History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]

Pre-war Warsaw Catedral.
"rebuilt"

Most of Warsaw as it was, no longer exists,russian installed communist government avoided rebuilding what represented anti-communist church or elites which meant the rebuilt structures were often nothing like the old ones.

History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]

@TheOther
I have some pictures of pre-war Poznań, i've asked a few friends to send me over their family photos from the country around it, once i'll get the i'll post them in bulk with pre-war Poznań pics.

Now for some more more pictures, Lwów.

The ironic tragedy of Lwów was that it was, apart from Kraków the only two great old Polish cities surviving the war intact and as the hostilities ended it was given away to the Ukrainians, by American president and Stalin no less.

Lwów, Hetmans Walls, the great theatre and statue of king Sobieski.

Lwów - Town hall.

Lwów - Ossolińscy Library, one of the oldest and largest book collection in Poland.

A rather sad picture, Akademicka street in Lwów 1937, above it a sign on the picture saying "tu mieszkam" which translates "i live here" after the war Soviets would exile the woman who sent this card along with most Polish citizens.

Dominican Church in Lwów.

University in Lwów.

Scottish Cafe - a cafe in Lwów where some of the greatest Polish matematicians and simoultenously some of the greatest minds of pre-war Europe would meet they discussed and argued over mathematical problems by beer or coffee, writing them down in what would later become known as a Scottish Book, a document of significant mathematical value , more then half of them would be murdered by Germans a few years after this picture was taken.

A few random ones.

Poznań Town hall.

Philharmonia - £ódż.

Town square in Zamość.

History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]


No, some were rebuilt but very few to their exact former looks.


Ypres had 35.000 inhabitants, Warsaw had 1.300000 inhabitants, we're talking about a city thats something like 35 times bigger then Ypres.

There were several reasons why Warsaw was not rebuilt to its former splendor, one was that virtually all major cities in Poland were destroyed to a great degree, there was not enough building material, the priority was to shelter people not to rebuild structures.

Second we had a communist goverment enforced on us by Russians, said goverment was doing everything to distance itself from the anti-communist pre-war Poland, this included not rebuilding the city in the pre-war fashion, only major landmarks were rebuilt and even then not brick for brick.

History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]


Most of them did not, Warsaw before the war numbered some 1.300000 people, directly after the war it was less then half a milion, out of every three people on these pictures two were killed by Germans.

History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]

Warsaw taxis (non-motorised type)

Dorożka carriage.

Warsaw riksza.

Two guys carrying that fellow who critisized this thread.

St Alexanders church on the Three Crosses square.

John the Baptists catedral.

Karowa street.

Warsaw night life, the lady is hot but needs a push up, cant do a belly dance without proper boobs IMHO.

No idea which street is that, the building with the eagles is a corner of the now gone bank.

Warsaw Philharmonia (or is it spelled Philharmony?)

Moniuszki street, balcony view.

History / Polish Atlantis (pre-war Warsaw, Poland in pictures). [38]

Indeed it is.

A different view on Marszałkowska street.

Ogród Saski (Saxon garden).

Plac Teatralny (Theatre Square.)

Ulica Długa (Long Street).

Krakowskie Przedmieście (krakowian subburb).

Entrance to the Warsaw University.

Speaking of prudential, one of the first skyscrapers in Poland (it was considered as such at the time though nowdays it would be classified only as a highrise).

Built in art deco early modern style the prudential was a sign of the city modernizing.

Prudential in 1938.

Prudential in 1945 after Germans moonscaped Warsaw.

Zielna Street.

The back streets and alleys behind the hustle and bustle of the city.

Saxon Garden entrance from the Iron Gate.

Krakovian Suburb.

Warsaw Old Town - market day.

A young boy selling newspapers.

Cars parked on a Warsaw street.

Waiting for a tram on a tram stop.

Warsaw Town Hall.

There were many ways to get around in pre war Warsaw, one of them was to take a Riksza.

And visit one of the many shopping centres.

And before i go, New World Street in the 30s.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


The only thing you manufactured is kitted socks, the only way i'm associated with firearms were a few times on a firing range and my 10 months in the army and i still was able to point out your basic mistakes.

As for Poles who made advancements in computing science - Stanisław Ułam, Stefan Banach, Stanisław Mazur, Karol Borsuk and Antonii £omnicki, many of the computing processes used today have been perfected by Banach and Ułam.

By the way we kept the tradition, we're one of the top computing developers even today :)

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


The link i showed you and every other source you can find, they were used in combat, they were issued to soldiers.


The gun was being at an early stage of issue.


A prototype is an original type, form, or instance of something serving as a typical example, basis, or standard for other things of the same category.

Thats according to wikipedia, just because both of the weapons have not been around long enough for larger numbers to be issued doesnt mean they're prototypes, both entered production and were issued, small numbers stem from the fact that they entered production stage respectively months and days before the war.


So by your logic rifles are similar because they use a similar caliber? Thats a pretty silly thing to say :)


I'm sorry i just cope badly with stupidity, notice that i agreed with you when you finally (after five or six attempts) produced a Polish design based on American one but you're trying to attach this to every other design.

The fact is Poles designed both personal weapons and armor/mechanized vehicles that were head and shoulders above the contemporary German and Western design and matched only by the Russians, that Poland was pyss poor and had barely any factories to produce that stuff is another matter.

Goodnight.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Yawn, yet another lie on your part, yes it was issued :)


Ah so your entire post was based on that it looked like, right that explains a lot right there :)


Again wrong, 50 were issued, further 400 were produced but not distributed, stop grasping at straws, when we copied something we did but our lmgs, smgs and automatic rifles were completely domestic produce (except for the BARS of course).


Yup, both the automatic wz30 and Mors smg were issued, 50 Mors and several hundred to a one thousand wz 38


You need to decide, first you're talking about a BAR which was copied legally because US failed to secure its license in Poland and was a light machinegun and now you're talking about the purchase of the heavy machinegun license which conversly was also legal.

Its not our fault that you failed to secure patent laws in Poland, we're not charity to pay for something we dont legaly have to and everything was done completely legally.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Absolutely


Wow so you werent ignorant all that time, you simply resort to lying, can i ask for a source?

militarium.net/viewart.php?aid=32
Mors had nothing to do with EMP-35, thats your fifth post in which you are cought lying, the design was fully indigenous.


Both armies had better designs then the BAR by that time, in fact Poles had a better indigenous automatic rifle as well (see previous pictures and comments).


Yet another lie on your part, by 1939 Poles had a domestic design far superior to BAR (wz 38) which has again been posted in this topic, a fully domestic design, lighter, more accurate and with a faster firing rate then BAR, before you try to humiliate yourself with another unbased claim, no it was not based off BAR or any other rifle :))

Any other lies and misconsceptions of yours you wish to to have debunked?:)


Everything was legal, no patent was done in Poland therefore no license was needed but of course you fails to mention it since the truth would not fit your biased prejudiced view :)

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Of course, Poles used American hmgs, German bolt action rifles and American pistoles, however these were not copied because indigenous designs did not exist but because full replacement was unfeasable due to financial issues.

On the other hand there's an automatic rifle, a smg, an lmg, artillery, heavy and light tranport trucks, self propelled artillery, tanks and planes all indigenous Polish production (you can find their pictueres here) and all designs superior to what was used in America at the time :)

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Thats the only post in which you are right buddy, in virtually every other post you managed to post what amounts to loads of made up bollocks, but ViS was indeed based on Browning, though again not copied.

I'm not trying to glorify Poland but we've had enough of our own inventions, our own tanks, our own autocannons, our own computers (which were copied by US, in the 30s Poland was THE most advanced in computing science, everything you use today in a computer was at one point invented perfected or dabbled in by a Pole, we managed to advance computing science farther then anyone :) ) our own machineguns, automatic rifles, scopes, but yeah ViS was based on a Browning, good job you got something right for the first time in how many posts?:)

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Still slower then French:) z


Its spelled Suomi and Suomi KP-31 was a submachinegun, Stg44 was an assault rifle, smgs and automatic rifles use completely different parts, there's no physical way for a rifle to be a copy of smg but hey you didnt even know the name :)))


Oh if you wouldnt betray us in 1939 its unlikely anyone would have been occupied.

Now get the fock out you little prick :)

Please refrain from insulting members, they are allowed to have their point of view in this discussion as well as you. If you can't discuss without using derogatory language, your best bet would be to give the thread a miss.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Mets before you post any more ignorant bull, the only, only technical or conceptual similarity between German Stg44 and M1 was that they used an intermiediate bullet, and even that concept is not taken from US since German army postulated the need for an intermiadiete bullet as early as 1923.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Also to be specific as to how much you lie and what kind of bullsh*t you serve here.

Stg44 does not use a rotating bolt at all, what you posted here is a fat lie, the Stg44 uses a tilting bolt thats one, two, it uses a short stroke piston while the M1 uses a long one.

Completely different parts, completely different design, any other chauvinist lie you wish to serve us? Both the semi and fully automatic guns were domestic products of Germany, superior to and developed independently of the American product.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


No they are not:)


Sure they are :)

Basically i cant be bugged to respond to Americans who think they know what makes the world tick and what makes the world tick is US.

Stg 43 and Stg 44 use different parts, non of them them borrow from M1 or any US design, period.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Look at the map Harriet, by 3rd September most German forces advanced between 40 and 60km into Poland and only one army advanced that deep in what was a breaktrough.


Yes i do, you lie.

Polish cavalry did not charge but was charged, you basically got the entire order of battle wrong.

Also Żubrówka, Stalowa Wola and others are places where Poles and Germans showed each other courtesy, its in various memoirs including Guderians so by your statement that no one showed anyone courtesy in cavalry battles is utterly false.

I knew you'd resort to lying and assaults at Poles but i hoped you got a bit less trollish, you did not, i'm done reading your posts again, just wanted to straight up your lies:))

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]




2-5 September, the farthest they are in 120km into Poland by 3rd, hardly first hours deep penetration, now get the fvck out you anti-Polish cvnt.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Without a British or French chassis we still had the modified Christie chassis with which we produced the fastest tank in the world and maybe instead of making a good TP7 we'd made a much better TP10 and TP14.

Also Poland didnt use French chassis, Polish military was interested only in Somuas but since French couldnt sell us any we bought 100 R-35s in what in 39 was an act of desperation.


Can you tell me what units were deep inside Poland within hours?


Which doesnt change the fact that Soviets invaded fortified regions with ammunition dumps where Polish reserve divisions have been organising thus destroying the entire Polish rear logistics at a stroke.

By September 14 Poland still had 720.000 men, by September 21 only some 320.000 thats how decisive the Soviet invasion was.


So you're arguing that the Allies who had 3300~ tanks and 3.5 milion men were weak? Could you elaborate?


Oh we're definitely better in WW2 and the world sees it, the reaction from Western supremacists is well... like yours.

Germany lost approximately 230 tanks in Poland and 740~ in France.

Poland destroyed 32% of the French destroyed tanks while having only 9% tanks the West had, only 11% AT guns etc, and its important to remember in what unfavorable conditions Poland fought as compared to the West, encircled from all sides, with rear echelons destroyed by Russian invasion.

Lets compare aircraft losses, Poles destroyed around 300 German airplanes having about 400 airplanes themselves. West destroyed around 1200 airplanes having 3000 airplanes themselves.

So Poland having around 12% of Western allied airpower destroyed about 25% of what the allies did.

And Isthatu i'm using conservative figures here, not counting all German losses ie armored cars (counted as tanks well into 1940 by both Poles and Allies) and not counting destroyed German scout planes etc, then the losses incurred by Poland would reach up to 50% of those in France in airplanes.

We can go on and keep comparing, there's no chauvinism, Poland had a capable war machine and if the West didnt put Poland in an untenable position and kept to its promises the war would be over by the time Germany was supposed to invade France, except it would be over in Berlin.

Its nothing about heroism and everything about people like you selling Poland as weak when dry figures show it did better with sharp sticks then the West did with nukes.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Its an original design it has nothing in common with BAR, Gewehr-43 is based in Gewehr-40 which might or might not have been copied from the Polish design but neither of them have anything to do with BAR or M1 internally or externally.

You may confuse it with wz1937 which was an aircraft gun but its nice to see good old American "everything came from us" redneck spirit again :)

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


7TP, 10TP, Pz III, PzIV R-35,D-2, BT-7, T-34, KV-1 and more.

There's quite a lot of countries, Poland included that had better tanks than the Czechs.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Actually there were multiple examples where cavalry units showed each other such courtesy initially.


Normally i ignore your posts all together but you seem determined to infest my thread, Poles did not charge German troops, they were charged downhill by what was probably a reinforced squadron of Siebzehnte Reiter Regiment or 17th Bamberg Reiter regiment, after the German commander was killed his unit was routed, during pursuit however Poles got into a crossfire from concealed machinegun nests and the squadron was almost destroyed.


Quite the opposite, Hildebrand makes mention of such things, Guderian scornuflly remarks about "ridiculous concessions" a dragoon unit under him made, Major Rożniak mentiones it in his memoirs, there are at least several documented cases where Polish and German cavalry not only allowed time to form up but didnt collect prisoners and allowed the defeated to witdhraw in peace.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]


Different turret, different gun, modified hull, completely differnt optics - Poles took a very poor tank and made a Panzer III equivalent (from Hildebrands own words) it had very little of the original british crapbox left in it.


Was it? It fought a week longer then the French, British and Low Countries, it made Germans fight the first massive battle of WW2 where 650.000 soldiers fought on both sides.

Also Blitzkrieg is a myth, unlike in Russia, France and everywhere else Poles actually stopped Wehrmacht all across their 2000km border for 3 days.

Turns out Polish army with its outdated equipment performed better then the combined armies of the entire Western Europe.


And some of the most succesfull ones, before Russia and Normandy Poland was the site of the largest armored battle, largest aerial battle and largest land battles (multiple) which cost Germans a grand total of 1/5th of their materiel.


On the contrary it did not lose like the French and British, it managed hold Germans along the entire border, it managed to win a number of massive battles, Polish army outperformed the West.

In addition Poland was forced to fight over half a milion Soviets and 50.000 Slovaks and unlike France it did not have allies, fortification lines or buffer states (low countries).

So if you state that Polish Army was weak then how do you describe the French/British/Low Countries performance which having much greater resources and superior strategic situation performed that much worse then Poles?


Village of Żubrówka i believe.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]

Bugger i posted Mors twice, i'll have some battlefield pictures sent to me from Germany in a few days.

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]

This is a rare one, from a friend who sent this to me i got the description, Polish infantry turning their gun on a Pz35T (seen in a distance) thats speeding towards their position.

A Pz II tank after a direct hit with a 100mm artillery shell, an engine, a piece of hull and a turret.

Mors smg, one of the few surviving pictures.

Polish sharpshooter, probably from the Hel naval base.

A section of a heavy armored train.

Polish 23TP medium tank with a single turret(artist rendition).

Love / Polish women are the most beautiful in the world! [1718]

They enter the "old hag" period of their life, 50+ is the "mother in law" thats when we should be allowed by law to put them down.

Unless its Monica Belucci, she's always 16 in my book.

Love / Polish women are the most beautiful in the world! [1718]


I'd get alcohol poisoning before i am ever this drunk.


But when they were born they were a genderless filthy diaper generating machine, we're talking about the period when women become soulless items for our pleasure and benefit (16-35yrs)


Yeah there's people who're fine with skullfvcking dead puppies, doesnt mean its normal.

Love / Polish women are the most beautiful in the world! [1718]


So you're fine with f*cking this?

History / Polish military in 1939 in pictures. [107]

Before i roll on a beer, Polish army motorised component just prior to the war.

Motorised infantry squad (from the Polish motorised-armored brigade).

C2P medium artillery tractor towing what looks like a 155mm howitzer (sorry thats actually a 75mm AT gun)

Ambulances.

More of the C2P medium tractor.

Domestically built truck for motorised units, 200 entered the ranks before the war.

C4P medium tractors towing 37mm Bofors AA guns and searchlights.

Motorised company.

C4P medium tractor/troop transport.

Citroen halftrack towing a 75mm howitzer manned by an artillery section.

An infantry unit mounted on lorries.

Citroen halftrack with a 75mm gun.

Polish mechanized unit parked outside a manor.

Sokól-1000 bike.

Polish motorised recon on campaign (soldiers wear German Stahlelms, some of the old German helmets were in use in Czechoslovakia, Poland, Romania and Hungary.)

C2P towing a 120mm mortar.

Partially motorised cavalry unit.

Light engineering tractor.

All terrain recon/light duty transport.