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Why are Polish Americans mocked in the American media?


paczemoj  1 | 3
30 Sep 2010   #91
I think it's also important to remember a bit of history. Until the 20th century, Slavs (including Poles) and other people from east of Germany, and southern Europeans (Italians, Greeks, etc.) were considered a kind of "second category" of "white" person in America-or sometimes not "white" at all.

From page 76 of Whiteness of a Different Color: European Immigrants and the Alchemy of Race:

The ascendent view among native-born Americans in the 1890s, even Anglo-Saxons and Others as John Wigmore was writing, was not that Japanese immigrants held "as good a claim to the color 'white' as the Southern European and Semitic peoples," and therefore ought to be granted citizenship, but rather, that Southern European, Semitic, and Slavic immigrants held as poor a claim to the color "white" as the Japanese, and therefore ought to be turned away at once. The racialism of this prevailing view of the newer European immigrants, its basis in republican logic, and its relationship to racialized assessments of Asians (...)

The Immigration Act of 1924 severely limited Polish (and other undesirable) immigration and anti-Slavic stereotypes were prevalent (much, much more than now) in American society until the interwar period. Most were variations of stereotypes that attach to any new and different group: dumb (can't speak English), smelly (eat different foods), shady (stick together), dirty (poor), etc. Some were new. After 1917, Slavs carried the stigma of Bolshevism and of trying to undermine moral order and good government. Most people couldn't care or didn't know how to distinguish between Slavs. And it's true that Poles did participate in labour unions. Plus, Poles were Catholics and America has a vast history of anti-Catholic sentiment. The KKK disliked: Blacks, Jews and Catholics. Even when Kennedy was elected, there were grumblings about a "Papist" plot to take over America. Remember that America was created by people who considered themselves religious outcasts (and partly were). They disliked the Catholic Church, to say the least.

As for jokes today, I think they come from that "tradition" but are also different in that though they may be offensive and in poor taste, they are not treated as serious statements of fact nor are they malicious. They bug me sometimes and I agree that political correctness dictates who we may or may not make fun of and jokes about, but I think they're also a sign of how normal it's become to be Polish-American. The lack of Black jokes (except by Black comedians) and the flow of heroic or "good" Black characters is, I think, a symptom of American still having trouble with its slave-owning and segregationist past. It's a strange way of trying to "correct" a historical "wrong".
Ironside  50 | 12383
30 Sep 2010   #92
This whole thread is a bunch nonsence, supposedly created by some guest,,,ya, right!

Yeah, all over again, how many times they can go about the Pollack jokes/? You say this is over and not a media mainstream, and its good enough for me!

Ah ?those guest......!
Bzibzioh
30 Sep 2010   #93
As for jokes today, I think they come from that "tradition" but are also different in that though they may be offensive and in poor taste, they are not treated as serious statements of fact nor are they malicious.

The way Poles are presented is more lazy stereotyping than maliciousness.

They are definitely overcompensating for the past wrongs.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #94
You're just leeches looking for money anyway.

What? From the greatest debtor nation in history who lives off China's bank?
Besides, 'money' is America's only way to 'win friends and influence enemies'.

This, from the nation who brought us TARP (AKA 'The Jobless Recovery Act').

Who, in most cases are just as racist as any American ever dreamed of being.

Any? Statistically, most racist Americans are her beloved minorities.

Why don't you talk about what your fellow Europeans say about you?

You mean, outside of the fact they are usually correct?

I never let my being 'American' keep me blind to her in-your-face realities.
trener zolwia  1 | 939
30 Sep 2010   #95
I think it's also important to remember a bit of history.

Good stuff, man.

Most of us have indeed moved on but there is a cottage industry that is determined to keep black historical grievance alive for their benefit today. The Left treats blacks like retarded children who ever need protection and eternal assistance. Another part of what they do is keep the past alive in the public psyche via pop culture entertainment and continual scolding about our racial past so that they can then implement their misplaced black sympathy into policy. It's dirty and divisive group politics enforced with PC is what it is.
Pinching Pete  - | 554
30 Sep 2010   #96
never let my being 'American' keep me blind to her in-your-face realities

Right.. and you're leaving the US when? You leave you'll be back in 2 years tops. Cut the crap.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #97
Most of us have indeed moved on but there is a cottage industry that is determined to keep black historical grievance alive for their benefit today.

It thinks it's more than just a 'cottage industry' - what's more, I think it's all contrived.

Right.. and you're leaving the US when? You leave you'll be back in 2 years tops. Cut the crap.

Nah, I've had enough of teaching grade school curriculum to college freshmen.
Chicago Pollock  7 | 503
30 Sep 2010   #98
The Big Lie on Polish Forum is that Poles in America are subjected to public bashing. A complete lie. Nothing is further from the truth. They were never subject to public bashing. The TV series (1970's) he keeps referring to was "All in the Family" about a bigot who's daughter was married to an American of Polish descent and the theme of the show was that the son-in-law would argue with his father-in-law about being bigoted. The show actually showed Poles to be progressive and open minded.
ZIMMY  6 | 1601
30 Sep 2010   #99
youtube.com/watch?v=ykuGCT2uixk
Bzibzioh
30 Sep 2010   #100
The show actually showed Poles to be progressive and open minded.

So how come many Americans today indicate this show as the source of all they know about Polish people and all the jokes about them?

ZIMMY
You know that those "Polish sayings" of Banacek have nothing to do with ... Polish sayings or proverbs at all. Not even one of them. So why do you keep quoting it?
Chicago Pollock  7 | 503
30 Sep 2010   #101
So how come many Americans today indicate this show as the source of all they know about Polish people and all the jokes about them?

answers.com/topic/all-in-the-family
Bzibzioh
30 Sep 2010   #102
Chicago Pollock
So a lot of people must have missed the sarcasm because they bought those jokes as truth.
Chicago Pollock  7 | 503
30 Sep 2010   #103
Here's the description of the character, hardly derogatory:

Rob Reiner as Michael Stivic. Gloria's Polish-American hippie husband was part of the counterculture of the 1960s. He constantly sparred with Archie (in the original pilot, the character 'Michael' was Irish-American). Michael's character was, in many ways, as stubborn as Archie, even though his moral views were generally presented as being more ethical and his logic somewhat more sound. For his bullheadedness, Stivic was sometimes criticized for being an elitist. While Archie demonstrated the lion's share of the hypocrisy, Michael had, on occasion, shown his own. As discussed in All in the Family retrospectives...

Bzibzioh
30 Sep 2010   #104
Chicago Pollock
I know what you mean, but still a lot of people I talked to said that they never personally meet a Pole before, and all they know it's from this show, all the jokes and innuendos. And they are still laughing at those jokes. Why shouldn't they? American TV never had a positive Polish role model, only those idiotic old tired prejudices. Check my recent example I posted earlier in this thread.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #105
^ "Sticks and stones may break my bones, and you are one dumb Polack" - Archie Bunker to Mike Stivic.

Of course the ultimate irony is that, when it all is said and done, the stupid libtard had it coming to him :)
Chicago Pollock  7 | 503
30 Sep 2010   #106
I know what you mean

^ "Sticks and stones may break my bones, and you are one dumb Polack" - Archie Bunker to Mike Stivic.

you can still get the show on cable or dvd's. It was a popular show. I'm old enough to remember it. All I can is...see it for yourself. YOU BE THE JUDGE.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #107
All I can is...see it for yourself. YOU BE THE JUDGE.

I hate that show so much, I have the first five seasons on DVD :)
guesswho  4 | 1272
30 Sep 2010   #108
I couldn't agree more with what you've said here (I was born and raised in 'America'). When I leave for Poland, I may not return here - not even to visit.

Go to your promised land man, I was there with my parents and couldn't wait to leave it behind me. You got to have a really strong connection to this country to love it. Then again, I guess, it's a matter of taste too.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #109
Go to your promised land man, I was there with my parents and couldn't wait to leave it behind me.

I have friends who moved to Poland only to return to the States after a few years.
As for me, I am under no illusions - living in Poland will in no way be like 'visiting' it.

I do know one thing: there are Poles who would gladly take my spot here in the US.
...
30 Sep 2010   #110
Why are Polish Americans mocked in the american media?

Where do you get this? Poles or Polish Americans are never much in the news here. Strange topic.

They were last prevalent maybe in the 80's.

Prior to the 80s.

convex:
I never heard anything about Poles in the media when I lived in the states.

same here...
well, maybe after our president died, they were talking a bit about it, but that's it...

That's opposite of my experience.. i meet a lot of people that tell me that they are part Polish or what not. Or at least are interested about Poland. And it seems I meet many -skis all the time.

And is it true that Polish Americans do not work too often in white collar jobs?

Not at all. The same goes for Poles that are here. In some areas (WI, IL, IN, OH, PA, NY, CT), however, where there are many blue collar jobs then there are many of Polish decent.

For some Americans, exposure to Poles is the 'Dumb Polack' joke.

For some but I would say not for the majority of Americans.

I might have learned about this here.

I don't really agree with that statement either. Whenever I meet a person from Chicago and they find out that I am a Pole, they always tell me that there is a huge Polish population in Chicago. I can't even recall of one person from Illinois that didn't tell me that.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #111
Whenever I meet a person from Chicago and they find out that I am a Pole, they always tell me that there is a huge Polish population in Chicago.

Even Poles residing in Poland will concede that Chicago is the capital of Poland :)
ZIMMY  6 | 1601
30 Sep 2010   #112
You know that those "Polish sayings" of Banacek have nothing to do with ... Polish sayings or proverbs at all. Not even one of them. So why do you keep quoting it?

The Banacek character was a positive one. Here was a successful, wealthy, wise-cracking detective type who was paid big bucks to crack crimes. He was so confident that he used his "proverbs" as a 'put-on'. Nothing wrong with that.
MediaWatch  10 | 942
30 Sep 2010   #113
ShortHairThug if I'm not mistaken that Opie & Anthony anti-Polish segment was about 11 years ago. No doubt that was anti-Polish slur propaganda, no doubt. But I used to listen to Opie & Anthony and in fairness to them they generally ignored the Polish and mocked just about everyone. They made fun of the Black Wrestler "The Rock" and made subtle if not overt ethnic & racist slurs against just about everyone. Even the Jews!

When they said some things about the Jews one time, a Jewish Holocaust survivor called up to tell them to stop it and then they made fun of him!

Here Opie & Anthony mock Jews and even mock a Jewish guy Ben Stein here. They throw around the phase "Jew me down".

This anti-Jewish segment occured about a month after their anti-Polish segment.

youtube.com/watch?v=MP0_wqgWilE

Opie & Anthony seemed to always have a hard time staying on normal radio. They would come on in some big cities for a couple years if not just a couple months, get thrown off then come back then get thrown off. Eventually they were thrown off all normal radio because of their failing ratings. I guess people like this crude humor at first but only a tiny crude element listen to it continuously.

Opie & Anthony were known for pushing the envelope. Basically whatever they said was what normal civilized people did not say. Their crudeness was basically a referendum on what most people shouldn't say.

They got thrown off one time for saying that the Boston Mayor died (when he didn"t) which scared the Mayor's family and they also got thrown off for their mocking of Catholics. They pushed things too much when they had a stunt where they prompted a couple to have sex inside church at Saint Patricks Cathedral in New York City.

Also former Senator Arlen Specter apologized for saying so called Polish jokes two years ago because both Polish Americans and Non-Polish Americans thought he was wrong in saying these anti-Polish slurs. Specter also lost BIG in Pennsylvania. No doubt Arlen Specter's anti-Polish slurs did not help him.

upi.com/Top_News/2008/12/17/Specter-apologizes-for-Polish-jokes/UPI-44361229547951/

I think most American people are fair minded today and don't like seeing people being insulted. That's part of the reason why Arlen Specter got into so much trouble saying jokes against Polish people.

The only people who like ethnic/racial bigotry against other people are generally unsophisticated crude people.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #114
Even the Jews!

Even the Jews? No wonder

Opie & Anthony seemed to always have a hard time staying on normal radio.

:)
Plastic Pole52  - | 67
30 Sep 2010   #115
So a lot of people must have missed the sarcasm because they bought those jokes as truth.

They did indeed and they still do.You can see the show on YT and read the comments there.
Personally I don't find it offensive.Unlike Archie who works "blue collar" job,Mike is an educated university teacher.BTW I was told a polack joke lately by some trailer trash retard.I wish I took pictures of his familly,trailer,car and landscaping of his place.I didn't but I can tell you they live like Slovakian gypsies.
OP wildeckirenegat
30 Sep 2010   #116
Will someone answer my question asked here 3 times:

Do PolAms work predominantly in blue collar jobs in US?
Teffle  22 | 1318
30 Sep 2010   #117
OK, can't answer from experience, but based on any US documentaries I've seen on any subject, movie credits etc, Polish surnames feature regularly - as least as much as Italian or Irish for example anyway.
...
30 Sep 2010   #118
wildeckirenegat
Do PolAms work predominantly in blue collar jobs in US?

Hey dumbo, I alread answered and so have at least another poster.
ZIMMY  6 | 1601
30 Sep 2010   #119
Do PolAms work predominantly in blue collar jobs in US?

Most, by far, first generation Poles work in blue collar jobs. Most second generation poles work in white collar jobs. Most third generation Poles are professionals. Most fourth generation Poles are millionaires.
richasis  1 | 409
30 Sep 2010   #120
And then, some millionaire Poles end up in prison like Tyco CEO Dennis Kozlowski :(


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