Real Estate / Thinking of buying an offplan Luxury Property Wroclaw [79]

what kind of place are you looking for? how big? what location?

Law / The 'Secret' of Poland's Economic Success [83]

Nika wrote:


uuuhhmmmm.....well.....yeah, kinda. when you can hire 3 people to do one person's job (and pay the same for it), 2 of them can be under-qualified as long as one of them isn't.....the other two push paper and make coffee for their boss and so the world turns.......

Nika wrote:


what would give you that silly idea? man, i have seen so much in my 3+ years here in Poland being in and out of companies and talking to thousands of people.....I could write some stuff about companies that would blow the doors off this conversation but I'd hate to expose/incriminate anyone or any company. to me, the "secret", as so many others have already pointed out, is obvious, and it's not Poland's ultra-economy savvy government or their "highly skilled and qualified workers".

A bunch of old timers who grew up in communist times running the country's government (maybe 3 of which can actually speak some English to hold a conversation with another country's president/prime minister.....come to think of it, I've never seen a Polish diplomat speaking anything but Polish on television......ever...) along with a work force sporting Master's Degrees that are given away in Poland like fliers in the Krakow rynek.

I know it's fun, and it feels good to be proud of Poland's recent success.....I'm happy to be in a country that is "on the up and up" so to speak, but let's not be delusional about it.

Life / Do expats living in Poland speak Polish? [233]

it's true, most expats no matter how long they've been here, can barely string a decent sentence together, which in my opinion is pathetic.

if I may add, when saying someone is "fluent" in Polish......think of it this way: for an English teacher, how many students do you come accross who are "fluent" in English? I've taught thousands, and I can count the number of fluent speakers on one.....maybe two hands. And English is the international language......and they've been exposed to it since they were young.....and have probably been studying it for over 10 years......THAT is the chances of finding a fluent expat Polish speaker in Poland.

Life / Do expats living in Poland speak Polish? [233]

beelzebub wrote:


considering you don't speak fluent Polish, i'd question whether even that one person is actually fluent for you have no way of judging for yourself.

fluent to me is CAE. achieving a level of Polish comparable to CAE would take eons.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but i've been here long enough and have been studying this language long enough to know what an expat is up against with Polish.....i've yet to meet someone even in the same galaxy as fluent.

Life / Do expats living in Poland speak Polish? [233]

Zman wrote:


to verify such a crazy submission, let's ask first for some facts:

how long were you "born and raised here"??? you are not at a native speaker's level for it would then be impossible for a foreigner to be at your level of Polish, so when did you leave Poland, and when did you return?

How long have the "3 expats" been living in Poland?

Life / Why do you choose to stay in Poland, why not other country? [152]


in what, an alien spacecraft? Poland to Holland in 3 hours? Denmark? WHAT? Literally impossible unless you fly, and flying....well....if you got that kinda dough, all the power to you.

Life / Why do you choose to stay in Poland, why not other country? [152]

convex wrote:


i used to think that too, but the fact of the matter is, I can't afford to travel anywhere outside of Poland anyway for I don't own a car and buying plane tickets when you're earning zloties is generally out of the question. Sure, i can fly to London/Dublin for under 200 zloties round trip, but the geographic location of Poland doesn't make the trip any easier/closer.

regarding costs in Poland, being from America, I find Poland unbelievably expensive.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]

Delphiandomine wrote:


No, i'm looking at it with the "why waste my time with a management position if I'm going to be paid less and given more responsibility" point of view. And again, like I said, I would never take a director's position if I couldn't speak Polish very very well. It simply doesn't work.

Delphiandomine wrote:


again, not what I saw. A year ago when the crisis hit, the ones who got eliminated from schools I either worked for or were familiar with, were the non-natives who weren't pulling their weight, had too many complaints or not enough requests from their students/classes, etc. So basically, the natives stayed, and the 25 year old girls with a "master's degree in English Philology" along with spending at the most 1 month in an English speaking country, got the boot.

You know, the Polish teachers who say things like, "I don't know what should I do."

Delphiandomine wrote:


well, if you're not a complete tool, go find another job at another language school. Of the schools I'm currently working for, I am the ONLY native speaker in both of them. There is always work for a GOOD native. The way I deal with bad directors is to simply do a kick a$$ job, get requested and offered lots of contracts as a result, and without me saying anything they are forced to be careful with how they are towards me. Simples. Hard work always pays off one way or another.

Delphiandomine wrote:


and this reflects the Polish business model, time and time again. they simply don't understand that "you have to spend money to make money". like I said, when the crisis began, I didn't see natives getting the axe, but when you have 1....maybe 2 natives working for you and half your contracts specifically request a native, letting the natives go is company suicide.

Delphiandomine wrote:


again, I live in a major city, and not only is it hard to find a native, but the odds start to near "needle in a haystack" to find a GOOD, responsible and experienced native.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]


dead on. I currently take home more than the director at my school, I know this for a fact, and I never exceed 30 lessons per week.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]


I agree as well, it's a language thing. if you want to be anything more than a teacher......speaking Polish becomes a necessity. talking to potential clients, dealing with issues with students.....Polish, Polish, Polish. Basically nobody from a foreign country speaks Polish at that level, hence, they never become anything else but a "teacher". I've been offered positions or have been recommended for them and I always need to bring up, "my Polish isn't at a sufficient level for that position." I wouldn't take a job like that unless I could really rock and roll in Polish.

also, I flat out never want to be in a situation where I need to deal with Poles on a daily basis making business decisions. I'm forced to quite often because they come to me for advice/guidance on this and that, but I keep a distance because it's simply not worth my time (or aggravation). I've seen enough to know I need to stay away. In language schools, it's an absolute clusterf#@k.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]


I see what I just described above routinely. Who else is going to work for 1800zl. net per month?

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]


anyone else tired of this excuse? the "we could do better but.....but it's a Polish thing"....excuse.


it's a major problem. what advice would you give a manager of 20 Poles, between the ages of 23-25.....who have NEVER had a job.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]

I'm waiting for the inevitable posts from the die-hard Poland defenders. If we could only tie this thread into the other thread from a few days ago discussing why so many foreigners from America, the U.K., France, etc. come here and take high level positions and how "any Pole could do what those guys are doing" and that these foreigners are a waste of money and....and....and....and.....

this forum routinely cracks me up.

Work / Is it normal for companies/schools in Poland to be rude? [116]


yes, it's normal. Language schools out here are notorious for being poorly managed, right up to the biggest most popular schools in the cities. I've dealt with several of them and know several teachers working for other schools all over the country, the story never changes. It's not just language schools but simply Polish business sense, or lack thereof. I teach my lessons, make sure my a$$ is covered and my paperwork is in, and I go home.

Watching good businesses being wasted away by poor management and abysmal business sense is something you simply will have to get used to, but just remember that these business people are dealing with Polish customers who share a common culture and are most likely used to this sort of thing.

THIS is another reason why Poland needs to hire foreigners to run their companies. Even if the Polish manager currently in place is competent, he's gotta know how to manage 50 incompetent employees.....no small task.

Flame away, but sometimes I just can't help but tie in one thread to another, but so many of these threads talking about issues in Poland all boil down to just a few main reasons, this being one of them, and a big one.

Life / Fat People in Poland? [161]


is this a joke?

in general, the avg. polish man/woman under the age of 25 seems to be thinner in Poland, but it's merely lifestyle, not the food. have you taken a look at Polish food lately? everything is with bread, butter, fried, lots of meat and potatoes....hardly weight-loss food, and most Polish people eat it. the "other" food is too expensive.

in America, you can choose to be thin or fat, and eat all different kinds of food for around the same price, a big difference between America and Poland. also, there are over 300 million people in America, meaning if 20% of the population is fat, that's larger than the entire population of Poland, so fat people simply appear more in the media due to the sheer number (and size, haha) of their fat asses.

getting back to lifestyle: in America, once you are of driving age, you get a car. everyone in America works once they're 16-17 years old....owning a car is a necessity, not a luxury. in Poland, most people don't get their first car till they are at least 26-27 adn don't get their first job till they're finished with their "master's", so they all walk everywhere till they can finally afford an old used car.

The American infrastructure is set up to be fast and convenient. If you want to exercise, that's also easily accessed and readily available. some decide to exercise, some don't, but for the ones that don't, because of the infrastructure, the American will tend to be fatter simply due to less movement.

Also worth noting, when i'm in America, regardless of what city, you see runners and cyclists EVERYWHERE. In Poland, they're few and far between, especially amongst the older residents.

something I love about Polish culture if I may add is the number of times I hear, "i was in the mountains this weekend." outdoor people are OK in my eyes. they really have an appreciation for forests, trees, mountains, etc., and it seems to be countrywide.

Language / Polish was chosen the HARDEST LANGUAGE in the world to learn... :D [1558]


define "fully".

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]


never said it was any different for other languages, just commenting on a previous comment.


tell that to some of my students. i will never understand how someone can take lessons for years, constantly hear english in the media most especially in their face on TV every day, yet they still can't form decent sentences in English. When I consider how far I've gotten in Polish through hard work and sweat and also considering there is basically nothing as far as Polish learning materials compared to English, it amazes me how bad people speak English after years of study. amazes me. Learning Polish is like slamming your head against the wall and I am approaching intermediate level with it......not being able to speak English at an intermediate level results from nothing else but pure laziness. As for Poles specifically, not knowing English is pure stupidity. Once you leave your country, you flat out cannot communicate. How can someone live like that. Pure isolationism, and it's more common in Poland than most of you are willing to admit.

Wait......hmmm....maybe I just listed a reason for having "foreign businessmen/businesswomen" in Poland........?.........give me time, maybe they'll start trickling in......

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]


truly a ridiculous statement. are you trying to tell me that a country that was COMMUNIST 20 years ago has today enough experienced businessmen/businesswomen that bringing in British, French, American people to take high positions in companies is all......"Poland's inferiority complex"? Really? It's all for no reason? They don't have something the Poles lack....whatsoever? Stop it. I refuse to elaborate further on why this is true because it will only result in flaming from the "overly sensitive side".

but this is a good start:


Delphiandomine wrote:


You're not a native speaker, therefore, your opinion doesn't count. As a native speaker of English, I've never met a single Pole that even comes close to a native. Even Polish English teachers....the best the school has to offer.....they simply can't compare.


uuuuhhhmmmm......so what you're saying is that a native knows the language thoroughly, natively as a matter of fact, and when they are given a job to do, they already know how to do it.......but a Polish English teacher needs to put in "serious effort" to pick up a new topic.......geeze.....and you call that "the only real advantage"? You sure grouped a lot of things into "the only advantage" don't you think?

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]


i'd be curious as to how many Americans actually live/work in Poland. here in Wroclaw, i'd venture to say under 100. country wide? 3,000 is probably an overestimate. of those 3,000, they're either teaching English or are transplants working as managers, directors, presidents, etc. Of these mentioned jobs, each and every one of them significantly improve Poland's economy in the long run. Showing Poles how to operate big businesses and teaching them English. Good deal.

Telling America that gaining residency is now going to be more difficult till you implement the VWP for Poland is hardly a bargaining chip.


why is that unfortunate? what were the adverse effects?

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]


it was a trade off. join the EU and reap the benefits of that, but risk lots of Poles leaving.

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]

I would doubt "having property" is an automatic visa for Poles. it would be easy to fenagle something like that on paper. mommy and daddy pay for the apt., you live in it and it's under both the current resident's name and the parents as well as co-signers. that person then goes to the US and never comes back, parents can then for example rent the place out to someone else in the meantime, etc. etc.

anywho, when i think of Poland, it's in a unique situation. the western countries have better industry, better cities, better weather, more tourism, more people from developed countries living there, etc. Because of this, less desire to leave it. Less desire to leave means less people overstaying visas elsewhere because they are happy with where they were born.

on the other side of the spectrum, you have the poorer countries. in general, they can't afford to travel around, and very few speak english. it is also worth noting that these countries generally don't have a sanctuary to go to in say America, meaning, a city with thousands of Botswanians or Estonians so that they can find work and support groups to help them along in the beginning.

Poland is kinda in between. economy is up, but mainly due to foreign investors. there are some rich Poles in Poland, but most people earn shite wages and live with mom and dad in a 50 sq. meter apt. Affording a decent car is near impossible and buying a nice house near your job on typical wages.....utterly impossible. Not to mention, they're always just a bit behind the rest of Europe.

As far as going to America, it's tempting for several reasons. Aside from an obviously higher standard of living, basic essentials are affordable. Also, you have many Polish sanctuaries in America. You can get off the plane with literally no English and be perfectly fine in Chicago, Greenpoint Brooklyn, etc. etc. Not to mention, you're almost guaranteed to have at the very least a second cousin or some distant uncle living there to hook up with when you arrive.

With all that said, the American govt. knows it, and knows it better than any of us do. They know the stats regardless as to whether they put them on the internet or not. The VWP has not been granted to Poland and I'm sure that if there are any bad reasons for it, there are just as many good reasons for them denying Poland. Not to mention, let us not forget about the fact that the Polish govt. very well may not want to be part of it due to the possibility of an exodus of skilled laborers along with highly educated people to give "the American dream" a shot. all too often I have students that fit those profiles and after their first visit to America, they are blown away and say, "if I had the opportunity to live/work there, I would." DISCLAIMER: not everyone of course, but several.

USA, Canada / REFUSED A HOLIDAY VISA TO THE U.S CAUSE IM POLISH [323]

it's worth noting that the Czech Republic, a country that used to have visa free travel privileges to Canada, no longer does. The Canadian govt. discovered a large concentration of Czechs living there illegally along with refugee applications, and now the Czech Republic needs a visa to travel to Canada.

Poland still has visa free travel rights to Canada (with the new Biometric passports).....is that discrimination against the Czechs or is it just because the Czechs break the law too often and the Poles, according to Canada's statistics/requirements, still meet their requirements for visa free travel?

I can assure you that if the Poles start piling up in Canada illegally like they are in the USA, the Poles will be the next to lose visa free travel privileges to Canada.

I mean.....is it that difficult to understand? Hell, while I was in the USA, without even looking I knew of several Poles living there illegally, and I didn't live in NYC, Michigan, Pittsburgh, Chicago, etc.

They're all over the states, illegally. Believe it. If I have to read another poster say how upset they are over Poland not being part of the VWP, I'm gonna puke.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]


huh? man, your responses are not only weak, but completely childish. that's the equivalent of saying, "WELL YOUR FEET SMELL SO NEEEEAHHHHH!" this forum is for adults. once you're old enough to see over the kitchen table, try here again.

do you have a polish passport Delph?

do you have any Polish blood?

you'd be surprised with my answers to those questions pappy.....;)

if i may conclude my thread:

basically, i have been reading threads on this forum for a few months now. of all the Polish forums out there, this one always struck me as the most ridiculous. not the website itself, but the posters. after some time, i noticed that there were a lot of people not only commenting on Poland (after living here for 3 months thinking they had it all figured out) but about America as well, 2 places I know well.

this thread proved to me just how empty the opinions/discourses/views of this forum's posters truly are when making Poland/America judgements and/or comments in general. internet jockies, propaganda kool-aid drinkers, and radio maria listeners that not only are out of touch within their own country but most certainly utterly clueless about the USA......and let me tell you.....there are some ALL-STARS on this forum.....true epitomies of that description. i don't know why, but they all seem to congregate to this website and it's downright embarrassing to read at times.

If I had to give out an award for "Most Pathetic and Embarrassing Entry", the award would have to go to the crowd favorite, "Delphiandomine". When confronted with a post stating how he "talks the talk but can't walk the walk", his response to this was.....wait for it......wait for it........


just precious. if only that quote could be placed into his avatar space for all to see with each and every one of his posts from here on out. better yet, it should be right on the front page of his website. you know, his website which advertises counsel or any kind of assistance to foreigners regarding paperwork or other things to make their stay in Poland easier. I'd give you the web address but I'm sure you're all sick of seeing it posted all over this forum already.

so, my congratulations to you, Mr. Delphiandomine! Wear it loud! Wear it proud!

for the select few that posted on this thread that met my criteria, thanks for playing.

for those that didn't satisfy my criteria yet still couldn't resist the urge to post on this thread....thanks for playing too.

-The Fuzz

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]

Ola243 wrote:


i don't eat fast food, live in an eastern european country, study languages, i'm thin, eat steak at best twice a year and hated George Bush.

am I obviously not American?

welcome to reality. there are more poles than you think that don't share the same blind patriotism as you do.

now go back and listen to more of your uncle's B.S. about how capitalism is bad and make sure to get your daily dose of radio maria today.


on the contrary.

it is doing exactly what it was designed to do. that being, to exploit and weed out those who no nothing about nothing when they form opinions about likes/dislikes regarding America and Poland for they have no basis to make these opinions.

this post is #65. this thread has been up for 3 days. from what i can see, only 2.....maaaaybe 3 people have met my criteria. this criteria shouldn't be too much to ask for considering the topic at hand. one would think that in order to make judgments about 2 countries, strong judgments at that, you would at the very LEAST have to spend some time in each.

this entire forum is infested with Ola243's and Delphiandomine's. they talk the talk but can't walk the walk.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]

ola243 wrote:


yeah, you're right. because things like saaaaaaaayy....communism is a desirable thing. yeah, they should have stayed in Poland and continued to wait on line for hours for a loaf of bread and some vinegar. let freedom ring!

i hear working in mines was real lucrative as well. what were they thinking walking away from a job opportunity like that?

not to mention, are you suggesting that the MILLIONS of Poles that went to America and NEVER CAME BACK stayed there because the dream they thought existed......doesn't exist? it was all a "false dream"?

have you worked/lived in the USA, or are you another person wasting our time on this thread speaking from no experience? lay off the propaganda kool-aid my friend and don't type till you have legs to stand on.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]


yep, and it works both ways. the questions I get from Americans about Poland......embarrassing. I keep telling myself, "i couldn't have been THAT ignorant before I came."

It's all in how the rest of the world, or a select country for that matter, is portrayed through magazines, television programs/news programs, culture, kitchen table discussions, etc. If you're a 10 year old kid and you hear enough times how "France sucks, I won't buy their wine anymore," after a while some start to get the same mindset, even if they don't know why.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]

Delphiandomine, is it really that difficult to follow simple rules? you could choose ANY thread on this forum and post your senseless babble on it but you insist on posting here when I specifically asked you to stay away. you know what this thread is about, the criteria I requested and you know you don't satisfy them all.

I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that you have never lived/worked in America, rendering your opinions on this thread useless. we don't want to hear it.

Maybe you just don't get it in English....sprobuje wyasnic w inny sposob:

no spadaj stad no! kurcze pieczone, to co, po prostu ciagle piszesz tu ale w ogole nie zwracasz uwagi na to co juz pisalem do ciebie?! Masz dziure w glowie? Prosze pana, wydaje mi sie ze dajesz mi sie we znaki.......bez powodu.

zobaczymy czy to dziala czy nie.......

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]


the domestic stuff is generally crap, but the micro-brews.....ahhhh, the microbrews, and they're available in basically any liquor store for the same price as an import. the best beer I've ever had is from America. Fat Tire from Colorado, Anchor Steam from San Francisco, Brooklyn Brewery....the list goes on.


not really. Lech, Zywiec, Tyskie, Warka, Zubr, Okocim, Piast....all sub-par beers, and all basically the same in character/taste. In Poland, I drink imports. I would like to try more of the hard-to-find Polish beers, maybe they're good, but as a whole, no, Polish beer isn't good and doesn't hold a candle next to the other "beer countries." Czech Rep., Slovakia, Belgium, Ireland, England, Netherlands, arguably Germany as well, all have better mass produced beer on the shelves.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]

What I like about the USA:

convenience.

great road systems.

ethnic food.

cheap food.

the almost limitless choices of food.

the ocean.

opportunity in general and the accessibility of goods in general.

NYC.

amazing sport fishing.

MLB, NFL, NHL. there's always something to watch on TV.

all the other TV programs on at night, every night, that have you laughing the whole time. I love American comedy.

Pizza. Pizza deserves it's own line.

Coke/Pepsi products that actually taste like Coke/Pepsi products.

parking.

customer service.

someone else mentioned micro-brews.....I second that.

What I like about Poland:

life is slower, more deliberate and one could argue that it's more simplistic because of it's slow pace.

safety. by 10:00 o'clock, the city shuts down completely excluding the rynek and you can walk around your neighborhood feeling safe.

pork products. the pork in Poland is superior to the pork in America.

chicken standing alone i'd say is better in Poland as well, but I prefer American recipes.

families are close.

ok.....gotta say it.....polish women. sure, plenty of them are neurotic, but my fiance is amazing.


Because if you don't meet the criteria in my OP, what I just wrote above would have been impossible. This is "PolishForums"......I'm not going to start a thread discussing just America. Go back and read my OP. The thread was inspired by previous threads about similar things, only my thread weeds out people passing judgment that have never lived/worked in country. You know....opinions worth listening to. Sorry pappy.


hell, i'm all for it. I meet all those criteria (to keep things honest, I'd say I'm an intermediate speaker but entirely communicative, my grammar far exceeds what I consider to be my small vocabulary, but I study non-stop....it's getting better and better every day) and because of this, I see Poland/America with different eyes than most.

hence, why I started this thread. real opinions from experienced people, not from some internet jockey.

feel free to make your own thread like you mentioned, just don't post here.

USA, Canada / Do you speak English? Have you lived in America? New LOVE/HATE list......... [144]

Delphiandomine wrote:


Please see post #6.


surely better than your eyesight/reading comprehension.