News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


Then you are not allies.

There are only two messianic countries in the world now.

1) America - with its Manifest Destiny

2) Russia - with its "Russkiy Mir"

If you want to play with the big boys, then you must be able to subscribe to or at least understand their messianic roles.

Currently, America has a GDP 10X bigger than Russia, and I think they will crush us with their culture and innovations.

Russia's strength is the appeal of its ideas. For 100 years, we keep the world on edge with our concept of fairness and equity. However, for the past thirty years we have been bankrupt....

Finally - we are finding something with which we can reply to the West. It's a work in progress - but in ten years it will be ready for the big time.

Russia's ideology will be just as attractive as what we had between 1918-1991.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]

@Torq

Poland has a unique place in Russian imperial history.

For Poles to treat it as some period of slavery or exploitation - is maximum stupidity.

Poland was never - ever - in its history so great as when it worked together with Russia. Then, we really wrote the fate of the planet together.

People who are afraid of Russia - FOOLS.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


No it will not.

If the Chinese do not want to be hypocrites, then they would send us 500-700,000 men right now to wrap up this military operation once and for all.

They are afraid.

They don't want sanctions like Russia experiences.

They do not want to be treated as dangerous and wild animals.

That's ok, and that's fine. We Russians have a long memory.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


Russians are fair.

We don't want more than is necessary.

We are fine being poorer than you, and less free.

But you double cross us, you play games with us - it will not end well for you.

Otto von Bismarck quote on topic:

"Do not expect that once you take advantage of Russia's weakness, you will receive dividends forever. Russians always come for their money. And when they come - don't rely on a signed agreement. They won't respect it. They will rely on their own strength. Remember: never humiliate Russia."

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


They were "our boys" - what do you expect?


I will tell you the truth - from a Russian perspective...

You have claims. Deep historical claims. Claims written in blood and tears.

We do not care.

You Western-leaning government decided to make itself an enemy of our country.

If you played with us, shared your toys, and told us how great we are - maybe you would now have some territories that are part of modern Ukraine and Belarus.

But you decided to be Poles - to be as independent as you always have been - so we "punished" you to the extent we could.

Then... through the war, you began realizing you made a deal with the wrong people, and really started helping us. Polish First Army, etc... For this sudden change of heart you got rewarded with the most industrially productive parts of Germany and the Baltic Coast.

I think we treated you fairly.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


Russia doesn't bleed for other people, without taking anything in return - unless it is some trivial exercise as the War in Angola, or the Vietnam War.

These wars were more about prestige. A chance to embarrass the Americans as they plotted.

If it's something closer to home - we won't be your donkeys. We won't deliver water for you.

If you want to avail yourself of Russian military power - prepare to see an invoice.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]

@Torq

The Chinese desire to involve Russia in their war against Taiwan and America is understandable.

The Chinese word for Russia is 战斗民族 (zhàndòu mínzú). It means "fighting people", or "battle-hardened folk".

It means they see and recognize a certain difference between us. Their pathetic attempts to plant, cultivate, and harvest rice - while building multi-generational prosperity - is hilarious to us wild barbarians.

"We will take what we need, and you will learn to love us - otherwise you will be killed". That's the Russian way, and it is 180 degrees opposed to the Chinese way.

But they understand that their 2,500 years of agricultural cultivation and bureaucracy building has made them weak in comparison to us.

So they want to use Russian meat to deliver them their victories.

This is a mistake, because if Russia cuts off a piece of its own flesh, it will take ten pounds of yours in return.

Off-Topic / USA News and Poland - part 16 [779]


If you expect Alien to know what the Didache is... then maybe you are not so smart as I thought you are.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


Don't underestimate the role of China and India in giving us some much needed oxygen supply.

I make jokes here about China's attempts to sit on two chairs at once... but they did really save us.

We were selling the Europeans something like $200B of energy exports a year. That's a lotta money to lose suddenly. I'm not sure if we could have continued the fight, if Chinese and Indian refineries refused to take our crude, and Chinese and Indian power plants refused to import our coal.

If we strike Poland - that is clearly "beyond the pale". That means we expect China and India to jeopardize their relationship with the EU and NATO - for the sake of a greater Russia. Will that happen? Something tells me the answer is "NO".

-//--

What's more... a Russia that controls Ukraine... PLUS Poland - will stop listening to anything China asks of it. Russia will be mainlining some strong "Imperial" methamphetamine at that point. It will Hulk out, and act as it normally behaves when it feels that only God alone can judge it.

The above is probably not in the interests of China, who would instead prefer a docile and predictable Russia.

Off-Topic / Random Chat Thread [1040]

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News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


Circumstances so fantastic - that they would never arise.

That kind of an attack would "collapse" our remaining international relationships.

Whereas China, India and maybe 50% of Americans - are willing to entertain the legitimacy of Russia's claims on Ukraine - nobody would feel the same way about Poland.

1) No ethnic Russian population to liberate.

2) No disputed territories (in fact, the most credible claim on territory in this relationship belongs to Poland).

3) No ambiguity in alliances

We do something like that, and we'll lose a lot of peoples' sympathies.


Poland was NEVER a part of the USSR.

Even in pre-Revolutionary times, Poland did not formally constitute an integral part of the Russia Empire. It was a separate possession of the Russian Tsar, with its own:

1) Constitution
2) Parliament
3) Administration
4) Laws

Until the November Uprising, Poland even had its own distinct army.

-//-

You cannot compare Ukraine, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, etc to Poland.

Those countries were as Russian as Puerto Rico or Hawaii are American.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


Goddamn Indians and Pakistanis.

They seem to have no "brakes".

Even Bangladesh - has more people than Russia.

-//--

You should be happy - at least they are native English speakers (at least those that emigrate).

Genealogy / Origins of Polish Genetics [17]


This alone.... should make an intelligent person stop and think.

Either you are allowing Russia to "own" all the bad chapters of your history, and you treat yourself as some newborn babe - innocent to the sins of the world...

or you admit you are as ancient as Russia, but simultaneously take some responsibility.

To listen to them, they were created in 861 AD, and were then rapidly placed into some cryogenic chamber - to be opened only in 1991. Emerging blameless like the Son of God.

Every sin is chalked up to Russia's account.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


Turkey is doing a terrible job at it. Malaysia has a TFR of 1.5 or so.

Our Tatars are also forgetting to reproduce.

It seems even Islam is not impervious to modern pressures on the family.

Just wait for those Sudans and Malis to catch up in development, and they will stop making kids abruptly too.

Genealogy / Origins of Polish Genetics [17]


It's the Volhyn stuff.

Every time you guys get close to some kind of understanding, Volhyn blows things up again.

Ukrainians GENUINELY do not understand you, or your position. To be completely honest - neither did I - until I spent years on this forum.

They really sincerely think that you are "stirring the pot" for no good reason, other than that you know they are weak right now and rely on your help.

They feel you are abusing the leverage, in order to make them admit something terrible which will be forever a stain on their national heroes. This - while they defend you from Russian imperialism with their bodies.

-//-

I even watched an interview where Sikorski and Sonya featured - and it was clear there that Sikorski was shocked at the genuine level of incomprehension he encountered on the subject.

Being a diplomat, he used some very kind interpretation of what was happening.

If Russians are infantile, then Ukrainians are twice as infantile. They think they are some perfect Marvel superheroes, and everyone should kiss their feet. They have no capacity to admit any wrongdoing, because their conception of self is so impossibly fragile.

They are building a Ukrainian national identity with scotch tape and glue... this identity is not yet ready to collide head on with historic events like ethnic cleansings.

You heard it from them - we are Orcs, and they are Elves. Elves are perfect.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


I don't know about Muslims, but I definitely hate Islam.

Stupid religion - designed for children. It cannot provide the same "brain f*ck" as Catholicism or Orthodoxy can.

Genealogy / Origins of Polish Genetics [17]


Sort of a carryover from the other thread (Admin move if necessary), but one of the primary reasons the Ukrainians hate you is because of the Jews.

Polish nobles did not collect taxes from their Ukrainian peasants themselves. Instead they outsourced the job to Jewish "tax farmers". As long as the Jewish tax collector paid the Pan what he was owed, he did not care what sort of depredations the Jew unleashed on the Ukrainians.

At some point - Poles and Jews began to meld in the Ukrainian imagination. It's the origin of the aphorisms like, "Worse than a Jew, can only be a Polish merchant".

In the 1930s and 1940s, Ukrainian fascists ranked their hatreds in the following priority order: "Jews, Poles, Muscovites".

Law / Gun control in Poland: should Polish people be allowed to own guns? - part 2 [54]

Poland will need some level of gun control - in any case. Because you have a country next door, that's full of literally millions of small arms.

Even in America you can't own a fully automatic rifle (in most instances). In Ukraine, you have your pick from the AK-74, the M4 Carbine, the FN SCAR, or FAL - if you are in the market for an assault rifle. It won't set you back more than $700-1000.

Payment is done in cryptocurrency, and then the weapon is dropped off in some inconspicuous bush or inside a drainage pipe - the geolocation of which is shared with you through WhatsApp. Just come with a little suitcase, or some trash bag, so people don't see you walking down the street with an assault rifle.

If you are in the market for something more serious, like a 0.50 cal Barret sniper rifle, or an M60 machine gun - $3,000-5,000.

European law enforcement has already been ringing the alarm bells for years. The borders with Romania and Hungary are especially porous.

Maybe you can't steal a tank, or an armored personnel carrier... but you can definitely steal anything smaller in Ukraine - and no one will ever bother to report it or look for it.

Genealogy / Origins of Polish Genetics [17]


It's what Iron's video says.

Your moms have always lived in Poland. Then some gopniks from the East arrived, killed their husbands, and planted their Orc seed.

• 
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News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


Haha, yes.

I have a Ukrainian friend here in NY, Vladislav, and he is about 195 centimeters tall and weighs about 120 kilograms.

Simultaneously, I have some non-Ukrainian friends who are professional "Ukraine haters".

When they meet Vlad, they suddenly begin to talk in a way I never get to hear from them, when it's just us. Suddenly, their approach to the conflict is very nuanced - and all they talk about is its infinite complexity. Hahaha!

Easy enough to hate each other on the internet, but when they come face to face Russians and Ukrainians are almost always the embodiment of courtesy itself.

Sure, there are videos of some deranged Russian Karen yelling slurs at Ukrainians in the Istanbul airport. Videos of Ukrainian drunks crashing bottles of wine over Russian drunks heads at some football match in Marseille. But it's not representative...

--//--

Here in New York, many Russians I know, attend Ukrainian charity drives, go to the same church, and appoint each other as godparents to their kids.

War is war. Life is life.

Genealogy / Origins of Polish Genetics [17]


Oh boy... now the truth comes out!

Our guys came and raped all the local women, that had been living there since time immemorial.

Good Germanic women, faithful to Wodan, fell to Asiatic barbarians from the swamps and forests of the East. Such shame!

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


You are right - it's universal.

In America, Southerners still hate Northerners. The Middle hates the Coasts, and it all revolves around "who owes who".

The poorer, rural regions feel they "feed" coastal America. The gun loving South, feels they protect the effeminate North, by enlisting in the military disproportionately or actually dealing with the waves of migrants that Northerners can only read about.

In the same way Ukraine expects things from Poland and Czechia for defending them, American Southerners feel they are owed recognition for being hardline on national security and immigration.

Southern Italy hates Northern Italy - for purported abandonment and arrogance. Poland B hates Poland A - for the same reasons. East Germans hate West Germans. Northern Chinese hate Southern Chinese.

People have some deep sensor inside their ass which measures the "fairness" of things.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


In America, the broadcast standard - also known as General American English - is Mid-Western in origin.

All the people on CNN and Fox News talk like they are from Chicago or somewhere in Ohio.

It has practically no "accent", or no "regional" identifiers like a New York or Texan accent would have.

Neutral, sterile, clean.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


No no, there are dozens of dialects. I meant the official three groups within the Russian "family" of peoples.

But Russian dialects are really tame in comparison to English or German ones. Everybody can easily understand each other.

The three main dialects within "Great Russian" Russian, are: (1) Northern, (2) Central, and (3) Southern. Then there are many smaller subdialects: Siberian, Pomorian, Central Asian, Baltic, Caucasus.

The literary and tv broadcast "Golden Standard" of Russian is the Moscow dialect (with some St. Petersburg influence). A lot of people actually find it quite harsh on the ear, or even annoying. Moscow people make high pitched sounds like 16 year old girls, and stretch their "As" to infinity.

The most even sounding Russian, is to my ear at least - the Uralic variety.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


This is the "Great Russian Chauvinist" (as Lenin would call it), or "Imperialist/Nationalist" position (as modern Ukrainians would call it).

Historically (in Imperial times), the Russian "folk" was divided into three groups. Great Russians (current Russians), Little Russians (current Ukrainians), and White Russians (Belarus).

The Ukrainian language was called the "Little Russian dialect", or "Malorosskiy Dialekt". It is actually spoken in a wider area than just modern Ukraine. People also speak a slightly more archaic version of it on the Russian side of the border. In the Belgorod, Kursk, Rostov, Krasnodar regions.

So the "High Russian" was called "Great Russian". It was the main language of USSR-level television, radio, film, etc. So, in this way everyone knew it too like High German.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


So Austria then, or Switzerland?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


Yes we all have a little chip on our shoulder, hehe. On our left shoulder!


I wouldn't say it's "easy". Maybe like for a Prussian to understand a Bavarian at the beginning of the 20th century.

Only 60-70% of the words are the same. The others are borrowed from Polish and other languages, and usually don't make sense to a Russian unless he reads a lot.

Pronunciation-wise there's a huge difference, more than the lexical gap. Ukrainians make a bunch of sounds we don't make, or that sound funny to us.

Also the understanding works differently in either direction. 100% of Ukrainians understand Russian, but maybe only 50-60% of Russians may be able to follow a Ukrainian conversation.

Maybe it's the same in Germany? Where 100% of Bavarians can readily understand Northerners, but only 50-60% of Northerners can easily understand Bavarians?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]

Just for some more context, for people unfamiliar with Gogol...

The line above is spoken by Taras Bulba, the protagonist of the book, to his son Andriy. Taras Bulba is a grizzled Ukrainian warlord, who symbolizes the Orthodox faith, the Cossack way of life, and eternal resistance to the Polish-Lithuanian Catholic nobility.

Andriy is Taras' good-for-nothing youngest son. Unlike loyal and pious Ostap (the Hector), Andriy is a sh*t for brains that follows the commands of his dick (Paris, to continue the Iliad analogy). He betrayed the Cossacks and joined the Polish side out of love for a Polish noblewoman.

Finally, one day Taras confronts him on the battlefield, and before executing him, delivers this line as a final judgment.

«Ну что, помогли тебе твои ляхи?»

Moral of the story - you can be loyal to Poles, but the Poles will value your loyalty for nothing. Meanwhile, your "bros" will surely come for you - and remember all your Polonophilia.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [366]


Genuine question - what can one discuss with the Virgin during an entire hour, every single day?

I find it hard to talk to my brother or mother for more than 20 minutes every few days. Not because I don't enjoy their company, but because I find that I don't have very much to say. That is - I need more time, for more events to accumulate - so there is then something to discuss.

I'm not Belousov, and I don't have the lives of thousands of men on my conscience - so maybe I don't understand something...


I really wish we had an active Ukrainian poster on this forum. One who could be somewhat objective, instead of just a patriotic bot like the previous two we had.

Anything I write about Ukrainian attitudes towards Poland will be immediately suspect, because of the source...

Nonetheless - I read Ukrainian newspapers daily. Every other evening I tune in to watch their evening talk shows (which frequently feature top officials). Probably around 25% of my Twitter feed is Ukrainian language. I follow several Ukrainian public persons on Facebook.

I can tell you - the feelings are... complex.

1) There is some sense of inadequacy when comparing themselves to Poland.

2) At the same time, this state of being less developed and much poorer than Poland, somehow feels to them as a violation of the natural order of the universe.

3) This inadequacy/shame, leads to a constant search for some kind of justification. "They became rich off our backs," or "The Russians held us back," or "The EU pumped them full of cash".

4) The shame deepens through the low class of work done by Ukrainians in Poland. Drivers, retail clerks, janitors, nannies, etc.

5) Finally shame turns to anger, and then full blown delusions of "Cossackism" (equivalent of Polish Sarmatism or Japanese Samuraism).

6) Poland constantly needling them with the Volhyn Massacres doesn't do any good. Not only are they treated as "the help", they are also being told that they are bloodthirsty apes suffering from historical amnesia. This sends them ballistic with fury.

And in general - the cultural undercurrent in Ukraine, for centuries, was extremely Polonophobic. In Ukraine, the novel Taras Bulba plays the same role, if not larger, as Ogniem i Mieczem plays in Poland. The whole book is one long anti-Polish screed.

The most quoted line from the book, that every single Ukrainian child knows, is "Well, did your Poles help you?".

This line has been quoted 10 million times by Ukrainians over the past two years, as Polish farmers dumped their grain onto highways, truckers blocked the border control points, and governments refused to hand over aging MiG jets.

News / Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23 [1012]


I'm not sure that Russia has ever provided anyone with meaningful amounts of mercenaries.

The champions, at least in European history, were the Swiss Confederacy and various German and Italian principalities.

In the modern world, mercenaries come from alternative places. The top three, for a while, were South Africans (veterans of actions against Angola), Rhodesians (Zimbabweans), and Colombians (because of their long war against FARC).

Now it's probably Sudanese (one of the longest running wars in the world, printing tons of veterans), again Colombians, and Afghans (American trained and hunted by the Taliban).

Honorable mention goes out to Nepalis.

--//--

If China needed troops, and fast, probably its three first stops would be

1) North Korea
2) Cambodia
3) Laos

All three are old buddies and essentially vassals. Plenty of military experience. Poor. Run by ideologically sympathetic groups of people.