Chances of Poland in case of war between EU (ie western Europe) and Visegrad Group ?

Aaargh, now I know you you mean. Sorry, I had a busy and tiring day so I didn`t catch what you meant.

However, think logically. The conflict in Ukraine has lasted since 2014 and will last for the next several years. As long as it lasts, Hungarians hungry for recapturing their old lands will support RuSSists, hoping to play a role of hyena which might feed on Ukraine`s corpse.

Even if Orban is gone, another politician will play the same card of retrieving the lands that Hungary was deprived of 100 years ago. Such great expectations may continue for a decade and more.

Don`t you think that we have enough premisses to declare the Visegrad group with Hungary nullified???

That's exactly same thing that certain circles repeat about Poland.


I think that as long as Orban is in power and supports Russia, it will be hardly possible for the Visegrad Group to work efficiently. But as I said, it's temporary. I don't believe that Hungary wants to risk annexing territories of Ukraine, as it would result in its isolation from other European countries. Little to gain, much to lose.

Hardly anybody believed RuSSists would invade. And???

The same with Hungarians - they might be thinking like this: let`s annex some land first and then we shall worry how to deal with Europe`s reaction.


Just like RuSSists. And???? :(*:(:(

So what? Dogs are barking but the caravan is treadding ahead ignoring them.

The latest election shows that Poles have chosen a gov which doesn`t intend to retrieve any land in the East at the cost of Ukraine, for example.

While during their latest elections, with the war fought on a full scale in Ukraine, Hungarians mostly voted for Orban who alludes to the recreation of Great Hungary.

Do you see the difference????

Most Hungarians are still nostalgic about their old lands which they lost in 1920. Most Poles aren`t.

Hungarian nostalgy poster

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I don't think that is true.
Hungarians are like Poles.
They are perfectly happy with the lands they possess and have no appetite for expansion.
Unlike those brutal Serbs.

I wouldn`t like to cause any distress to you but I have to disagree, with great discomfort on my part. Why? Because you can see Greater Hungary posters and other Trianon trauma symbols in Hungarian streets but you will never see similar pre war Poland posters in Polish streets.

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Vatican often profited on Hungarian desires. Why wouldn`t Russia?

Some correction of border where it is possible, where Hungarian statehood precede statehood of some others, where is Hungarian minority threatened and where Russia can agree with Vatican on finite borders of influence. Like in case of Ukraine, Croatia, Romania and also Austria. Trianon was especially unfair on border between Austria and Hungary. Austria as older partner (therefore more responsible for wars started by AHE) in AH grabbed lands to Hungary that was younger partner in the Empire.

@Veles
Those circles have insignificant impact, their mostly used as a soft-non-likely threat as a possible direction to see the reaction of other political orientation internally and abroad.

PiS shows itself that way as the "mature option" for centre, centre-right and non-extreme right wingers. + shows itself as a far better option to have as opposing force within politics for centre-left, leftists and extreme left.

It's like have a tiny unloaded dusty revolver in a safe to open from time to time to only show.

While Hungarians are basically yelling for making more revolvers and get back their revolver making factories. That's the difference

@pawian

The case of Hungarians and Russians is not the same, for bazzilions of reasons.

I don't know what exactly Orban alludes and what he has in mind. Hungarians vote for the president, not for the prime minister. The candidate they voted for - Katalin Novak - is opposed to the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Situation of Hungary is not the same as the situation of Russia. The latter can be isolated to some degree, as it is more self-sufficient. The European Union and NATO would not tolerate any annexation performed by Hungary. It would have no border with any of their new friends, so it would likely end up in a situation worse than North Korea. Additionally, by annexation of Transcarpathia, around million of Ukrainians will suddenly become Hungarian citizens - those will become an internal threat to the Hungarian government.

There's no single reason why Hungary would even consider attacking Ukraine. There's no benefits in this at all.

On the other hand, Russian propaganda works differently in different countries, aimed at destabilising the EU and NATO, creating animosity between the nations. That's why you hear about Hungarian plans about annexing lands, and that's why some other people in other countries hear about Poland trying to retrieve Lviv and resurrect the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. In Poland, however, we keep seeing folks yapping about Volhynia 24/7. :)

Another difference is that Hungarians are exposed to the Western way of thinking, they often speak English, they encounter different media. Russians, who are mostly speaking only Russian (and possibly the language of their ethnic group), will be exposed to only one thought. That thought presents invasion as normal.

Someone being nostalgic about historical treaties doesn't automatically becoming Rambo.

The poster you included asks: "Where is the truth?" - as you can easily notice, it shows three different countries controlling same areas in history. Where do you see nostalgia here? To me it looks like a poster from the opposite side. :)

@Kashub1410

From what I keep noticing, these circles are being either ridiculed in every country they operate, or are just disagreed with - with an exception for other trolls and a bunch of useful idiots who are far from being significant.

Seriously, I have a question. What will Hungary do after that hypothetical annexation? Reality is not a video game like Total War series or Crusader Kings. Reality of year 2022 is also not Medieval reality, where the majority of population (peasants) didn't give a damn what's the language of nobles who steal their crops. There are consequences of doing that, and I'd like to know what's the plan? :)

Ok. There is nothing I can disagree with in your post. You have dissipated my worries about vindictive Hungarians for a while. But if they come up with some new dramatic fuss concerning Ukraine, I will have to return to the topic again. :):):)

But, on second thouhgts:
It is possible that Orban secretly counts on the collapse of the EU and as Putin`s ally, he won`t need NATO anymore. With Putin`s and RuSSist help, he is planning to recapture as much land as possible - starting from Ukraine.

It has been recently revealed Putin started making plans of annexing Ukraine in early 2000s. Orban might be planning ahead with a similar time span.

I don't buy that.
Hungarian people have no appetite for an expanded Hungary, except maybe for Transylvania..

Transylvania, yes. And Rijeka. As Hungarians call it `Croatian corridor to the sea`.

But we there coming to the problem. If you ask people in Rijeka (coastal city on Adriatic) and Istra (peninsula) to chose on referendum where would they rather belong- in Italy, in Hungary or in Serbia when Croatia collapse, most of them would chose Serbia, no matter its almost 100% Catholic populace. Then what would Hungary? Forcibly to take them? Or Italy? Add to it that Serbian army during WW1 liberated local Slavs (some of them considered themselves Serbs at that time) on Istra, Rijeka as in whole of Dalmatia, complete Serbian and Slavic Adriatic. I don`t say `Croatian Adriatic` because it wasn`t that. `Croat` thing is essentially Vatican`s invention.

So, exactly that `Croatian corridor to the sea` is only way to Hungary to get to Adriatic. Zagreb would want them and Karlovac (continental cities on direction) but Dalmatian coast would refuse Hungary. And Italy.

What I want to tell you, even if Hungary take part in division of former to be Croatia, if Trianon fall, Hungary can realistically count on certain continental areas but, won`t get access to Adriatic. I mean that could be possible only if world powers force populace of Istra and Rijeka and impose military pressure on those areas.

Its all very interesting.

@Crow
What is it that you don't understand when we tell you that nobody cares about Serbia and Serbs?
You are completely irrelevant!

But how could you people care? You are all deluded and wrongly informed.

Yeah,yeah, yeah...... Serbs are well informed and the rest of the World is ignorant......pathetic!

I didn`t say rest of the World. Few of you here.

We are the same as the rest of the world and better informed than the average Serb.

Many are trained, like you, not to take in consideration certain sources. That`s your problem. Serbs are more open.

Serbs are narrow minded,self centred bigots as they have proved time and again and you continue to do so ad nauseam on this forum, which just confirms our opinions of Serbs.

The best thing you could do to promote Serbs is to stop posting.