Cursed soldiers controvercy - not all Poles respect them

Yes, ruled with Polish hands. Martial law by Jaruzelski was a pure Polish design and implementation. Was Jaruzelski and his henchmen Jews? No, he came from Polish nobility.


But it was true. Many elites didn`t mind partitions as long as their estates and property in Eastern Poland were protected under Russian rule.

@pawian
Considering that communism propaganda (Poles bad pany etc) isn't it strange that Jaruzelski became a general then in a "people's" army?
Almost as if he was fighting for the people and not power hungry communists :)

That is true @pawian
My family is a good example, from Lithuanian side of the family. They worked under Russian Tsarist regime in the administration (Just like the judges family in Pan Tadeusz) but, joined uprisings when called (On Poland's side of course)

No, it isn`t. There were more Red Counts in communist ranks. They were watched over with suspicion until they proved themselves worthy of communist trust. He deserved it by working as a secret agent in 1950s and never ever betrayed communism.


Yes, they did but it was later on, when noblemen who had initially agreed to Russian partition saw that it wasn` t so rosy after all.

There were good and bad ones in all Polish social classes and within ethnicities living in Poland at different times in history.
Not all NOBLEmen were that noble.
Take Targowica or Potocki who refused to cooperate with the Polish underground but was ok with hosting Gorring in Łańcut. There are more and more examples.

As for Jews in the communist/stalinist authorities , there were many but it wasn't only Jews who were responsible for Stalinist atrocities in Poland.

As for cursed soldiers, we can't judge them as a whole but their individual deeds.

Wow, it is the second time that Pres Duda surprised me positively. Do you remember his previous time when he spoke beautiful words about the Ghetto Rising and its fighters?

Two days ago he went to Zaleszany, the village in northern Poland where one of cursed soldiers` units carried out a massacre of innocent civilians of Belarussian decent. Duda put a wreath, knelt down and said a prayer for their souls. Really incredible.

Still, he seemed a bit embarassed. The media weren`t notified about the visit and the participants of the ceremony weren`t allowed to take photos.

Some photos were taken, nevertheless.

• 
  4.jpg
  
• 
  3.jpg
  

President of all Poles or only better public relations. He is for me still not really koscher.

You mean not kosher enough???

Yes not kosher and no enough. In German is something not koscher/kosher when it is not cristall clear.

In NAmerican English 'not kosher' carries a strong implication of dishonesty or trickery.

Thank you for Info. Pretty the same. Only my English is not so fine.

Aaah, I thought you were talking about Jewish traditions. Coz Duda has no problem with them, either.

• 
  uid_62b8f521acb3ba96.jpg
  

Of course not, his wife is jewish descendant. But he is not kosher for me because he is not idependant and must do what they (PiS) want.

Yes, he is like Zelig.

This is an interesting subject that has been "bastardized".
My opinion, for what it is worth, is that most of these guys had their hearts in the right place.
Maybe not their brains...... some were criminals or racsts, but not most of them.
Most of them were patriotic Poles.

Yes, I think it is correct.

Blimey Pawian, we agree on something.... :-)

One doesn't exclude the other

I always agree with true statements.


Yes, thank you for adding it. Still, what Milo said, is true.

It is nice to be in agreement for a change.

What the hell that dimwit is doing? What for? Somebody paid him or what?

I thought it was clear: to honour the innocent victims, including women and children, of the massacre carried out by one of cursed soldiers. We know that fascists like you see nothing bad in such actions;. But decent people do care and oppose them. Duda is sometimes able to behave decently - I must admit it.

Good point.But I think you know what I meant.

Why would anyone respect thugs and criminals and such? Might as well respect the men currently in polish prisons just for being polish in that case.

He shouldn't, it send a bad message out there. What is his job anyways? What a joke!


Why this scum still post here?

His job at that monument is playing a role that every Polish President should do in their terms- namely, uniting Poles of different views. So, previously, we could see and hear Duda honouring cursed soldiers on various occasions. In Zaleszany, he honoured their victims at last.

Are you against uniting Poles? Then you are a fascist with roots in ancient Rome: not only "fasces" but primarily "divide et empera."

He should just stick to doing what he supposed to do. I don't get why he makes such unliteral decisions like a fool..
Like Kwasniewski that certified Soviet dared to apologize for Jedwabne in the name of the Polish nation. What a joke? He could do it only in his own name and his Soviet comrades...


poles and soviets cannot unite ...

Why shouldn't he? And what kind of bad message?
As for his job - he's the President of Poland and making such gestures is one of the things that presidents do.


Not really, Polish presidents are being voted in into the office in democratic elections and have the right to represent the Polish nation... Just like Yeltsin did when he apologised for the Katyń massacre:

tygodnikprzeglad.pl/jelcyn-przeprosil-za-katyn/

I suspect you don't have a problem with such a gesture in that case?

And, anyway, I don't get it what's your problem - Duda didn't apologise for anything in the name of anyone. He just put a wreath and said a prayer for the victims - it's the most basic, humane gesture...

I don't care much about it!


Because that is not his job. Also because there is no consensus as to what is what. Also there is no need for it. Why the hell he is overactive in filds and subject that are not urgent and could be left alone. Whilst he have nothing to offer in those areas that are of a vital importance. It his last term, is he wants to play any political role in the future? What a dimwit!


yada yada it doesn't give them a carte blanch to do willy nilly whatever they want...


My problem is that he done it to further his own personal agenda not Poland's agenda and by doing so he made an impression that can and will be interpreted in a way that will harm Poland in one way or the other. Because Poland doesn't have elite that would solve problems but have( integncikow z PRLu, ktorzy ise bawia w polityke a prowinni kury macac.) some useless people who don't know what they are doing.

Exactly.


Of course it is Poland`s agenda. It is high time to get rid of those nationalist demons which have haunted us since Dmowski times.


Similarly, Poles and fascists can`t unite. How do you like it??? :):):)

Here is the description of a very controvercial "hero" who first colluded with Soviets and communists but later dropped them. His infamous activities include murdering Jews, also children.

https://polishforums.com/history/cursed-soldiers-controvercy-poles-respect-84588/7/#msg1749229

He is venerated by some Poles as one of cursed soldiers with monuments and plaques. Other Poles perceive his as a collaborationist and murderer.

• 
  photo11519155040.j.jpg
  
• 
  800pxPomnik_Jzefa.jpg