Torq
11 Sep 2025
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Yes, that's curious - if they ran out of fuel shouldn't they crash? It's as if someone landed them exactly where they were supposed to land.
Let's read and analyze everything, from both sides. Surely that's what's being done "by those whose job it is to do it", so let's imitate those wisemen. :)
just planed and landed in the fields, almost intact
Yes, that's curious - if they ran out of fuel shouldn't they crash? It's as if someone landed them exactly where they were supposed to land.
More feeble orc attempts to obfuscate.
Let's read and analyze everything, from both sides. Surely that's what's being done "by those whose job it is to do it", so let's imitate those wisemen. :)
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
The best calm and balanced way to deal with such violations of airspace would be sending accidental unarmed drones to Królewiec and Belarus, and giving Ukraine 100 drones and 1000 Starlinks every time it happens.
But then they would really be tempted to send those drones themselves! xD
The best calm and balanced way to deal with such violations of airspace would be sending accidental unarmed drones to Królewiec and Belarus, and giving Ukraine 100 drones and 1000 Starlinks every time it happens.
But then they would really be tempted to send those drones themselves! xD
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / The most pro-Russian Polish politicians [14]
Good point.
By pro-Russian I meant the perception of their actions by the general society (as in the examples given in the opening post).
Also, being perceived as pro-Russian does not disqualify a politician in public eyes (Mentzen and even Braun enjoy a solid, steady support).
How about judging them for their job as Polish politicians?
Good point.
By pro-Russian I meant the perception of their actions by the general society (as in the examples given in the opening post).
Also, being perceived as pro-Russian does not disqualify a politician in public eyes (Mentzen and even Braun enjoy a solid, steady support).
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
If so, then my opinion of Putin has just dropped significantly.
After the provocation there are voices in the EU to send more aid to Ukraine, and what's the point of helping to strenghten the air defence of NATO East Flank which is Putin's obvious next target?
Testing Polish reaction and NATO response is the most commonsensical explanation.
Putin's cunning plan
If so, then my opinion of Putin has just dropped significantly.
After the provocation there are voices in the EU to send more aid to Ukraine, and what's the point of helping to strenghten the air defence of NATO East Flank which is Putin's obvious next target?
Testing Polish reaction and NATO response is the most commonsensical explanation.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
The shopkeepers can actually fly and shoot? Well, well, well... Fair play, to Latający Holendrzy. :)
Who is saying Ukraine "fake manufactured" those drones? Just curious because it takes a special kind of idiot to believe that.
Sure...
businessinsider.com/department-13-mesmer-drones-2017-1?IR=T
311institute.com/new-us-military-intercept-tech-lets-operators-take-control-of-enemy-drones/
yahoo.com/news/military-tech-hacks-takes-control-234956714.html
... the technology has been available for roughly a decade now (the second article is from 2017).
Yes, but he's certainly not retarded enough to believe that 19 unarmed drones would intimidate Poland. It was more about testing NATO response.
especially to the Dutch pilots
The shopkeepers can actually fly and shoot? Well, well, well... Fair play, to Latający Holendrzy. :)
I've seen people
Who is saying Ukraine "fake manufactured" those drones? Just curious because it takes a special kind of idiot to believe that.
Any links?
Sure...
businessinsider.com/department-13-mesmer-drones-2017-1?IR=T
311institute.com/new-us-military-intercept-tech-lets-operators-take-control-of-enemy-drones/
yahoo.com/news/military-tech-hacks-takes-control-234956714.html
... the technology has been available for roughly a decade now (the second article is from 2017).
Remember how he brought his dog to the meeting with Merkel even though it was common knowledge she's afraid of dogs?
Yes, but he's certainly not retarded enough to believe that 19 unarmed drones would intimidate Poland. It was more about testing NATO response.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Nobody says Ukraine produced or "fake manufactured" these drones, but they might have hacked them, taken over control and redirected them towards Poland. Such action would be nearly impossible to prove, so not much risk for Ukrainians and a lot to gain.
Nobody mentions it officially for fear of being called a ruska onuca etc. but there is such possibility and there were instances of both sides - Russians and Ukrainians - taking over the other side's drones.
However, taking into account that Zapad '25 is beginning soon and Putin feels strong support from China, he might well have ordered such provocation. Maybe to test the NATO response, maybe to scare us (lol). Russians sometimes act illogically. I'd say it's 65-35 chances between Putin f*cking around and Ukraine trying dirty tricks. So much more likely it was Russia.
The reason that it's happening is because the West wasn't decisive enough in 2022. I blame nuclear weapons. In the good old days, rotten, corrupt and weak countries who tried to f*ck around too much, very quickly found out. Nuclear weapons allow decomposing, stinking bodies of certain countries to be kept on life support. Disgusting.
It's against nature. It's against honour. It's against natural selection.
This is of course bullsh*t - some of the drones have much higher range and even the Gerberas were equipped with extra fuel tanks to increase their range.
Ukraine doesn't produce those drones and even if they decided to "fake manufacture" them it would be very risky considering how closely supervised the skies are in this conflict and how politically volatile it would be if it turned out they were sent by Ukraine
Nobody says Ukraine produced or "fake manufactured" these drones, but they might have hacked them, taken over control and redirected them towards Poland. Such action would be nearly impossible to prove, so not much risk for Ukrainians and a lot to gain.
He didn't mention the possibility of those drones being "taken over" by Ukrainians.
Nobody mentions it officially for fear of being called a ruska onuca etc. but there is such possibility and there were instances of both sides - Russians and Ukrainians - taking over the other side's drones.
However, taking into account that Zapad '25 is beginning soon and Putin feels strong support from China, he might well have ordered such provocation. Maybe to test the NATO response, maybe to scare us (lol). Russians sometimes act illogically. I'd say it's 65-35 chances between Putin f*cking around and Ukraine trying dirty tricks. So much more likely it was Russia.
The reason that it's happening is because the West wasn't decisive enough in 2022. I blame nuclear weapons. In the good old days, rotten, corrupt and weak countries who tried to f*ck around too much, very quickly found out. Nuclear weapons allow decomposing, stinking bodies of certain countries to be kept on life support. Disgusting.
It's against nature. It's against honour. It's against natural selection.
drones that they used for attacking Ukraine have only a range of 700 km
This is of course bullsh*t - some of the drones have much higher range and even the Gerberas were equipped with extra fuel tanks to increase their range.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
... not to mention still quite a few trained reservists (especially in AA defence ;)).
Setka z rana jak śmietana :D
Do I sound like I'm worried? Saint Virgin Mary has us in her protection always. Relax, Jonno.
a very large and skillful military, very good training and the tragic history of Polad and the rich history of its army
... not to mention still quite a few trained reservists (especially in AA defence ;)).
not least the vodka at 9am
Setka z rana jak śmietana :D
You shouldn't worry too much.
Do I sound like I'm worried? Saint Virgin Mary has us in her protection always. Relax, Jonno.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / The most pro-Russian Polish politicians [14]
Novi is half dead and a clown and he can still cause some annoyance in the forum. In the same way JKM can still cause some annoyance in Polish politics.
You should be writing for Polska Zbrojna ha ha
Well, he certainly is not a big friend of Ukraine.
C is half dead and a clown
Novi is half dead and a clown and he can still cause some annoyance in the forum. In the same way JKM can still cause some annoyance in Polish politics.
Polish intelligence services are competent, professional, know their job very well and care about Poland which they swear to protect
You should be writing for Polska Zbrojna ha ha
Nawrocki would had been closest
Well, he certainly is not a big friend of Ukraine.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Mostly in the civilian sector. As I said before, Poland is by and large a victim of her own success: a G20 economy, ever increasing wages, and practically zero unemployment make military jobs quite unattractive to most men with brains and balls. Also, the army is full of slightly retarded troglodytes who are there only because their dad or uncle was/is in the service.
In the old days it was 'za mundurem panny sznurem'; these days if you tell a girl you're in the army it's 'nie wiem co czuję, muszę to przemyśleć' haha :D
is in the civilian sector or abroad
Mostly in the civilian sector. As I said before, Poland is by and large a victim of her own success: a G20 economy, ever increasing wages, and practically zero unemployment make military jobs quite unattractive to most men with brains and balls. Also, the army is full of slightly retarded troglodytes who are there only because their dad or uncle was/is in the service.
In the old days it was 'za mundurem panny sznurem'; these days if you tell a girl you're in the army it's 'nie wiem co czuję, muszę to przemyśleć' haha :D
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / The most pro-Russian Polish politicians [14]
As in the thread title.
Of course, I don't mean muppets like Piskorski, Maciak or Tołwiński but proper politicians with at least a couple of percent support among Poles and active in/with some influence on mainline politics.
(A) Sławomir Mentzen (Konfederacja) - publicly called for a negotiated agreement with Vladimir Putin to end the war in Ukraine and implied that Ukraine is treating Poland unfairly, made comments aligning with pro-Russian or at least Russia-conciliatory narratives.
(B) Grzegorz Braun (Konfederacja Korony Polskiej) - was praised by Russian media for his positions on Ukraine, voted against the Sejm resolution condemning Russia's invasion, and in 2022 joined a pro-Russian rally.
(C) Janusz Korwin-Mikke (Konfederacja ORWiN) - publicly supported the annexation of Crimea, challenged Russian accountability (e.g. for the Bucha massacre), appeared on Russian TV, and pushed narratives blaming Ukraine and minimizing Russian aggression. Also, notorius for calling Putin "Jego Ekscelencja".
(D) other (why?)
Cast your votes.
As in the thread title.
Of course, I don't mean muppets like Piskorski, Maciak or Tołwiński but proper politicians with at least a couple of percent support among Poles and active in/with some influence on mainline politics.
(A) Sławomir Mentzen (Konfederacja) - publicly called for a negotiated agreement with Vladimir Putin to end the war in Ukraine and implied that Ukraine is treating Poland unfairly, made comments aligning with pro-Russian or at least Russia-conciliatory narratives.
(B) Grzegorz Braun (Konfederacja Korony Polskiej) - was praised by Russian media for his positions on Ukraine, voted against the Sejm resolution condemning Russia's invasion, and in 2022 joined a pro-Russian rally.
(C) Janusz Korwin-Mikke (Konfederacja ORWiN) - publicly supported the annexation of Crimea, challenged Russian accountability (e.g. for the Bucha massacre), appeared on Russian TV, and pushed narratives blaming Ukraine and minimizing Russian aggression. Also, notorius for calling Putin "Jego Ekscelencja".
(D) other (why?)
Cast your votes.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
It would be even better with a different president in America.
With Trump... it's good but not brilliant.
it's good that these drones flew in
It would be even better with a different president in America.
With Trump... it's good but not brilliant.
Torq
11 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
The plot thickens even more - General Kukuła (Chief of the Defence Staff) confirms that Belarus warned us before the drones entered our airspace. So, it looks like they might have been taken over electronically and redirected towards Poland by someone who has such capability.
In other news, the Czechs offered to send a special chopper unit right away to help us defend from low flying drones. Fair play, little brothers. :)
The plot thickens even more - General Kukuła (Chief of the Defence Staff) confirms that Belarus warned us before the drones entered our airspace. So, it looks like they might have been taken over electronically and redirected towards Poland by someone who has such capability.
In other news, the Czechs offered to send a special chopper unit right away to help us defend from low flying drones. Fair play, little brothers. :)
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
@Bobko
Iveco, Tales, Mistral - at least it is foreigners who were f*cking you in the anus. In Poland our own are even worse - a silly mortar grenade that normally costs 500pln, when Polish army comes shopping the contract price is 2500pln (for real). Everyone and their grandmother wants to make money on the Army. :-/
@Bobko
Iveco, Tales, Mistral - at least it is foreigners who were f*cking you in the anus. In Poland our own are even worse - a silly mortar grenade that normally costs 500pln, when Polish army comes shopping the contract price is 2500pln (for real). Everyone and their grandmother wants to make money on the Army. :-/
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Oh, we do have resources. The question is: how do we use them?
For example, Poland has the only NATO standard TNT factory in Europe (Nitro-Chem Bydgoszcz). Do we use its output to produce sh*tloads of artillery ammo that we will eventually desperately need? No. Instead of that we sell it to Americans at cost price (over twice cheaper than India!). We have some money to spend on weapons as well, but when Poles come to buy something the prices magically rise (sometimes up to 40%). The Turks and Italians look at us as if we were retards and can't believe how much we pay. etc.
We could be like Switzerland - impenetrable. Instead our defences are still inadequate. Hopefully, the whole drones affair - whoever is behind it - will force more serious defense build-up.
But do they have enough resources
Oh, we do have resources. The question is: how do we use them?
For example, Poland has the only NATO standard TNT factory in Europe (Nitro-Chem Bydgoszcz). Do we use its output to produce sh*tloads of artillery ammo that we will eventually desperately need? No. Instead of that we sell it to Americans at cost price (over twice cheaper than India!). We have some money to spend on weapons as well, but when Poles come to buy something the prices magically rise (sometimes up to 40%). The Turks and Italians look at us as if we were retards and can't believe how much we pay. etc.
We could be like Switzerland - impenetrable. Instead our defences are still inadequate. Hopefully, the whole drones affair - whoever is behind it - will force more serious defense build-up.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Anyways--just a theoretical question: what if this was indeed a Ukrainian operation? Do we attack Ukraine? :)
Anyways--just a theoretical question: what if this was indeed a Ukrainian operation? Do we attack Ukraine? :)
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Your mum's liberal.
But the rocket that killed two farmers in Przewodów was Ukrainian after all and not Russian as everyone thought at first.
It's a possibility.
It looks like it. But it won't hurt to double-check, just in case.
Shut up, liberal.
Your mum's liberal.
They always do.
But the rocket that killed two farmers in Przewodów was Ukrainian after all and not Russian as everyone thought at first.
What if the drones were actually launched by Ukraine to invite NATO to WW3?
It's a possibility.
I think it is a Russian action
It looks like it. But it won't hurt to double-check, just in case.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
No Russian plane violated Polish airspace. It was drones. Are we 100% sure those were Russian drones? Russia denies.
Maybe it's the potato fuhrer f*cking around because he's butthurt we closed the border for the duration of Zapad and all those AliExpress and Temu stuff is stuck in Belarus?
Maybe it's the Ukrainians trying to drag us more into the war? Do you think they're not capable of that? Remember when that rocket fell in Przewodów? Everyone was initially blaming Russia but it turned out to be a Ukrainian rocket.
Let's calm down, investigate it thoroughly, and then - when we are 100% sure what happened - we can start shooting.
we should just do like Erdogan did, shot down Russian plane
No Russian plane violated Polish airspace. It was drones. Are we 100% sure those were Russian drones? Russia denies.
Maybe it's the potato fuhrer f*cking around because he's butthurt we closed the border for the duration of Zapad and all those AliExpress and Temu stuff is stuck in Belarus?
Maybe it's the Ukrainians trying to drag us more into the war? Do you think they're not capable of that? Remember when that rocket fell in Przewodów? Everyone was initially blaming Russia but it turned out to be a Ukrainian rocket.
Let's calm down, investigate it thoroughly, and then - when we are 100% sure what happened - we can start shooting.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
I'm not opposed to the idea itself. We simply don't have the capabilities.
A better idea would be to institute a NATO no-fly zone over a buffer area in Ukraine, with joint NATO forces.
Shooting down missiles while they're still over Ukraine was proposed by serious politicians and generals.
I'm not opposed to the idea itself. We simply don't have the capabilities.
A better idea would be to institute a NATO no-fly zone over a buffer area in Ukraine, with joint NATO forces.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Did you read the article? Using Patriots for what you suggested is not very likely and SkySabre and Mała Narew are designed specifically to defend objects in Poland, whilst Poprad, Pilica and Piorun are all short-range.
I wrote that we are not at war.
It all depends. If they are willing to sacrifice millions of their soldiers (and they don't seem to value human life very highly), then they currently have much higher material capabilities to conduct war against Eastern Flank of NATO (Finland, the Baltics, Poland) than they did in 2015.
Look, I'm not saying that we should sit back and watch idly how further waves of drones are violating our airspace. However, let's not make rash decisions.
tech.wp.pl/polskie-patrioty-ochronia-ukraine-ekspert-wydaje-sie-sceptyczny,7047552255237056a
Did you read the article? Using Patriots for what you suggested is not very likely and SkySabre and Mała Narew are designed specifically to defend objects in Poland, whilst Poprad, Pilica and Piorun are all short-range.
You wrote yourself that we're not in a conflict.
I wrote that we are not at war.
I doubt that for the time being they're willing, ready and able to make war with the entire NATO.
It all depends. If they are willing to sacrifice millions of their soldiers (and they don't seem to value human life very highly), then they currently have much higher material capabilities to conduct war against Eastern Flank of NATO (Finland, the Baltics, Poland) than they did in 2015.
Look, I'm not saying that we should sit back and watch idly how further waves of drones are violating our airspace. However, let's not make rash decisions.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
Absolutely no need for that.
Article 4 was triggered...
tvpworld.com/88842008/nato-triggers-article-4-after-polish-jets-shoot-down-russian-drones-in-airspace
... and so far it's quite enough.
Don't panic, guys. If there is to be war, there will be war. If there will be war, we will win it.
However, as of today, we are not at war with Russia yet. Chill out.
Article 5!
Absolutely no need for that.
Article 4 was triggered...
tvpworld.com/88842008/nato-triggers-article-4-after-polish-jets-shoot-down-russian-drones-in-airspace
... and so far it's quite enough.
Don't panic, guys. If there is to be war, there will be war. If there will be war, we will win it.
However, as of today, we are not at war with Russia yet. Chill out.
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
We certainly don't have such long-range capabilites to cover the Ukrainian territory, so your idea would involve placing our AA batteries in Ukraine. Can you see the risk?
In any conflict it always happens on both sides.
You are referring to the incident from 2015. Back then Russia didn't want war with either Turkey or (especially) NATO. These days their entire economy is switched into war mode and they are producing large quantities of weapons with the exact purpose of war with NATO. That's why they would most likely react differently than in 2015. Hastening the outbreak of the war with Russia is hardly reasonable before we get ready for it. In 3 years time (preferably 5 though), they can invade away. Today, it would mean a lot of blood shed unnecessarily.
Russia denies those were Russian drones...
kyivindependent.com/moscow-says-no-evidence-drones-downed-over-poland-were-russian/
No, I meant air defences, not airplanes.
We certainly don't have such long-range capabilites to cover the Ukrainian territory, so your idea would involve placing our AA batteries in Ukraine. Can you see the risk?
Do they though?
In any conflict it always happens on both sides.
Turkey, a NATO country, shot down a RuSSian fighter jet when it violated the country's airspace.
You are referring to the incident from 2015. Back then Russia didn't want war with either Turkey or (especially) NATO. These days their entire economy is switched into war mode and they are producing large quantities of weapons with the exact purpose of war with NATO. That's why they would most likely react differently than in 2015. Hastening the outbreak of the war with Russia is hardly reasonable before we get ready for it. In 3 years time (preferably 5 though), they can invade away. Today, it would mean a lot of blood shed unnecessarily.
Russia denies those were Russian drones...
kyivindependent.com/moscow-says-no-evidence-drones-downed-over-poland-were-russian/
Torq
10 Sep 2025
News / Polish-Russian war? Drones entering Polish airspace. [252]
You would be punishing those who don't necessarily agree with the putinist government, as well as their children who are in Polish education system.
Exactly.
That would involve using our airplanes over Ukraine. That would mean the airplanes might be shot down by Russians, and that would mean war. So, if we want to avoid the direct hot war with Russia*, it's probably not the best idea.
But our planes enter Russian airspace as well, by accident or not. Our choppers fly over Belarus as well, accidentally or not. Should they be shot down as well? It's easy to start a full-blown war, Paulina, but slightly more difficult to stop it.
Could someone, please, change the thread title to "NATO's aid to Poland if Russia invades" or something similar? The current title is misleading - we are not at war with Russia yet.
--
* - and, yes, we want to avoid it because we are not ready yet
Deporting r*SSian citizens would be another.
You would be punishing those who don't necessarily agree with the putinist government, as well as their children who are in Polish education system.
The people left are probably those that deserve to stay
Exactly.
the bare minimum would be Poland using its/allied air defences to shoot down RuSSian missiles and drones already over Ukraine before they enter Polish territory
That would involve using our airplanes over Ukraine. That would mean the airplanes might be shot down by Russians, and that would mean war. So, if we want to avoid the direct hot war with Russia*, it's probably not the best idea.
NATO countries should start opening fire at any RuSSian fighter jets "accidentally" entering NATO air space
But our planes enter Russian airspace as well, by accident or not. Our choppers fly over Belarus as well, accidentally or not. Should they be shot down as well? It's easy to start a full-blown war, Paulina, but slightly more difficult to stop it.
Could someone, please, change the thread title to "NATO's aid to Poland if Russia invades" or something similar? The current title is misleading - we are not at war with Russia yet.
--
* - and, yes, we want to avoid it because we are not ready yet
Torq
9 Sep 2025
Off-Topic / Music Thread - part 2 [972]
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Torq
9 Sep 2025
News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]
I try to, but it makes me dizzy sometimes!
Another optimist. :)
Oh, well... I really hope you're right, guys. *fingers crossed*
look at all of the movements on that chess board called world politics!
I try to, but it makes me dizzy sometimes!
When Russia realises the blunder. A deal or a peace treaty can be signed.
Another optimist. :)
Oh, well... I really hope you're right, guys. *fingers crossed*
Torq
9 Sep 2025
News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]
Exactly!
When Ukraine loses Donbass and invades Poland to regain "Закерзоння" and compensate for the loss in the east, the West will be so confused that they will probably still send Ukraine weapons and money before they realise what's happening.
Can you realistically see Russia losing - with the USA no longer giving too much of a toss and European NATO being what it is?
It will always depend on the mood in the Kremlin unless at least 4 EU countries (Poland, Germany, Finland, Romania) develop their strong and independent nuclear forces.
Oh, your eternal optimism, BB! :)
the West is still in the starting boxes....confused, arguing, scratching heads
Exactly!
When Ukraine loses Donbass and invades Poland to regain "Закерзоння" and compensate for the loss in the east, the West will be so confused that they will probably still send Ukraine weapons and money before they realise what's happening.
with Russia losing
Can you realistically see Russia losing - with the USA no longer giving too much of a toss and European NATO being what it is?
Our future safety would depend on the mood in the Kremlin!
It will always depend on the mood in the Kremlin unless at least 4 EU countries (Poland, Germany, Finland, Romania) develop their strong and independent nuclear forces.
Ukraine would become the first clearly drawn border of the so called new world...and all behind would be safe.
Oh, your eternal optimism, BB! :)
Torq
9 Sep 2025
News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]
That's the point. The Cold War was when the USA and Soviet Union made proxy wars somewhere in Asia or Africa and we read about it in newspapers. When Ukraine is invaded and soon maybe Poland, then there is nothing cold about it - indeed it is very hot!
It all depends on the price. I shall ask again: is the West invading (or in ANY meaningful way punishing) Hungary and Slovakia? No? Then why should Poland not conduct similar policies: remaining the part of the West while maintaining friendly relations with Russia? If Slovaks and Hungarians can, why can't we?
As I said, it depends on the price. If the victorious West means millions of Poles dead and Poland razed to the ground once again, then I suppose I'll take a rain check.
if you see the world with a view of a new developing Cold War
That's the point. The Cold War was when the USA and Soviet Union made proxy wars somewhere in Asia or Africa and we read about it in newspapers. When Ukraine is invaded and soon maybe Poland, then there is nothing cold about it - indeed it is very hot!
would you want to win in the end
It all depends on the price. I shall ask again: is the West invading (or in ANY meaningful way punishing) Hungary and Slovakia? No? Then why should Poland not conduct similar policies: remaining the part of the West while maintaining friendly relations with Russia? If Slovaks and Hungarians can, why can't we?
As I said, it depends on the price. If the victorious West means millions of Poles dead and Poland razed to the ground once again, then I suppose I'll take a rain check.
Torq
9 Sep 2025
News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]
If only it was so easy, BB. If only.
It's not like we have to tick a box: (A) victorious Russia (B) victorious West, and that's it. There are many shades of grey between and a different option is good for Portugal and different for Poland. Hungary and Slovakia are conducting strongly pro-Russian policies. Are they being invaded by the West because of it? No, but they are safeguarding their interests in case of Russia going full retard.
We have much more to lose in case of the ever-more-likely war with Russia than we have to win in case of Ukrainian "victory" (whatever that means, and which doesn't exclude Polish-Russian or Polish-Ukrainian war anyway). Especially that Ukraine was never friendly towards Poland - they were your pupils, your Waffen-SS boys (they still cherish the tradition!) and today they even refuse to acknowledge the genocide they commited against Poles.
It's not all that black-and-white.
the question is, whom do you want to win?
If only it was so easy, BB. If only.
It's not like we have to tick a box: (A) victorious Russia (B) victorious West, and that's it. There are many shades of grey between and a different option is good for Portugal and different for Poland. Hungary and Slovakia are conducting strongly pro-Russian policies. Are they being invaded by the West because of it? No, but they are safeguarding their interests in case of Russia going full retard.
We have much more to lose in case of the ever-more-likely war with Russia than we have to win in case of Ukrainian "victory" (whatever that means, and which doesn't exclude Polish-Russian or Polish-Ukrainian war anyway). Especially that Ukraine was never friendly towards Poland - they were your pupils, your Waffen-SS boys (they still cherish the tradition!) and today they even refuse to acknowledge the genocide they commited against Poles.
It's not all that black-and-white.
Torq
9 Sep 2025
Off-Topic / Music Thread - part 2 [972]
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Torq
9 Sep 2025
News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]
Can anyone answer the question already?
No?
OK, I will give you more time to think. Just don't take too long... until the answer is more than obvious.
the title question is still valid - do we risk more being allied to Russia or being eternally hostile towards her?
Can anyone answer the question already?
No?
OK, I will give you more time to think. Just don't take too long... until the answer is more than obvious.