mix and fry several minutes.

Combine dough ingredients, adding just enough water to get a soft dough. Roll out thin and cut with drinking glass into circles. Place a portion of filling on each and pinch ends of dough together to seal. Transfer pierogi to lightly salted boiling water and cook 20 minutes.

POTATO-FILLED PIEROGI, PODLASIE STYLE
Dough:
1 kg flour
hot water
Filling:
3 kg potatoes
onion
pork fatback, for frying
salt, pepper
To prepare filling: Peel potatoes and grate on fine side of grater. Season with salt and pepper and fry in rendered drippings with finely chopped onion.

Work flour and water into a dough, roll put thin and cut into circles with drinking glass. Place a portion of filling on each, pinch ends together to seal and cook in lightly salted water. when they float up, cook several minutes longer. Garnish with fatback nuggets fried with chopped onion. These pierogi are best the next day, sliced and fried in fat.

POPPYSEED-FILLED PIEROGI
Dough:
1 kg flour
½ cup olive oil
50 g yeast
pinch salt
Filling:
2 cups poppyseeds mixed with sugar
Work ingredients into a yeast dough whilst adding warm water. Roll out dough to ½
cm thickness and cut into circles with drinking glass. Place a portion of poppyseed mixture on each. Seals ends together to form pierogi and fry in oil. When cool, dust with icing sugar.

FRIED CARP
1 carp
salt, pepper
Clean carp, removing gills and guts. Rinse under running water and cut into steaks. Salt, intersperse wtih onion and lemonm slices, cover and refriegrate 2-3 hours or overnight. Risne, pat dry, sprinkle with pepper, dredge in flour and fry on both sides in oil to a nice golden-brown. For a crispy skin bake in preheated 160°C oven one hour. Serve hot with prepared horseradish or horseradish sauce.

Horseradish sauce: combine equal parts prepared horseradish, sour cream and mayonnaise, season with lemon juice.

FISH IN MARINADE
1 kg freshwater fish fillets
oil, for frying
2 onions
Marinade:
1 cup vinegar
3 cups water
2 teaspoons sugar
5 peppercorns, 3 grains allspice, 1-2 bay leaves
1-2 days before serving, cut fillets into slices 5-6 cm wide, salt, pepper and set aside for 60-90 minutes. Dredge in flour, fry on both sides in hot oil and set aside to cool. Slice onion, scald with boiling water and set aside to cool.

To prepare marinade: Combine all ingredients, bring to the boil under cover and set aside to cool. In glass pan or bowl alternate layers of fish and onion, drench with marinade and cover. Refrigerate until ready to serve.

HERRING UNDER BLANKET
1 kg herring fillets
3 beetroots
1 kg potatoes
1 kg carrots
3 hard-boiled eggs
mayonnaise
Rinse fillets, and soak in water about 90 minutes, changing water once. Cook beetroots, potatoes and carrots, peel and cut into thin sticks. Chop eggs. Cut soaked, drained fillets into strips about 0.5 cm wide. In a (preferably glass) serving dish layer ingredients:

1. potaotes
2. herring
3. mayonnaise
4. beetroot
5. herring
6. mayonnaise
7. carrots
8. herring
9. mayonnaise
10. chopped egg.

HERRING IN OIL
½ kg herring fillets
2 onions
olive oil
Marinade:
2 cups cold pre-boiled water
2 cups vinegar
½ teaspoons sugar
2 grains allspice, 1 bay leaf
Soak fillets in water about 3 hours, changing it several times. Dice onions, scald with boiling water and drain. Cut fillets into small pieces and smother with onions. Prepare marinade, drench herring and onions and set aside for 12 hours. Drain off marinade and drench herring with olive oil.

CREAMED HERRING
½ kg herring fillets
Marinade:
3 cups cold, pre-boiled water
1 cup vinegar
½ teaspoon sugar
2 grains allspice, 1 bay leaf
sour cream
Soak fillets in water about 3 hours, changing it several times. Dice onions, scald with boiling water and drain. Slice fillets into small pieces and smother with onions. Prepare marinade and with it drench herring and onions. Let stand for 12 hours. Remove herring from marinade and drench with sour cream.

BATTERED HERRING
½ kg herring fillets
1 sliced onion
Dough:
2 cups flour
1.2 g yeast
½ cup milk
⅓ cup water
3 eggs
Soak herring in water 3 hours, changing it several times. Cut fillets into pieces and smother with onions and let stand covered 1-2 hours. Prepare batter: dissolve yeast in milk, combine all ingredients and mix well. Dip fillets in batter and fry in oil. Serve hot or cold.

Language / ANGLOS HAVE TROUBLE WITH SZCZ, SOME WITH TRILLED 'R' [22]

One way to explain to an English speaker how to pronounce teh common szcz in Polish is to have them say such words as SUGGESTION. The 'st' in that word effectively approximates the Polish szcz.

The trilled Scottish 'r' is more problematic esp. for Americans unaccustomed to that sound, even though they are probably saying it all the time without knowing it. I recall one student I couldn't get to say robota, rasa, uta, etc. for the life me.

But this same speaker in his native English was saying geryń for gettign, beryń for betting, lołryń for loading and bołryń for boating, as is the custom of many Americans. After much effort of having him repeat geryń umpteen times I had him switch into ryba, and finally he got it.