News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

Let's say, Marek ( just an example) is a human being and eats chicken eggs and because he's against abortion, he's a hypocrite, right? Hmm, I hope you're laughing with me right now, LOL

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


are you comparing eating a chicken with killing an unborn child?

Hmm, maybe we are wasting our time trying to discuss it, berni

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


if it was only about her body, we wouldn't have this discussion, berni.
It's about the body inside of her body, we're talking about.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


I'm not arguing with you berni, the problem we have is that you don't know what's been said earlier in this thread (I assume). Read it first and then come back and we'll go from there.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


OK then let them help by making contraception widely available for everyone instead. (very cheap or for free, even better).

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

quit poking, berni. There's a law that allows abortion and we all know it and most of us here, don't oppose abortion out of emergency but we do oppose abortion out of convenience because we believe that adult people should be making adult decisions and not screw around like rabbits, knowing that there will be no consequences for their actions whatsoever. Further, there's no need for abortion if people will be using contraception, right?

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

As I already said earlier, there is no set answer to when a baby is alive in the mother's womb. Many people believe that the baby is alive at conception. Others believe it is when the heart beats for the first time (about 6 weeks after conception). Still others believe that the baby is not alive until quickening (16-20 weeks after conception), and some don't believe the baby is alive until it is full-term (37 weeks after conception) or even born. This is a matter that, at this point, is debatable and a personal belief, rather than a scientific certainty.

Besides berni, I haven't mentioned religion in this thread yet and my opinion about abortion has absolutely nothing to do with it.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


what does the well being have to do with it? We're not talking about abortion out of emergency, we're talking about abortion out of convenience. I'm not opposing the first.


some American friends. I'm not opposing it in emergency situations.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

care to answer this question berni23?

When is a baby alive in the mother's womb?

There is no set answer to this question yet but maybe you'll be able to answer it anyway, who knows?

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


this is exactly what I was repeatedly telling Jon but he seems not to care. If there was a set point of when a baby is alive inside the mother's womb, we wouldn't have this discussion now.


if mine doesn't then yours doesn't work either Jon, because we're opposing our opinions equally, using different arguments.
I guess, the best we can do is to agree to disagree and call it quits.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


because they're deciding against life and why, because "she doesn't want it".
"Doesn't want" is not an excuse for killing. Try imagine, someone will come to a conclusion, he doesn't want you anymore, would you be OK with it if he killed you?

Besides, why not just use contraception to avoid that problem to begin with?


no one has clearly determined when a baby is alive in the mother's womb. Just because we have a law allowing abortion, it doesn't make it right (unless emergency, of course)


don't you realize that you're doing just that, you're imposing your opinion on me and people who feel like me?


and yet, it doesn't make our society (as such) underdeveloped and this is how you made it sound above. Look Jon, we're totally different people but I would never dare to tell you, you're underdeveloped because of it and this is all I'm expecting from an intelligent guy like you too. Respect if you want to be respected.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


Since no one has clearly determined when a baby is alive inside the mother's womb, why would you decide to kill what's possibly alive, Jon?


btw, In more developed societies my a$$. I'm not giving you any reason to insult me or my country, so don't get it started, Jon.

We don't have to be, think and feel the same as you to be developed, got it? So, according to you if someone disagrees with you, he's a member of an underdeveloped society, right? I wonder, why a liberal and an open minded guy like you, has a problem with accepting the views and/or the way of life of other people? Learn to accept if you want to be accepted, Jon!!! (and I'm not a lib like you, Jon)

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

most people have no problems with doing anything at all, as long as they make money.

My question is, would you like other people to decide about your right to live or not? Do you believe all life is precious?

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


OK, I guess, you wouldn't have any problem with other people deciding whether you suppose to live or die then, right? or do you believe that your life is more precious than the life of an unborn child?

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

Is it really that simple? How much does your life mean to you, Tommy? Do you believe that it would be OK for others to decide whether you're supposed to live or die?

(over and out for right now)

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


don't you think that if abortion and its consequences, were made much more visible and understandable, the amount of abortions, would go back significantly? Of course, I don't have any numbers to support my claim but it makes sense to me and I'm personally convinced, it would.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


yes, they do but not enough.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


obviously, they don't teach enough, otherwise, we would have nothing to discuss about now ;-)


of course, education and contraception before abortion and abortion only out of emergency, not out of convenience.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]

She said that she wouldn't have abortion if:
"If I had been properly informed beforehand, I wouldn't have done it.
Choice is all very well so long as it is a fully informed choice, and that would involve, e.g., scans and pictures and literature about the development stages of the unborn child."

She's talking about the consequences, not about the possibilities.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


it was partly, by making her decision too easy (is what she's saying).

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


agree, as long as she decides about HER body and not the body inside of her that she helped creating (very actively too).

I'm gonna repeat myself, abortion out of emergency YES, abortion out of convenience NO,

Cary the consequences of your actions people. Act like adults. If you're old enough to f/ck, you're old enough to raise a child too, end of story.

If you're not ready to raise a child, don't f'ck or use contraception, simple as that.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


no, it's the body inside of her body, we're talking about here.

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


Although by law a fetus within the womb is technically not a human being, consider these things: the fetus's heart is beating, its brain is functioning, and it already has all the genes in its cells to tell all of the traits of the soon-born child. This is how scientists define living organisms, isn't it?

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


but since you can't exclude the possibility that the unborn baby is actually alive at the time of abortion, it's appropriate to decide for its right to live rather than against it.

Life / Why is circumcision not practiced in Poland? [701]


I couldn't argue with you here, Jon. If anyone knows it, it's you, LOL (not meant as an insult whatsoever).


oh my, Natasia, LOL (You know I like you :-) )

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


nicely said, agree 100%

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


I didn't want to say it but I had the same feeling for quite some time now. He deserves to be complimented for his word choice though, no doubt about it.

Love / Google: Polish women "easier" than English women - official! [52]


can you provide a link to support it? I'm not saying, you're wrong but somehow, it sounds like another attack on Christians and PF is full of it.

Love / Google: Polish women "easier" than English women - official! [52]

you're funny, man LOL

News / Abortion still under control in Poland [2986]


your view is dangerous, man. Basically what you're saying is, to hell with others as long as it suits me.

even science hasn't determined yet the exact point where the baby is considered alive but you guys seem to already know it better... As Grzegorz said above, since we are not quite sure whether its alive or not, we have to assume it is and act accordingly.