Arts and crafts

Any of you familiar with Peter Doig?

He has some good stuff. There's balance in his work.

@AntV, I can't say that I am.


You probably could if you practiced :)


I forgot to post the artist herself :) - Annie Stegg with one of her paintings:

• 
  IMG_20240925_224208_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240925_224401_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240925_224522_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240925_225043_.jpg
  

Back in the 1950s, you could buy huge canvases by Sir Lawrence Alma-Tadema (post pre-raphaelite, a forerunner of photorealism) for less than the price of a used family car. Now they cost tens of millions and one of his (the second picture with the petals or a version of it) I think holds the record for art prices.

• 
  IMG_0886.jpeg
  
• 
  IMG_0885.jpeg
  
• 
  IMG_0884.jpeg
  
• 
  IMG_0887.jpeg
  

@Paulina

Give Doig a look-see.

Now I do like those :)

The second picture in post 29 appears to me to be in the style of John William Waterhouse. Also reminds me a bit of the style of painting in Midsummer Eve by Edward Robert Hughes although the subject matter differs. The ones in the post below are delving into fantasy and you know I like fantasy art. Thanks for posting them :)

The painting below is a favourite of mine:

• 
  Circe Invidiosa - John William Waterhouse
  

Beautiful paintings. I have one of his on my wall at home.


Guess his paintings have become more popular over the years.


She's younger than I thought she'd be. She definitely has a leaning toward fantasy.....

I also like Klimt, but the lesser known paintings. My favourite of his is Mada Primavesi.

That would be the Irish monks, thank you very much. Where would you be without us? A great bunch of lads!

Re photo-realism, I was really into that when I was a teenager and preparing my portfolio for applying to art college. As Paulina says, I marvelled at the skill of being able to render the subject exactly in its 'real' form. For me it was about mastering the technique (which, incidentally I never did). At the same time I loved the loose style of the Impressionists, the classic 'dappled sunlight' and the atmosphere of their work.

@Paulina, I would classify Annie Stegg more as an illlustrator. Yes, her work is highly skilled. She's very talented. And that begs the question, what's the difference between an 'artist' and an 'illustrator ............

Continuing on the theme of crafts, what about shell craft? Sailors frequently made gifts for their ladies from shells. Here is a beautiful piece from the early 1800s:

There was also a fashion for creating shell encrusted follies in grand gardens.

• 
  mdugginsfig09.jpg
  

I have no idea when that photo was taken - I found it on the internet and posted it because I like the fact that her painting is taller than her ;D From what I've managed to find on the inernet it seems that she was born in 1982 :)


But... as far as I know she isn't an illustrator :) She's a painter. I am not aware of her illustrating any books or anything of this sort. 🤔

In case of confusion about what I mean:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illustrator


Sorry, but I'm not sure what you mean by "illustrator"...

If you mean the difference between an artist and a painter (as in "rzemieślnik"?) then I guess in your view the Renaissance and Pre-Raphaelite painters were "illustators" and not "artists"? 🤨

If I'm to be honest I don't care about that "question", that distinction anymore :) Especially that in English people seem to use the word "artist" very freely. I used to care about that distinction when I was at art school. I guess that's what an art school does to you - it turns you into a bit of an art snob :) Fortunately to a great extent I grew out of it and nowadays I just enjoy art.

That's why every time I'll post about another painter I will probably just call them "artists" interchangeably with painters or illustrators, because I personally consider illustrators to be artists too :)


I did and I'm afraid he's defenitely not my cup of tea...
From the paintings I've seen I only like this one a bit - I'm not crazy about the style, but at least this one is pretty good:

• 
  IMG_20240926_142311_.jpg
  

Another artist :)

Nick Alm is mainly an oil painter, but he also paints some very good watercolours. His paintings are defenitely not "comfort art" for me, since they can be sort of depressive and they sometimes make me feel uneasy, but I like his art style and compostion in his paintings. I like how he builds shapes with his looser brush strokes and creates a sense of intimacy in some scenes - it feels like we're in the room with the person depicted in the painting.

nickalm.com/about/

• 
  IMG_20240926_151445_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_151645_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_151815_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_151933_.jpg
  

And some more:

• 
  IMG_20240926_154402_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_153810_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_153956_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_154124_.jpg
  

Based on some of his paintings I'm wondering if he has drinking problems lol:

• 
  IMG_20240926_154914_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_155013_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_155411_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_155206_.jpg
  

So do I. I wasn't trying to be a smart arse or start a silly argument. It was just one of those musings that invites some kind of discussion on a topic.

There is a distinction though, in my opinion. An artist can act as an illustrator for a book for example but somebody who earns their bread and butter from illustrating books, may sadly never have an exhibition of their work and until quite recently the copyright of an illustrator's work belonged to the person who commissioned it so they actually lose the ownership of their own work.

But in artistic terms, I think there is also a distinction in that an illustrator generally has to have a solid technique while a successful artist can be quite weak technically. Illustrators also need versatility. They may be known for a distinctive style but they can usually work equally well in more than one medium and in more than one style and tackle a wide range of subjects. Finally, they need to be able to give form to somebody else's ideas. A good book illustrator will read the text and create the illustrations in such a way that the author feels 'yes, that's the way it looks in my mind, that's how it would look if I could draw this myself,' - that's quite a special skill.

For example, there was a trio of English sisters who were all illustrators in the early part of the twentieth century, mostly for children's books. One of the sisters, Joyce Brisley, did these, quite different in style, the classic pen and ink drawing and a beautifully rendered watercolour portrait:

• 
  746b546662fe21e93980.jpg
  
• 
  26940db154c86ba0def8.jpg
  

The first and second set of paintings looks like a period where he was interested in exploring light. The third and final set, you can see that the brushwork is much looser and the lighting is not so evident. Seems like this is a phase of exploring a different way of using paint. It's fascinating isn't it, seeing how an artist's work evolves? He's very talented. I wouldn't want any of those images on my wall though.

Some of them are a bit "dancing butler", aren't they.

That one (plus a load of other Vettriano copies) are on the wall of my local MaccyD's in Warsaw.

I would say that the main difference between an artist and an illustrator is the level of creativity. Illustrators base the illustrations on the material. Has a base so to speak. Artist requires more own input.

Then why did you write that you "would classify Annie Stegg more as an illustrator" as if an illustrator wasn't an artist?


Not really, it depends what you're illustrating and what kind of illustrations the client expects :) (and it depends what you consider to be "solid technique" vs "weak technique"). Also, I've seen some really bad, very low quality illustrations in e-books for kids... The author/publishing house must've been really stingy or with zero taste lol


As for style - that's rather rare, from my observation... Often authors pick an illustrator precisely because they like their particular art style and they'd like that style for their book.


I disagree... It doesn't matter much if there's a material to base on or not. The artistic creative process is the same. Leonardo da Vinci and Michelangelo were basically "illustrating" the Bible :))) Does that mean they weren't artists?

Also, you and Atch seem to forget that besides the paid work illustrators usually create their own art too :)))

Probably done using software of some kind.

An illustrator is obviously a type of artist.

I'm completely fine with that as I'm clueless about art :)
I would say that illustrator can be a great artist but doesn't have to be. It's a job rather than calling :)

I forgot to add two important reasons - because she enjoys it and to make people like me happy :)))


Me neither, but I would like to see his paintings in real life :)


Oh, Lenka, I'm afraid you have no idea what you're talking about :))))


I don't remember exactly, it was quite some time ago, but probably yes... That wasn't the problem though - a skilled and experienced digital artist can make lovely illustrations for children's books, even resembling traditional art. The problem was the skill level...

For example, there's a children's book illustrator based in Canada, Kate Pellerin, who creates both traditionally and digitally (in Procreate).

Here are some of her works done traditionally:

• 
  IMG_20240926_205650_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_205902_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_205948_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_210052_.jpg
  

And those are her digital illustrations:

• 
  IMG_20240926_210513_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_210401_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_210615_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240926_210658_.jpg
  

And the author :):

• 
  IMG_20240926_205522_.jpg
  

Yes, he is and I forgot to add that I really like how he paints people - he's great at it.

@AntV, btw, could you post some of the paintings by Peter Doig that you like and explain why you like them? I'm honestly curious why some people like this kind of art. 🤔


So maybe I'll try to explain... Firstly, you have to have that "calling" for making art to become an illustrator in the first place. Because in order to reach that level at which you're good enough to be an illustrator you have to learn and practice a lot. And you won't learn and practice enough without that drive to make art. You'll just choose another profession. And then in order to be a successful illustrator you have to love what you're doing. It's not only about illustrators - the same apply to anyone working in any creative field, imho... You have to have a passion for what you're doing. That's why artists fear being replaced by AI so much, because they can't just get another job... Because making art isn't "just another job" for them, it's usually their life's passion, their dream job, part of who they are... Of course, just like with every profession you can experience a burnout, but it doesn't mean that this "calling" wasn't there and isn't there.

For example, here Kate Pellerin explaines when and why she decided to become an illustrator:

mossery.co/en-ca/blogs/inspiration/artist-collaboration-an-interview-with-kate-poopikat

"I went to art school thinking I'd go into character design and work for game companies such as Blizzard. It wasn't until my second semester at Seneca College when one of my professors told me my work didn't communicate anything.

He happened to be a children's book illustrator and he basically opened my eyes to this whole new world. Since then, I've strived to make my illustrations more narrative-like, and begun to pursue a career in picture book illustrations."

Yes, that's absolutely spot on as Jon would say.

I love her little cosy corner where she works - how I would have loved that when I was a teenager ;) I can see she's an Ikea fan! I recognise Kallax shelving and Ikea storage boxes and her work table looks like Ikea too :)

The crappy E-book art is probably because a lot those books are self-published by people who have an idea for a children's story but aren't capable of illustrating it themselves. Basically they're would-be writers, not artists. Most of those books make little to no money so the authors either don't want or can't afford to buy decent art so they download free stuff from the web. The quality of legitimately available free images is usually pretty poor. The better stuff has to be paid for.

This would look nice on a living room wall. It's artistically related to northern English "grim art" (this is a thing, and a thing I personally like) but is much more positive and visually appealing than a lot of pictures of northern factories.

Warwick Mill, Middleton, Rochdale, 2015, by Cathy Read

• 
  IMG_0898.jpeg
  

@jon357, I personally can't have colourful art on my walls (even though I like colourful art), because I rest best in neutral, light-coloured spaces. I also don't like living in a space with too much clutter, especially on walls (although I like visiting such places lol). I'm guessing it's due to the fact that I grew up in a one-room flat with pretty dark furniture, dark carpets and a big, reddish corner sofa.

Btw, jon357, do you have any souvenirs from your travels, from places where you went to for work? You know, like handmade stuff, for decoration, something like that?


The thing is that it wasn't self-published, it was published by an actual publishing house and that's why I was so surprised by the low quality... The images weren't downloaded from the internet either, since the illustrations fitted the text and were clearly drawn by the same person. It's just they were really bad...
Maybe that wasn't a big publishing house (I don't remember which one was it), but there a lot of beginner artists who are just starting out and would be ready to make better illustrations for peanuts or even for free just to have something published, so it was hard for me to understand why they went for such low quality...


Me too... I didn't have my own room, so my desk was in the kitchen with a wall on the left and an old, noisy fridge on the right - there was no space for any cozy corner ;/


I've noticed many artists and craftspeople are - or, at least, of the Ikea's storage options (they use those mainly for storing art and craft materials) :)


And she has Ikea's pegboard over her desk too :) It seems to be very popular among artists and craftspeople and I was wondering whether not to get it at some point too since it's easily customizable, comes in different sizes and it saves desk space:

• 
  IMG_20240927_203902_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240927_204900_.jpg
  
• 
  IMG_20240927_204603_.jpg
  

You'd like our flat. Big white walls, high ceilings, a big living room and no pictures at all since it was last painted and we didn't get round to rehanging them. Just big mirrors. I wanted to paint it black with a white ceiling and details. My OH took a bit of convincing but I showed some nice pics on Google. Then events intervened and I couldn't get it done. The whole place needs properly painting (not just a couple of coats of white emulsion) though since we both smoke on and off and have lived there for 12 years. I may get round to doing it or choose a different colour. It's bad enough that we have a black sofa and if my glasses aren't on and the lights are low, I have to be careful not to accidentally squash our black cat.


Sounds like northern England where sometimes everything in a room, carpets, wallpaper, curtains, sofa, tablecloths, cushions are all in different (usually dark) flowery patterns. We were always a bit different, bright orange wallpaper etc. Maybe that's why I like plain decor.


A few things, some of the nicer stuff at my mum's house. Nice ceramics from Sudan, especially. The longest stints were in Iraq and Mauritania, neither of which are great for crafts (though in Mauritania they have nice hammered metal decorations, set in black wood).

Lots of shiny Arab tat in our home (I like shiny things) calligraphic Quran verses, incense burners, copper bowls, incense jars, coffee making stuff, though it's probably mostly made in China. The place I've been longest is of course Poland and my folks came to visit a few times and always bought pottery, glassware and linen things.

Do you know Jan Kallwejt's work? I think he's Polish but lives in Spain. Mostly signed prints and a very distinct style.

We had a copy of this on the wall which is probably still in a cupboard. It's Robin Hood's Bay by Albert Wainwright, an intriguing character. He was an occasional illustrator who lived a very quiet life as a 'confirmed bachelor' in a small terraced house in provincial England. His main job though was as curator of his city's art collection from the 1920s to the 1960s. He had a good budget and a knack of buying works by unknown artists (especially Bloomsbury group ones and also Lowry) before they became famous and the prices rocketed. The city in question sold a very small part of the collection he made and built a big shopping centre and art gallery with the money.

We also had some copies of Barbara Hepworth's line drawings of surgeons at work that I bought in England but my OH disliked them because of the subject matter. And we've some original oil and acrylic paintings, abstract non-representative by a well known Polish artist but they aren't on display because he was my friend and I'm still sad that he died early and don't want reminding.

We've also got some big posters of Hilma af Klint paintings which were on the walls but weren't framed properly and got a bit tatty. . Amazing stuff and not only the first female abstract artist but pretty well the first abstract artist. Her story is an amazing one; her paintings were boxed up in Sweden for nearly a century before they were rediscovered. There was a big touring exhibition of her stuff. I don't know if it was in Warsaw; I saw it in Berlin at the Hamburger Bahnhof.

• 
  IMG_0901.jpeg
  

This is by a Belgian artist called Mohssin Amghar. It was on social media. I think he's an amateur artist. It's ink on paper and called "waves". I'd happily have that on the wall too.

• 
  IMG_0902.jpeg
  

I just realized that there are paintings hanging on the walls of our house almost everywhere, even in the bathroom. There are 30 of them in total, mostly originals but also reproductions.