Gypsies or Roma: European and Polish attitudes towards

but the Polish are the best!!!!!! (after to the Spanish and the English)
sorry grzegorz!!!!

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Of course, I've just never had the chance to meet one.

I'm sure nobody all over the world can be in competition with Romanians (Gipsies as well as Romania residents).
Don't be angry, Grzegorz.

The international attitude to Roma sucks big time.Some of the comments here and elsewhere sound like jokes or the very least what mad old bats used to say a hundred years ago.All thats missing is " gypsies kidnap gadjos babies" or other such BS. Im not saying there arnt Roma crime gangs etc but when your from a comunity that has been persecuted for centuries how much respect are you going to have for the outside world? Proportionatly the Roma of Europe lost more people murdered in the holocaust than the jewish people but where as one "race" now has its own country and numerous specific laws protecting it from harm the other Race,the Roma/Sinti?Gypsies have nothing and seem to bring out the worst in many peoples nature. In this day and age,the conditions that Europes Roma are forced to live in is shamefull.Look at more moderate societies or area's where roma are a bit more accepted/intergrated and you see a totaly different side to this fascinating culture that predates the creation of Poland as a state.

k
ps and without them music would have stopped on the western banks of the danube....

without Gypsys you wouldn't have Lurchers, my favourite dog


you've obviously never visited Balnain House in Inverness

When I lived in Poland I had no preconceived ideas about what the Gypsies (or Roma) were like. In my town of 60 000 you could see them very often, so probably about a twentieth of the population could have been Gypsy. They would hang out in the park, sing, eat, talk (loudly!). When the Romanian Gypsies arrived in the mid-nineties, those would beg: young women with children sitting out on the pavements in freezing weather, that kind of thing. I never saw the native Polish Gypsies help them in any way, so there goes the notion of a general Roma solidarity. I think it's more like every tribe for itself. I have also never heard of Gypsies being prosecuted in any way, there were no fights in the streets with the Polish, nobody set their houses on fire or threw their children out of schools. Quite the contrary, school authorities would bend over backwards to keep Roma children learning for as long as possible. Even so, most kids are taken from education by their parents by the time they are about 13! And then they get married and have kids of their own. I have seen many a pregnant Roma teenager who looked as if she would rather climb trees and ride her bike. Now here in London I have gotten to know the culture much better, as a community interpreter I am in touch with the Roma almost every day. They came to the UK as "refugees" from terrible acts of Polish racism, they go around telling stories of how Poles raped their women, beat their children, burnt down their homes etc., etc. This quite shocked me, as some of these Roma actually hail from the town I used to live in, and I should have witnessed these horrors, and most of the center of town, where the Roma lived, should have been reduced to a pile of rubble I guess! I know they made up 99% of these stories to have a credible refugee profile, and as no loyalty is due outside the clan, suck it up Poles! Tough luck you're Gajo!

They also talk about not being allowed to send their children to school in Poland, but all the Roma families I'd worked with here sooner or later come into contact with the Social Services over... not sending their kids to school!

Their music might be beautiful and their culture is certainly very interesting, nevertheless, they do marry off their children as teenagers and then often masquerade the ensuing pregnancy as either rape or youthful folly to their GP (as if they would ever allow their daughters to stay away from home for even one night!), they do not send their children to schools, they usually try not to work longer than 16 hours a week (UK residents know why), and they still think Council housing and all sorts of social handouts are their God-given right, even though Poland is now in the EU and the rules of the game have changed.

Around 2005, I often had to interpret conversations along the lines of: Poland is in the EU! Go get a job! We have to withdraw your refugee status! - But but but I cannot speak the language, I am a refugee! Give give give! - I told you... Poland is in the EU... etc. etc.

And last but not least, speaking of tolerance: a Roma lady for whom I was interpreting at a medical centre told me, while we were chatting idly in the waiting area, that any Roma girl or boy who leaves the clan, marries a Gajo of any sort - is dead to their family. They cannot visit or even call! This of course is seen as great tragedy, and so avoided.

To sum up: I am quite friendly with a lot of these Roma that I work for, they are generally nice people, but do remember that they are very different - and that THEY want to keep it that way. They do not overmuch love work and generally have an attitude that life should be going their way "just because". I think it would have been a much better solution for both us and them if they had been allowed to keep roaming the world in their tabors.

BTW - a wonderful, beautiful film about Gypsies, acted I think by Gypsies, is "Dom za Vesanje" (Czas Cyganów in Polish, Time of the Gypsies in English) by Kusturica. It shows both the ugliness and the luminous beauty of this culture. Because like every culture it has both, and I disagree with the PC axiom that nothing bad can ever be said about any minority. We are all people.

magdalena, I heartily agree with all the points you've made above.just trying for a little balance against the witch hunt. Ive never heard myself of persecution per se of Roma in modern day Poland either,in fact,to my shame I own a "hit"record by some lass called kayah singing with a Gypsy "prince" kid I think he sort of raps in Polish and she warbles in Rom.

Made up stories of hardship in an attempt to stay in the UK are Im sure not confined only to gypsies though,many africans ariving claim to be from warzones etc when theyre actually just economic tourists.

No,the persecution of the roma to such a disgusting standard as to have needed a UN commision set up is actually more in Romania and Slovakia where opprtunities are closed due to nothing more than rascisim pure and simple.

The main "problem" in the UK is not with genuine roma/gypsies,our problems are with the so called "irish travellers" or more commenly known as " Pikeys". No one seems to know who these people are supposed to be,they are all as white (or ginger lol) as your avarage irish person but have somehow,without putting anything into this country managed to obtain some sort of protected status as a "racial minority" which is utter tosh as they are white europeans who at some time were bandits or tinkers back in the emereld isle,kicked out of ireland for being a pain in the ass then ended up over here dripping with cheap gold chains and beating up young girls left right and center.


No,tell me more,thats ma families neck of the woods :)

it has a museum of Highland music, examples of musical instruments going back thousands of years, it would take a couple of days to listen to each recording

FLAMENCO!!- nothing other that spanish Gypsy dance


true not very nice but better than dress of some polish womans, i wonder why they(not all) wear this crazy clother they look like they willnot have nothing so what deferent ??

in my opinions polish people dont like so much Gypsy and in many examples they have right ,Gypsy dont want work and this is fact, iknow many gypsies and some even openly tell that its hards whites people dont trust them but if they try they can find work and live normal .its many confilcts to on their own area but not abaut this is this topic..

however some of them are really nice :)

regards from sunny Morocco ;)

My Lord!!! Gypsies are humans. Remember the holocaust, 3 million dead because someone think is a solution. Give them better oportunities in life and the countries will see changes. READ the Roma people history first. By the way, Gypsies in the Middle Ages help armies to contain the Ottoman invasions, a debt a lot of countries have with them. And remember some famous Gypsies: fantastic artists, businessmen, and very good and respectable people. The policies in some countries about Gypsies are simply evil.I hope the younger generations overcome the mistakes of their antecesors in matters about Gypsies.Generation Net, my hopes are with your kind.

I don't know what "better" opportunities in life you could get than what Polish Roma are getting in the UK. Free education, free housing, benefits galore, support from the Social Services, you name, they got it.

Most of them haven't even bothered to learn English - they get interpreters paid for by the local authority.
They do not attend schools, they very rarely work, and they are always asking for more, more, more!
I don't think the tragic deaths of their ancestors have anything at all to do with it, and they should not be used as an excuse.

as well as I know we have good policy towards gipsies, we spend a lot of money to try to educate them and include them into society, some of them successfully ended university, what is more we havent created gettos for them like Czech rep, Slovakia or other southern Europeans states so we try to include them into society, last time we started to use EU funds in this case and we have small successes. I think that our way is better than Czech or Romanian, maybe we can do it our way because there is only 12 000 - 50 000 of Gipsies in Poland, and in Romania there is 550 000 - 2 000 000 gipsies in Czech rep there is 200 000 gipsies closed in ghettos. I know that there is big Gipsy society in western Europe but I dont know the details about them.

Ghetto in slovakia

upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/pl/6/67/Osiedle_romskie_Słowacja.jpg

as to attitude towards Gipsies ... I m not going to tell nice stories about Poles who love gipsies ... attitude is definitely negative, but a lot of people like their music or dancers and I think that art is place where they should try their chances.

as to Gipesies

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people

We were out with my cousins (8 of us) walking on the Rynek on a Saturday afternoon and there were a couple groups of them. It took me and my brother a few minutes to realise whoi they were but our cousins directed us away from them so we did not have to come into contact with them.

Forgot to add, everyone else on the Rynek seemed to be avoiding them too.

I would guess you have to be deported to a brothel where your mother works or to Mongolia.

Looking back at Gypsies in Poland, I am now sure there were the originators of the Nigerian scam.

I also remember that the experiences people had with Gypsies weren't too nice (hold on to your wallet!). Most simply avoided them, and if that's racism then all who do not live in Africa are only superficially supportive of the Black race and are really racists. That would be about 85% of Earth's population.

Say what you like,you all will anyway,but to this day the most beautifull girl I have seen in Poland was a Roma.And they sure as s**t have better music :)

Same in Spain

What is thought of as Spanish/Castillian music is Gitano music.

Thanks for the clip.
Yep,Tourists flock to flamenco bars and then join in with the "locals" in saying how dirty the gypos are f,drying their clothes on rocks,yuck..". It would make me laugh if it wasnt all to common an attitude.

Take as you find I say. My best neighbours,the ones on my street Id trust with my house keys are of genuine Romany stock,settled down obviously as I dont live by the side of a road:)

"yeah,but the ones in Eastern Europe are different" I always hear......Well,D'oh,treat a group of people so frikkin badly for centuries ,condem them to an itinerent lifestyle,push to the margins of sociaty and see what happens. Sure some could live with the "nice" people,musicians,etc,ie ,pet projects. Add to that a holocaust in ww2 that very few people seem to have heard of and when they do are amazed at just how brutal it was,a higher percentage of european roma died than jews per head of pop'. And in most cases locals were more than happy to help or casually observe the nazis get rid of these "vermin".,with a history like that what do you expect a peoples to do? Yeah,sure,there are laws now,and oppertuinityies that I grant you are being squandered by Roma as I write,but,someone tell me how long,how many generations it takes for a whole people to regain trust in the rest of the world? Atleast the jewish people got a country,from what I see and hear all the european Roma got was more of the sameuntill a few years ago,and,oddly enough,inclusive laws only seemed to be passed when EU membership was being persued.....

youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=D2TBMeHyEMY

links not working mate.
If its one showing some Roma behaving like an idiot or something from the 17th century, Its Ok, I dont dispute a lot of Rom are scumbags.And I studied psychology just long enough to be dangerous so I like to get to the root of things.

But not all. All I was trying to get to the bottom of was ,why did this culture develope,one where theft from non Rom is not seen as a crime etc In a way it doesnt sound much difference to old imperialism,"take what you want from "them",theyre not like us and hate us."

Double click on the YouTube video and it will open in another window/tab. ;)

Christ dude, this one unworking link provoke you to write all this stuff. now im affraid what are you going to post after watching the video hehehe.


try now. youtube.com/watch?v=D2TBMeHyEMY .enjoy

ok,thats just a ROFL moment :)
Mind you,if you go back far enough thats all any monarchy in europe ever was,some dude called himself king then his kids were king for a couple of generations then some one else said,nope,Im king now,and on and on....

Ok,links still not working but Ive seen these guys on TV Im pretty sure :)

to be absolutely honest with you i dont find them more funny than any current euro-royalty with british one at the top


hmmm, search for Gypsy Kings - Romania . intersting coverage

Aye,none of them ever cast the net widely enough,geneticaly ,if you know what I mean :)
If I put in Gypsy Kings im going to get 500 versions of Bambalaya:)

There are few people who are so racist and disrespectful as the gypsies. Of course you can find some individual gypsies that are good persons. But their culture is one of the few in the world that I have no respect for at all. How they treat their own children is horrible as well.

and women. once i saw couple of poor gypsie man sitting on the bench and playing with a mobile and the young pregnant gypise woman with a big backpack standing nearby. there was enough pleace for three but they took it all with their lazy asses and didnt give a damn about her. young woman kneeling on the sidewalk and pretending to be an old, shaking granny is a norm. forcing little kidos to beg is another common practice among them.

Merged thread:
ROMA/GYPSIES IN POLAND

How are the Roma treated in Poland compared in other eastern and western European countries? I know the frogs are deporting them out of France.

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1320046/Pregnant-12-year-old-Roma-raid-Six-arrests-child-trafficking-ring-smashed.html

An interesting read.

..
Cyganie are just like negros straight from Africa.