I haved read alot over the past year about the Polish property market...mostly very positive stuff but when I browse the forums there is little info...infact every time someone starts a thread about Poland it seems the discussion goes off topic,usually concentrating on other countries which is becoming slightly worrying.
I am flying out to Poland in a month or so to look at some Polish property,with my girlfriend who is originally from Poland.
She has a house that her parents left her which she wants to sell and use as a down payment on an investment property there, I am also thinking of buying a property as we may return to live/marry there and it seems that buying now is a good time.
Perhaps some of you who have been there,who know the market,purchaced or looked into perchasing could offer some advice...I appreciate replies staying on topic...
where should we buy,why?
what should we buy,why?
is there money to be made buying and renovating an older city property?
how easy is it to obtain finance?
what should i be wary of,what are the pitfalls?
with so many options,and so many new huge new build apartment blocks being built where is the best rental and capital growth?
is parking essential in citys?
any decent estate agents you know of?
i know its alot but neither myself or my girlfriend can afford to mess this on up so your advice is appreciated.
you can make money on buying and selling an appartment, the price growth at the moment is madness, so you might even win some in a very short time. with a house prety much the same.
buying an old city property and renovating it can be a difficult thing to do because of adaministrative/paper work that goes with it. if you want to do that, you might step in a pile of sh... I wouldn't go this way.
anyway buying an old property in an old neighbourhood might be a mistake from starters.
finance shouldn't be a problem, nowadays you get it very quickly, but make the choice of a bank very carefully
parking: a garage is always a good idea, for the car protection rather than finding a place to park.
anyway, take what I wrote with a distance, I don't have much experience with it myself. I'm saying what I remember from my brother's experience with these things. He owns an appartement in Gdansk and now is building a house,
one more thing. if you plan to buy a property, hurry up. the prices in cities like Gdansk or Warsaw already reach the same level as in Brussels in the European Quartier - and that's expensive.
usually concentrating on other countries which is becoming slightly worrying.
dont worry blueberries its just me an wujek who dont like certain people and openly say about that-the rest of poles are ok as rest of the civilised world-politicly correct.mind you,i lived and worked with this people for 3 years so i think i have the right to express my opinion have i?
Why should you be scared ? Poland is a free country and here you can express all kinds of opinions - as long as they are based on facts - and that some people who want to undermine that rule as well as caouse problems aren`t being welcomed here is a different issue.
..You know here you aren`t being fined for comiting "thought crimes" and "speech crimes" like "homophobia" or "islamophobia" ..the media here aren`t using self censorship to hide varous events that are going on in our country.. ..the police here isn`t scared of being accused of being "racist".. ..noone here displaying the national flag in his own country can not be acused of "facism".. ..we also aren`t changing our history books to make our history fit into the politically correct sheme ..and noone here is affraid of nameing things by their real name ..unlike in some parts of Europe.
If you`re searching for a realestate offer - you`re going to find it here:
oferty.net/mieszkania/ mls.com.pl
or in any other MLS system - that one above contains offers only from a limited number of cities. Basicly every bigger city in Poland has an MLS system.
I agree with the anwsers given by glowa besides that, in the courent moment one of the best places to buy an appartment is Gdynia (it`s a part of 3City) cose it had been voted as the place to live in Poland - and when you`re asking about capital growth then the real estate prices are rising here very fast - ofcourse the best place for a real estate investment are the major cities as well as the Mazury region - however the prices are rising so fast that it would be advisable that you`d make your purchase as fast as possible.
If I can add my two bobs worth, UNLESS you are living in Poland, buying a property is not a good investment in poland, Poland is still a third world country, and the current property boom is the work of big business. ie banks and lending institution.
quoting glowa. one more thing. if you plan to buy a property, hurry up. the prices in cities like Gdansk or Warsaw already reach the same level as in Brussels in the European Quartier - and that's expensive
what utter nonsense comparing Gdansk to Brussels, when you compare earning from people from these countries. There is a unwriting law in poland, one price for non poles and one for locals.
Could someone explain to me how a person on 1500zl a month can afford to pay a morgage of 500000zl
The best option is if you wish to live in poland, purchase a property in the country and either do it up, or build yourself.
The prices of homes will crash faster than they are currently growing..
I agree with lef. It appears that the home prices in Poland are so high just because... in other countries the homes are expensive. But there\'s no other reasonable explanation - the Polish economy and wages of Poles contradict it.
Well, this idiot had already written a number of exacly the same questions (the numbers are only different)
Each time when someone writes that he wans to come here or settle here he`s writing some bullshit like "all the people who settled in Poland had died at an age of 50" ect.
It`s the Xth time he`s doing this - and I think this funny man from Australia ought to be finally banned.
Poles are following the herd. Prices of new homes between January and June 2006. The Pole's favorite saying: "You cannot look worse than your neighbour". IMO they are shooting themselves in their foot - in a few years only about 10% of the whole society will afford to buy a home... :(.
Poles have a nature of having a house than there neighbour, I don't know why, homes are being built bigger and bigger...Has any thought of the amount of money need for heating and maintenance.
Unless you belong to the government, mafia or big business, it will be very hard to live on the average earnings of 1400zl a month
Poles are following the herd. Prices of new homes between January and June 2006. The Pole's favorite saying: "You cannot look worse than your neighbour".
How about supply and demand ?
There are 123251 real estate offers in this service alone.
krn.pl
If someone`s selling those real estates and is offering the prices his offering - then there has to be someone who`s buying them.. it`s really quite simple..
Guy I have read with intrest your various offerings with regards to buying property in Poland,
glowa...my own research shows that what you wrote is spot on...thank you.Rafik, Wujek_Dobra_Rada,lef ,and names...again thank you for you insightfull and often entertaining predictions.
Perhaps I can shed some light on the Polish property market myself.
I come from a city Called Belfast in Northern Ireland.For over 800 years this part of the world has suffered due to ongoing political violence...bombs,shootings,etc.
The majority of our young people moved to australia,america and the uk, and as such we had what was know as \"the brain drain\"..although even our uneducated found well paying jobs on building sites around europe.
20 years ago house prices were extremly low...an average belfast home cost around 2000 euros and the average wage was also pretty low.
Now the average belfast home costs around 200,000 euro and rising.
In dublin you cannot buy a property within ten miles of the city center for less than 1 million when even 10 years ago it would have been 100,000.
You have to also remember that Ireland was also a very poor country...house prices are rising and people are buying...everyone i know who owns a property here is trying to...or already has bought a second home.
Poland is simply experiencing the same thing as Ireland did before it joined the eu...what Belfast experienced before the troubles ended and what every country including the united kingdom and america experienced.
Your young people leave becaues the want a better life and more money.
In 10 years you will not recognise Poland because the massive amount of money the eu will inject will make huge differences.As poland has a high standard of education and a work force is cheao many,many companies will invest there because it is cheap for them to do so.
As Poland stats to shake off its old world communist image many ,many People will travell there as tourists which will bring so much money you will not believe.
The children that are born today will be raised in a different Poland to the one you know and when they come to the age when they want to study and work they will stay in Poland.
In ten years time alot of the Polish who are overseas will come home, they will want to start families, businesses, buy property etc
There are so many people buying property now in pooland because they have some surpluss cash and cannot afford property in their home countries...
but remember...if you stay to long wherever you are you to may find that like them you are priced out of your home property market.
It`s since 1997 we`re getting all those really huge investments and our companies changed their strategies from a price-competetive approach to a quality-competetive approach. It`s since that time we`re reciving EU funds (though it`s only from this year that we can say that they are significant).
And when we`re talking about migration then it`s since the early 1990s that we`re seeing a large wave of comebacks cose it`s since that time the people who imigrated from here during the 1980s are returning back and setteling here.
It might take us a while untill we`re going to get as wealthy as Ireland - but we`re on that way qute fast for a country of our size - the situation here is developing so fast that with each year it`s difficoult for me, though I`m living here, to recognize my country.
This is part of Warsaw`s downtown now - from what you can see only the 3 skyscrapers on the right have existed 10 years ago: And this is only the beginning.
what utter nonsense comparing Gdansk to Brussels, when you compare earning from people from these countries.
take a magazine and see the prices. I'm not comparing the cities but the prices per square meeter. it so happens, that I've spend last week in Poland and checked the matter, since I'm myself interested in investing in an appart in Brussels. and I can tell you, the prices are simillar.
people's earnings have nothing to do with it. WTF?
glowa take a magazine and see the prices. I'm not comparing the cities but the prices per square meeter. it so happens, that I've spend last week in Poland and checked the matter, since I'm myself interested in investing in an appart in Brussels. and I can tell you, the prices are simillar.
people's earnings have nothing to do with it. WTF?
I here what you are saying, I probally agree that real estate in Warsaw/Krakow is worth looking into.. but keep in mind if you were forced to sell you may not recover what you have invested....in every country there are sought after locations which will always retain value. I don't believe homes in the country are worth investing in unless it is your full time residence.
A lot of poles have been brainwashed in thinking their homes are now worth a fortune, some are and most are not..
Bubbleberry a bit of advice let the buyer beware
Wujek_Dobra_Rada
This is part of Warsaw`s downtown now - from what you can see only the 3 skyscrapers on the right have existed 10 years ago:
Poland as compared to other countries has very little skyscrapers.
I carn't understand why poles use americans terms lik downtown let poland be poland and let poland be polish ....please don't be an american stooge.
Rafik....If you are buying a property to live in ,sure this will be good, but a property for investment and borrowing big money, I doubt it.
This bloke wujek whoever he is doesn't know what he is talking about, he has never been to a western type country, all he knows is what he reads in comics ie micky mouse, donald duck etc
The key to real estate is what my property might be worth in say 5 -10 years time and if somebody will be able to buy my property in that time. On current polish earnings that is the question.
Let`s just omit all of the trollish posts and continue the discussion from the point where it ended.
So let me remind you how the discussion looked like before it turned into a fest for trolles:
-----------------------
#2
these are all quite difficult questions,
where? i'd say "aim at big city".
you can make money on buying and selling an appartment, the price growth at the moment is madness, so you might even win some in a very short time. with a house prety much the same.
buying an old city property and renovating it can be a difficult thing to do because of adaministrative/paper work that goes with it. if you want to do that, you might step in a pile of sh... I wouldn't go this way.
anyway buying an old property in an old neighbourhood might be a mistake from starters.
finance shouldn't be a problem, nowadays you get it very quickly, but make the choice of a bank very carefully
parking: a garage is always a good idea, for the car protection rather than finding a place to park.
anyway, take what I wrote with a distance, I don't have much experience with it myself. I'm saying what I remember from my brother's experience with these things. He owns an appartement in Gdansk and now is building a house,
one more thing. if you plan to buy a property, hurry up. the prices in cities like Gdansk or Warsaw already reach the same level as in Brussels in the European Quartier - and that's expensive.
Why should you be scared ? Poland is a free country and here you can express all kinds of opinions - as long as they are based on facts - and that some people who want to undermine that rule as well as caouse problems aren`t being welcomed here is a different issue.
..You know here you aren`t being fined for comiting "thought crimes" and "speech crimes" like "homophobia" or "islamophobia" ..the media here aren`t using self censorship to hide varous events that are going on in our country.. ..the police here isn`t scared of being accused of being "racist".. ..noone here displaying the national flag in his own country can not be acused of "facism".. ..we also aren`t changing our history books to make our history fit into the politically correct sheme ..and noone here is affraid of nameing things by their real name ..unlike in some parts of Europe.
If you`re searching for a realestate offer - you`re going to find it here:
oferty.net/mieszkania mls.com.pl
or in any other MLS system - that one above contains offers only from a limited number of cities. Basicly every bigger city in Poland has an MLS system.
I agree with the anwsers given by glowa besides that, in the courent moment one of the best places to buy an appartment is Gdynia (it`s a part of 3City) cose it had been voted as the place to live in Poland - and when you`re asking about capital growth then the real estate prices are rising here very fast - ofcourse the best place for a real estate investment are the major cities as well as the Mazury region - however the prices are rising so fast that it would be advisable that you`d make your purchase as fast as possible.
From what country are you - if I may ask ? ------------------------------------------------------------- names
#15
Poles are following the herd. Prices of new homes between January and June 2006. The Pole's favorite saying: "You cannot look worse than your neighbour". IMO they are shooting themselves in their foot - in a few years only about 10% of the whole society will afford to buy a home... .
Quoting: names, Post #15 Poles are following the herd. Prices of new homes between January and June 2006. The Pole's favorite saying: "You cannot look worse than your neighbour". IMO they are shooting themselves in their foot - in a few years only about 10% of the whole society will afford to buy a home... .
How about supply and demand ?
There are 123251 real estate offers in this service alone.
krn.pl/[/url]
If someone`s selling those real estates and is offering the prices his offering - then there has to be someone who`s buying them.. it`s really quite simple..
Guy I have read with intrest your various offerings with regards to buying property in Poland,
glowa...my own research shows that what you wrote is spot on...thank you.Rafik, Wujek_Dobra_Rada,lef ,and names...again thank you for you insightfull and often entertaining predictions.
Perhaps I can shed some light on the Polish property market myself.
I come from a city Called Belfast in Northern Ireland.For over 800 years this part of the world has suffered due to ongoing political violence...bombs,shootings,etc.
The majority of our young people moved to australia,america and the uk, and as such we had what was know as \"the brain drain\"..although even our uneducated found well paying jobs on building sites around europe.
20 years ago house prices were extremly low...an average belfast home cost around 2000 euros and the average wage was also pretty low.
Now the average belfast home costs around 200,000 euro and rising.
In dublin you cannot buy a property within ten miles of the city center for less than 1 million when even 10 years ago it would have been 100,000.
You have to also remember that Ireland was also a very poor country...house prices are rising and people are buying...everyone i know who owns a property here is trying to...or already has bought a second home.
Poland is simply experiencing the same thing as Ireland did before it joined the eu...what Belfast experienced before the troubles ended and what every country including the united kingdom and america experienced.
Your young people leave becaues the want a better life and more money.
In 10 years you will not recognise Poland because the massive amount of money the eu will inject will make huge differences.As poland has a high standard of education and a work force is cheao many,many companies will invest there because it is cheap for them to do so.
As Poland stats to shake off its old world communist image many ,many People will travell there as tourists which will bring so much money you will not believe.
The children that are born today will be raised in a different Poland to the one you know and when they come to the age when they want to study and work they will stay in Poland.
In ten years time alot of the Polish who are overseas will come home, they will want to start families, businesses, buy property etc
There are so many people buying property now in pooland because they have some surpluss cash and cannot afford property in their home countries...
but remember...if you stay to long wherever you are you to may find that like them you are priced out of your home property market.
It`s since 1997 we`re getting all those really huge investments and our companies changed their strategies from a price-competetive approach to a quality-competetive approach. It`s since that time we`re reciving EU funds (though it`s only from this year that we can say that they are significant).
And when we`re talking about migration then it`s since the early 1990s that we`re seeing a large wave of comebacks cose it`s since that time the people who imigrated from here during the 1980s are returning back and setteling here.
It might take us a while untill we`re going to get as wealthy as Ireland - but we`re on that way qute fast for a country of our size - the situation here is developing so fast that with each year it`s difficoult for me, though I`m living here, to recognize my country.
This is part of Warsaw`s downtown now - from what you can see only the 3 skyscrapers on the right have existed 10 years ago:
And this is only the beginning. ----------------------------------------------------
The answers for all of the idiotic questions and "opinions" is already contained in what has been said above.
well when i spoke to my ex employer 3 years ago(indian guy who made a fortune from buing and selling properties)he said that he was going to buy a big property in krakow(tenement house)-if such a person thinks that poland is a good country to invest money i would belive him.if i remember properly at this time he already bought a few properties in dubai so he is not just a common investor.
This bloke wujek whoever he is doesn't know what he is talking about, he has never been to a western type country, all he knows is what he reads in comics ie micky mouse, donald duck etc
i doubt it somehow
The key to real estate is what my property might be worth in say 5 -10 years time and if somebody will be able to buy my property in that time. On current polish earnings that is the question.
Polish earnings are rising and i can not see them stop rising as so many skilled people are heading west.the unemployment rate is 16% now(compared to over 20%a few years ago) and still falling.in 5 10 years time the people who work overseas will start coming back and pumping their money into our system.once there will be a good infrastructure(airports and especially highways!)poland will develop even faster.Poland and ukraine stand a very good chance to organise euro champs in 2012 if we do the necessary changes will be imposed even faster.lef i respect your point of view but let me not agree with you.i am an optimist but only when time gone past we would see who was right.my only concern is the goverment we have now but even though i think they can't screw it up
Location, Location, location is the key to any real estate purchases, if you buy in the right location you will never go wrong. I make the point that real estate in poland is a baby and is heading in an unknown direction, it may go up, it may stabilise, it may bottom out... there is a cycle in real estate growth and it depends what is the flavour of the month for investors and investment funds, at the moment here shares seem to be the flavour of the months.
It is unknown (I think) if the poilish government will introduce capital gains tax which will put a damper on this type of iinvestment.
I stress and make the following point again, It does not help the average pole when real estate goes thru the roof as it puts them out of the property market.
Years ago poles would purchase a block of land and build when funds were available and were relative debt free. now to access real estate they will have to borrow money and be at the mercy of the banks.
Interest rates are pretty low at the moment but they too rise, and I recall a time when interest rates here were 13% How much can a average worker borrow and still maintain a good lifestyle. The big change will be poles will be living in homes owned by the banks whereas previously they were self owned.
Increase health and petrol prices do not help the situation.
It is good to discuss all angles to a arguement... it is good to have a devils advocate:)
Most people who leave Poland for a considerable amount of time rarely return to live pernamently in poland.
