70th anniversary of 1943 Wołyń/Volhynia and Eastern Galicia Massacre - controvercies

And remember the fallen, just as we remember our enemies' fallen soldiers now.


They never 'lived with you' by choice. Who would want to?

What sort of choice is that? They ended up in Austria through the Polish partitions.

Nobody ever asked them anything.

What bills? For what?


You know very well that's not what that was all about.

For bringing strife into our lands, and for murdering countless innocents like cowards.

I don't believe that a son must pay for a father's crimes - but these animals actively embrace that part of their history. They glorify it. Therefore, they are guilty too.

Otherwise who will punish them? The Poles? Hahaha

They sh*t in your plate, and you ask for seconds.

@Bobko, they didn't murder anyone. It happened long time ago.


By this logic RuSSian "animals" are guilty too and you should pay your bills too.

What is "that"?

If it's an official event, then it's very much about the fallen.

If it's something organised by an extreme political group, then Poland has the same creepy right wing stuff and Poles aren't in a great position to complain.

Better to look at the future not the past.

Do you see Russian officials saying "we didn't kill enough people in Katyn?"

Do you see Russian ceremonies commemorating the crushing of the Prague Spring or the protests in Budapest?

The only bad thing we do is the recent trend of whitewashing Stalin, but this will pass. People will wake up, and remember again why it is wrong. In any case, Stalin killed more of us than he ever did of you - so we do not need to listen to your lectures. This is our problem, and we will figure it out - without your assistance.

Now compare that to Ukrainians - who live without apology. Like little babies - everything with them has to be forgiven.

So then how are we equally guilty? Where do we glorify crimes and massacres? Show me.

@jon357, "that" is not about "remembering enemies' fallen soldiers". When Poles do that they don't put on Nazi uniforms.


I'm not a member of any "creepy right wing stuff" nor do I defend it, so I can complain all I want.


RuSSians tell Poles the same. Now look at them.

And who you tried and failed to invade (having previously tried to starve every single one to death, hence your sour grapes and trying to rake up dark chapters of the past.


And some others do. You'll not change that any time soon.

And yes, Polish fascists do Hitler salutes.


We see decades of denial, the Katyn monument being 'downgraded' and recent editions of 'official' text books omitting it.

And that's what makes you a sick country in our eyes. You're whitewashing a monster that bathed your own people in blood. Is there anything more sick that a country can do?


That's exactly the problem with RuSSians and UkrainianSS - you don't listen to your victims.

There are??? And they do???? Man....I had no idea!!!!

Every decent Russian, and absolutely everyone in my circle of acquaintances - without exception - understands this was a terrible crime against the Polish nation.

Maybe some bumpkin out in the sticks, who has never opened a book, and only consumes zombie tv thinks it was justified... but again no decent person in Russia thinks so.

The downgrading of monuments is only because of the present problems in the relations between our countries. It will go back to normal once things quiet down. And even so, I think we shouldn't go low and do such things.


Actually, I stopped raking up this sh*t years ago on this forum, and the only reason I'm doing it now is because Ukraine's moronic foreign minister thrust it back into the spotlight - absolutely unprompted.

If you don't like me talking about this, go and complain to the UA Ministry of Foreign Affairs that they are leading a counterproductive policy.

@Bratwurst Boy
There's been enough about it on here over the years, including pictures.

....not Poles!

On my father's side, my great grandfather was sent to Kemerovo, in Siberia, where he froze to death in a labor camp. The charge was "espionage in favor of Japan". The man had never been to Japan, or spoken Japanese, and had no possible means of contacting them.

His brother, was unceremoniously shot in a MGB basement, and dumped into a pit outside of the city. We only discovered what happened to them around the late 1990s or early 2000s.

All of my grandparents were total orphans.

I don't need you telling me about what a monster Stalin was.

Outside people attacking Russia over Stalin only leads to a reflexive rallying around the flag.

What do you want from me? To tell you that I'm sorry Stalin did these things to your country? Of course I am sorry. Happy?

Stockholm Syndrome

Sorry, Bobko....


It could have been different....without Hitler....I learned at first the russian soldiers surrendered en masse till they realized they didn't get liberated or even treated better by Stalin's enemy...

One can't help wondering what could have happened with better treatment and even support.....but then Hitler and Co. would had been different people and everything would be different...probably!

@Bratwurst Boy

Stalin was a criminal that robbed banks and trains to fill Bolshevik coffers during their underground days. Lenin during this time sat in Switzerland, drinking coffee and writing smart books.

He was brutalized through abusive parents, the Tsar's Okhranka, prisons, the Civil War, and then the Polish Soviet war. If you grew a monster in a laboratory, you could not do better than Stalin.

In his last will and testament, Lenin warned his comrades about Koba's sadistic tendencies.

Through his brutality he emerged on top, and killed every real opponent - from Trotsky to Tukhachevsky.

It's just cruel fate we ended up in the hands of this butcher. He broke my country, and robbed us of everything except our soul.

That's retarded though. RuSSia is attacked over Stalin only because they whitewash him.


I want you (and other RuSSians) to be able to admit that it happened and acknowledge that Poles have the right to feel angry about what was done to Poland and Poles. In other words - we'd like to see some empathy and understanding from you.


Yes, thank you.

It absolutely happened, and Poles absolutely have the right to be angry.

It's just that I feel like BB, when people attack him over Hitler. He never defends him, he never says what he did was right - and yet sometimes it feels like he has to answer for the entire Third Reich.

Back on topic, and to Ukraine - they not only won't apologize, they GLORIFY it.

With parades. With fancy funerals. With monuments. With "documentaries" on television.

These are the people you gave so much weapons and money to, so that they could kill more of us. What the hell is wrong with you? Why are you not helping us?

These are the people you're trying and failing to demonise.

Or even aren't, since you've no reason to make assumptions about the personal politics of the individuals whose lives you've wrecked.


Why would anyone help r*SSia in its war crimes and hatred of freedom?

@Bobko, but RuSSia is doing the same. Parades. Fancy funerals. Monuments. "Documentaries" on television. You GLORIFY the Soviet Union, Stalin, the Soviet Army.


So they could defend their country against an invasion.


Because what you're doing is wrong.

I have no problem glorifying the Soviet Union and the Soviet Army - because this is my motherland, and the military in which my family lost so many. F*cking sue me.

I do have problems with glorifying Stalin. I hate the monuments that some idiots are putting up (almost all on private initiative, and practically never state sanctioned). I don't like the documentaries being made by clueless journalists. I don't like the security services in general - the lot of them - the FSB foremost among them. They're descendants of the murderous Cheka, MGB, and KGB.

But because the army is a cross section of the entire Russian society I will not hate them. They are not in the same category as the grey little mice from the FSB and other spies. My friends and relatives are in this army, and I know they are good people that would not harm an innocent person if they could help it. They would rather die.

Pawian - I will record that you shamelessly refused to defend Ukro-Nazis.

Thank you.

@Bobko
my svoeekh nye brasayem - vpyeryod!!!

And that's the problem. Because Stalin wasn't the only problem. The Soviet Union didn't let Poland go after Stalin died. And the Soviet Army soldiers raped, looted, murdered and burned in Poland, not Stalin. When you're glorifying something - then there's no room for criticism, for the truth, because uncomfortable truth is "tarnishing" the glorified image in people's heads.

Hey, stupid, the Russian army is in Russia defending Russia from the UA, the aggressor.
Or there is no such thing as self-determination...

Just as I never hated the German army. 99% had no choice. Being executed for disobeying orders is not a choice.
SS and Auschwitz guards are another matter - the worst of them being women.

As a reminder...It was the FSB that told the US to check on the Tsarnaev brothers. We blew it off and got the Boston bombing as a reward.

Also...Every country needs its KGB, FSB, CIA, Mossad, and people who euthanize little kittens.

Все правильно.


We let you go later, didn't we? We let everyone else go too.

It's hard to think of another example of country that bloodlessly relinquished an entire empire, and didn't ask for anything in return. Britain and France gave away their possessions, screaming and kicking, and only after it became impossible to resist the United States and the Soviet Union.

Gorbachev may have been a galactic scale moron, but he did do the things I described above. You should pray to his ghost before bed.


Same. They were mostly too busy fighting and dying at the front, and didn't have the time or opportunity to terrorize innocent people.

Not to be compared to the vampires that moved in the rear of the German army, practically never did any fighting, but instead were specialists at torching villages and executing women and kids.


First of all - volunteers. Second - f*cking fanatics.

Any kind of a fanatic should be avoided.

@Bobko, you "let us go" after almost a half a century! Takie z was dobre pany! lol 😂 And not willingly either - the Soviet Union was collapsing - you had no other choice. Also, it wasn't so "bloodless" in case of some countries either.

Plus, sovoks like Putin seem to be regretting it.


What??? What a dying empire that enslaved and brutalized other countries could possibly ask for? (not that you got too much anyway)

I posted it before but I will gladly post it again. Soviet army leaving Poland...

... not a single shot fired, echelons rolling in perfect order, soldiers smiling and waving their hands.

What a f*cking evil empire...


Gave away? In Algeria alone there were 1.5 million deaths (mostly civilians) and 2 million people resettled or displaced. The French... it fills me with shame that we taught them how to eat with a knife and fork... but that's off-topic in this thread. France is quite close to Western Ukraine in my favourite countries/regions ranking.


Things were not quite as simple as that. It might have ended up in quite a mess...

Thank you Kania, as always.


Dokladnie tak jest! Dziekuje Paulina, w koncu jestesmy po tej samej stronie.

As a reward, some more photos of old Nazi fags for you. I really enjoy that none of them are of an age that it could be even remotely possible that they served in the OUN-UPA or SS Galician. Also, the presence of many strange medals that they got from god knows who. F*cking cosplayers.

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