History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

And please explain to me what was so strange in this man's behaviour (or other people who traded foreign currencies illegally).
It was a simple free market mechanism, where you buy and sell goods (including foreign currencies) at their real market value, the official exchange rates were ridiculous (the State used to pay several times less for a dollar than it was really worth, while buying from them at the same prices was really difficult), so those "cinkciarze" were necessary both for foreigners, who wanted to spend their cash and for the Poles who could afford something more than most people, but didn't have access to the foreign currencies reserves, controlled by the communist party's regime, or for those who for example sold a flat/house and had to convert their money to some stable currency otherwise they would lose half of the money within a year, because of 100% inflation.

I know this whole trade was illegal, but so were many other things in the Eastern Block, it was just another means of oppression.

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]


Actually both reasons,
Collective farming wasn't a big success in Poland, so the state allowed the peasants to keep their land, but buying more was difficult, in the 50's if you had too many land you were labelled a "kułak" (I don't even know what this name meant) and persecutions could start, that's why most people just sticked for years to their small farms. When the old died, their children often divided the land and thus the farms became even smaller.

With the food shortages during the communist era, the peasants couldn't simply produce one thing (vegetable/corn/animals), because they were much better off cultivating a little bit of everything, for their own needs, and the surplus went for sale. That's why this tradition remained even after the communism fell. Of course nowadays there are more bigger farms specialized in producing just one one thing, but it's a slow process.

And the shape of the fields (narrow strips) is reflecting the typical look of a Polish village: one long road with houses close to each other (often on both sides of the road), and the relativy long fields behind the house, which width is equal to the width of the houseyard.

Genealogy / Polish Roots: Doda or Roda [14]

the stats on Polish surnames on wikipedia - they refer the original sources, if you don't trust them, you may check some of their sources, if you really want to go deep into the subject :)

News / How does Poland imagine other countries see her? [84]

I did understand your question, the things people believe about other countries, or the way they perceive other countries are more or less stereotypes (not generalizations like "_All_ Irish people are alcoholics", but rather "Irish people drink lots of beer and whiskey"). Mind-boggling because you asked about stereotypes to the second power ("stereotypes squared"), IMHO :)

News / How does Poland imagine other countries see her? [84]

dannyboy, I think you went overboard this time, you want to know Polish people stereotypes about other Europeans stereotypes of Poland? Mind-boggling

Genealogy / When did Poles adopt surnames? [27]

Polish surnames started in the Middle Ages, they were usually derivated from nicknames or some other characteristics (like father's name), but they weren't hereditary (many of them were given from the father onto the son, but the process wasn't the only possible way or creating surnames). The obligation of inheriting father's surname was introduced only in the 19th century.

Genealogy / Polish Roots: Doda or Roda [14]

There are several main sources (like in other languages) for surnames. Geographic/toponymic ones are (according to wikipedia, but I guess it's taken from some official statistics) the seventh most popular group (8,2%)

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polskie_nazwiska#Podzia.C5.82_nazwisk_ze_wzgl.C4.99du_na_tre.C5.9B.C4.87_zawart.C4.85_w_rdzeniu

Goda - still no idea, but according to those statistics ~6% of the names are foreign, ambiguous, general, hard to explain, so you can't really eliminate any possibility (unless it's phonetically too strange for our language, but all of them, Doda, Goda or even Roda, are phonetically OK)

Law / Importing Alcohol Into Poland - any limits? [15]

only persons above the age of 17 can bring in/out alcohol/cigarettes

and from what I just found (on another forum, so I can't guarantee, but the other posters there seemed to agree):
1 litre of alcohol stronger than 22% Vol.
OR 2 litres of alcohol weaker than 22% Vol.
(or any combination that doesn't exceed the limit, for example 0,5 l strong alcohol + 1 l of weaker alcohol)

in addition you can bring in 2 l of wine (but not champagne of liquor wine, those fall under the above mentioned category of under 22% Vol. alcohols)

other limits regard tobacco (cigarettes, cigars), some cosmetics (50 g parfum, 250 ml eau de toilette, but also children can bring those) and prescription drugs (for own use only).

now if you come from European Union, you can import 10 litres of vodka

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

and my parents never realized what's going on, I sometimes believe they don't realize till now, they were just simple folks brought up in the country, they went to church and my mom had her "ksiazeczka partyjna" just like bunia's father, because she was a teacher and had to be a party memebr if she wanted to avoid complications (she started working in 1967), but I never heard a word of cummunist propaganda in my house (neither anti-communist), they just took the reality for granted, never did anything about chnaging it, I don't know if they thought about it all. One of my grandfathers was a semi-communist, he fought in Bataliony Chłopskie (guerilla movement of peasants during World War II), right after the war he got nominated a director of some smaller factory, went off scene after few years and turned back to farming. He never spoke about communism either, but he was going to church when he was old, and his son (my oncle) was he only person in the whole family interested at all in politics when I was young (he knew stuff that was not taught at school, like Ribbentoop-Molotow pact and the 17 September 1939 Russian invasion, the Katyn Massacre, the falsified elections after the War, the persecutions in the 1950's and later etc.)

but I know there were many families where parents were fully aware of the farce they were leaving, they tried to educate their children to be good patriots. When I was in high school some of my mates or friends knew about the attrocities of the dictatorship, some didn't, but I never met a convinced communist child/teenager. So the division in Poland was rather conformists/non-conformists, not communists/anticommunists.

Travel / Place to stay in Bialystok and between Bialystok and Kazimierz Dolny [11]



Mel Brooks references:
imdb.com/title/tt0063462


it's the European bison (żubr), not buffalo, and be careful, my friend's teacher who once went to Puszcza Białowieska thought she was seeing a dummy, started approaching it to find it out - to her horror - that it was real :)

those beasts use to stand/lie without moving for long time like they were dead

Life / Postal Customs in Poland [17]

she should just call some customs office and ask what are the laws in this case

Genealogy / Polish Roots: Doda or Roda [14]

Dzierzgowski/Dzierzgowska - definitely legal names, there are 2 villages named Dzierzgów in my area, so the surnames derivated from this name is very likely (although I never met anybody with that name :)

I guess you probably know that the ending -i is for males, -a for females
no idea about Roda/Doda, sorry, the problem with short names is that every letter is important

lol, I knew she had it coming since the moment I saw the thread title :)

Life / Postal Customs in Poland [17]

"cło" means customs (as the amount of money you have to pay),
"odprawa celna" - I don't know the English term exactly, but it's when you declare you have/don't have anything subject to customs (or some other goods that need special documnets to brought in/out of the country)

did you send it from EU?

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

Polish Communist Party fought hard the Catholic Church basically in the 50's (they even imprisoned the head of the Church in Poland, Primate Stefan Wyszynski), but they basically failed (like they failed in another field of the so-called socialist "reforms" - nationalization of the agriculture, all those forms of collective farming - kolkhoz and sovkhoz - didn't have much success here, except for the territories that were German before the World War II, so they had no private owners after 1945), so later the persecutions of the Church were smaller (relatively of course, they still happened to murder a priest now and then, like famous Jerzy Popiełuszko in the 80's). Later on, the communists of lower relevance weren't forbidden to follow the traditional costums (strongly connected with the church), if they weren't manifesting their religiousness, they were allowed for example to have marriage at Church, to baptize their children and get other sacraments, to go to Church for Christmas and Easter.

And of course there were some convinced communist too, who rejected all forms of religion, but their views didn't appeal to the masses.


you know the saying "A good Indian is a dead Indian"?
(and I know it was origanally ""The only good Indians I ever saw were dead.")

About drugs, it's hard to say because borders were controlled quite effectively, so one may assume the import of drugs to Poland wasn't significative, but we had some home-made version of heroin, it was made from poppies, no reliable statistics on the use of drugs (as the dictatorships tend to manipulate the statistics at their will), besides they could easily put you in a psychiatric clinic for that, so you didn't see many people under the influence (of drugs, because drunk people were a completely different story) in the streets.

Some other questions of dannyboy:

- What sports were popular under communisim?
- footbal (or soccer as some wish to call it), boxing, athletics, cycling, volleyball, handball, weightlifting, fencing, tennis table and many others.
What is strange we had almost no swimming pools, so no good swimmers, tennis was considered too "western", so only good palyer was W. Fibak (in the 70's/80's), golf was virtually non existant.

- Were steroids widely available?
Probably, but only among the professional sportsmen, you must have heard how Eastern Germany and also Soviet Union mass produced their "supermen" to win the Olympic medals "for the glory of Party/Country". As much as I'd love to believe that Poland was clean, I can't be that naive, sure we couldn't match with the communist Germany, but I'm convinced the "brothers" helped us sometimes with "medical" supplies, we probably had our own production as well.

In the 90's Poland became one of the biggest producers of synthetic drugs (like amphetamine).

- Were guns widely available?
No. There were of course some guns availble from the World War II for a while, Later some "normal" people could have shotguns for hunting, but it was rare. There was also a small amount of pneumatic guns, but everything was under strict control of the police.

- A Russian guy I used to know absolutely hated standing in a group of people on a corner because during the communist times they would be beaten by police for doing this (different rules for Russia I assume), he didn't realise it was normal for people to have a conversation like this.

- Generally, there were rules about "public gathering", so if a certain number (I don't remember the limit) of people were simply standing together in the street, they could be considered as an "illegal manifestation", but in my city I din't experience the problem with police beating you for that (unless it really was an illegal manifestation, then they let the dogs lose - as dogs I mean "pigs") - There were also police forces (ZOMO) specialised in dealing with demonstrations, they were effective (beating you without leaving marks), and they could even beat you to death.

- What would be the singlest biggest and most visible difference between now and then?
I guess it's too hard to answer, for some people personal freedom is the most important thing (you can talk what you want without being afraid that government doesn't like, you can read books that were censored without risking persecutions, you can travel abroad, as a tourist if you can afford it or to work, without waiting months for a passport and get your application rejected).

For other people economic changes are the most imprtant, no matter how far we are from the Western welfare, because under communism you couldn't just establish a company and have success, only small firms were allowed, and if some were making too much profit, the tax offices could destroy them in the blink of an eye.

And there's also social life, it's chaning too, some things to the better, some to the worse. And many other aspects, it really depends on what you value the most.

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

LOL, the excerpt is from a comedy called my life, seriously. I just tried to dramatize it a little, skipping the usual narratve parts so it's better to read, at least I hope so

Travel / How really cheap is in Poland? [37]


Just ask some specific prices (goods, services etc.) and it will be easier for us to answer.

for example (exchange rate British pound/Polish zloty: 1 GBP = 5,6 PLN approx.)
a 0,5 litre Polish beer (Żywiec, Tyskie, Lech)
- in a shop: 2,50-3,00 PLN
- in a pub (bar) 6-12 PLN (I guess some places may charge even more, but I haven't been in Kraków for a while)

- pizza 10-20 PLN (I guess?)
- tram/bus ticket ~3 PLN
- train ticket for about 80 kms ~14 PLN (or more for faster trains)

some other shop prices:
- bread 1,50-3 PLN
- tomatoes, bananas, oranges ~4-5 PLN/kg
- grapes ~8-12 PLN/kg
- apples ~2-3 PLN/kg
- orange juice 4 PLN (apple juice 3 PLN)
- Polish vodka 0,5 litre 20-30 PLN (of course there are some more expensive too)
- Finlandia vodka 0,7 litre ~50 PLN
- Italian dry red wine 0,7 litre - cheapest IGT, DOC ~20 PLN, cheapest DOCG ~30 PLN
- milk 1 litre ~2-2,50 PLN
- music CDs 30-80 PLN (usually the more popular the more expensive)
- films on DVDs 40-80 PLN, but if you want Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind or Kill Bill for example, you can find it for 15-20 PLN (just plain movie, no extras)

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

May 1989, the communism would crumble in few months, but THEY still don't know it, or are in denial.
I'm 19 yrs old, standing before the WKU (military commision deciding whether you fit in the Army), which I presented earlier with a written refusal to join the Army (I'm rather a pacifist person).

I have to answer some "standard" questions (and my answers are true, you don't want to lie, because, they do have their sources of information):

Q: Are there any priests or nuns in your family?
A: No
Q: Any family members living in the West?
A: No
Q: Is it a religion that doesn't allow you to do military service? Do you realize that the Catholic Church doesn't oppose to it?

A: Yes, I know, but I'm not a religious person at all, it's just my deep belief that you shouldn't kill other people or even learn how to do it.

Q: I know your family is religious and goes to church [that's one lady from the commission asking, who knows my family].
A: It's true about my family, not myself
(some other Q & A, I don't remember anymore)
Q: What would you do if Germans attacked Poland, wouldn't you defend it?
A: Which Germans, from Western Germany or those from Eastern?

And this answer, which wasn't an answer, almost ruined it for me, someone smiled, but one colonel got really furious, started shouting, because you could be a pacifist, but you still had to love your "comrades" from other Eastern Block countries

News / How Poles truly feel about their situation in Poland and being in EU? [76]

off topic


just read this sentence and you'll know where Michal used to get all his answers


Some were trying, indeed, some other were just conformists or people completely unaware of politics nor interested in it, but most people were simply forced to it, because every factory and school had presence lists checked, and who didn't appear at the parade would face annoying consequences, at work or at school. (That's why for example North Koreans have always almost 100% frequency at their elections).

There was an amount of Polish white-red flags and commie red flags, they were handed to you by the school principal, and everybody was praying to avoid them, especially those red. If you got one, you were trying to bully some teacher's pets into taking over from you, or worst case to exchange it for a white-red flag

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

Thanks :)
I just hope no-one jumps on my back and starts correcting "this wasn't like that, it was different in my family etc.", because I stick to the topic, personal MEMORIES, not facts, so I may be wrong sometimes, if my memory plays tricks on me :)

another thing:
you all heard about the empty Polish shops, looooong queues, but there were things you simply couldn't buy in shops, you had to go to the factory. For example loud speakers, you could normally get those cheap 40-50-60 Watts, but when my friend and I decided to go for a better sound 110 (or 120) W, we had to travel 200 km, to Września (near Poznan) to the Tonsil (the only Polish porducer of speakers at that time) company's factory shop and buy them there, and they were selling only one set per person. Some people travelled to the producers' shop to buy tiles for bathroom, other to buy a water closet (if they wanted something nicer than available in shops).

Food / [Quiz] And you thought you knew Polish cuisine? (in Polish language) [27]

darn, I shoud have googled too

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

Polish labels used to buy licences only for a few western albums a year, and the Polish anti-establishment bands had many troubles with their recordings, some of them had to wait for years till their first albums were published, some never made it, because they were singing about things not to the liking of the government.

The books (like everything) were censored, many authors were banned, so they were published only in underground (there were several clandestine publishers in Poland and also the Polish emigration was printing books, for example the Kultura magazine in Paris, were many artists and some translators worked, those books were then smuggled to Poland and circulated among people you could trust). Geroge Orwell's Animal Farm published officially in the late 80's was a huge success, because all those anti-utopian authors (namely Orwell with his 1984 and for example A.Huxley's for his Brave New World) were considered to be totally anti-communist and were blacklisted for decades.

I remember standing in a queue for all night when I was 16, because my uncle needed coal (for heating) and you had to start waiting about 2 days before the delivery to shop.

I remember once I gave some chocaltes and a banana to my mom for Xmas, because I was in another city and I could buy it standing only 1 hr in a queue (in my city you had to wait much more for bananas, so we basically never bought them).

The low crime was indeed a big plus, when I was 14 I went with a classmate to a concert 80 kms from my home, we travelled back at midnight with the last train and we weren't scared. In my city, 30,000 inhabints, but has a river and a cathedral :) I only heard of one murder and it was committed by a mentally disturbed guy who raped and killed a 16 yrs old girl. The whole town was shocked.

One of the worst things with very tragic consequences: People had a different view on property, almost all industry was state-owned, so it felt like it belonged to no-one, thus stealing something from your factory was "normal" and generally accepted, it almost wasn't regarded as stealing. People knew it wasn't good, but on the other hand they thought "everybody's doing it, why shouldn't I". I can understand that (from their perspective), but after the communism fell, it wasn't that easy to change this attitude, and so many years later we still got people here who steal for example rail tracks to sell the steel. Also deceiving is a big problem, after centuries under occupation (since 1795 till 1918, then 1939-45 and then communism), it became Polish second nature to act against any form of governments, because it was necessary, but things like this aren't so easiy to change, so many still don't feel bad about different forms of cheating (I read several times about American teachers coming to Poland, who were simply shocked by students cheating during classes, tests; that's how it's been for decades, and you can't lose those habits overnight).

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

oh, the cinema :)

some nice memories from the Dark Age:
American movies were pretty rare in the 80's, I remember only a few films:
Star Wars trilogy, Butch Cassidy ... and Enter the Dragon, which some people saw 10-20 times, if it was screened three times daily for a week, they'd go to see the movie three times daily for a week and Bruce Lee became a real cult figure.

in big cities there were students clubs which were allowed to show (but only to a limited audience) some more non-communist movies, they often got them directly from foreign embassies for just one screening.

In the mid-eighties a great Film Festival (Warsaw Film Festival) was started, every autumn you could see like 100-200 contemporary foreign movies (in 2 or 3 weeks, so noone was able to actually see them all), that's where I saw for example Jim Jarmusch's films for the first time in my life.

In the 60's (but that's not my personal experience) there was a certain Radio Luxembourg, which played rock'n'roll (Beatles etc.) and it was the only source of music for many Polish teenagers, I think the commies didn't disturb their signal since they probably didn't have much (or any) politics, so it wasn't considered a big threat. And the Rolling Stones played in Warsaw in 1967 or so (just one concert).

Even in the late 80's (and that is my personal experience) radio stations were the only source of music for Polish kids/youth, and had to register all on tape-recorders, because we didn't have a free market, so my mother's pay was 11$/month (she was a teacher) and father's 15$/month (an electrician), which was enough for living (or surviving) in Poland, but of course you couldn't afford to buy anything from the West with that kind of income and not go bankrupt.

But I miss the radio from those times,
They were several radio-jays (or DJ's or whatever you call them) who populrized some independent rock music, I really liked all those punk/new wave/goth bands and a small British label (4AD) was adored in Poland, I think Cocteau Twins, Dead Can Dance, Birthday Party, This Mortal Coil, Killing Joke, Dead Kennedys, Exploited had more fans here than anywhere else in the world. Nowadays (and this started soon after the fall of the Iron Curtain, the radio stations began to air mostly pop and then more meaningless pop and Spice Girls and boys-bands and Britney Spears) the radio in Poland is so terrible :(

Also we had a huge music festival in Jarocin, with punk, reggae, new wave bands from all over the country, which was an oasis of freedom, sex and drugs and rock'n'roll. The secret police was trying to infiltrate the festival, but I think they never succeeded. There were also smaller festivals (like Róbreggae and later Marchewka in Warsaw) and once or twice a year you could go and see some interesting and unique concerts (The Swans with their heavy, industrial sound and Michael Gira undressing on the scene was a big shock).

But all those things were so unique, that you can still remember them after 20 years, because you had to wait for months for some great events, it wasn't like in the West, where you can go to a gig every week and listen to some interesting music.

Normally we were fed with pop music, both Polish and foreign, and some Polish folklore in addition.

Food / [Quiz] And you thought you knew Polish cuisine? (in Polish language) [27]


I really doubt it, since even Polish people don't know those things, they wouldn't sell too well :)
of course oscypek is an exception, it's famous all other the country thanks to the people from Zakopnae selling it in all big cities of Poland

Also bliny and kołduny are familiar to many people, and I knew Szare kluski because for thirteen years, I lived in the area where they are from.

Life / Indian coming to Poland need details please [13]

I don't know the prices, but I guess Aleje Jerozolimskie should be a very expensive area for appartments, it's almost in the heart of Warsaw.

News / Poland in Schengen Group [16]

well, we're are already partially passport-free, I don't know about trips to UK, but you can travel on the continent with only your ID card, I guess it's not a big problem. But I travel by car, not sure if I'd need a passport for a flight. And border crossing isn't that slow either, you just show your ID/passport, and off you go, it takes 1-2 minutes in most cases

History / Memories of the Polish communist era [115]

I guess you require too much, giving us at least a 5,000 words assignment :)
For example I was 19 yrs old in 1989, how am I supposed to describe a half of my life, it would take a lot. Unless someone has his diaries from that era.

And mixed feelings in such cases are obvious. You were young, first kisses, first love, passionate discussions with friends, some great events (cultural, sports etc.), you had a life before you and lots of optimism despite the surrunding grey (or even darker) reality. So all that passion interfers in your memory with the political/economic/social conditions.

Now, trying to be as objective as possible, after almost 20 years, I may say it sucked, sometimes a little, sometimes badly. The social life wasn't that bad, in some periods even great, but it was a dictatorship, with all its consequences, especially for personal liberty, which turns out not so important for most people, who just want to be fed, given job, given their paycheck (no matter how lousy it's compared to the free economy countries), those people are the biggest part of the commie era eulogists, but I guess I'm simplifying the problem, so be patient, someone may elaborate, if you give them more time, I guess.

Travel / Wireless Internet connection in Poland [18]


hot spots (I guess you need Wi-Fi in your notebook/laptop):
Hotspot's name: ZamekNet-J1 Będzin
Będzin | ul. Grunwaldzka 7 | Hotel | e-mail:biuro(at)zamek(dot)net(dot)pl
paid net access
standard: WLAN (802.11b/g)

you can check other hot spots in the Katowice area (or any place in Poland) at: hot.spots.pl/eng/index.php

when you search for one, "County" refers to "Województwo" (and Bedzin is in "slaskie" County from the pop-up list)

other possbilities:
- net cafes (cyber cafes) usually called in Polish "kawiarenka internetowa" - they normally allow you to bring anything on a CD, usually also to install your own applications on their comps (in case you need a specific programs, but don't forget to uninstall them when finished), burn your CDs, I don't know about other portable drive types as I'm using only CDs/DVDs (CD-RWs are rather cheap). I once wanted to connect my notebook instead of using their PC, but the older lady didn't know how exactly we could do it, so I gave up, but if there are guys with an actual knowledge of the network systems, you may always try and ask if it's possible to use your own notebook. Prices vary, may charge 1$ to 3$/hour;


- "antiquated" phone modems are the last resort, as they charge way too much for a minute of a dial-up connection, their only advantage is that you most likely won't have to sing anything, just plug in, connect, disconnect, wait for the bill next month :)

- the pre-paid version is possible, but I'm not sure it's a good idea if you come there only for a month - it depends on the ISP (if it's Telekomunikacja Polska S.A. then your family would still have to sign a contract with them, and they have these nasty contracts where it says it becomes automatically prolongated, unless you state 30 days before you want to terminate it - just immagine: 4 years ago when I changed from pre-paid dial-up to broadband - all within the same Internet service provider - they still charged me for the next month of pre-paid though I didn't need it anymore. The Company is changing, but slowly, so they may still have these stupid regulations)

Language / Complete the saying in correct form and spelling? [9]

well, it would help a bit if you told us in what context/situations your granma was using it :)
but here's a rough guess: "tańcuje" which is (or rather was) a colloquial version of "tańczy" (which means "he/she dances/is dancing), the infitive form of the verb would be "tańcować" (instead of the correct "tańczyć" = "to dance")