Current Polish-Russian relations.. What do the Poles think?

he does what he has to..in most cases he was pushed to do what he does..i think is more reactionary than imperialistic behaviour.

see Chechen war and foreign sponsored mercenaries,or Georgia war ,or slathering russian population in ukraine was result of nato and eu meddling in ukraine.i f he left those provocation and open hostility unanswered he would face same things in russia

Please, stop being a Putin apologist.

Putin wants to recreate the Russian/Soviet Empire, hes gone on record as claiming that the collapse of the Soviet Union was a disaster.

The line that Russia is being 'pushed' into invading his neighbours is an excuse for rebuilding the Empire.


The reason why Russia does that is because any country with a border dispute is ineligible for NATO membership, and Russia is military unable to occupy any country in it entirety.

Surely that's not true? Croatia and Slovenia had a border dispute for years (from what I remember, there's an ex-Yugoslavian army base under Slovenian control despite being located in Croatia), Croatia and Montenegro have a dispute over Prevlaka, Spain and the UK have a dispute over Gibraltar, etc etc...

You are entitled to your opinion but as a matter of fact that opinion doesn't translate into reality.
In fact Russia doesn't have anything substantial to offer and peruse policies of their predecessors.


If a said country tramples on Poland's toes in the process that is wrong. If at the same time such a country has nothing to offer in a terms of cultural or economical advancement but stick to that old Assyrian style of domination such outdated and backwoods ideas make to be such a country 'an imperialistic monster'.

remind me ,what economical and cultural and enlighten thingies Poland and US offered to Iraq after illegal and criminal invasion.or any country nato invaded.

russia at least can say,it is defending its crutial interest and security threats and russian people(in case of ukraine)

Non-peaceful dispute. rferl.org/content/article/1099020.html


Starting a war in the name of citizens of a neighbouring country is not defence. Russia has absolutely no right to invade Ukraine.

The invasion of Iraq was equally illegal, but thats not justification for Russia actions - which were worst as it was conquering land for the purpose of expanding an Imperial Empire

Russia didnt start civil war in Ukraine-you lie


protecting russian people and historical right to Crimea.and crimean people selfdetermination( is a cardinal principle in modern international law where people have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status)


no no equal.remind me who Poland and US were defending there?what historically justified land belong to Poland in Iraq?
Russia actions are fully justified and even more-they were quite moderate.cant imagine what US would do if US citizens were being murder by thousands in lets say Mexico

I beg to differ, however it's clear that "the west" doesn't give a flying feck about Ukraine, they just use it as one of cards in their game with Russia. One day they will strike a deal with Putin and in exchange for something else, will throw Ukraine under the bus. Similarly, one can see how the west is using "Russian threat" to pressure Central Europe on many thing. Buy Patriot batteries, accept "refugees" & German controlled EU superstate etc. or else big evil Russia will come and eat you alive.

Ah, Gregy's true colours reveal himself to be a Russian sympathiser. Funny how many of these self-proclaimed "patriots" actually long for the embrace of Mother Russia again.


Strange, I don't remember you supporting the right of the Germans in Poland to self determination.


Yep, that's you definitely outed as yet another pro-Russian troll. How much is the Kremlin paying you?

PiS types chafe under Russian rule but at least life makes sense to them then. They get to be eternal victims, responsible for nothing. The idea of a Poland that is not being victimized scares them to death. The could forgive Russia for Smolensk (if we pretend for a moment that Russia engineered it) but they could never forgive the EU and NATO for offering Poland a place at the table of nations that are responsible for themselves.

nothing strange..no such thread i found here..and i assure you i would support german rights in Poland as long as they are historically and ethically justifiable.if i was leader in pre war Poland i would let Germany to build motorway and hand em over Gdansk-even tho Gdansk was part of Poland for far longer and was founded by poles.i would never chose war over some city if people of this city doesnt want to be polish-let em go


PIS type are obsessed antyrussian idiots,like waszczykowski and Macierewicz.am sick of historical grieviances obsessions and paranoia.



??????????????

Those countries were ruled in authoritarian tyrannical manner not due to consensus of the majority but due to the oppression by the minority. I'm not saying that chaos that came with NATO/USA intervention is better but if you're looking for justification you can always find one.


Maybe Poland should follow their suit and rise in defense of the oppressed Polish minority in Lithuania?

Sure, if Poland wants to be invaded by NATO and risk having Russia take over parts of Poland during the chaos of such an intervention.

The Polish minority isn't repressed anyway, and most young Poles aren't infected with the idiotic nationalism of the elders.

Sure they are!


I have been sarcastic, maybe due to your plebian DNA you don't get sarcasm?

Make up your mind, is Russia involved or not?

Those Russian citizens could very easily leave Ukraine, so why did they need protecting by Russia by an invasion and occupation? The Ukrainian citizen have every right to defend their country against Foreign invasion (as did Iraqi's for that matter). The Russian invasion force could, of course, leave Ukraine but they choose not to. They are not defending Russian Citizens, they are committing an armed invasion.


No, No and Not when under control of a foreign power. The vote was not valid due to the presence of armed foreign troops.

Also, without international recognition, any Russian claim to Crimes is invalid. Its an Russian occupation, plain and simple.


If they support Russia, they aren't Polish. PiS are never going to be pro-Russia, they deserve credit for that.

If gregy741 is pro Russia, then he IS Russian, not PiS.

Genetic experts says that Russians originate from Poles.

this is not true - however Slavs were once a gentically homogenic entity originated somewhere in the north Ukraine possibly in the swamps of the Pripyat' river - from there they expanded in a couple of directions initially and started to mix with indigenous populations where they expanded

Swamp people?
Like the Crannogmen in Game of Thrones?
gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Crannogmen

Doesn't really make sense though, how can they be


yet originate in Ukraine, surely they came from somewhere, it's not like they jst dropped out of the sky

I know Wikipedia isn't really to be trusted but there's plenty here on who the Slavs came from
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Slavs#Historiography

I guess you could say that in some ways. While I understand that Poland and Russia have a very complicated history and reconciling totally would most likely be impossible. However, I would like to see increased trade and decreased military rhetoric between the two countries.

Just because I admire Putin because he is a 'strongman' that the West is scared of and has improved the economic situation in Russia up until the invasion of Ukraine and the sanctions afterwards, does not mean that I want Poland to return back to Communism or the old system.

I simply wish for Poland not to be totally reliant economically on the west. Poland can certainly gain from trade with Russia. Also, I admire leaders that have the cajones to stand up to the west whether it's the Visegard 4, Russia, or even Iran - who is being wrongfully criticized over their nuclear program by the US, again due to certain lobbies and foreign interests.

Basically yes. Russia as a state is loathed here throughout society.

Merged:

Top 5 Things A Polish Person Will Not Admit To A Russian

Here is my list:

1) Vodka > horilka > zubrowka

2) Polish businesses made absolutely tons of money in Russia and CIS countries pre-UKR meltdown.

3) Poles appreciate Russian sense of humor.

4) Large national oil and gas deposits are actually a nice thing to have

5) It is nice that it was a Russian rocket that delivered Mirosław Hermaszewski to space.

More pointless propaganda that changes nobody's opinion and makes people like you less.

As they say in orcland, Ёб твою мать

it is meaningless and forgettable

It's not a meltdown, it was an aggression of a foreign army

Five facts about Russia that everyone knows

1. Your army are primitive rapists
2. You are poor because your leaders are thieves
3. You are unhappy because you are not free
4. Your president is a murderer
5. Your food is awful

Bonus fact

Those oil and gas deposits don't belong to the plebs.

I would modify it...

1. The model of government has not changed since the tsars, just the job titles.
2. Most people aren't 'citizens' in the modern sense of the word but subjects of the tsar
3. The vast majority of the population are obedient and passive (so they don't mind the government robbing or even killing them)
4. The government regards the subjects with contempt
5. Negative selection operates at all levels of society destroying chances for positive change.

Top 5 Things A Russian Person Will Not Admit To A Pole...

1. In retrospect, it would have been better for the entire world if Poland had won in 1612.
2. Poland, rather than Russia, is the real Sarmatia and mother of all Slavia.
3. It doesn't make sense to have monuments of occupational troops in a free, independent country.
4. Honour and integrity are actually nice things to have.
5. Russians secretely love and admire Poles, and wish they could be more like us.

... and as a honorary mention, outside the top 5 list - Fiat 125p was way better than Lada 2103.

There is a quote from some Greek, regarding the Romans: "Conquered, we conquer." It was in regards to how the Greeks, despite being militarily subjugated, conquered the Romans through culture.

How do you know, then, that merging with Russia would not forever change the fabric of Poland? Russians are not as small as Lithuanians which you can systematically sideline and dilute. It would effect changes in your society that would have made it unrecognizable to you. Poland, with all its idiosyncrasies, is a product of history and geography as any nation is. Including Russia. Your freedoms and our autocracy have reasons behind them. Could Poland control such a territory while keeping in place the highly decentralized form of government you poets enjoy so much? Perhaps an absolutist autocracy is the only way dozens of peoples can be kept in check, without everything descending into a bloodbath regularly?

Well, I suppose we'll never know. I'd like to believe though that if Poland had won back then, and controlled the vast territories of what is now Russia, we would not only have avoided partitions but also would have been powerful enough to triumph over all the autocracies of that age. Poland, with her Golden Freedom, would have become something comparable to the USA, only at least a 100 years earlier, and consequently would be the greatest superpower in the history of Earth. Imagine - with our high culture, ingenuity, magnanimity and moral superiority, how much more could have been achieved.

Oh, well.. as I said, we'll never know. :(