Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

Yes here the application is $25,000 for a liquor license here. I did see one liquor store for sale in a suburb outside of Chicago (Round Lake) for $120k with about $15k of inventory included. The location wasn't the best but it didn't really have much competition in the surrounding area.

I will go back to Poland this summer so I'll look a bit more into it. Real estate is very expensive in Wroclaw as well as the other major cities in Poland so I'd probably have to rent if I did something like that.

I have considered also opening up like an import/export business as I have noticed a lot of western goods we have in Poland are in very high demand but the prices are even higher than in the US. Electronics, iphones, ipads, luxury watches, etc. On the other hand, I have noticed that leather and sheepskin is very high quality in Poland and popular in the US but very expensive if you want something quality and even then it's often hard to find. My friend Mark gave me the idea since like I wrote earlier he makes a decent passive income (about $2k a month) sending Rolexes and basketball shoes to Poland. This would be a great online business and I wouldn't necessarily need a brick and mortar location but I don't think that websites like ebay, craigslist, etc. are as widely used in Poland as they are in the US. That would really be the main limiting factor. I could be wrong though.

Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

Yes there are still a ton of those old 'bloki' left - good suggestion!! I have looked into opening up a c store in the states and it can be very profitable especially if you have a liquor license. Those can be a bit tricky to obtain for a new business, at least in and around Chicago, but I was looking more into purchasing an existing location and remodeling it myself (My father is a contractor and he taught me carpentry, electricity, plumbing, etc. since a young age).

Everything adds up in a c store - the atm machine, cigarettes, alcohol, lottery, and of course the highest profits (at least here) from the chips, sodas, coffees, etc.

I don't think I'd be able to purchase much with $80k-$100k BUT perhaps doing a lease, $20k or so in inventory, 1 part time person to help out... that would be more realistic.

It may sound stupid because like when people say in terms of business dreams like oh I want to make a successful tech start-up, I want to open a fine French restaurant, whatever. Me? I'm more simple.. as lame as it sounds my dream is to open up a convenience store and then if the cash flow is good from it perhaps another location or even a gas station.

One thing that really surprised me is when I went to college in Cincinnati they had a ton of like 'drive thru' convenience stores. So basically, you stay in your car, tell the attendant what you want, he loads it up in a bag, you pay, and leave. You never get out of your car. I've only seen one of those here in Chicago. Although novel, I don't think that would work in Poland as walking and using public transport is much more common.

If you don't mind me asking, what part of Poland did you run this type of business? Was it in the city, suburbs, or more rural area? I'd primarily be looking in Wroclaw as that's the city I am most familiar with. The c store that my grandma ran was mostly like a deli - meats, cheeses, etc. but they also had like basic soft drinks like Pepsi. It was very successful because it was really the only store of it's kind in the area. They live in Oborniki Slaskie which is about 45 mins or so outside of Wroclaw and has about 20k or so inhabitants.

I'll never forget one of the times I was Poland and bought like a small glass bottle of Coke. I started walking out with it and the lady stops me she's like no you have to drink it here! I'm like well that's crazy I want to drink it at home or in my car. She couldn't believe I'd be willing to pay the 5, 10 groszy or whatever it was for the convenience of taking it with me instead of standing in the store and drinking it. Ah the culture differences...

Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

Pol Attorney - yes Poland has been backstabbed and sold out many times throughout history. Even worse, many times it has been by its own government. I do see where you are coming from though and I do agree but I just didn't want to stir up a storm here. It is sad that a country with a GDP of $1 trillion and ranking in 20/21st place in terms of GDP has such low wages when compared to Western Countries.

As far as the small businesses, I believe it - my grandparents from my dads side own a few small business and are wealthy even by western standards. They're definetely $1mil USD in net worth but yet some of the cheapest, most frugal people you'll ever meet. They have a metal fabrication shop, a deli/small food store, and a stall in the 'targ' that sells meats, sausages, etc. Basically the targ is like a big open air bazaar where people sell clothes, food, home items, etc. You can find great things for a fraction of the price compared to a retail store in the city center. A lot of the money they made was actually back in Communism when meat was considered a luxury and was rationed out. My uncle on the hand from my mom's family owns a fairly large hotel by Polish standards in Tychy called Hotel Piramida which is I believe 9 stories and it looks like a big glass pyramid, hence it's name. The rest of my family is pretty average though.

Unfortunately, I have only about $80k in savings so although I would perhaps have enough to rent a space, buy some inventory, hire some staff, etc. I feel it would be very risky to go into a country where although I know the language I know next to nothing about the business laws. I'm kind of at the point where I'm debating whether to go the mundane route and do an MBA in the US or finally do something I want and go to Poland. I wouldn't plan on like spending it and I'd still work but I'd want to at least keep it saved up in case things don't work out, I get fired, or whatever else may happen. Once I understood the business climate and laws, I would be willing to invest in a small business venture but I think think it would be too risky at this point. I think it would be much safer at least in my position to first get a job and feel out the situation and identify a need in the market. One of my good friends in the US who is jeweler makes a nice supplemental income purchasing Rolex's from pawn shops and craigslist in the US and reselling them to Poland. He also sends a lot of shoes especially Nike's, Jordan's, Adidas, etc. He actually makes a couple grand a month doing this and oftentimes he can't find enough Rolex's here at a good price to resell. I have noticed that many products and services popular in the US have started popping up in Poland - micro breweries, liquor stores selling tequila, scotch, and other imports, internet advertising and marketing firms, Harley motorcycles, internet auction sites, concert promoters, etc. I'd probably go the more traditional and safer route and just open up a kiosk with some cigarrettes and beer or a little convenience store near a university though.

Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

Thanks Delphi I will check it out for sure.

I do know for a fact that some small business owners have become very financially successful. I have two family members that run small businesses and are wealthy even by western standards. Although I would love to open a small business, even like a deli or convenience store or something, it would be much more realistic to do in the US than in Poland. For Poland, I'd want to first learn the business laws and bureaucracy before investing in something like that.

Work / Popular expat jobs in Poland [14]

Thanks... my apologies by expatriate I just meant in general a person moving to another country to work there... so immigrant I guess would be more correct. Also, with native I should've elaborated - I meant native English speaker I forgot to type in 'English.' I am able to speak, write, and read fluently in Polish. Although the company I currently work for has like 35 sales offices around the world unfortunately Poland isn't one of them. They are in Denmark, Spain, England, Italy, and Russia though. I work in a pseudo call center now so believe me the last thing I'd want to do is move from a US call center to one in Poland. I make great money especially for a recent grad but it is so boring.

I was looking mostly into doing something along the lines of pharmaceutical or medical device sales or managing a sales team. I'd be open to other jobs but would prefer something in sales as that's where I have the most experience. I don't know how the labor market is in Poland for those kinds of jobs. I have gone through my 2nd interview at a company called PNA - Polish National Alliance which is a Polish fraternal organization but they also sell life insurance and annuities. They run like a lot of retreats, Polish language weekend schools, dances, and stuff like that. If I do get the job (I find out tomorrow) I think it would really help me make some contacts in Poland as my position would involve travel around the US and also to Poland. They're very close with the PiS government as well as various US politicians. If I do end up with that job, I think it would really help me network and open some doors in the future if I ever wanted to work for the Polish government or something. I guess I'll see what happens. With the company I'm at right now the only international assignment I'll have is a few weeks in Tel Aviv every year.

Management - always doable if you have the right skills, though the days of people being hired in good positions just because they're a foreigner with an MBA are over.... damn lol

Sales - easy to get if you know what you're doing. Companies are pretty much open to anyone that is willing to build a market for them, especially in the UK or Ireland. I spotted one post a while ago that offered a starting salary of 10k + commission for the right candidate. that's at least good news though since most of my background has been in sales. Just wondering, was that salary of 10k in zloty, dollars, euro also was it monthly, annual? 10k zloty plus commission a month would seem realistic and I think I could live on that since I'm single and no kids plus I'd take about $80k in savings with me just in case. 10k dollars + commission would probably only be possible for like a sales director. Also, would you mind sharing where you saw that post or perhaps any other websites?

Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

And for the comment of selling the polish economy to foreigners, sorry to say that is just not a intelligent comment.. I'm sure that the money I pay in tax and the money I put in the economy is better than nothing. So in a global world you will never be able to prevent this.. And especially as a pole it's basically something you shouldn't say out loud..

A lot of Polish people think this because oftentimes it appears that the politicians, especially in the previous government, seemed to be more concerned with satisfying foreign investors than the local population. However, that is the effect of globalization. If Poland didn't open up their economies at all we'd be in a situation like Cuba or North Korea.

The foreign companies come to Poland because of the abundant highly educated, highly skilled labor force where the wages are relatively low compared to say Germany, France, England, etc. It's both a blessing and a curse.

The economy is very strong in Poland - that's a fact. However, a lot of average people state that despite the overall economic situation being much better, their own situations are not improving. Again, it has to do with labor costs.

And delphiandomine you're right a lot of people do 'moonlight' like that and I think it has to do with the old communist mentality. Also, Polish people are very good at saving money and not living beyond their means. They do small things that add up like paint their own house, use public transport, etc. I don't currently live in Poland but my entire family (aside from mom and dad) do and I visit Poland regularly. If I found a job where I could make at least like $35k-$40k a year I'd move right away. However, I feel that this may be unrealistic for say a sales manager or med device/pharma salesman.

Language / How well do Polish people understand Slovak? [88]

I agree with KPC21...

In my opinion, Polish is far different from the other Slav languages of the regions i.e. Ukranian, Russia, Czech, Slovak, Serbian, etc. When I hear one of those languages, I can understand Serbian actually the most of out all of them since a lot of words are identical but of course the alphabet is Cyrillic. Ukranian and Russian are pretty similar to each other but a Polish person will have trouble understanding those. Czech and Slovak are a bit more similar to Polish than Ukranian and Russian though.

Work / Expatriating to Poland... good career move for a young male? [50]

My cousins and family in Poland told me that both of those jobs offered me a generous compensation package. They stated that most families with two working adults survive on far less. It boggles my mind because many things like clothes, cars, gas, real estate, etc. are the same price as in Chicago yet people make substantially less. I really don't know how people in Poland manage to do it. I wouldn't go to Poland to make my millions nor grow my savings account. If I were going to expatriate to a country to do that I'd chose a wealthy Arab country or even Kazakhstan which is paying $80,000 annually for native English teachers now (10% income tax) to teach at their one of their dozen or so schools for the 'elite' of the country. I did some research and it seems like living in Poland may be more realistic for retirement than at a young age. I think a young adult would be better off even in Germany or even Czech Rep. if they want to save some money. Of course there are exceptions.

I was in Poland a few months ago because well, long story short, a construction company illegally dug an enormous hole on our property and was filling it with rubble. We have 1.3 Ha outside of Wroclaw and some company was hired by the city to do some work on canals or something with the Odra river but instead of properly disposed of the waste the people tore up our entire property. We had like 100+ apple trees on the property and the land value was worth quite a bit of money. It's more the sentimental value though because that was my grandma's house from my mom's side, would've been my parents' house for retirement, and then eventually mine. That house survived WW2 but some company managed to destroy it in 3 months. Now the land is a giant hole with rubble everywhere - it literally looks like a SCUD or something landed on our yard. So yeah, I was there to start a very long and tedious battle against the construction company. I may add also, if you ever are in a legal dispute hire a private investigator and a good lawyer (lots of young lawyer in Poland - but oftentimes their ambition makes up for their inexperience) because the PL cops at least in my experience with this are very lazy.

Anyway, while I was there I saw new German cars and even Harley motorcycles as well as Starbucks, Armani stores, etc. Although, I may add while these stores were full it looked like most people were window shopping as few actually had bags with purchases. I bought a pair of shoes for like 300 zloty which is about $75 which isn't too bad but for an average Pole that's a lot of money. However, even like with the cars I just don't understand how someone could afford a $20,000 VW Golf let alone even $70k BMW/Mercedes if most people are living on $1k-$2k a month. I wondered if a lot of these people work abroad or have like their main bread winner working abroad because their lifestyle just didn't justify what the incomes tend to be in Poland.

Top execs, politicians, and the top 5% seem to make like 15k-25k+ zloty a month. I read that the PM gets paid like 20k or 25k Zloty a month - that's like 5k-6k USD since the dollar is strong and zloty is weak at the moment.