News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


For Zinedine Zidane - any humiliation is worth it. Don't forget Benzema as well.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


France was losing from the beginning.

The Algerians kicked them out without any hope.

The CIA, and then the US Army had to bail them out of Vietnam.

In the end, the US did not do any better in Vietnam.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


We'll make it right.

One day, no one will even remember that there was a brief thirty year period of being separated from Russia.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


We have a deep, deep, debt before the people of Kherson.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


The cause is the glory of Russia and protection of our homeland from the encroachment of hostile parties.

It does not accrue to the glory of Russia, when we kill innocent people with FPV drones, for the crime of "surrendering Kherson back to the Ukrainians".

If we are to rely on Khersonians to defend Kherson against Ukrainians, instead of our Ground Forces, Naval Infantry, Airborne, and Spetsnaz - then our worth is zero.

We pulled out, to the other side of the river, to preserve our forces. This - after promising Khersonians we would never abandon them. AND NOW WE PUNISH THEM FOR BEING RE-OCCUPIED?

I would personally visit this unit, and put against a wall every single drone operator that thinks this is "cool" or "funny". I would send such an FPV team into storm assault infantry, but not before breaking their faces and cutting their tendons - so they have an especially joyous time advancing across the open stretch.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I refuse to believe that there is a unit on the Dnieper that uses Khersonian civilians as hunting exercises.

I have seen the footage like you have. It's disgusting. But I hope it is some kind of a mistake.

If it's truly the case, then they should be executed summarily like the dogs that they are. They are worse than enemies, and are doing immeasurable damage to the cause.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Our cause is right.

God is with us.

If the Almighty thought we were killing too many innocents, he would send us problems. Instead, he gives us at every step exactly what we need - including Donald J. Trump.

We take what is ours, and we restore the natural balance of the universe - cleaning the Earth of its impurities in the process.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


One theory that I've come across, is that Western liberals still want to be racist (but without appearing so), and therefore unload on poor whites, Russians, and Christians - the only three groups safe to hate.

--//--

Then I also hear, especially from my Ukrainian friends, that it's "Kosher" to hate Russia, because it is so big and so heavily armed. That is - being the aggressor, being bigger, and being stronger - means it's fair game to troll you in whatever way the smaller fella wants to. In other words - we hate what we fear.

This logic can also be applied to white people and Christians. They are so rich, so dominant, and their influence so entrenched - that it's permissible to troll them.

--//--

Absence of guilt is another popular explanation. The West's collective guilt over the Holocaust dictates the pussyfooting attitude towards Israel and Jews. Nobody except Germany really feels any guilt in regards to what happened to Russia. That's why Germany is the only large country in the enemy camp that advocates moderation.

--//--

The most charitable explanation for why Russia receives so much more toxicity than the Netanyahu regime, or the Sudanese government, or the junta of Myanmar, or the Islamist government of Syria - is that on some level we are still seen as family. Psychotic, impulsive, infantile, paranoid... but still family.

That is, the West is genuinely DISAPPOINTED with Russia. They expect this type of behavior from Sudan and from Myanmar - but they did not expect it from us.

And in the way that only family members are able to be harsh - so the West is hard on us.

The amount of responsibility accorded to you, is proportionate to how stable and predictable you are. And Russia was rewarded with a lot of responsibility. Security Council veto, nuclear arsenal, G8, IMF and World Bank boards, Russia-NATO Council, etc. And with all this responsibility, Russia decided to act like a wild gorilla.

This is the most charitable explanation for why it's ok to hate Russians.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Asking people not to use genocidal language towards Russians, means to have an inflated opinion of self?

P.S. - I don't know why I bother replying to you, since you always misunderstand my meaning - and then reply with something that is completely orthogonal to what I was writing.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

@Mr Grunwald

The wanton racism towards Russians will one day bite "Civilized Europeans" in the ass, and in a way they can probably scarcely predict now.

--//--

Sort of off-topic, but also... on-topic - I've been very disappointed with the Financial Times' editorial boards policy towards comments under articles.

All articles written on the topic of Israel have comments disabled.

All articles written on the topic of Russia are free to be commented on. The comments under Russian articles are full, just as on PF, with references to orcs and slaves, and frequent celebrations of the death of Russian bureaucrats or even tourists vacationing in Egypt.

Now I understand why the FT does not want comments under Israel articles. British law has powerful guardrails against platforming hate speech, and antisemitism is especially fiercely policed. So they do not want that liability. They don't want problems with advertisers, who might not want their handbag advertised next to a Nazi screed. They don't want the burden or expense of moderating the threads for antisemitic speech, etc.

But why... does the FT not care about dehumanizing Russians? Why is it safe and even encouraged to use the worst slurs and epithets against Russia? Because we had not been the primary target of the Holocaust? Because we are your favorite boogeyman for the past century, and everyone loves to hate a villain? To hate Russians means to stand up for freedom - so much so, that even genocidal language is treated as "anti-authoritarianism"?

......

This duplicity, hypocrisy, and double think will f*ck you. I promise you this. You can't nourish and grow your hate for so long, without permanent repercussions for your soul.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


You are a very special boy!

If we are "rusn*ggers", would you like me to tell you how your Western overlords view you?

You think that by licking their boots, and spreading your legs for them, that you have become something more than a chimpanzee for them - my Polish friend?

It's really wonderful to see "Europeans" open their mouths, and then see the flood of "civilization" that comes out.

Thanks for not calling me an untermenschen or a slave or a mongoloid Asiatic beast today - my European Master!

--//--

For non-retarded Poles, from Bobko:

When Poles today adopt the language of racial superiority, moral supremacy, or civilizational disgust toward Russians, you are not just mimicking Nazi rhetoric, you're also repeating a cycle of humiliation that you once suffered under.

By calling me a "rusn*gger", you betray your own historical experience, and you forfeit the moral credibility that you often (and rightfully) invoke.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Well... in Dune - you have the House Harkonnen - led by a Baron Vladimir Harkonnen.

In Star Trek you had Chekhov - Kirk's trusty navigator.

Obviously - these authors were projecting their then present day reality of the Cold War into the distant future. But still, even those authors thought that even ten thousand years from now - there would still be traces of who was Russian, who was English, and so on. This... due to the extraordinary impact of our specific age across the past 200,000 years.

It gives me a little comfort, that when we may be colonizing Alpha Centauri's satellites, there will still be Grzegorzes and Borises.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


The only reliable way to have a revival - in the current dismal demographic context - is a terrible war where we lose large portions of our population.

These wars that shake everything to the foundation, paradoxically, make people reproduce more.

If everyone continues to grow fat, lazy, and selfish through life in a capitalist aquarium - you won't get a sudden and unexpected boost in birth rates.

You need a nuclear holocaust, or a plague - then whatever Poles and Russians remain will reproduce enthusiastically.

There's many reasons why this is so - housing, land, public health, etc.

So unless you are willing to send 50% of Poland to their death - you won't save Poland. No one has managed it. Not the French. Not the Koreans. Not the Russians. There is no amount of money or incentives that will make people produce families again, unless we throw them back to an earlier state of existence.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

In the same way demographics is destiny - manpower is determinant.

Even in the age of drones, robots, and ai - you need boots on the ground to occupy territory. No drone will perform the job of occupation for you.

Infantry - salt of the Earth - has always won wars, and will continue in this role. Nothing can defeat infantry - not air, not sea, and not even nukes.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I don't associate myself with the people, in the same way you do - perhaps.

For me - it is more important that Russia remains an independent pole within the world.

If we restrict immigration, and die out like the Spartans - some Roman will one day come and bulldoze us.

Sparta and Athens lost to Rome, because they restricted military service and public service to Athenian and Spartan citizens.

Even Pyrrhus, God of War that he was, eventually ran out of manpower - and today we have the term "Pyrrhic Victory". As he said - "One more victory like this - and I'm done for."

For every army that Pyrrhus destroyed, Rome raised two more. When it started running out of men to throw into the meat grinder, Rome simply expanded citizenship - and gained access to hundreds of thousands of more recruits.

In whose world do we live today - Rome's or Athens'?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Unless people suddenly start making more children - and I mean RIGHT NOW - this end result is sort of baked in. We only have to sit and wait for it to come to be.

People don't say that "demographics is fate" for no reason. Present day patterns, are a 100% accurate indicator of where you will be in 10-20-30 years. So if you don't fix things or discover that you are unable - all you can do it sit and wait, and hope the browns will be nice to you and your kids.

As for the elites - they don't care.

Russians will always control Russia. Poles will always control Poland. WASPs and Ashkenazim will always run America.

All the brown people will be below the white Russian and Polish elites.

It's the Polish and Russian lumpenproletariat that will have street fights with immigrants, stage marches for racial purity, etc.

Elites are global - and have long since stopped caring about their home populations.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I wish we got immigrants from China and Korea in the same proportion as America. Even better Europeans - but they don't even emigrate to America anymore in the same numbers.

Russia is Russia - and we get the type of people that are ready to live here, and for whom it still represents an upgrade.

Future Russia will be brown, half Muslim, and bi-trilingual.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


We will lose Cubans, and you would lose Englishmen and Spaniards.


Well - the reason we need 11 million worth of fresh blood is not because of Ukraine. It's because 8 million Russians will retire by 2030. But we also want to grow, and create new jobs. 11 million is the number the Ministry of Labor came up with - all things considered.

As you know - our demographics are ****.

Under this kind of trajectory, by 2050 or so, Russians will be a minority in their own country.

Is this price worth it - in exchange for continued relevance on the global stage? For Russian elites certainly. For the average Russian worker, who will one day wake up and say "where is my country?" - maybe not.

Thankfully - one never has to consult the average Russian worker about anything. That is, until he puts on his little Budenov cap and sticks a pitchfork in your bourgeois guts.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Poland may be an exception, but Germany is empty. The UK is empty. Italy had nothing but its good navy to begin with. Spain cannot fight - in principle.

Only France has some good stuff left - because they were greedy in sharing with the Ukrainians.

When I say there are no shells and no tanks - you only have to read what Rhinemetall, BAE, and others write in their own press reports.

There WILL be a mountain of shells, and hordes of tanks, but later - not now.

Poland - like France - stopped helping Ukraine as soon as it started eating into core stocks. Also, Poland decided not to wait on German and British production - and instead to go with some exotic purchases. That may help it too

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

... and if the war ends soon, but Europe is only ready to fight in 4-5 years: can you imagine where Russia would be by that point in time?

If we start reconstituting the army in 2026, by 2030 it will be in a much scarier shape than it was in 2022.

If Trump removes sanctions on us, as a reward for ending the war, then China will no longer be limited in assisting Russia's military industrial complex in retooling and expanding.

The way our economy is structured now, Putin will not be able to rapidly decrease military spending without causing a nasty recession - so the factories will continue to receive hundreds of billions of dollars.

We are currently investing billions into expanding North Korea's industrial capabilities. Their war machine works almost exclusively to our benefit.

We will be able to recruit hundreds of thousands of Cubans, Angolans, Nepalis, Ethiopians, Nicaraguans, etc.

Already today, I read a report where our Minister of Labor was telling Putin we will need 11 million additional citizens by 2030 if we are to deliver on various promises. This can only mean that Putin will have to open the immigration gates even wider. It means almost a tripling in the level of immigration, from 700K or so, to 2 million a year.

I expect many of these people will earn their citizenship through service.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Europe has emptied itself of weapons. That's already a defeat - without even putting a single soldier in the field.

America's Pentagon planners are stopping weapons shipments without consulting with Trump and Rubio, because they are worried that "stocks are running dangerously low".

Russia has successfully absorbed a sizable portion of the collective West's weapon stocks. If in the beginning it was legacy systems like artillery guns and tanks, then over the past two years it has been state of the art equipment - that in many cases even America's allies don't possess.

When the West arrives, what will it fight with, if we rule out nuclear weapons?

Where are the tanks? Where are the shells? Where are the men (Starmer and Macron could not put together a force of 12,000)?

You gonna fight with a naked ass? No. You need at least 4-5 years to get into fighting shape. That's why I say "impotence".

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


This is tactical/operational - while the strategic goal is to demonstrate Western impotence.

Killing the maximum possible number of AFU servicemen is unfortunately the only logical way of waging the war at this point. This is because Ukraine has catastrophic issues with mobilizing new forces - so every brigade removed from the map represents a permanent reduction in their combat potential.

Holes are opening in the front. Some Ukrainian officers complain they are asked to maintain 5 km stretches of the "zero line" with 10-12 men.

Still, Ukraine has new and deep lines of fortifications it has erected 40-50 kilometers behind the current lines. Those lines are much straighter, and thus easier to defend. They are finally building them properly, in the way the Russians built theirs to stop the 2023 Summer Offensive.

That is, I'm not sure you can simply kill your way through this war. "Kill Counts" didn't win America Vietnam, and it didn't stop the Taliban. Granted - Vietnam and Afghanistan had infinitely healthier demographics.

What needs to happen is either:

1) Electronic warfare systems make a further leap in efficiency, and once again clear the skies of drones. Current systems are unable to disrupt fiber optic drones, or drones that rapidly hop frequencies, or drones employing neural networks to autonomously acquire targets.

2) We figure out some way to reliably find and kill drone operators. There's much progress in this direction. Over the past 6 months, hundreds of Ukrainian drone operator crews have been destroyed. But it's hard work, and requires creative thinking and constant innovation.

If you can't clear the skies of drones, strategic offensives are extremely difficult to pull off. Maybe inpossible. Only slow, incremental gains are possible.

Americans are currently experimenting with microwave weapons, which can down hundreds of drones simultaneously by frying their internal components. Maybe this will be the key.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


I think the goal is to fix in place a Western defeat.

Not demilitarization. Not denazification. But just the fact of a Western defeat.

If Ukraine is left without 20% of its initial territory, following a negotiated ceasefire - that would amount to a Western defeat - no matter what anybody else says to the contrary.

Biden's moving of goalposts to "Well, we had prevented a full takeover of Ukraine, and that's a great victory indeed" - is total bullsh*t.

He promised that Putin would be in a cage. He said the "Rouble is Rubble". He said Russia would be more isolated than the worst pariah regimes.

That doesn't sound like Russia getting to keep a territory the size of Greece, or three Switzerlands.

--//--

Why is it important to "fix" a Western defeat in fact? Because everyone is tired of it, but still somewhat afraid that it has some single flex left - which could set us up for a further 50 years of Western domination.

If the West is seen to have lost, after it threw everything including the kitchen sink at Russia - then that is a powerful signal to everyone else. To China. To India. To Brazil - that it is possible to ignore the West and overcome it.

This will accrue to us in myriad ways, from prospective alliances, to arms sales, to increased trade - as people learn not to fear Western sanctions and Western militaries.

If we lose - then it's a chilling message to everyone else. If Russia could not resist - how can we hope to resist?

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


...


Everybody loves each other on PF - in the end. What a strange place!

I would never think Jon357 and Amiga500 would want to hang out with each other, but here we are...

A model for the rest of the world - tearing itself apart by left/right axis, or through whatever other bent.

--///--

Seeing Richard's post on Adrian, I decided to go back to Polanda and read some of his old posts. He wrote a lot - and on a lot of different topics. Then I decided to go back to the very first "Polish Aid to Ukraine if Russia Invades" thread, and see who was writing what in March and April of 2022.

It was actually not as bad as I thought. Of course, there were posts like this one from Maf (made on April 15th, 2022)

"Time is on Ukraine's side... The Russian army is facing collapse and won't really be able to fight by June or so at the latest..."

To be honest, though, I wrote some pretty stupid posts as well back then.

It's glorious of course to see PAK still in his full "HAPPY GULAG *******" mode. Kania is actually staunchly pro-Ukrainian at the start of the conflict as well, but you can see his views drifting closer to May-June.

Jon is obsessed with Kadyrov, and wants to hang every Chechen from a lamppost or strangulate them with piano wire.

Velund is consistent - in that he neither hates Ukrainians nor wanted this war to begin with. He seems actually a bit less of a war hawk than me, in those first months.

Atch wrote from a surprisingly sober perspective, given the excitement at the time (24th February, 2022):

"Would everybody please stop sounding so delighted at the prospect of going to war with Russia. World War Three may be unavoidable but it's not a cause for celebration."

AntV wins the award for the most clear-eyed post (from a person that was always neutral):

"I'm not so sure, fellas.

Emotions are running high right now, so all this talk of independence from Russia energy and significant increases in military spending, etc still have yet to meet the realities of time. Let's not get ahead of ourselves."

Novichok is of course the champion. He never wavered - not one single day. From 24 February, 2024 - he was solid in insisting that Ukraine will never return Crimea, and would never reoccupy the Donbass.

Off-Topic / Remembering Adrian [24]

RIP Dirk Diggler

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

@Mr Grunwald

We need your help in Russia.

If we live together - we don't need anyone else.

Feel bad you have never experienced the nature and climate of San Francisco? Go to Vladivostok on the other end of the Pacific.

Can't travel to Egypt and Turkey for the palm trees and beaches? Go to Sochi and Gelendzhik.

Can't ski in Chamonix? Come ski the Caucasus - the tallest mountains in Europe.

You want deserts? We got em. Tundra? Yes. Endless forest yes? Volcanoes and geysers - more than Yellowstone - yes. Ice sheets and glaciers - more than Canada.

In Russia we have everything. More than everything. We are larger than a continent. 110 of the naturally occurring elements from the periodic table.

We have more energy than God himself. America will start tapping oil fields right underneath its cities, before we even open our fields in conservation.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Three countries that are f*cked Grunnie.

Not sure you want to copy their example. They lack the weight for independence. None have even a fraction of the freedom of maneuver of Russia.

Germany and Turkey especially - they cannot take a step without a consultation with the boss.

Russia answers only to God Almighty.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]


Google is your friend. R1A is the main genetic marker.

Russians are actually four different "Russians". The ones in the NorthWest have high Scandinavian and Finno-Ugric admixture. In the center - practically Stone Age Slavs.

In the Southwest - lots of Steppe and Caucasus admixture.

In the East - increasingly Asian as you move East - primarily through Tatar mixing.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

In general - it always makes me laugh when Poles complain about repression.

A Pole invented the entire KGB. Within the Warsaw Pact - everyone quietly took notes from the UB on how to smash even the smallest grass shoots of dissent.

For a very "freedom loving" people, Poles sure know how to tighten the screws. Maybe they got that from the Germans...

--//--

Another interesting aspect, is the quality of Polish infantry. From what I have read - Soviet generals rated German infantry most highly. The GDR probably had the best infantry available - superior in every way to Soviet infantry. Discipline, physicality, ideological solidness, level of education and technical aptitude.

The Poles probably ranked second to the Germans. The problem of the Poles was they were largely a conscription reliant forces like ours - while the GDR had a professional army that emphasized long term service.

Still, Polish infantry was assigned hugely important tasks. If the Germans were to be the tip of the spear, Poles were supposed to protect the flanks and exploit breakthroughs.

News / Why should Poland consider pursuing a strategic alliance with Russia? [396]

In the times of the Warsaw Pact, Poland had several "specializations".

However, before any of their other contributions - you have to remember that the Ludowe Wojsko Polskie was the second-largest Warsaw Pact army after the Soviet Union. IT WAS BIGGER THAN THE ARMY OF THE GDR - which was the most militarized state on Earth for a short while.

But back to Polish "special competences":

1) Almost the entire Soviet fleet of amphibious landing ships was built in Poland - primarily in Gdansk. Russia still uses Polish ships to move troops across seas.

2) Poland produced a disproportionate number of mine warfare vessels and coastal defense ships. Basically - it was Poland's job to control the Baltic.

3) Logistical corps. Poland had a much higher density of pre-positioned depots and railheads. Soviet military planners trusted Polish logistics much more than Romanian or Bulgarian logistics. Poland provided the capacity to rapidly reinforce East Germany and Czechoslovakia - and to keep Swedish forces bottled up in their ports.

4) Alongside licensed production of T-55 and T-72 tanks, Poland had a large indigenous industry. Honker jeeps, Sokol helicopters, Star and Jelcz trucks, etc.

5) Military education - Poland was second only to Moscow in how many Angolans, Cubans, Vietnamese, and Ethiopians were trained and given an education. Many of them went on to become big people in their home countries.

6) Internal Security and Control - even the KGB was envious of the reach of the UB and the fierceness of the ZOMO riot police. Poland was a test bed for how to control populations. Polish security officers worked in every corner of the world advising governments on how to establish ironclad security. Solidarity ruined their reputation a little bit - but they were still among the most ruthless and efficient. Certainly more ruthless than our own Russian internal security forces.