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Referendum to decide about exotic immigrants in Poland


OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #421
Requests and applications by Germany two years ago asking Poland to accept these migrants are very different from today

No. German requests and application from 2023 to the PiS gov have taken a long time to be processed by the red tape so the transfer is taking place this year.

Similarly, cases from 2022 were finalised in 2023. And so on. PiS gov participated in it willingly.
gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #422
Hey, guys, what was the outcome of the last referendum on migrants?

the last referendum on migrants was held during the elections in 2015 when PiS won mainly thanks to strongly opposing the "let's share the migrants around in Europe we have too much of them in Germany" idea and then followed by doing whatever they could to stop the idea's realisation
Novichok 4 | 8442
11 Jun 2024 #423
What was the question and the outcome?
gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #424
PIS accepted Dublin Agreement and agreed to receive migrants from Germany.

only those who first claimed asylum in Poland afaik - if you have proof to the contrary feel free to post it here
OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #425
only those who first claimed asylum in Poland afaik

You prove you don`t know what Dublin Agreement really is. :):):)

The Dublin Agreement, a European bloc agreement, determines which country an asylum application will be processed in. It provides that EU countries can send applicants back to their first point of entry into the EU where they have either already got an asylum application under way, or could have initiated one on entry.
Poloniusz 4 | 785
11 Jun 2024 #426
requests and application from 2023 to the PiS gov have taken a long time to be processed by the red tape

PiS used red tape to halt migrants and Tusk is rolling out the red carpet to welcome them.

Four years ago you were one of the biggest migrant advocates on PF. Tusk is fulfilling your wishes.

Here is what you said:


Here is what I said:


Here is how you responded to me:


So, you voted for the devil:



And now you are getting the horns! :)


gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #427
What was the question and the outcome?

there was no actual referendum back then (2015) - PiS won on the promise they would no accept "migrant quotas" that Western European countries wanted to share with us - and they kept their word

wait a sec though - there was an actual referendum on this last year along the last elections - however the referendum was mostly boycotted by the followers of the then opposition (now forming a government) because they were told to do so by the oppositon figures (as our current prime minister, Mr Tusk said "I cancel this referendum")

because of the boycott the referendum had not enough people voting to be binding (less then 50 per cent of those eligible voted but the vast majority of those who did voted against the idea of "migrant quotas")

(the story is not quite as straightforward though, because there were actually four questions in the referendum and only one of those was on the topic of immigration - what remains though that people depraved themselves of the right to vote on important issues because of one deranged man (Tusk) who now poses as the one true defender of Polish borders against immigration)
OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #428
PiS won on the promise they would no accept "migrant quotas"

And then they invited hundred thousands exotic foreigners to Poland, like no other gov in history of Poland. On such a scale that even other European countries with migration history were shocked.

We need everybody

And PiS fulfilled that wish! They sold visas to migrants by hundred thousands!

you voted for

For Mr Honourable Prime Minister Reverend Donald Holy Tusk who never sold visas to migrants like PiS did! HA!!!



gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #429
@pawian

yes indeed - I didn't know about the point b) - so let's look at the numbers - less than 4 thousand people in 2022 who claimed asylum in Poland or entered the EU in Poland and then sought to claim an asylum or were caught as illegals in Germany - it's not a staggering number if you ask me if you take into consideration that it was the middle of the Belarus border crisis - and also they could have crossed the EU border in Lithuania and were maliciously sent back to Poland by the Germans (there were numerous instnaces back then when Polish police and border guards caught people travelling from Lithuania to Germany through Poland being transported by human traffickers)
OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #430
they could have crossed the EU border in Lithuania

Amassing how you - talking about Lithuania or Poloniusz - talking about Austria etc twist and manipulate the facts which are quite simple - Germans know the law and are sending back migrants who entered the EU in Poland.
gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #431
@pawian

hundred thousands foreign workers to Poland

firstly it was businesses who applied for work permits for foreigners not the government - secondly only a fraction of those who received work permits actually received Polish visas - thirdly foreign workers are workers: they pay taxes and don't cost the state any money - and on the fourth count: if you followed the proceedings of the "Visa scandal commision" in the Sejm you would know that there is now talk only about a couple of hundreds fraudulent visa cases there

Germans know the law and are sending back migrants who entered the EU in Poland.

how do you actually know?
OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #432
Four years ago you were

4 years ago is prehistory in this fast moving world. Ha!!!!

Tusk is fulfilling

No, Mr Honourable Prime Minister Reverend Donald Holy Tusk is doing his best to protect the border. True hero!
Poloniusz 4 | 785
11 Jun 2024 #433
Tusk who never sold visas to migrants like PiS did

Better for there to be orderly and legal migration along with fees to help cover the costs and visas with expiration dates than for there to be out of control illegal immigration with spiraling welfare costs in the billions and no way to ever get rid of them.

doing his best to protect the border.

Closing it off to Ukrainians and Belarusians in the East and opening the flood gates in the West to every unskilled welfare recipient coming in from Africa, Asia and the Middle East.
OP pawian 223 | 24385
11 Jun 2024 #434
how do you actually know?

Coz I prefer to believe Germans than rightists who are notorious liars and cheaters. They came to power here a few times thanks to their nasty lies. Whenever a rightist claims sth, I instantly smell the rat.

Check this Polo liar, for example. Each post by him contains a lie. E.g,

Closing it off to Ukrainians and Belarusians in the East

gumishu 14 | 6223
11 Jun 2024 #435
They came to power here a few times thanks to their nasty lies

what lies - you care to divulge?
Poloniusz 4 | 785
11 Jun 2024 #436
I prefer to believe Germans

Of course you do. We all know the real reason behind it too. :)


OP pawian 223 | 24385
12 Jun 2024 #437
what lies - you care to divulge?

what lies

The first case of coming to power by PiS thanks to their lies was in 2005 during presidential campaign when rightists falsely claimed Tusk`s grandpa voluntarily joined Wehrmacht to fight for Germans.

In 2015 PIS propagated the slogan Poland in ruin and won the national elections.
gumishu 14 | 6223
12 Jun 2024 #438
Poland in ruin

so how come people believed in that lie if it wasn't true at all

as for Tusk's grandpa - Jacek Kurski who brought up the accusation was relegated from the PiS presidential campaing office and Lech Kaczyński publicly apologized to Tusk about the accusation in a television debate (as per wikipedia) - this source claims Kurski was expelled from the party in fact, as a result: wiadomosci.gazeta.pl/wiadomosci/7,114873,2969023.html
Paulina 16 | 4395
12 Jun 2024 #439
so how come people believed in that lie if it wasn't true at all

Because they were stupid? I honestly don't know how anyone with half a brain could believe that "Poland in ruin" bullsh1t.
gumishu 14 | 6223
12 Jun 2024 #440
Because they were stupid?

can I call those people who believed that "PiS brought in hundreds of thousands of immigrants from Africa and the Middle East" and voted for "the democratic camp" stupid , too - or is it some breech of DEMOCRACY

how about PiS claiming that tens of billions of PLN were being drained from the Polish state budget by VAT fraudsters during that election campaing - was it a lie, too?
Paulina 16 | 4395
12 Jun 2024 #441
can I call those people who believed (...) stupid , too

I don't think it's as easy for an ordinary person to verify how many visas were given to foreigners or how many money were "drained from the Polish state budget by VAT fraudsters" as is looking around you and checking whether your own country in which you live is "in ruin" or not lol
gumishu 14 | 6223
12 Jun 2024 #442
it is pretty easy to verify if "hundreds of thousands of immigrants from Africa and the Middle East were brought to the country" because it would be readily visible around you
Paulina 16 | 4395
12 Jun 2024 #443
@gumishu, not necessarily. Giving them a visa and them staying in Poland are two different things, as we found out, especially if that would happen during the period of 8 years. It would also depend on where someone lives - big city, a town, a village, etc.

because it would be readily visible around you

Well, even in my local Biedronka I've seen in more recent years groups of young men that look like they're from Pakistan/India/Bangladesh (and I live in Kielce and not some big city like Warsaw). My guess is that they're probably students, but who knows what other people might think...
gumishu 14 | 6223
12 Jun 2024 #444
@Paulina

by the way: as far as I can remember "Poland in ruin" was not the main motto of PiS parliamentary campaign in 2015 - also the leaked "tapes" of 2014 had the home secretary/minister of internal affairs say: "Polish state is only in theory". This and the VAT fraud scale before PiS came to power justified "Poland in ruin" to some extent in my opinion.
Novichok 4 | 8442
12 Jun 2024 #445
Why would a white and sane country ignore the miserable experience of moronic countries like the US and the UK and start this "it's only a few" immigration crap?

It's never a few. Few become many...Then you get Londonistan where you will be an outvoted minority very quickly...

Is Poland sane?
OP pawian 223 | 24385
12 Jun 2024 #446
Polish state budget by VAT fraudsters during that election campaing - was it a lie, too?

No, it wasn`t a lie because fraudsters existed both during Tusk`s and PiS` rules.
However, PiS lied that VAT fraudsters were somehow connected with the rulers and working on their orders. It was a lie coz later nobody was accused and brought to court.

so how come people believed in that lie if it wasn't true at all

We aren`t discussing if sb believed or not. We are discussing the usage of lies in order to grab power. PIS lied in multiple ways and it had allowed them to win the elections until 15th October.

as far as I can remember "Poland in ruin" was not the main motto of PiS parliamentary campaign in 2015

So your memory is quite selective. I remember PIS` TV ads and politicians exploiting that slogan ad nauseam. That is why I considered it amasssing when PIS declared the economy was thriving under their rule only about 2-3 months after they had created the new gov.
gumishu 14 | 6223
13 Jun 2024 #447
because fraudsters existed both during Tusk`s and PiS` rules.

ok, again

- Polish budget income in 2015 (the last year of the first PO regime) - 290 billion PLN

- Polish budget income in 2018 (three years into PiS rule - after implementing anti-VAT-fraud measures that PO delayed and delayed and.. and after introducing consistent checks of the fuel imported into the country which where non-existen under PO regime) - 380 billion PLN

-inflation between 2015 and 2018= under 4 per cent

-practically no tax hikes between 2018 and 2015 and yet almost 25 per cent rise in the state income (one fourth for those who don't work in percentages)

-the state income rise between 2015 and 2018 fully covered all the social programmes PiS introduced (500+ programme which awarded parents 500 PLN per month for each child, for example)
Ironside 50 | 12540
13 Jun 2024 #448
They sold visas to migrants by hundreds of thousands!

What is your problem are you a racist xenophobic rat?
---

Nobody was accused and brought to court.

That is a valid point, they talk about it a lot but even don't do anything to punish those a-holes. that is the main PiS problem a lot of steam and little action.

--

Is Poland sane?

Is the US sane?

PiS brought in hundreds of thousands of immigrants f

That is not a point. They have papers they can always be deported. The crux of the matter is that Germany sent their illegal migrants to Poland and we are going to keep them thanks to Tusk, but to be honest Moraciwcki started that process.
gumishu 14 | 6223
13 Jun 2024 #449
no confront it with these:

Donald Tusk, February 16th, 2014: "When I hear the proposal that every child after the first in a family should receive 500 PLN per month.. accroding to my best knowledge there is no way to finance the project"

Donald Tusk, February 16th, 2014: "If someone knows where those billions are burried.. and they can be immediately distributed among the populace, then I will be the happiest prime minister in the world to author or co-author of such a project"

Jacek Vincent Rostowski, Polish finance minister: October 25th, 2015: "There is no money for the promises that PiS made, and there won't be any until the end of this parliamentary term" (famous "Pinięndzy nie ma i nie będzie")

Ewa Kopacz, somewhere in 2015 or 2016: "That money won't be there neither in 2017 nor in 2018" (about financing 500+) (Ewa Kopacz was handpicked by Tusk to lead the government after he left for Brussels)

Bronisław Komorowski, somewhere in 2016: "This is the stupidest way of spending public money" (about 500+ programme) (President of Poland 2011-2015, PO politician)

Donald Tusk: July 2021: "We managed to get Poland through the crisis in such a manner, that it was possible to start big social programmes, too..We would start such projects at roughly the same time. Ewa Kopacz had a project ready similar to 500+, but she was in this last year of cleaning up after the global crisis"

Ewa Kopacz, July 2021: "PiS politicans simply lie. They say that it was very difficult at first, because we left public finances in ruin with an EU excessive deficit procedure in place , but they still gave people 500+. We left public finances in a good shape. That's why you could give out money left and right."

in the edning days of 2023 the new Polish government illegally changed the directors of the Polish public broadceters and Polish public news agency - one of the first thing they did was destroying the archives of the public news channel TVP Info (including the archive articles and videos on the website of the channel)
Novichok 4 | 8442
13 Jun 2024 #450
Is the US sane?

No, but we were the first to show the world what extreme stupidity of importing slaves and migrants leads to.

Those who ignore such American stupidity are imbeciles. Poland, I am talking about you and to you...so please remove all brown crap immediately...

Want "exotic"? Get a couple of tigers...Make sure they are not faggots...A male and a female will work just fine.


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