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"Shale Gas Revolution" will make Poland a Leading Country in Europe!


PennBoy  
19 May 2011 /  #122
Gas Powers Wrestle in Poland
blogs.wsj.com/emergingeurope/2011/05/19/gas-powers-wrestle-in-poland/?mod=google_news_blog
davidcompa83  
20 May 2011 /  #123
Merged thread:
Poland seeks independence from Russian imports through shale gas despite pollution concern

Some U.S. states were forced to step up environmental standards after high levels of methane were found in tap water, while France recently put a similar project on hold.

But Poland seems undeterred by the risks, saying it cannot afford to ignore such a valuable reserve of energy.

deseretnews.com/article/700136678/Poland-targets-shale-gas-despite-pollution-concern.html
PlasticPole  
20 May 2011 /  #124
It's a delicate balance. On the one hand, it means not having to depend on others for this type of energy, perhaps weaning a nation off crude oil and gasoline. On the other, it can make large patches of land uninhabitable and cause lakes and ponds to explode.

Hopefully, no methane will find it's way into water wells. If it does, don't smoke or light a match around any water from it.
Varsovian  
20 May 2011 /  #125
The problem is that manipulated/ill-informed public opinion and commercial timescales don't have much respect for each other. I'm sort of involved in both nuclear and shale gas - "just following orders" ...

Wait for global warmism to decline in popularity with a few cold years and far higher electricity prices (caused by CO2 allowances). However, the elites should be able to hold the line - as they did for mass immigration and de facto ghettoisation.
davidcompa83  
21 May 2011 /  #126
Poland seeks independence from Russian imports through shale gas despite pollution concern

europetopnews.com/30677/poland-seeks-independence-from-russian-imports -through-shale-gas-despite-pollution-concerns.html
GrzegorzK  
29 May 2011 /  #127
Merged thread:
Hydraulic Fracturing or HYRDROFRACKING of Polish shale gas

It's not as dangerous as left wing propaganda and global warming anarchists believe. Most people don't even know what hydraulic fracturing is so let me educate you. Natural gas is also known as methane which is a gas given off from decaying organic matter... when you fart that is methane gas. Now SHALE GAS is methane gas that is buried deep under ground and trapped in rock shales, which is a layer of brittle rock.. the gas is trapped in the shale. Now in order to harvest the gas the latest technology is HYDRAULIC FRACTURING... not so evil as CNN, BBC, France, and global warming progandists say. IT is a very simple process. First you drill a hole down to the shale, then once you reach the shale rock you drill horizontal for maximum surface area of the well hole... this is important in harvesting the gas and you will understand why after i'm done explaining. Now once the bores are drilled, you pump HYRDAULIC fluid... yes just like on machinery or on truck jacks... you pump that into the well hole and hope that you can fracture the shale, hence the name HYDRAULIC FRACTURING. It functions on the same principle as a truck jack or heavy machinery... hyrdaulic fluid being pump and forced into a cylinder to lift extreme amounts of weight... well instead of lifting weight, the fluid is forced into the shale causing a pressure build up great enough to crack the rock and then release the gas which can be harvested. I know this is gonna make some people mad... the truth has a tendency of making people mad.

IF you don't believe me, look it up on wikipedia or a nuetral source such as a respected encylclopedia, but dont trust what the news or news paper tells you, don't trust what your energy deparment tells you because they are all in the pockets of politicians who wants to pursue their own interests. Poland has 5.3 trillion cubic meters of shales gas that can be extracted right now as we speak... this will bring Poland into superpower status, it won't have to rely on Russia or other imports.. plus this will create jobs for Poles and bring in revenue from leases as well as jobs for Poles and others who come to work on the wells which will boost Polish economy. This is a blessing from God I believe.
AussieSheila  
29 May 2011 /  #128
Physical fracturing is not the problem, its the chemicals used in the fluid that is the problem because they pollute ground water and contaminate the soil and water supplies in many places. Even if Poland poses all of the world's oil, it will never be a superpower. It will only be a gas rich country just like many arab countries with little or no influence over the world except on gas price.
1jola  
29 May 2011 /  #129
this will bring Poland into superpower status

You must not be familiar with Poland at all. It can make a few well connected, ex-communist "businessmen" into the oligarch status, but you're right, some poor worker will make a decent wage for a while.

This is a blessing from God I believe.

Unless God loves corruption, theft, and ex-communists and their well placed heirs, this is not a blessing.

A little reading for you:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confessions_of_an_Economic_Hit_Man
Maaarysia  
29 May 2011 /  #130
Even if Poland poses all of the world's oil

Lol. We are talking about natural gas (methan) not oil!
rozumiemnic  
29 May 2011 /  #131
IF you don't believe me, look it up on wikipedia

classic...

this will bring Poland into superpower status

yeh right.......

This is a blessing from God

*sighs*
nic30  
29 May 2011 /  #132
Physical... ...price

Oh no! A clever woman. I'm getting out of here!

Exxonmobil and Chevron want that gas at least to get it out so Obama must do all he can to make it happen. Unlike Bush he won't fight you for it, just try to charm you out of mining it. Poland can enjoy its gas the way Canada enjoys its sand oil and Aussies enjoys its Gold. The financial stability of all the people will take presidence over the power weilded by an elect few, I'd hope.
spiritus  
2 Jun 2011 /  #133
A mining company on the UK coastline has been ordered to stop exploratory shale drilling as it might have caused a couple of small tremors in Northern England.........
Antek_Stalich  
2 Jun 2011 /  #134
The whole Black Upper Silesia is undermined and nobody makes fuss about that ;-)
JonnyM  
2 Jun 2011 /  #135
Physical fracturing is not the problem, its the chemicals used in the fluid that is the problem because they pollute ground water and contaminate the soil and water supplies in many places

Yes. This is true.

A mining company on the UK coastline has been ordered to stop exploratory shale drilling as it might have caused a couple of small tremors in Northern England.........

Not so small that they can be ignored. And this in an area with no previous seismic activity.

Shale gas is very bad news.
Antek_Stalich  
2 Jun 2011 /  #136
Yea, I can remember the Greenies blocking the construction of the A4 motorway. Cutting couple of trees meant committing a crime for them. They ignored the fact someone was killed by a car in neighboring Strzelce Opolskie everyday because of the lack of the motorway.

Something similar can be heard in your comment, Jonny.
JonnyM  
3 Jun 2011 /  #137
Not really. Nobody is being killed because Poland isn't pumping toxic and highly dangerous substances into the ground. If anything, there are statistically likely to be fatalities from increased mineral drilling - I work in that field and sadly know how dangerous drilling is. But that's going off on a tangent, rather like your post.

The dangers of shale fracking are well known - watch the film Gasland, it's a good laypersons' guide to this highly dangerous and unpleasant practice.
ItsAllAboutME  
3 Jun 2011 /  #138
here's what's going to happen, most likely, and I realize my prediction is as good as anyone else's:
- the 5.3 trillion cubic meters will not make Poland a superpower. It will help with not having to buy natural gas from Russia, so in that respect, it's good, it will reduce Russia's influence over Poland.

- there is little expertise in Poland in shale gas extraction, so Poland has to call on experts from the US, so you can already see large US energy companies getting involved, as well as the French. It means that while there will be some new jobs created for the local population, a lot of the profits will end up outside Poland.

- Poland's environmental regulations are pretty much non-existent, particularly with respect to the chemical mixture used for fracking. The dangers of fracking exist everywhere (locals near fracking sites reported being able to set their tap water on fire - and that's where tap water quality is supposedly closely monitored...), no point in pretending it will be any different for Poland. So to balance the few highly-connected individuals who will make a whole lot of money, a lot of regular folks will suffer from chemical contamination of their immediate environment and reduction in their property value.

The sad truth is, companies like Exxon and Chevron are extremely to start drilling far away from American backyards, where they can still make a lot of money and not be subjected to the consequences of negative public opinion.

It's a mixed blessing, just like the Gulf oil reserves, and I sincerely hope that someone in Poland will come up with a better way of bringing the gas up to the surface. This is where the real money is - technical innovation.
Antek_Stalich  
3 Jun 2011 /  #139
Poland's environmental regulations are pretty much non-existent

Tell me more and present some facts. In reality, Poland's environmental regulations are pretty strict and well defined.
An armchair opinion?

The sad truth is, companies like Exxon and Chevron are extremely to start drilling far away from American backyards, where they can still make a lot of money and not be subjected to the consequences of negative public opinion.

Yes, I have heard there are water-fuelled cars in US. As long as the water comes from the Mexican Gulf.
Harry  
3 Jun 2011 /  #140
An armchair opinion?

Just common-or-garden ignorance combined with stupidity.
JonnyM  
3 Jun 2011 /  #141
In reality, Poland's environmental regulations are pretty strict and well defined

And breakable.

The hard facts remain. Extraction of 'shale gas' is is a highly dangerous process involving pumping large amounts of toxic substances into the ground at very high pressure. Contamination of groundwater is but one of its problems. This is why some jurisdictions have banned it and more are discussing a ban. These facts are incontrovertible.
Harry  
3 Jun 2011 /  #142
And breakable.

All regulations are breakable, although allegedly breaking them can end up with a company being fined half a billion zloty.
JonnyM  
3 Jun 2011 /  #143
can end up with

Can - but we know very well that business works differently and always has. Only the inept get caught - only the very inept or very unlucky get brought to justice.

Fortunately the 'shale gas' idea is unlikely to come to much in Poland for a whole host of reasons.
delphiandomine  
3 Jun 2011 /  #144
this will bring Poland into superpower status, it won't have to rely on Russia or other imports.. plus this will create jobs for Poles and bring in revenue from leases as well as jobs for Poles and others who come to work on the wells which will boost Polish economy. This is a blessing from God I believe.

Of course, only a yank would say such things - anyone living here knows the opposite.
Antek_Stalich  
3 Jun 2011 /  #145
Let me disagree with you this time, Delphi. Speak for yourself.
Ironside  
3 Jun 2011 /  #146
anyone living here knows the opposite.

except for some idiots !
Gee, it first time I have agreed with delph !
good on you M !
Monia  
3 Jun 2011 /  #147
This is a blessing from God I believe.

Yes , it is and it will lower the costs of maintenance for an average household as winter season can really drain out people`s pockets especially those old ones . BTW old people in Poland are not sent to pensioners houses, but they live in their apartments or houses . In overall this will make our whole society wealthier . For example gas in Poland is so expensive that eg my heating bill for 1 month is 1500 zł to heat a house of 330 square meters , my brother who lives in Toronto in similar house pays just

100 $ - 300 zł which means 5 times less , thanks to atomic power plant in Scarborough located just 10 km away east of Toronto . It iritates me a lot!!!!!

Nobody in Toronto can hear outcries about any dangers of such plant located in such a short distance from a city .

Some critics exist but I suppose that they are sponsored by major companies for which shale gas extraction in Poland is a big market competition .

For Poland it may become a mile step towards becoming a world major economic player with its due place in worlds economy that Poland deserves .
Antek_Stalich  
3 Jun 2011 /  #148
Monia, I agree with you in practically all aspects. However, the price of natural gas will also depend on some more factors. First, investment cost needs to be depreciated and it takes at least several years. Secondly, the price of fuel is mainly depending on the taxes Government will apply. For example, petrol is not that expensive you know. The most of the price is made of taxes.

Just drifting away a little: Commercial drinkable alcohol is very cheap. Taxes in Poland make it 21 zloties (US$7) per half litre vodka bottle. What is it however compared to tens of dollars paid for same in US? ;-)
Monia  
3 Jun 2011 /  #149
Antek , I am deeply aware of that pricing procedures ( the state has to impose taxes to pay for its budget expeditures ) , which doesn`t mean that these costs will get lower in time . Maybe I will live up to such times :).
Antek_Stalich  
3 Jun 2011 /  #150
I'm with you, Monia. My winter heating with natural gas is way too expensive.

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