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Why do Poles come to England?


Slawek076 - | 81  
4 Nov 2009 /  #271
Mister H

What's about people who has worked here for over couple years? Like me 4 years now. Do you think I still shouldn't have access to your benefits if i need them, schools and health care? It's said now that if you're longer than 12mths you will get basics ( health care, benefith, housing and edu) like british people, but before that time you won't. So, what's wrong with it?
laddy - | 22  
4 Nov 2009 /  #272
Slawek076
do you believe that your are entitled to the same benefits as some one who has paid for 20 years into the system?
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
4 Nov 2009 /  #273
Do you not?

Lets face it, the idea that Poles are going to make there millions and return to Poland is not happening, so the majority of these people are there for the rest of their lives.

Contributing, working and paying taxes.
So they must get NHS and education.
Or the next generation, if they survive, will be uneducated halfwits.
Mister H 11 | 761  
4 Nov 2009 /  #274
What's about people who has worked here for over couple years? Like me 4 years now. Do you think I still shouldn't have access to your benefits if i need them, schools and health care? It's said now that if you're longer than 12mths you will get basics ( health care, benefith, housing and edu) like british people, but before that time you won't. So, what's wrong with it?

Sorry but I don't think a year is long enough. It isn't exactly fair on those that have paid in for all of their lives is it ?

Lets face it, the idea that Poles are going to make there millions and return to Poland is not happening, so the majority of these people are there for the rest of their lives.

Then they should apply for British citizenship if they plan to stay here forever. It's what many non-EU immigrants end up doing.
Slawek076 - | 81  
4 Nov 2009 /  #275
the idea that Poles are going to make there millions and return to Poland is not happening

Don't worry about it they won't. As I said before, we work here, we would like to live here for the rest of life because we hope you will accept us like your own citizens. If you agree for diabolic plans we will get back to Poland because better is to be a little less rich but not to be a slave. Next thing is if you count all central europe people who works here it's milions count them by their goods and savings here and you will get nice sum of cash they can take out from here to their origin countries and your economy may be in trouble, big trouble. The sword is edged on both sides. Pure logic. As I said we can make it together but not alone
derek trotter 10 | 203  
4 Nov 2009 /  #276
What's about people who has worked here for over couple years? Like me 4 years now.

Sorry but I don't think a year is long enough. It isn't exactly fair on those that have paid in for all of their lives is it ?

sorry smart arse but this is not the answer
what about people working legally for over 4-5 years? are they entitled or not?
stick your ideas up your arse and let deal with it somebody more mature and responsible.
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
4 Nov 2009 /  #277
Then they should apply for British citizenship if they plan to stay here forever.

What would that change?
Can they not keep their cultural identity?
I fail to see what that has to do with anything, to be honest.

Don't worry about it they won't.

I know, I am just following the proposal put forward.

we hope you will accept us like your own citizens.

I'm Irish and live in Poland :)

If you agree for diabolic plans

I don't.

Pure logic.

Polish people were invited to Ireland and the U.K to work.
The credit crunch happened, no fault of the immigrants and now that things aren't going well, thank you very much, there's the airport.

It's a two faced thing to do.
Mister H 11 | 761  
4 Nov 2009 /  #278
sorry smart arse but this is not the answer
what about people working legally for over 4-5 years? are they entitled or not?

What about them ? You could apply for British citizenship if you want to be entitled to the same as a British person.

stick your ideas up your arse and let deal with it somebody more mature and responsible.

What a charming and mature response.
Slawek076 - | 81  
4 Nov 2009 /  #279
sorry smart arse but this is not the answer
what about people working legally for over 4-5 years? are they entitled or not?
stick your ideas up your arse and let deal with it somebody more mature and responsible.

You mean doing slaves hiding facts about it. I think it's slowly happening...but there's one thing you may overcalculate :)

Don't worry about it they won't. As I said before, we work here, we would like to live here for the rest of life because we hope you will accept us like your own citizens. If you agree for diabolic plans we will get back to Poland because better is to be a little less rich but not to be a slave. Next thing is if you count all central europe people who works here it's milions count them by their goods and savings here and you will get nice sum of cash they can take out from here to their origin countries and your economy may be in trouble, big trouble. The sword is edged on both sides. Pure logic. As I said we can make it together but not alone

SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
4 Nov 2009 /  #280
You mean doing slaves hiding facts about it.

I mean you can't invite people to work for you and when things go wrong (credit crunch) and it is not the fault of the employee, you can't just sack them. Unfair dismissal.

And yes it would turn them into slaves, untouchables, second class citizens.

I think it's slowly happening..

This same argument in England is from before my grandfather's time.

but there's one thing you may overcalculate :)

cash they can take out from here to their origin countries

I don't see that happening, purely because the diabolical plan is a human rights violation.
(within the E.U. to another E.U. member)
Slawek076 - | 81  
4 Nov 2009 /  #281
Seam Beam it wasn't to you...lol...i definitely agree with you...this was to Derek Trotter. I'm a little lost with these quotes :) -------You mean doing slaves hiding facts about it. I think it's slowly happening...but there's one thing you may overcalculate :)-------
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
4 Nov 2009 /  #282
it wasn't to you...lol..

:)
derek trotter 10 | 203  
4 Nov 2009 /  #283
Slawek067:
Don't worry about it they won't. As I said before, we work here, we would like to live here for the rest of life because we hope you will accept us like your own citizens. If you agree for diabolic plans we will get back to Poland because better is to be a little less rich but not to be a slave. Next thing is if you count all central europe people who works here it's milions count them by their goods and savings here and you will get nice sum of cash they can take out from here to their origin countries and your economy may be in trouble, big trouble. The sword is edged on both sides. Pure logic. As I said we can make it together but not alone

sorry if you wanna be British its your choice. People wander around EU, getting jobs and are entitled to every form of social security if they follow requirements, nobody force you to be French Spanish or whoever.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
4 Nov 2009 /  #284
I think it depends on the claiming period and also how responsible the immigrant was in procuring employment before his arrival. I've heard stories about some who just went across without a sound knowledge of the job application process (went in blind) and such types are neither in tandem/tow with legislation or sense. The new EU Directive expressly states that they should have taken reasonable steps to find work in their home country before leaving for pastures new. Getting a job is a job in itself so such people shouldn't be able to rely on benefits through their own foolishness. However, for those that went across with a job waiting for them and were the victims of external forces such as the crisis in their sector (thus losing their job) then that's different. I'm not prepared to say tough tit*ies in that case. I believe they should be entitled to benefits an an interim measure.

We need to be specific about the type of benefit as the nature of benefits is important. Some benefits are more important than others. I don't think imposing arbitrary time frames for all benefits is helpful. Obviously, we need a time frame as a consensus so that there is no preferential treatment (for individual benefits).

Let's take my situation as a guide. My benefit entitlement depends on my contract type. The length of time is not a material factor here. If I worked an 'o dzieƂo' contract or 'zlecenie' one for 10 years, I don't think I would be entitled to any benefits here. This is based on not making ZUS contributions. So, it is contribution based. In the modern EU, there should be more of an even playing field. If benefits are hard to get here, they shouldn't be that easier to get back home either.
derek trotter 10 | 203  
4 Nov 2009 /  #285
If benefits are hard to get here, they shouldn't be that easier to get back home either.

I agree 100% with it.
The problem is with Poland right now because she can't really support its own people, even after 20 years of so called transformation. It is not our fault but direct result or Yaltan agreements. Thats why Poland still suffer and this is the reason why so many Poles, particularly young ones looking for a better future in Europe. Problem with UK and Ireland is simple, most Poles want to go there cos the language they learn could be a potential gain for everyone cos whole world communicate in Engleze, thats why people prefer to go over there and not to Sweden, Norway, France or even Netherlands. Germany is different story and everybody know why it is not the best option, even now in era of peace and smile faces at each other.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
4 Nov 2009 /  #286
I agree, trotter. Stare decisis (standing by your decisions) is important. The underpinning rationale behind Tehran and Yalta was to keep the option of a future enemy open whilst appearing to reach a noble agreement. Poland suffered as a result. It wasn't long before a stand was taken against communism and the Cold War started. Poland was just a pawn to be shuffled and that was wrong.

However, Poland has discovered a newfound high level of GDP. If Tusk doesn't squander cash then there should be enough to go round. This money must go on the infrastructure of the country such as roads but Poland is being assisted through EU funds too.

Another point worth mentioning is Poland has never been a benefits culture as we know it in Britain, especially to foreigners. We cannot expect an overnight transition, simply a move towards a level playing field.
ShelleyS 14 | 2,893  
4 Nov 2009 /  #287
just like animals, food and work... NO THANK YOU, MONEY IS NOT EVERYT5HING AND YOU CAN NOT BUY EVERYTHING FOR IT! IF IT'S YOUR VISION OF THE FUTURE OF EU GOOD LUCK AND PLEASE JOIN YOUR NATIONAL PARTY BODIES TO SUPPORT THEM IN WISE DECISIONS HOW TO CREATE SLAVES IN FUTURE EUROPE. ONE ADVICE, IF SOMETHING LIKE THIS WOULD BECOME REAL IN THE FUTURE, BE SURE 100% THAT ALL POLISH AND OTHER CENTRAL EUROPE CITIZENS WILL TAKE THEIR MONEY AND GOODS BACK WITH THEM AND YOU WILL BE IN NICE MESS WITHOUT THEM.

My cousin lives in Dubia, she has a maid, her son goes to private school..they pay "tourist" tax, her husband is a director of a large Engineering company..I wouldnt consider them slaves, quite the oposite.

You are creating a class of people who contribute but are not 'allowed' to be educated and if they get sick are not on the NHS and what die?

They wouldnt be paying NI or hardly any Tax, they could aford private insurance and pay for their kids to go to school. As Ive stated, my cousin lives in a country where she has to do this, its her choice to be there.

Polish people were invited

Who invited them? Look dont get me wrong, I have nothing against Polish people but to say they were "invited" is a bit strong Sean...they came because the boarders were open..no one extended them an invitation..

So no one liked my plan then? :D

Look it was purely an idea to stop people whining on about who Poles clog up the hospitals and schools..Take the problem away and people stop complaining...it works quite well in the UAE.
gumishu 11 | 5,993  
4 Nov 2009 /  #288
Look it was purely an idea to stop people whining on about who Poles clog up the hospitals and schools..Take the problem away and people stop complaining...it works quite well in the UAE.

it actually is not as bad an idea
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
4 Nov 2009 /  #289
Hardly any tax, Shelley? Tax is regulated by brackets. How can you tamper with that? Besides, it will look pretty bad for Britain when Obama has opted for a social medicine system and then we are seen to be abandoning Aneurin Bevan's vision even more by forcing private insurance schemes on people. Education is a right and not an exclusive privelege. It's not Poland's or our (Scottish) fault that we are accustomed to free education and you guys down south have to pay for it ;0 ;) ;)

Many Poles were welcomed as they brought a whole new skillset to the table and tidied up important parts of the economy due to egotistical Brits not wanting to get their hands dirty or by 'lowering' themselves. At the higher rungs of the job ladder, dentists and doctors received golden handshakes and I can say that Poles with those skills were welcomed and warmly received in Scotland. I guess down south too.

Blame the globalists, Shelley. The Poles are just using their options. They were oppressed for so long under communism. This was an ideology attacked by the West but we did very little to break them out of it.
derek trotter 10 | 203  
4 Nov 2009 /  #290
it works quite well in the UAE.

yeah for sure it works, we should follow the way of UAE :) :) :)
dont even compare how societies work in two different dimensions
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
5 Nov 2009 /  #291
they could aford private insurance and pay for their kids to go to school.

Sure why does anyone on a minimum wage pay NI at all, sure they can all afford private insurance and private schools, can't they?

My cousin lives in Dubia, she has a maid, her son goes to private school..they pay "tourist" tax, her husband is a director of a large Engineering company..I wouldnt consider them slaves, quite the oposite.

it works quite well in the UAE.

For some.





Just google 'EAU slaves' and see for yourself what a Utopia you are planning.
UAE: Address Abuse of Migrant Workers
hrw.org/en/news/2006/03/28/uae-address-abuse-migrant-workers

Who invited them?

Your and my governments.

it actually is not as bad an idea

Oh yeah, it is a fantastic idea, for some.
ShelleyS 14 | 2,893  
5 Nov 2009 /  #292
Hardly any tax, Shelley? Tax is regulated by brackets. How can you tamper with that?

Quite easy Seanus, thats what we have tax codes for ;0)

I dont care about America, Im talking about foreigners in England. Education is a right for those who are citizens of that country not for those who tip up and expect it for free.....Im not down south either...Dont try and ruffle my feathers with comments like that!! How rude!! ;0)

dentists and doctors received golden handshakes and I can say that Poles with those skills were welcomed and warmly received in Scotland. I guess down south too.

Cant say Ive come across many..but Im sure they are doing a sterling job...Im sure they could aford private health care and education for their kids on the wages they get paid (remember low tax?)

Blame the globalists, Shelley. The Poles are just using their options. They were oppressed for so long under communism. This was an ideology attacked by the West but we did very little to break them out of it.

The cold war? Im blaming my government, not new members of the EU.

Still no takers for my excellent plan?

yeah for sure it works, we should follow the way of UAE :) :) :)
dont even compare how societies work in two different dimensions

It works for many...Just think how private health care would florish and all the new jobs it would creat? Just think of the new schools (private) who could employ teachers...

Dont certain foreigners have to have private health care in Poland? Are there not English speaking private schools in Poland?
derek trotter 10 | 203  
5 Nov 2009 /  #293
Are there not English speaking private schools in Poland?

nope, only English speaking schools are private in Poland, sorry a couple German ones also. Unfortunately no Polish private schools at the moment, but we are working on it.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
5 Nov 2009 /  #294
Tax codes are not subject to change that often. They wouldn't go with your proposal is what I meant :)

Well, I see your point. Educating is a part of raising your kid and how are teachers and education professionals going to get paid if everything is for free? True enough! Also, the change process occurred long ago in the NHS through CCT and General Management so I'm just a bleeding heart harping back to the good old fundamental ethos of the NHS. How does ruffling feathers feel? ;) ;) I'm a sheep, not a bird :)

I agree! I just wanted to say that they were/are welcomed but my ex gets 5 times more in England than she got here in Poland. She got 30,000 PLN a year in Poland as a dentist but gets around 30,000 pounds in the UK.

Blaming the government is the right way here. They have much to answer for.

I think non-EU nationals would need that, Shelley. I'm not aware of any foreigners here that need private medical insurance. I need the public one, ZUS. With my current contract set up, I have to pay it.
ShelleyS 14 | 2,893  
5 Nov 2009 /  #295
For some.

Im not even compairing Poles to Indians that paid hardly anything work in dangerous conditions...Im offering a solution, Polish people are quite well paid in a lot of areas in this country, they work as it has been pointed out as doctors and engineers and a whole host of other professions..Builders have a certain degree of respect in this country, we have a different mind-set.

Im talking about if the freebies were not on offer, there would be no scroungers, the lower paid wouldnt come, it would mean our own lazy b&stards would have to get off the dole and do the jobs..they have just passed a ruling with regards to women with kids..no more sitting at home until the kids turns 16!
Ironside 51 | 11,339  
5 Nov 2009 /  #296
How about Hitlers attitute to Poles, do you think he would have been satisfied with old territories returned? Surely you remember his attitude to Poles?

After Poles rejected his proposal - of become ally, and corridor compensated by Odessa and attack on Soviets - were the price!
Hitler wanted sort out first France (supported by Britain).
French and British guarantees had the effect that Poland become first meal on Hitlers menu!
French and British had no intension of military support Poland, they sacrificed Poland to buy for themselves one year for preparation to war.
It was cold blooded treason, but I don't blame British , I blame Polish government because they should foreseen it,(even if they knew what honor means).

I-S ( wonders whatever I-S offended in some way G-M)
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
5 Nov 2009 /  #297
Im offering a solution

I appreciate that, I just think that this particular solution can only lead to slavery.

Im talking about if the freebies were not on offer, there would be no scroungers, the lower paid wouldnt come, it would mean our own lazy b&stards would have to get off the dole and do the jobs..

This we can agree upon, just the method has to be worked out.

they have just passed a ruling with regards to women with kids..no more sitting at home until the kids turns 16!

16?? how the hell did you get such a law to begin with?
tornado2007 11 | 2,274  
5 Nov 2009 /  #298
ShelleyS
ShelleyS, its not just the lazy mums!!! Children actually in Poland have access to our benefits and benefits system through a family member who may be resident/working in the UK!!!! Its shocking if you ask me!!
SeanBM 35 | 5,808  
5 Nov 2009 /  #299
Children actually in Poland have access to our benefits and benefits system through a family member who may

???
Any links?
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
5 Nov 2009 /  #300
I can't find any links on that kind of thing. It just depends how much you buy into hearsay but if there is a loophole to be circumvented in a procedure, you bet your bottom dollar that a Pole can find it. Polak potrafi ;) ;)

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