News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


You are right - it's universal.

In America, Southerners still hate Northerners. The Middle hates the Coasts, and it all revolves around "who owes who".

The poorer, rural regions feel they "feed" coastal America. The gun loving South, feels they protect the effeminate North, by enlisting in the military disproportionately or actually dealing with the waves of migrants that Northerners can only read about.

In the same way Ukraine expects things from Poland and Czechia for defending them, American Southerners feel they are owed recognition for being hardline on national security and immigration.

Southern Italy hates Northern Italy - for purported abandonment and arrogance. Poland B hates Poland A - for the same reasons. East Germans hate West Germans. Northern Chinese hate Southern Chinese.

People have some deep sensor inside their ass which measures the "fairness" of things.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


In America, the broadcast standard - also known as General American English - is Mid-Western in origin.

All the people on CNN and Fox News talk like they are from Chicago or somewhere in Ohio.

It has practically no "accent", or no "regional" identifiers like a New York or Texan accent would have.

Neutral, sterile, clean.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


No no, there are dozens of dialects. I meant the official three groups within the Russian "family" of peoples.

But Russian dialects are really tame in comparison to English or German ones. Everybody can easily understand each other.

The three main dialects within "Great Russian" Russian, are: (1) Northern, (2) Central, and (3) Southern. Then there are many smaller subdialects: Siberian, Pomorian, Central Asian, Baltic, Caucasus.

The literary and tv broadcast "Golden Standard" of Russian is the Moscow dialect (with some St. Petersburg influence). A lot of people actually find it quite harsh on the ear, or even annoying. Moscow people make high pitched sounds like 16 year old girls, and stretch their "As" to infinity.

The most even sounding Russian, is to my ear at least - the Uralic variety.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


This is the "Great Russian Chauvinist" (as Lenin would call it), or "Imperialist/Nationalist" position (as modern Ukrainians would call it).

Historically (in Imperial times), the Russian "folk" was divided into three groups. Great Russians (current Russians), Little Russians (current Ukrainians), and White Russians (Belarus).

The Ukrainian language was called the "Little Russian dialect", or "Malorosskiy Dialekt". It is actually spoken in a wider area than just modern Ukraine. People also speak a slightly more archaic version of it on the Russian side of the border. In the Belgorod, Kursk, Rostov, Krasnodar regions.

So the "High Russian" was called "Great Russian". It was the main language of USSR-level television, radio, film, etc. So, in this way everyone knew it too like High German.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


So Austria then, or Switzerland?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Yes we all have a little chip on our shoulder, hehe. On our left shoulder!


I wouldn't say it's "easy". Maybe like for a Prussian to understand a Bavarian at the beginning of the 20th century.

Only 60-70% of the words are the same. The others are borrowed from Polish and other languages, and usually don't make sense to a Russian unless he reads a lot.

Pronunciation-wise there's a huge difference, more than the lexical gap. Ukrainians make a bunch of sounds we don't make, or that sound funny to us.

Also the understanding works differently in either direction. 100% of Ukrainians understand Russian, but maybe only 50-60% of Russians may be able to follow a Ukrainian conversation.

Maybe it's the same in Germany? Where 100% of Bavarians can readily understand Northerners, but only 50-60% of Northerners can easily understand Bavarians?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

Just for some more context, for people unfamiliar with Gogol...

The line above is spoken by Taras Bulba, the protagonist of the book, to his son Andriy. Taras Bulba is a grizzled Ukrainian warlord, who symbolizes the Orthodox faith, the Cossack way of life, and eternal resistance to the Polish-Lithuanian Catholic nobility.

Andriy is Taras' good-for-nothing youngest son. Unlike loyal and pious Ostap (the Hector), Andriy is a sh*t for brains that follows the commands of his dick (Paris, to continue the Iliad analogy). He betrayed the Cossacks and joined the Polish side out of love for a Polish noblewoman.

Finally, one day Taras confronts him on the battlefield, and before executing him, delivers this line as a final judgment.

«Ну что, помогли тебе твои ляхи?»

Moral of the story - you can be loyal to Poles, but the Poles will value your loyalty for nothing. Meanwhile, your "bros" will surely come for you - and remember all your Polonophilia.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Genuine question - what can one discuss with the Virgin during an entire hour, every single day?

I find it hard to talk to my brother or mother for more than 20 minutes every few days. Not because I don't enjoy their company, but because I find that I don't have very much to say. That is - I need more time, for more events to accumulate - so there is then something to discuss.

I'm not Belousov, and I don't have the lives of thousands of men on my conscience - so maybe I don't understand something...


I really wish we had an active Ukrainian poster on this forum. One who could be somewhat objective, instead of just a patriotic bot like the previous two we had.

Anything I write about Ukrainian attitudes towards Poland will be immediately suspect, because of the source...

Nonetheless - I read Ukrainian newspapers daily. Every other evening I tune in to watch their evening talk shows (which frequently feature top officials). Probably around 25% of my Twitter feed is Ukrainian language. I follow several Ukrainian public persons on Facebook.

I can tell you - the feelings are... complex.

1) There is some sense of inadequacy when comparing themselves to Poland.

2) At the same time, this state of being less developed and much poorer than Poland, somehow feels to them as a violation of the natural order of the universe.

3) This inadequacy/shame, leads to a constant search for some kind of justification. "They became rich off our backs," or "The Russians held us back," or "The EU pumped them full of cash".

4) The shame deepens through the low class of work done by Ukrainians in Poland. Drivers, retail clerks, janitors, nannies, etc.

5) Finally shame turns to anger, and then full blown delusions of "Cossackism" (equivalent of Polish Sarmatism or Japanese Samuraism).

6) Poland constantly needling them with the Volhyn Massacres doesn't do any good. Not only are they treated as "the help", they are also being told that they are bloodthirsty apes suffering from historical amnesia. This sends them ballistic with fury.

And in general - the cultural undercurrent in Ukraine, for centuries, was extremely Polonophobic. In Ukraine, the novel Taras Bulba plays the same role, if not larger, as Ogniem i Mieczem plays in Poland. The whole book is one long anti-Polish screed.

The most quoted line from the book, that every single Ukrainian child knows, is "Well, did your Poles help you?".

This line has been quoted 10 million times by Ukrainians over the past two years, as Polish farmers dumped their grain onto highways, truckers blocked the border control points, and governments refused to hand over aging MiG jets.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


In pure mathematical terms - we lost several hundred thousand men, but gained approximately 3-5 million additional citizens.

Through this kind of Satanic math - the war is providing good returns.

Take into account the coal, the metals, the gas, the rare earths - and you could really make an argument that the investment "works".

If you are especially cynical - you could argue that we lost a "lower quality" of material than the Ukrainians. Convicts, chronically unemployed, low education, low income... vs yesterday's "lawyers", "doctors", "film directors", "businessmen", etc.

Their losses are truly irreparable.... ours not so much.


Yes. Prays 5 times a day, like a Muslim. Begins every morning by spending an hour in his private chapel, conversing with the Virgin.

For this reason, many people think he's not "all right" in the head.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Sometimes the person is so bent out of shape, that he cannot climb into the cart. I've seen several such videos.

At this point, several of his friends might reappear from some collection of bushes, toss him into the drone, and then immediately run back for cover.

If it's the second echelon of an attack arriving on a BMP - the BMP might deploy smoke and do a little half circle around the wounded man - obscuring vision - and then try to pick him up fast.

Sometimes nobody comes - and you have to either shoot yourself, or try to crawl back to your lines.

--///--

According to the best estimates, Russia has suffered approximately 1 million casualties in this war thus far. Of that, approximately 110-150K are Killed in Action. A further 250-350K are otherwise irreplaceable losses (amputations, mostly).

But the other half a million suffered superficial or non-incapacitating injuries and were likely returned into action. There are cases where a single infantryman suffered 7 or more injuries, and each time returned to fight.

So "evacuation" does happen - and in large numbers. "Battlefield medicine" exists - and is in much better shape than 2022 (when it was embarrassing to compare our first aid kits to the Western ones Ukraine was provided with).

In fact, Belousov (the new minister of defense), has made "battlefield medicine" an especial priority. Now everyone has top quality tourniquets and clotting agents.

The drones used for evacuating casualties is also his introduction largely.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


If China followed Gorbachev's example and greeted the people on Tianamen Square with flowers and candies - there would be no China now. At least, not as we know it now - as a Great Power.


I'm sure Uyghurs and Tibetans also view things differently than the Han Chinese.


Why don't you try evacuating that wounded soldier yourself? When you are lying by his side, similarly full of shrapnel - with a Ukrainian drone hovering above you, recording your death for Twitter and Facebook - perhaps it would make you view things differently?

Evacuation is often impossible in this war - unless you are advancing. Because we are advancing, we are able to return to the Ukrainians ten times the amount of bodies they are able to return to us.

As the battlefield starts becoming your rear, it's easy enough to go and collect all the bodies and ship em back to the Ukrainians. The Ukrainians are only able to send us back the bodies that pile up after an UNSUCCESSFUL assault.

-//-

The few videos I had seen, where Russian soldiers appear to shoot wounded comrades - it's clear that the wounded person is the one requesting it.

Besides concern for the men that will likely get killed trying to evacuate you... there is also the fact that Ukrainian drone operators are sadists. They will taunt a wounded man by flying around him in circles. They'll play games with him.

Nobody wants to be a clown for Ukrainians in the last 15 minutes of his life.

--//--

There are uncrewed ground drones now that do much of the evacuation work. Basically a remotely controlled cart. The wounded guy only has to be able to climb inside, and then the drone will carry him back to his lines.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


It cannot be stopped, to try to do so - would be suicidal, not just for the individual but likely for the Russian state as well.

They say that "the road to hell is paved with good intentions". Russia's history is the best example of this.

1) The "good" Decembrists... in their drive for liberalism - freaked out the Tsar to such an extent, that we got an autocratic backlash that lasted for nearly half a century. While Europe modernized, we sat in a dark dungeon, thanks to their work.

2) The "good" Democrats in the Spring of 1917 succeeded in toppling the monarchy and burying the empire. They also lost us WW1, which led to the independence of Finland, Poland, the Baltics. They plunged the country into a Civil War. They handed it over, ultimately, to the Bolsheviks.

3) The "good" and "virtuous" Gorbachev, destroyed the largest country on Earth, destroyed our alliances, and plunged the country into two decades of poverty. China meanwhile, carefully took notes, and instead ran their own people over with tanks in a public square. Now China has one of the largest economies in the world, and we export mainly oil and metals.

The "good guys" don't really have a good reputation in Russia. They usually make things much worse. Only some nice literature, some nice music, and some nice art can be considered a positive side effect.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Better question is - how has Russia ever betrayed Poland?

Did we use you as cannon fodder, while holding our men back?

Did we ever stop at your border - and announce the mission complete - or did we liberate you fully and then others?

Did we rob your industry and your treasure - leaving you on a starvation diet - or did we help you rebuild?

When has a Russian ever asked a Pole to do something, that a Russian wasn't willing to do himself?

What is betrayal? Occupation? Conquest? That's not betrayal.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Tough words, from a slithering grey worm who has never worn a uniform, or sacrificed for someone else without asking for anything in return.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


By grieving together, in the way only a brother can grieve.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


For Zinedine Zidane - any humiliation is worth it. Don't forget Benzema as well.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


France was losing from the beginning.

The Algerians kicked them out without any hope.

The CIA, and then the US Army had to bail them out of Vietnam.

In the end, the US did not do any better in Vietnam.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


We'll make it right.

One day, no one will even remember that there was a brief thirty year period of being separated from Russia.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


We have a deep, deep, debt before the people of Kherson.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


The cause is the glory of Russia and protection of our homeland from the encroachment of hostile parties.

It does not accrue to the glory of Russia, when we kill innocent people with FPV drones, for the crime of "surrendering Kherson back to the Ukrainians".

If we are to rely on Khersonians to defend Kherson against Ukrainians, instead of our Ground Forces, Naval Infantry, Airborne, and Spetsnaz - then our worth is zero.

We pulled out, to the other side of the river, to preserve our forces. This - after promising Khersonians we would never abandon them. AND NOW WE PUNISH THEM FOR BEING RE-OCCUPIED?

I would personally visit this unit, and put against a wall every single drone operator that thinks this is "cool" or "funny". I would send such an FPV team into storm assault infantry, but not before breaking their faces and cutting their tendons - so they have an especially joyous time advancing across the open stretch.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I refuse to believe that there is a unit on the Dnieper that uses Khersonian civilians as hunting exercises.

I have seen the footage like you have. It's disgusting. But I hope it is some kind of a mistake.

If it's truly the case, then they should be executed summarily like the dogs that they are. They are worse than enemies, and are doing immeasurable damage to the cause.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Our cause is right.

God is with us.

If the Almighty thought we were killing too many innocents, he would send us problems. Instead, he gives us at every step exactly what we need - including Donald J. Trump.

We take what is ours, and we restore the natural balance of the universe - cleaning the Earth of its impurities in the process.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


One theory that I've come across, is that Western liberals still want to be racist (but without appearing so), and therefore unload on poor whites, Russians, and Christians - the only three groups safe to hate.

--//--

Then I also hear, especially from my Ukrainian friends, that it's "Kosher" to hate Russia, because it is so big and so heavily armed. That is - being the aggressor, being bigger, and being stronger - means it's fair game to troll you in whatever way the smaller fella wants to. In other words - we hate what we fear.

This logic can also be applied to white people and Christians. They are so rich, so dominant, and their influence so entrenched - that it's permissible to troll them.

--//--

Absence of guilt is another popular explanation. The West's collective guilt over the Holocaust dictates the pussyfooting attitude towards Israel and Jews. Nobody except Germany really feels any guilt in regards to what happened to Russia. That's why Germany is the only large country in the enemy camp that advocates moderation.

--//--

The most charitable explanation for why Russia receives so much more toxicity than the Netanyahu regime, or the Sudanese government, or the junta of Myanmar, or the Islamist government of Syria - is that on some level we are still seen as family. Psychotic, impulsive, infantile, paranoid... but still family.

That is, the West is genuinely DISAPPOINTED with Russia. They expect this type of behavior from Sudan and from Myanmar - but they did not expect it from us.

And in the way that only family members are able to be harsh - so the West is hard on us.

The amount of responsibility accorded to you, is proportionate to how stable and predictable you are. And Russia was rewarded with a lot of responsibility. Security Council veto, nuclear arsenal, G8, IMF and World Bank boards, Russia-NATO Council, etc. And with all this responsibility, Russia decided to act like a wild gorilla.

This is the most charitable explanation for why it's ok to hate Russians.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Asking people not to use genocidal language towards Russians, means to have an inflated opinion of self?

P.S. - I don't know why I bother replying to you, since you always misunderstand my meaning - and then reply with something that is completely orthogonal to what I was writing.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

@Mr Grunwald

The wanton racism towards Russians will one day bite "Civilized Europeans" in the ass, and in a way they can probably scarcely predict now.

--//--

Sort of off-topic, but also... on-topic - I've been very disappointed with the Financial Times' editorial boards policy towards comments under articles.

All articles written on the topic of Israel have comments disabled.

All articles written on the topic of Russia are free to be commented on. The comments under Russian articles are full, just as on PF, with references to orcs and slaves, and frequent celebrations of the death of Russian bureaucrats or even tourists vacationing in Egypt.

Now I understand why the FT does not want comments under Israel articles. British law has powerful guardrails against platforming hate speech, and antisemitism is especially fiercely policed. So they do not want that liability. They don't want problems with advertisers, who might not want their handbag advertised next to a Nazi screed. They don't want the burden or expense of moderating the threads for antisemitic speech, etc.

But why... does the FT not care about dehumanizing Russians? Why is it safe and even encouraged to use the worst slurs and epithets against Russia? Because we had not been the primary target of the Holocaust? Because we are your favorite boogeyman for the past century, and everyone loves to hate a villain? To hate Russians means to stand up for freedom - so much so, that even genocidal language is treated as "anti-authoritarianism"?

......

This duplicity, hypocrisy, and double think will f*ck you. I promise you this. You can't nourish and grow your hate for so long, without permanent repercussions for your soul.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


You are a very special boy!

If we are "rusn*ggers", would you like me to tell you how your Western overlords view you?

You think that by licking their boots, and spreading your legs for them, that you have become something more than a chimpanzee for them - my Polish friend?

It's really wonderful to see "Europeans" open their mouths, and then see the flood of "civilization" that comes out.

Thanks for not calling me an untermenschen or a slave or a mongoloid Asiatic beast today - my European Master!

--//--

For non-retarded Poles, from Bobko:

When Poles today adopt the language of racial superiority, moral supremacy, or civilizational disgust toward Russians, you are not just mimicking Nazi rhetoric, you're also repeating a cycle of humiliation that you once suffered under.

By calling me a "rusn*gger", you betray your own historical experience, and you forfeit the moral credibility that you often (and rightfully) invoke.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Well... in Dune - you have the House Harkonnen - led by a Baron Vladimir Harkonnen.

In Star Trek you had Chekhov - Kirk's trusty navigator.

Obviously - these authors were projecting their then present day reality of the Cold War into the distant future. But still, even those authors thought that even ten thousand years from now - there would still be traces of who was Russian, who was English, and so on. This... due to the extraordinary impact of our specific age across the past 200,000 years.

It gives me a little comfort, that when we may be colonizing Alpha Centauri's satellites, there will still be Grzegorzes and Borises.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


The only reliable way to have a revival - in the current dismal demographic context - is a terrible war where we lose large portions of our population.

These wars that shake everything to the foundation, paradoxically, make people reproduce more.

If everyone continues to grow fat, lazy, and selfish through life in a capitalist aquarium - you won't get a sudden and unexpected boost in birth rates.

You need a nuclear holocaust, or a plague - then whatever Poles and Russians remain will reproduce enthusiastically.

There's many reasons why this is so - housing, land, public health, etc.

So unless you are willing to send 50% of Poland to their death - you won't save Poland. No one has managed it. Not the French. Not the Koreans. Not the Russians. There is no amount of money or incentives that will make people produce families again, unless we throw them back to an earlier state of existence.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

In the same way demographics is destiny - manpower is determinant.

Even in the age of drones, robots, and ai - you need boots on the ground to occupy territory. No drone will perform the job of occupation for you.

Infantry - salt of the Earth - has always won wars, and will continue in this role. Nothing can defeat infantry - not air, not sea, and not even nukes.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I don't associate myself with the people, in the same way you do - perhaps.

For me - it is more important that Russia remains an independent pole within the world.

If we restrict immigration, and die out like the Spartans - some Roman will one day come and bulldoze us.

Sparta and Athens lost to Rome, because they restricted military service and public service to Athenian and Spartan citizens.

Even Pyrrhus, God of War that he was, eventually ran out of manpower - and today we have the term "Pyrrhic Victory". As he said - "One more victory like this - and I'm done for."

For every army that Pyrrhus destroyed, Rome raised two more. When it started running out of men to throw into the meat grinder, Rome simply expanded citizenship - and gained access to hundreds of thousands of more recruits.

In whose world do we live today - Rome's or Athens'?