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Poland calls on British expertise to analyse the Smolensk accident


Crow 147 | 9,302
10 Apr 2021 #31
their hate of Russia?

No way Russians killed Kaczinsky when back then Serbian president Boris Tadic and Serbian FM Vuk Jeremic (later president of UN GA) arranged with the Lach (over the Sarmatian connection) Polish support for the Serbian cause. Lech traveled to Russia to coordinate and so NATO and the EU killed him.

ps

Behind the shoulder of Serbian Tadic is the Vuk Jeremic

ps

Vuk Jeremic, Sarmatian connection, ancient Sarmatian symbolism during talks to Lach Kaczinsky

p

Polish King Mieszko's denar (coins minted since 970 AD)

Lech was a great Sarmatian. Hero. He died bravely, serving ancestors. So they welcomed him in the afterlife and even now they dance, drink and eat with him.
Strzelec35 26 | 1,569
10 Apr 2021 #32
yea I think it may have been nato that did him in.
Crow 147 | 9,302
10 Apr 2021 #33
Sure. Lech made a scandal at UN GA over the NATO attack on Yugoslavia and the partition of Serbia. He dared to criticize NATO and even the government of Poland, his own country. He fo***d them publicly. Next, he traveled to Russia and his plane never landed, he died in a crash.
Novichok 1 | 2,727
10 Apr 2021 #34
I like your explanation a lot more than any other conspiracy theory. My problem with it is that that plane hit a tree during landing. That would be two strikes at once - a tree and an explosive. That happens only in the movies like Mission Impossible.
pawian 176 | 15,325
10 Apr 2021 #35
My problem with it is that that plane hit a tree during landing

Planting that tree there was a part of the whole scheme. On top of that tree, Russians hid a box with explosives.
Novichok 1 | 2,727
10 Apr 2021 #36
Planting that tree there was a part of the whole scheme...

...cooked up 50 years before.
I sense that we agree here.
Strzelec35 26 | 1,569
10 Apr 2021 #37
"My problem with it is that that plane hit a tree during landing. That would be two strikes at once - a tree and an explosive"

somehow does pis explain it and the conspiracy Russia did it by Polish media?
Miloslaw 9 | 3,032
10 Apr 2021 #38
Russia lovers are agreeing......the rest of us understand and know Russians better......
Novichok 1 | 2,727
10 Apr 2021 #39
Russia lovers are agreeing......

How about for once discussing the event without getting personal. So, on the basis of the best information available to YOU, what do you think happened to that plane?

Milo is unable to suffer such a sacrifice.

Let him speak. By now, everybody has an opinion on this subject.
My suggestion, simple explanations first before we get to Godwin's law.
Velund 1 | 388
10 Apr 2021 #40
British experts found traces of explosives on the plane.

So, russians would the last in the list of suspects, as it was polish military plane that is heading TO Russia from polish airport...
Miloslaw 9 | 3,032
10 Apr 2021 #41
, what do you think happened to that plane?

I think the Russians blew it up.
They don't care.
They tried to poison people in The UK, they invade Ukraine.....they waited outside Warsaw in 1945 and let the Germans do their worst, they held onto and controlled most of Eastern Europe for nearly 45 years after the war....... are you all nuts????

The Russians are not our friends.
mafketis 25 | 9,318
10 Apr 2021 #42
the rest of us understand and know Russians better......

I totally agree that Russia _could_ do something like that and might if it thought it was necessary, but.... there's no credible evidence that that was the case.

Pilot (and entire Polish government?) error.... Jarosław from thinking up the idea to Duda to packing so many necessary people on one plane.... they should be in jail.

The innocence of Tusk and Komorowski is just kind of.... glowing.

Jarek and Duda.... are guilty and have spent how much trying to cover up their hubris and negligence?
Miloslaw 9 | 3,032
10 Apr 2021 #43
@mafketis

Poles made loads of really stupid mistakes, but we know Russians..... just because the evidence is not overwhelming, does not prove their innocence.
Would you trust the evidence of a serial murderer?
Novichok 1 | 2,727
10 Apr 2021 #44
So, Russians would the last in the list of suspects,

Thanks, Velund, I knew I can count on you in a moment of need.

Now, let's get an explanation of how the Russians installed an explosive device on a Polish military plane parked at a Polish base and protected by the Polish armed guards. And how that device would explode at the exact moment the damn plane hits a tree as it is about to land.

Also, didn't the Russians offer to send a Russian pilot to make it easier to communicate with the Smolensk tower, and Poland refused?
Also, didn't the Russians try to re-route the plane to a different airport because of the fog and the Poles insisted to land at Smolensk?

Finally, what would be the upside for Russia to down that plane?

Would you trust the evidence of a serial murderer?

Yes. I trusted serial murderers with my life when I flew on Air Berlin in 2017 and nothing happened. In fact, they were supremely nice.
pawian 176 | 15,325
10 Apr 2021 #45
I think the Russians blew it up.

Exactly! They sent a suicide terrorist squirrel up that tree which the plane hit. The squirrel was packed with TNT and remote controlled! You are a genius.

My suggestion, simple explanations first before we get to Godwin's law.

The Polish crew was forced to land against all odds by their political superiors coz rightists needed to open a Presidential campaign with a patriotic event such as a visit to Katyń cemetary near Smoleńsk. Kaczyński brothers talked on the phone about landing at all cost though the visibility in the fog was 200-400 metres while the 1500 metres was the border limit. Seeing nothing, they got down so low that they crashed into a birch tree 1 kilometre before the runway. After losing the wing, the plane capsized and hit the ground. Simple.

Yes, Russian air traffic controllers made mistakes too but it is normal in Russia and Poles should know better how things work there. Yet, they decided to land by hook or by crook at zero visibility.
Novichok 1 | 2,727
10 Apr 2021 #46
Kaczyński brothers talked on the phone about landing at all cost

That is exactly my understanding of what took place. This makes the pilot criminally, professionally, and morally responsible. He clearly forgot that, while in flight, he was God. Actually more than that but he folded like that obedient idiot at Chernobyl.

Now, pawian, my respect for you is way up and will stay there until you revert to your old self and say something really stupid again.
Ironside 50 | 11,041
10 Apr 2021 #47
there's no credible evidence

I have been saying that for years. There is no evidence as it has been destroyed. So all we have here and there are guesses, opinions and theories including one you concocted.

Jarek and Duda....

Yet again your likes and dislikes here are influencing heavily your otherwise pretty levelheaded outlook on issues.
Don't know about Duda being low key pen-pusher at the time, but there was JK and LK and some others as well as Tusk and a few others in his gov and thereabouts who are pretty much as responsible and as guilty.

Not to mention that handling over investigation to Russia was a sole decision mad by Tusk.
Anyway if we dig deeper there are truckloads of people who are guilty, responsible and otherwise liable for lost of crap happing in Poland fort the last 30 years.
mafketis 25 | 9,318
10 Apr 2021 #48
This makes the pilot criminally, professionally, and morally responsible.

Kaczyński had a reputation for bullying pilots to land even when the pilots thought it unsafe.... so he bears part of the blame himself.

My opinion of the Russian state (as opposed to individual Russians) could not be lower but... no credible evidence this was anything but a tragic accident (though maybe JKaczyński and ADuda should be in jail for crimes against the Polish state).
pawian 176 | 15,325
10 Apr 2021 #49
This makes the pilot criminally, professionally, and morally responsible

It is not so easy with those PiS rightists in power. Two years earlier, there had been an infamous flight of the Polish President Kaczyński to Georgia which was under Russian attack at the time. The pilot refused to land in the capital city of Tbilisi cos it was too risky in war conditions . Afterwards, the pilot was accused by PiS media and politicians of excessive cowardice and had to undergo a formal investigation which acquitted him, though. His second pilot was later the main pilot in the crash flight - he already knew that rightist politicians refuse to accept NO from a pilot.

he was God.

Not next to rightist who deem themselves closer to God than average guys.

until you revert to your old self

I am myself all the time. I never change. What for?


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