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Will PiS be happy if AfD wins elections in Germany?


Bratwurst Boy  8 | 12041
2 hrs ago   #841
Would it be acceptable for someone to say that he dislikes Jews,

Nobody bats an eye at demos in Berlin, where hooded people scream and hold banners with "From the river to the sea", which in effect means total annihilation/genocide/wiping off the map of Israel....so....I guess that is seen as acceptable!

For comparison...these AfD remarks are as dirty and mean Stammtisch-material as they come but nobody asks for annihilation of a muslim country....only less muslims in Germany!
Tacitus  2 | 1339
2 hrs ago   #842
Nobody bats an eye at demos in Berlin

Are those protests organized by a political party?

Which party is systematically using that kind of rhetoric against jews?
Bratwurst Boy  8 | 12041
2 hrs ago   #843
they'll have to look what AfD politicians are saying and writing behind the scenes.

I wonder if they will ever find anything....

IMHO these dreams and visions of violent overthrowing of governments is more a "thing" for activists....for movements....for people who know they have otherwise no chance in hell to make their dreams come true otherwise.

The AfD has begun as a new party with tiny numbers and has gone the whole long hard way with wholly democratic means...meaning ground work from the bottom up....they just don't need to endanger all this progress and success now with violent visions...

Are those protests organized by a political party?

It's always some members of the Linke (at least in Berlin) screaming loudest at these demos....

...For years, the slogan "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" has been heard at left-wing demonstrations.
Demanding a Palestine stretching from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea means nothing less than the annihilation of Israel: the end of the Jewish state....


tagesspiegel.de/gesellschaft/linker-judenhass-es-gibt-einen-grossen-unwillen-den-antisemitismus-in-den-eigenen-reihen-zu-erkennen-10592407.html
Tacitus  2 | 1339
2 hrs ago   #844
I wonder if they will ever find anything....

Well...

Chat group leak reveals far-right fantasies of Germany's AfD

Among tens of thousands of posts is talk of jailing Angela Merkel, calls for armed resistance, and homophobia

theguardian.com/world/2022/may/20/chat-group-leak-reveals-far-right-fantasies-of-germany-afd

Who knows what else is there.

It's always some members of the Linke

Yeah, "some" members. Not the entire party leadership.

Look, I have no interest in defending the Left party. If you ask me it was a political tragedy that the SED survived the GDR. And I hope Wolfram Weimar will do something against the antisemitism in those "progressive" circles who call themselves artists.

But the case against the AfD is not built on the presence of some AfD members on demonstrations, so I don't see the comparison here.
Bratwurst Boy  8 | 12041
2 hrs ago   #845
Yeah, "some" members. Not the entire party leadership.

Is that so! :) I guess you will find some nutters in EVERY party....

But the case against the AfD is not built on the presence of some AfD members on demonstrations,

Exactly....imagine it would had been AfD members screaming such things at a demo....

Why does our gov treat them so differently? That all gives way to doubt our official institutions which have to be neutral!
jon357  72 | 23738
2 hrs ago   #846
At least I have more than strong opinions to back up my positions

Except of course you don't. Just opinions bordering on obsession about a culture you and almost nobody else understands.

Next you'll be calling the EU the Fourth Reich.

Enough people already do, however economic imperialism will obviously do for now unless they continue use to deteriorate.

Birmingham ...Ruhr

They really are chalk and cheese; there are several regions on the island which correspond closer to the Ruhr valley. As I say, never try to understand things that not outsider in history has succeeded in understanding.

where hooded people scream and hold banners with "From the river to the sea",

We have that too. Those are largely just words from people who can do nothing, however the people with such banners do get prosecuted when it is feasible to do so. A healthy tradition of demonstrations is fine, as long as they're spontaneous rather than carefully planned and as long as society uses the full force of the law when laws are broken.

Chat group leak reveals far-right fantasies of Germany's AfD

Among tens of thousands of posts is talk of jailing Angela Merkel, calls for armed resistance, and homophobia

As I said earlier, fascists are like wolves in sheep's' clothing. They try to pass themselves off as reasonable, pretend their supporters have valid concerns or that there's some sort of existential risk to society (generally blaming migration or ethnic minorities) and when they get a sniff of power, they reveal their true face.

I'd worry about Hungary too; they're already meddling in Ukraine at Putler's behest and they're only a short drive or train ride into Germany with no real borders.
Tacitus  2 | 1339
2 hrs ago   #847
I'd be delighted if you could prove me wrong. Always funny to bring that up against a friend of mine who is a die-hard lefty, but really uncomfortable with some of the voices inside the party and their views on Israel.
Tacitus  2 | 1339
1 hr ago   #848
there are several regions on the island which correspond closer to the Ruhr valley

Two regions that rose to prominence during the industrial revolution, became main hubs for the manufacturing industry and never fully recovered when those industries disappeared. Quite a lot of parralels there.

And to be honest, this comparison wasn't my idea. It was made by a fellow student at Durham university who came from Birmingham and who had spent some time in the Ruhe Valley. He said he feld a kinship there.

Just opinions

This is really the problem with populism isn't it? That you can not have reasonable discussions anymore because the other side simply ignores all evidence that contradicts their views.

however economic imperialism will obviously do for now

There is an actual imperialist power in Europe waging a war against a peaceful country right now.

The Ukrainians are currently facing imperialism down and as a result want to join the EU.

Before 2015 and especially 2022 those defamations were just stupid. Now they are also making light of the kind of evil Ukraine is opposing.

And btw also an often-used argument to excuse Russian imperialism. Because after all, if the EU is imperialistic, why shouldn't Russia be allowed to do the same?
jon357  72 | 23738
1 hr ago   #849
Quite a lot of parralels there.

There are much better parallels. Your friend was probably being polite. It's worth remembering where the Industrial Revolution started in the 1750s.

This is really the problem with populism isn't it?

The problem with populism is that so much of it is about subverting overly restrictive legal frameworks and rigid and unspontaneous cultural world views that lack a safety valve for the personal gain of its backers.

if the EU is imperialistic

Economically, you and I both know that it is.

However you are being rather upierdliwy, and this discussion isn't moving forward the genuine concerns about the reemergence of fascism in Germany. A cynic or a sceptic would suggest that attempts at defection are present. So, what do you think about the attempts at interference in elections by that Musk character?
Novichok  4 | 8907
1 hr ago   #850
But the case against the AfD is not built on the presence of some AfD members on demonstrations

Go ahead...Make your case against the AfD - in your own words...No links, quotes, feelings, or adjectives, please...

Just numbers...GDP, migrants, unemployment, prices,...stuff like this...

by that Musk character?

Musk is not a character. He is a real person who decided, at a great loss to himself, to be an American patriot.
jon357  72 | 23738
1 hr ago   #851
Make your case against the AfD - in your own words.

Tacitus does very much know what he's talking about when assessing the political landscape in his own country. And there's no reason he should agree to your silly demands about quotes. I disagree with his assessment of UK society and politics however when discussing internal German matters his views are sound and most important,y from someone there.

Musk is not a character

He's a vile character and a wannabe Bond Villain. The fascist salutes should give you a clue about his character.
Novichok  4 | 8907
52 mins ago   #852
Tacitus does very much know what he's talking about when assessing the political landscape in his own country.

Then he should be able to make his case for or against AfD - in his own words.

And there's no reason he should agree to your silly demands about quotes.

Go to any HS debate and see if they allow links and quotes as rebuttals. Only Western bootlicking cowards debate by proxies. "It's not me. It's him".

Look up "coward" and "plausible deniability". Also "seems" and "it appears"...
jon357  72 | 23738
42 mins ago   #853
Why would anyone have to "make a case"?

HS

What is that?
Novichok  4 | 8907
36 mins ago   #854
Could you please let him speak for himself?

If you are eager to join...here is a question for you...

When did the UK government ask UK voters - directly and in simple English - if they want more migrants?

If you fail to respond in good faith, I will take it as "Never".

While you are thinking, stay out of my conversation with PF Germans. They know English very well.
jon357  72 | 23738
19 mins ago   #855
Could you please let him speak for himself?

This from you? The discussion here moves sluggishly but effectively without your input.

If you fail to

There you go again. You are not in a position to make demands or set conditions.

The problems that Europe face have very little to do with immigration; it is simply a paper tiger that rules up the lowest common denominator.
Novichok  4 | 8907
11 mins ago   #856
without your input.

I didn't input anything. I just asked a question.

Where did you find the word "demand"?

The problems that Europe face

I didn't ask what problems Europe has.

I asked this:

When did the UK government ask UK voters - directly and in simple English - if they want more migrants?

They were asked about Brexit.

If you don't know, just say: I am too ignorant to answer that question.

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