Lodz vs Wroclaw - difference in mentality of people?

Ah... the "if you dont like it get out" argument. I like to hear it from Poles the most, as they take the greatest offense when someone who is not Polish criticizes or complains about their country, and literally one minute later, in Polish, among their friends, "co za chujowy kraj".

Pawian, Im not bad-tempered, Im a realist and I consider things like public transportation and parking an important aspect of living in a city rather than "oooh how peeeerty them buildings look". In that regard I found that the smaller cities are far cheaper, more comfortable and nicer to live in, some of them from the top of my head were Legnica, Torun, Bialystok, Swidnica, and Czestochowa.

Thats a no, no, no...
Apparently you never lived there.
There are several thing you can't do when you live near the spiritual capital of a country. To go there as a tourist or pilgrim is one thing, but to live there is completly another thing.

Personaly I pity people who live in Częstochowa, £ódź and Oświęcim.

What are you talking about? Don't you know £ódzkie voivodeship? £ódź is not in Mazowieckie.

Mind boggling ;)
Two days ago I was talking with £ódź city official and he complained for four hours about Warsaw taking £ódź money. He completly brainwashed me ;D

Try the article in "Polityka" : "Boat people, life in the trains £ódź-Warszawa". I always wondered why did people spend so much time in traffic, driving 120 km one way (say Barrie-Toronto). Nothing beats this, (in Polish):


polityka

If you tried to ride through Warsaw in ruch hours it would take more time than riding by a train from £ódź to Warsaw. This is the paradox.

Very interesting article. Each day 250 thousand people from £ódź goes to Warsaw to work there.
For me it would be a terrible perspective. I like to travel ;) but thats to much...

They were quite right. Krakow doesn`t need those Russians from former Russian partition. :):):):)


You got me wrong. I wasn`t annoyed by your attitude when I gave you that piece of advice. I am just worried about your mental health. I care about it as one day, under too much stress, you might snap and do sth crazy. That is all.

No, never lived there but visited a few times and from I saw, heard and experienced, looks like a good place to live. But WTH, I really have no idea what you mean by there being things you "cant" do there, that is incredibly vague. No premarital sex? Half the the people I met had children and werent married. No drinking? Get real... What is it?

A priest from a village near Gniezno told me once how people from there called people from near village - Słupca. They called them Poles :)

Near Słupca was once border between Prussian and Russian annexed territories...

more than 1/3rd of £ódź? No kidding.

Wow, Im not that wound up. If I see something wrong I say what I think. Considering the amount of BS in the world, its kind of refreshing, wouldnt you say?

But actually that sounds quite appetizing, have a complete breakdown and go on some rampage with my firearms, seems like a good way to go, but fear not, no innocent bystanders will get hurt. Ive got morals, you know? So youre safe.

Well you can drink, have fun, but there are more restricions on that than in any other place in Poland. For example you have there clubs but they are under more control and restrictions and they are open seldomly than anywhere else.

The way of private life is also under more scrutinity. I'm not talking here about people who actually live there, but those who come there as pilgrims. They are coming there because of sanctuary and are behaving more zelaously than normally. They also tend to impose the same behaviour on others. If you live near sanctuary it is nothing new to you and you also behave normally. You sometimes drink, have fun and wear more reveling clothes in the summer. Pilgrims sometimes have problem with that. Thats all I wanted to point out.

People from Częstochowa are sick and tired of this, so if you will talk to them you will see that they have even more liberal views than other Poles. It's a reaction to strict rules that clergy and pilgrims are imposing on them.

My opinion on £ódź:

1. £ódź is not a tourist site. There is little to see.
2. £ódź is depopulating in favor of Warsaw and other big cities.
3. People from £ódź admit the ugliness of their city but at the same time they are very proud of their roots.
4. The downtown of £ódź is really run down. There are many derilict or crumbling building there, but it's the soul of the city. £ódź without it wouldn't be £ódź anymore.

5. Besides Stare Bałuty and Śródmieście (the downtown) for which the old crumbling tenement houses are typical, £ódź composes of other dictricts/areas which look completely differently. I don't agree with Alligator that living in £ódź is in any way a torment.

6. The night life in £ódź is very poor recently.
7. Piotrkowska street doesn't look well even though most building have been renovated in recent years. The tacky pavement stone from the 90s ruins the effect. Also the architectural chaos and poor selection of shops doesn't help. Unfortunately Piotrkowska has changed from a trade street to a shotbar and kebab street. If someone takes a turn from Piotrkowska st. in any direction (or peep into backyard of fabulous facades on Piotrkowska) will find himself in few meters among run down buildings.

8. £ódź has many social problems. There is a huge mix of people from different walks of life living together but the lowests of the social ladder are the ones who most stand out.

9. £ódź is not huge in terms of area, hence it doesn't take long to get form one to the other end of the city. Municipal communication is quite ok, barring some few exceptions.

10. £ódź is one of the most atheistic cities in Poland, so if someone expect a colourful celebrations during religious holidays might be disappointed.

In regard to OP's query, I would suggest him to choose Wrocław.

Wroclaw for sure. Wroclaw is a beautiful city, especially the old town/town square. not to mention the bridges. there is so much more to see in Wroclaw, and overall the whole city looks much better and neater compared to Lodz. Apart from Piotrkowska street, there is absolutely nothing to do over there. The vast majority of the city looks like ****, and its not a tourist city. Wroclaw is more touristy, but I don't really think there is any touristy cities in Poland, apart from Krakow. Even Krakow is not all that touristy last time I went in summer of 2011. All my Polish friends told me not to go there, I asked them why? Its a beautiful old city. They said its too touristy and there are way too many of them in the summer. I go there in the summer and there were not many at all. You would have some big groups here and there, but generally there was tons of room to walk around and take pictures. If you want to see a true touristy city, go to Venice in the summer time.

I've been to both. Lived in £ódź for a month or two and visited Wrocław on many occasions... hands down go to Wrocław! It's beautiful! £ódź is grey and industrial but with a few nice places.

Just got back from Lodz. This is my 2nd visit and disliked it more than the first time. It seriously feels like I am traveling back in time. Their main attraction is a cemetery and a shopping mall? Rest of the city is dismal, grey and depressing. I go there for family reasons but seriously, if you come from a medium to large sized city in North America and enjoy what a city has to offer, you will dislike this place. If you like fog and damp weather, it's great!! Biggest entertainment was the launching of fireworks on New Year's. Was a lot but my first question was what about fires? Then the news comes a few days later about people dying as a result of fires on New Year's. The locals will defend the cities reputation to the bitter end all the while hating it with another breath. Strange place. So happy to be back home!

First off Warsaw is not ugly. Second why are you considering these two cities? Lodz is like an industrial blue collar city it's like Toronto of Poland LOL. Wroclaw is much more appealing as a tourist city but keep in mind this is originally a German city. So not really the true Polish Experience. You should go to Zakopane if you are in the area. It's the location of the highest peak in Poland in regards to the Carpathian Mountains.

moved from

Maybe part of it is I hate this city Lodz in a way. From these dirtbags brudasy Polak patologia who walk around and others who have their dogs shet in middle of sidewalks or constant dog shet everywhere and trash and little kids just throwing it on the street to just how boring and mindless it is with almost no attractive women and a bunch of people missing their front teeth. To the racism against Ukrainians I see or just how these low lives act. It is literally like an abyss. This town. I miss small towns or country side even in Poland I am sure Id be much happier there. It is hard to even get myself to want to go outside here even if the weather is good. most likely I know Ill see someone with their dog taking a **** in the middle of the street and not clean it.

i can see when being in such cities or places why the west used to talk about Poland or look at Poland as such a depressing downward spiral country and place. such a grey sullen place with no life in it. these people you cant even interact with them even if you wanted to and there would be an interesting conversarion to be had which there never is, they just go to these bars or restaurants or public places in their own little groups. only in smaller towns or urban places people are friendly or would even talk to you.

But why, why are there so many ugly places in Poland like Lodz, Mielec, Ruda Slaska with its commie flats on the main square, Sosnowiec, Katowice and the other satellites around it?

For comparison the ugliest city in Czechia is just one - Most. They even consider Usti nad Labem ugly and industrial but it's more beautiful than all of the above Polish towns and cities.

Even before the war Polish towns looked drab and industrial so it's not because of destruction. Industrial cities in Czechia looked like Plzeň - quite nice market square or the striking Klatovy. Even in Czech Silesia the towns look better than the Polish ones just across the border.

Czechia vs Poland feel like Portugal vs Spain - Spaniards love building ugly high rise apartments even on the Canary islands. They ruined their coastal areas with overbuilding. Meanwhile Portugal has preserved, lower-rise classical buildings in coastal towns and Madeira looks more beautiful than the Tenerife concrete jungle. Even Czech commie flats look higher quality than those in Poland. I guess Poland has been mismanaged politically since before the 1st partition even.

@JakeRyan
Well you don't get it that any Pole wasn't highly motivated to work for any occupant for cheap no cash at all, maybe in Czechia Czechs made top quality tanks for the Germans to roll over in Europe and in to Russia ;)

But Poles generally speaking are highly unmotivated to work for enemies. So if commies wanted quality buildings, they could take a hike!

So you'd be stubborn and have your capital destroyed. Czechs turned out smarter in the wrong term honestly. Now they don't have as much woe is me mentality as Poles.

Poles have the ability to rebuild things, new trends come and go. But, don't come here and tell me nor anyone that Czechs are better.

You are the one here on Polish forums, talking out of your other end. It doesn't improve my view about you at all, you might be bored. But to me, Poland is more important just like Czechia seems more important to you.

I could talk about Czechs being Austrian copycats without their own culture having Vienna version 2 as Prague. What is there to lose there for you? Even bricks are most likely Austrian, but I rather write about wanting to experience how Czech beer tastes cause I don't. Even tho I dislike beer

So it's up to, you put another card on the table or go to the bar and take a drink basically