History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


I was not talking about Spanner but RIF and Warszawa brands, there is an existing myth that Germans produced human-fat derived soap on an industrial scale and thats proven false by IPN which compared the samples available, neither "Warszawa" nor "RIF" were made with human fat.

Spanner did make soap out of humans for his messed up experiments but that was a fringe case, not production for commercial use.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Myth, some concentration camps wife allegedly made lamp covers from skin but it was never proven, the soap thing is jewish invented rubbish(the guy who claimed it was jewish), the alleged human fat soap "Warszawa" brand was in reality not made from humans at all, thats proven already.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


I'm sorry for the off topic but how the bloody fudge did the baby shields made their way into discussion about energy politics?

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Newsflash no we are not, we could and should develop economic ties with Azerbeijan and import from there at the same time heavily investing in nuclear, solar and alternative power research, if we're dependent from Russia its over for us and you.

Another newsflash, Russia will not respect any trade agreements and use its resources as means of blackmail, if we get dependent they'll just skyrocket the prices and if costs of extraction get too high they'll just pull out of any deals they made and everyone's fucked.


I dont care about the Russians in light of this issue, what i care about is the serious instability of Russia as far as any economic or political deals are concerned, building such economic ties with a country that has noregard for law and political/diplomatic standards when there are alternatives is bloody stupid.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Region, Nord Stream like all pipelines will inevitably expand and increase regional dependency on Russian resources and being dependent on Russia in any aspect is a very bad thing for obvious reasons.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]

Wellllll now so you dont need a market for your goods and cheap labor force? You do realise that a significant part of your economy is tangled with Polish imports and exports? Oh and if there's ever a conflict with Russia guess on who's lands shit will hit the brick? Not yours.

As for pissing you off, you want to be the leader of Europe, i'm fine with that you've got all the prerequisites for that position but with it comes the responsibility to enact diplomacy thats in the interest of Europe as such not Germany and fuck Europe.

Nord Stream is a perfect example where you not only attempt to fuck up yourselves but also the region.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]

BB before Poles at large grow to like Germany or to be objective about Germany another generation needs to pass, the reasons are quite obvious besides you needed us in EU, matter of fact you need a strong dynamic Poland for various reasons both economical and military so its not like you're doing this because you're good neighbours, you're doing it because you're good diplomats.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


Uh, no? Iran is not going to stop its nuclear program whether Russia mediates or not, Russia is inherently opposed to US even if it periodically works with it AND Poland feels fucked in the arse which means next time around its going to flip US a finger and just join the anti-insertinternationalUSoperation camp.

U.S just blew away all possible gains, the only ones who gained are Russia and Iran.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Not at all, i'd be either impassive or i'd work to save them, it mainly depends on the danger i'd put my family to, i would be willing to risk my life for Jews, i would not be willing to risk my loved ones.

I do however see that Jews slander us regardless so the loss of jewish population if it saved Poland would be acceptable, look at it this way, they were Polish therefore they should be ready to give their life for their country and if they werent ready then they were clearly not Polish and we owe them nothing.


I got a lot of unulfilled dreams and i'm pretty sure Jews arent in them so you can rest in peace Pawian i hold no grudge against your people:)


I'd say i feel insulted but Poles ought to be used to jewish slander by now, all you can do is hurl insults and call us anti-semites.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]

I like to equate Hitlers approach to ideology in the same way as Teutonic Knights, first they invented a piece of ideology for political purposes then they kept using it untill they believed it, initially Poland was a political adversary and little more.


And? Polish national interest preceds all others, Jews accuse us of being accomplices when we saved them, the other way around they'd at least have some basis, also if Poland allied itself with Germany and Germany would win we would be in the victors camp and guess who's writing history after wars are done?:)


That is incorrect, specifically Russia was Hitlers obsesion, Poland was briefly considered as a viable ally, of course these have been brief musings of several staff oficers but mainly because of Polands opposition rather than Nazi Germany not wanting to.

Yes Jews would have to die, but on the other side there would be no Katyń, no jewish NKVD, no massacres of polish inteligentsia and quite frankly Germany even as a far stronger ally would be preferable to Russia's domination.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Not really, lots of Hitlers hatred towards Poland came from the defiant resistance it put up both politically and later militarily.


Britain had little to offer Germany, in fact despite Hitlers positive sentiment Britain would be a natural enemy once Germany would win in the East since III Reich was a perpetum mobile of war, as long as it had ambitions to fulfill it would try to shoulder them and becoming a naval and colonial power was pretty high up on the list.

Poland on the other hand especially pre war Poland was a mirror image of Germany in many respects and had serious potential as an ally unlike Romania, Hungary or even Italy.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]

Not really he had quite a good shot at defeating Russia, he failed but thats not really Russias doing, mostly it was his own fuck ups.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]


Germany sunk because of shortages in manpower and equipment, Poland as an ally equals at least a milion more troops at a time when Germans did not have that milion.

History / Polish-German alliance. [489]

It was impossible true but we've been discussing a purely could-be situation where despite all unlikelyhood Poland ends up in the German camp.

History / Can anyone from Poland tell me about Auschwitz and The Ghetto? [625]

Personaly i'd be content to leave it to rot, its just a waste of space;)

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


Through war which was always his perceived conclusion to any major political offensive, there was no alternative scenario nor any plan of how to direct a nation should Germany lose the imminent war which in turn gave birth to a deeply angered and frustrated Nazi Germany and yet another defeat.


Not really, all was going downhill the moment Bismarck came to power with his "Blood and Iron" military solutions backed by politics provide short term gains and long term losses.

Without Bismarck you could have became a European superpower through the might of your economy, political pressure and extreme dynamic of your nation, today all of Europe would willlingly and peacefully follow your lead, as it is the opportunity is permanently lost and instead you're only one of contemporary leaders of Europe and in decline at that.

BUT! You have some patriot missiles (saw Wrocławs post)

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]

And make mortal enemies out of them, in time they would retaliate and make sure Germany would never rise to power again, Bismarck was an impressive man with great understanding of what makes diplomacy tick but ignoring human nature, you cant build a lasting political entity with a gun, people will eventually break out and destroy it, and you.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


For you or Lusitania?


Not really, the Spring Offensive didnt have enough punch U.S or not and given the amount of social unrest in Europe the war would stop in the few months due to massive communist uprisings in both Germany and France.


Any major lost war would have Germany enter a genocidal war of retribution, thats the inflexible mindset which is the legacy of your beloved Bismarck.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


WW 2 yes, by the time of Normandy Russia was fucking Germany sideways with a rough stick, also lend lease made things a bit easier but was not critical to Russia.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


My personal feelings? Since we're getting personal i believe that U.S is perhaps the greatest country in living history, not the smartest, not the noblest, it has its share of ups and downs but still i believe it to be in many ways a window to what a better mankind could be.


Where did i dispute it? I've simply stated that if you want to retain influence in Europe you will have to turn to Poland since its the fourth most important country in Europe in regards to geopolitics, without the voice of U.K AND Poland Germany and France will effectively keep you out of the picture in the region.


Randal lets not be childish, U.S extends aid not because its lovely shiney and humane but because it has significant interests in the country getting strong.

Possibly the only country which you support financially without any rational basis is Israel, all other countries were investmenets that paid back.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


Actually Ukraine will be the reason for the next regional war ( or lack of thereoff ) depending on what they decide in the Black Sea issue.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


No one relies on America however Poland is the only significant supporter next to UK and many nations around us look as to what are we going to do next.

If Europe remains peacefull than Poland will join the big 3 (Germany, France, UK) within the next 20-30 years but US needs that voice much much earlier, no one relies on US its US that will grow to rely on Poland if it hopes to retain its influence in Europe.

Important bit is to understand that if US is going to help out Poland become a fully self supporting strong player thats only because this situation is furthering US goals, so its not exactly a hand out.


Only in the age of kings and great leaders, in times of democracy when its much less personalized its a much more complicated process.


Sean at the moment there is no threat however there will be, unless you are willing to bet that Europe is stabilized for good, building our political, military and economical standing in anticipation of the threat is done so much better when its still not there.

Some sort of conflict with Russia is a foregone conclusion, Eastern Europe and Russia have simply to many colliding goals and interests to maintain status quo for much longer, the question is when will the conflict begin, what will be the sides and what form will it take.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


No sir, Kaczyński is a moron who would antagonize Russia because he's a little twat ridden with inferiority issues and as a means to appeal to the more simple electorate that swallows anti-german, anti-russian and anti-corruption slogans whereas i ...


... believe that in great diplomacy actions require a valid reason and a purpose, improving relations with Russia above a certain level is not possible without submission, aggravating them seriously takes far more than a defence shield.

The shield showed Russia that we're ready to defy and oppose them, remember that russian goverment operates in a simple weak-strong polarity, submissive nations get used in the worst ways, too bold nations get subdued (Georgia) whereas moderately independent nations have hopes of maintaining relatively normal relations.

The shield is such a path of moderation russian rhetoric notwhistanding.


Not at all but we need to bolster polish position in central Europe by first improving our economical, political and military standing and at a later stage turning towards smaller/weaker nations like Ukraine, Hungary or Romania since Western Europe is in our situation only a paper supporter in times of the true crisis.

So milk the West while we can, get used by US if it wants to use us and then with improved strength turn to the thus far overlooked part of Europe where our true political capital and potential lies.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


They would not, Russia does not disclose how many operational launchers it has but i'm betting with the state of their nuclear stockpile, not many, also that would aggravate Baltic Republics, Ukraine, even Belarus, those are the countries that would really hate seeing Russia go active, there was a LOT to lose in terms of political capital for Russia there.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


However it was in the Polish interest, despite not being altruist.


Sean lets face it, Europe is a bunch of cynical fuckers who would sell Poland out without a second of consideration, they did it twice in 1939 and in Yalta, our politicians have no illusions as to the value of NATO or EU, if USA chooses to invest in Poland in its own interests then lets have them do it, it doesnt matter if Poland gets stronger as part of US plot what matters is that Poland gets stronger.

Those Patriots are completely irrelevant by themselves but i see them as a beginning of pro-polish effort that might do for us what it did for Japan, Germany or Korea and such investment is worth more than a thousand EUs or NATOs.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


I seriously doubt that, i believe that there's a long running agenda and political continuity and presidents only add or substract in respect to it in a relatively small way.

For example invasion of Iraq was ALL about oil (stealing it in food for oil programmes and so forth) and i doubt that was Bushs idea, more likely that it was more or less subtly suggested to him.


Russians use terms like provocation like a serial rapist uses a kidnapped teenager ie whenever they feel like it, ultimately such a middle finger to them is a positive thing for Poland since it furthers us from their zone of influence.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


Actually you see it in completely wrong context, its not protection, its a gesture, a signal if you will.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]


You mistake US presidents with people who make actual decisions, Bush for example was a redneck who needed a red and blue diagram not to smear shit over his ass while wiping, there's advisors and people behind the face who make the decisions, presidents in US are little more than faces.


In this particular case yes, however i believe that US will invest quite a lot into Poland in the immidiate future.


Iran was (despite constant stream of merry bullshit by Ahmedejinah) never against US in any but purely demonstrative way.


USA is not interested in dialogue of equals with a potential rival so stop deluding yourself, Americans will give Russia the finger at every step of the way.


There's a polish saying, "if you cant count, count on yourself" US of A is a selfish bitch and rightly so, thats the way diplomacy works but i do believe that all of the above is implausible, USA has significant political gains in making Poland strong and is likely to invest in it, if not? Well thats US loss really.

News / US to deploy Patriot missiles to Poland [405]

Well i'm not biased on this issue, lord knows there's enough bias in me but i think you know on which issues :)


Nope, they're still very much there.


The fact is that Abchazja and Osetia are closely related with Georgia and while they didnt want to be parts of Georgia they definitely didnt want big brother to help them, of course Russia didnt ask them since it wanted to block a potential pipeline and its troops are stationing there despite official withdrawal.