Life / Problems for Dual Earner Families in Poland (and rest of EU) [19]


but if you are educating your child as you go, then it is being used, arguably, for one of the best purposes ...

Life / Problems for Dual Earner Families in Poland (and rest of EU) [19]


perfect ... if you can get it

Life / Problems for Dual Earner Families in Poland (and rest of EU) [19]

In a perfect world, with perfect people ... anything is possible.

But what you are really trying to say is ... do we think it is actually ok for the mama, who would normally have been at home looking after the babies and cleaning and cooking and looking forward to the return of the man in the evening, and turning her intelligence and energy to making the home nice for him and the meal enticing ... do we think it's ok that now she isn't there, the kids are with someone else (eg, in nurseries when they're less than a year old, catching all manner of bugs, crying and not having their nappies changed promptly) and everyone eats ready-meals and has to un-wind with a large glass of wine?

I had a very enlightened upbringing and education. Very Western, I guess. But ... sometimes I would like to live in the jungle and spend all day foraging for berries with my little daughter, and pointing out interesting creatures in the undergrowth, and lie together with her and just look at the sky, because we have time. Time is everything. I think it all moves too fast and we all try to do too much. I think there is immense value in bringing up your child yourself, rather than farming him/her out to God knows who for hours at a time. I think there is great satisfaction in being caring and looking after your home and loving your partner. I think there is a lot lot wrong with dashing out of the door at 7.45 and staggering back at 6.30 ...

But for a woman, being at home only works if the other party totally respects her input, and the fact that she could be ruling the City, but has chosen, out of love, to bake and make beds and iron and wipe runny noses and teach her/your children to speak and love and be decent people when they grow up. If even the slightest hint of disrespect enters in, the whole thing collapses into resentment and despair.

So is it ok for both parents to work full time? No, absolutely not.
Is it ok for the woman to stay at home? Yes, with conditions. And so long as she still gets time to read novels.

Thus spoke a highly-educated mother who would like to invest the time in educating her own daughter, pre-school.

Love / Help-my polish bf doesn't fancy me! [94]


you're right - and the poster needs to make sure that she hasn't started dressing down and making no effort because she thinks she is safe ... no no no ... important always to keep some element of mystery, and for there to be some things you say no on, and for him to see you across the street and think 'cool - she's actually mine!' ... just like making sure you polish the mercedes and don't leave macdonalds cartons in it ... we are possessions, after all, and if we want to be cherished, we need to take care of ourselves ; )

(crap, i know, but i fear true)

Language / Are there multiple meanings for "jestes kochany"? [9]

and sometimes you appreciate your own upbringing and culture more. and sometimes you reflect on it and think 'actually, that's not the best way to go'.

and sometimes you can be someone else - reinvent yourself - in that other language. and if everything goes wrong, at least you are left with the skill of being able to talk to all the cashiers in Tesco (polish) ... ; )

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]

or just text
darling you are so hot can't wait to suck yr c**k again today was amazing i love you so much and i was thinking can we honeymoon in the seychelles rather than hawaii?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


so what if you trust .. and then find out that your trust was misplaced? but by that point you love someone and have small children and a life with them?

things aren't always so simple as principles would suggest.

eg, i know a polish woman (so no, it isn't me), who has a 13 yr old daughter and a roving husband. she herself is very thin and worn down and although only 32 looks about 52. recently she lost her father to cancer. two months after that her young brother, 25, died in a car crash. his young wife and baby survived. while my friend was in poland at the funeral, her husband (in england) went out every day, and stayed out all night. he went out in a fresh white shirt and leather trousers, drenched in aftershave, so i think we can imagine what he was doing. oh, and he is also a drinker and a thief, and lost his job because of this, and she has been supporting the family. and when she came back, she found some text messages and discovered he was having an affair with her best friend.

now, is she to kick him out, and lose her home, her family (as the daughter would go with him, as adores her father), and be left all alone, trying to 'start' her life again? or does she live with it, make him sleep on the sofa for a few weeks, and still cook supper, look after her daughter, talk about what they're doing for christmas, and catch up with the elderly in-laws?

i'm sure everyone will say 'no, get rid of that bastard, kick him out, so what about the kid, she will be free, she will have her chance at life again, she will find someone who really loves her ...' - there are a lot of ifs in that. nothing solid. what she has now, while not ideal, is, at least, real.

i wouldn't presume to judge her for staying where she is. and i wouldn't presume to say that blind trust is the only, and best, way forward for anyone.

of course one should be able to trust, but sometimes one can't. and one might have to accept that and live with it .. one might, po prostu, take a view.

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


but does checking phones mean she doesn't trust? maybe she is just curious, in that tabloid-reading, eavesdropping kind of way, as to what you've been up to ... you have to admit, it is tempting.

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


me too ... and where everybody waited nicely, making gentle conversation, for the hostess to be seated before starting ... and where everybody offered everyone else the dish first before themselves ... and where indeed you had to say 'please may i get down?' if you want ed to leave (at the end, after pudding, when the adults were just talking).


'fraid so. and of course, having once taken all that 'please may i get down for granted', i do now slightly miss it : (

Language / Are there multiple meanings for "jestes kochany"? [9]


but it is an equivalent in meaning/usage ... these are the things i really like. these are the things you can only learn on the street, and not from a book.

that is why i like conducting my life in polish. always something new to observe, even when fighting/crying/regretting/fretting. much more interesting to do this in another language. every cloud has a silver lining ...

Love / HELP!! Need some advice about Polish guy at work. [26]


that is with polish girls. but you are irish. so he isn't on such familiar territory (yet ; ). so he is hanging back a little. so you have to open the door and make it easy for him at least to get over the threshold.


frankly have forgotten myself : )
from yorkshire.
but gone native in poland.


to be fair, most polish guys have at some point a beautiful polish gf, as most polish girls are pretty well turned-out. but quite a lot again treat those same dolls without the respect they deserve. and there are polish guys who find that cultural difference (there i go on that again) with other girls - eg, irish, english - intriguing and seductive. they think they might want a woman who thinks differently. and they are game to try it. we, i guess, are exotic for them. cool. we just aren't quite so good at the washing up ; )

so: maybe - and you have to face this - he split up with her and is still in love with her, or still having sex with her, or still arguing with her. but possibly he split up with her and you are the new and exotic one. you won't really know until you ask him round and have that back massage. actually, you won't really know until a few months down the line whether you were real or a fantasy. tough, but true.

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


yet again you are so right


again right. and maybe, to be fair on me, that is why i am now so aware - freshly aware - of cultural differences between whatever upbringing i may have had, and that of the poles around me (much as i love them). because i am now bringing up a daughter together with her polish daddy, only i feel like i am bringing her up on my own because all of the please, thank you, be nice, share, kiss night night, give that to daddy/whoever, be a helpful girl, etc. ... comes from me. and i don't see that input from him. i see swearing and too much tv and here have some chocolate/sugar/ketcup/coca cola and dawaj dupe.

ok. oops. now i see it. it's true - you're right again - it's down largely to individuals. probably. only i really don't see so much conscious behavioural shaping from the polish side - and not only her father is here, but her uncle, friends, and god father. a range of generations, a range of personalities. but one constant: the child can shout 'daj' and she gets it. with me, she has to say please, quietly. then maybe she gets it.

szwed, respect yr opinion. tell me what you think. is there not a cultural difference here? and you too, shelley.

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


yes, i think there is a lot more forgiving and forgetting in polish marriages ... which isn't always a bad thing, so long as respect is maintained.

Love / HELP!! Need some advice about Polish guy at work. [26]

i don't think even that should be necessary with a polish guy ... (boy am i giving them a good write-up here!! anyone would think i LIKE those b'stards!! ; )

Love / HELP!! Need some advice about Polish guy at work. [26]

frankly i don't think the porn will be necessary. just ask him round and he will take the opportunity. you won't have to force him ...

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


absolutely agree, and i did say i can now understand situations where cheating/lying seem the best option, for survival (and of course that is different to lying because you're having an affair - not survival then - stupid choice).

but a lot of polish men do have affairs. a lot. i think english men are too scared. they probably just use the internet instead of rocking the boat. another example of poles having more energy than brits ; )

Love / HELP!! Need some advice about Polish guy at work. [26]


but they are really good at massaging .. pity not to get a bit of that while they will still do it ... (as like all men you are likely to get more of that at the start of the relationship...).


yes, they are
and they have v nice bodies
and a good mental attitude towards sex
and are v good at cuddling afterwards, too

not that i've tried so many that i can give such a definitive judgement, i guess, but still ... they are usually highly-sexed, put it that way. and you said yourself he was cute. they are like teddy bears with hard-ons ... every girl's dream ; )

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]


I was actually talking about telling the truth/lying in general, and not about checking phones, but if you are offended, I am sorry. However, I stand by what I said. Having said that, I said it quite lightly and didn't go into the full case. As follows:

I can't speak for all British people, but I can speak for a solid middle-class upbringing and what was instilled into me at home, and at school (a private school, so I can't speak for state schools). I represent a particular English type and was effectively brought up on wartime values. I had the following regularly and very emphatically drilled into me, as did we all:

- You must always tell the truth.
- If you have done something wrong, you MUST own up. (eg, in the classroom - the whole class will be punished if the culprit doesn't own up, etc.)

- It is always better to tell the truth.
- There is nothing more repulsive than a liar.

Additionally, in exams, that a cheat was the lowest form of life, and that cheating was absolutely not on.

I was taught that certain things just weren't on - weren't acceptable. That decent people didn't behave like that.

I never gave it much thought until I started my adventures in Poland and Polishdom. First example: I was teaching a group of fantastic women in Poland in the 90s. They had to pass their First Cert in order to keep their jobs, as they were all teachers. I had known them about 6 months when we started doing mock exams. They were great people, and very serious about their English, so I thought it practically unnecessary to say at the start of the exam that of course there should be no cheating - but I still said it, as I had heard it so many times myself, that it was just the standard form. When they had finished the exam, I jokingly asked who had cheated. All those women, save one, put their hands up, laughing. I, being young and naive, almost fainted with shock. They had CHEATED? In an exam? And were teachers? And were laughing about it?

I am not saying they were bad people or did something wrong. In their culture, I learnt and observed, lying and cheating the system was an ingrained thing. You were EXPECTED to cheat. If you didn't cheat you were considered stupid. And in the circumstances in which they had been brought up, and their parents, indeed it would have been very foolish - life-threatening, even - to tell the bald truth all the time.

I learnt that of course there are situations where one has to deceive in order to survive, or to thrive. The 'everyone must tell the truth' rule only works if everyone does it ... that is why my parents and school were so adamant about it. And in Poland, people regularly lie and don't feel bad at all about it. In a certain stratum of English society, people rarely lie, and if they do, they feel bad. Of course, there are white lies (to save face, to save someone else's dignity), which aren't so bad, but there are other deceptions - such as cheating in an exam - that have a direct reflection on your intrinsic worth as a person. On your decency, or not.

Forgive me, but I suspect you probably haven't had enough exposure to English culture to know where I am coming from on this. Your one boyfriend is not enough of an example. How old is he? Where is he from? Etc. And the traditional British model of decency DOES have honesty as one of its cornerstones. And please don't tell me that you are taught to tell the truth in the same way in Poland, because that isn't true. I have observed for many years now, all sorts of people, in all sorts of situations. I understand why there is this tacit acceptance of the necessity for deception in some situations, but I feel it clash with my own upbringing. And the one thing I certainly do have authority to talk on is that.

So ... in conclusion, yes, sorry, I chucked out a comment without backing it up. And your English bf is jealous and checks your phone all the time. And if you watch 'Dad's Army', all the episodes, you might discern some of the values I'm trying to explain here. And they are very English, if not British. And Poles have a different culture.


exactly. as usual, southern, you have said more effectively in less than a sentence what i tried to say in 25 paragraphs ...

Language / Are there multiple meanings for "jestes kochany"? [9]

can it not also mean
'that was really sweet of you?'

obviously not a literal translation but from observation in context that is a frequent english equivalent

and it also can be translated as
'you are loved' (literal)
or 'you are really sweet/lovely' (effectively you are loved, being worthy of love)

whatever way you look at it, it's a good thing ...

Love / My Polish girlfriend checks my mobile phone all the time [70]

all girlfriends will always check your phone at some time or another, but english ones will be much slower about it - polish ones are practised and will do it from the outset. and if caught with it in their hand they will either swear blind they have never ever checked it or touched it or they will say yes of course you idiot what do you think you would be allowed a private life??!! get real.

the best way is not to try to change her - you won't. so delete absolutely every message, sent and received, and every call, made and received, asap. keep your phone totally clean. that will really fxxx her off but she won't be able to do anything about it. it will also keep her totally in the dark. i know you haven't anything to hide, but it is the principle.

or, if you have nothing to hide, just let her check it. but don't think you will stop her. even if she says she won't do it, she will. trust me. lying is ingrained in the polish culture, i'm afraid - and i will argue to the hilt with anyone on that one, because i have observed it over several years now and i know they mean nothing bad by it, but just have been brought up that if in doubt, you lie, rather than 'stupidly' telling the truth, like brits.

you can only win this one by not caring, and not having anything to hide.

Love / HELP!! Need some advice about Polish guy at work. [26]

irish_girl88
certainly invite him round. watch a film with him. mention how long it is since you had a back massage ... polish guys ARE cute, and even cuter in the sack, trust me.

Love / Do not marry Polish woman [212]


agree. it is a barrier to spiritual connection (i would have thought).


one of the most sensible observations ever. i see you are perspicacious, seanus. and offer other qualities as well. pity you already have a regular sexual outlet.


weighty for a saturday morning but yes, you are right. will be impressing this, with the help of a chastity belt, on my daughter ...

Love / Do not marry Polish woman [212]

oh, don't be so daft - are you honestly saying you thought i meant it was only worth talking to a guy once you had checked his bank balance? of course not. but i did use to think that money, etc., didn't matter - and now i know i was WRONG. it does. impossible to deny that in our world. especially if you have two children who you love very much and want the best for (and i don't mean things like fast cars and lots of toys - i mean education, a room of their own, mind-broadening experiences, a stable, gentle, life - these things all cost money - and it is exhausting for only one of the partnership to provide that, along with the physical nurturing of the child - come off it - in your bonkers world, what exactly does the man do, then?)



Nathan - brak slow. You clearly have problems. I'm sorry for you, genuinely. Nobody said anything about my having a fat ass or wanting to sit at home all day ... I simply pointed out that in evolutionary terms, one does better as a woman if one has a strong, virile male who is able to provide for the female and young when they are both vulnerable and unable to do so for themselves. And fyi, sex when you are pregnant, as a woman, can be particularly nice as nobody is worrying about you getting pregnant, as you already are. But I won't bore you with my views on the importance of a healthy, loving sex life. That would presumably translate as my being a (life)-sucking whoe.


Gunslinger44, thank you. I love you. You understand what I was trying to say.


Yes, please pick me up on it ... I know ... but I did have something of a point, even if it is more complicated than that. And where people quell their instincts they can end up living very unhappy lives. (also, of course, they can where they allow their instincts to dominate and disrupt - but the point is that the instincts are there, and deserve recognition and understanding).

And the overall point was that perhaps we should not be so hard on Polish women ... they are only following their instincts, and are more up-front about it that other women. And, possibly, they will be happier and more satisfied for it ...

Love / Do not marry Polish woman [212]

not sure if you realise but it is possible to be both intelligent and blonde ... wow ... what a package ...

Love / Do not marry Polish woman [212]

Am not a geneticist and know nothing about it ... just know that intelligence, however sharp, can be dulled and circumvented by the instinct to procreate. Crazy. Nature. And thus intelligent women all over the world dress in their underwear and dance around poles/Poles ...

Love / Personal issues with two women, they want to be my friend - a Polish thing? [49]


it is. they want a rich older boyfriend who will do all sorts of useful things for them, and make them feel looked after, and buy them presents. they don't want to waste themselves on sexy younger guys who will just use and abuse them, treat them mean (not to keep them keen - just because they can't be bothered to treat them nicely), and be unfaithful to them, regardless of how beautiful or lovely or devoted the girls are. They have learnt, either by observation, or the hard way, that a guy who considers himself v lucky to be with a girl treats her better, much better, than a young buck who thinks he's doing her a favour. I'm sure there's something personal about it, too - you must be a nice guy, and attractive. What you have found a pleasant surprise, i guess, is that your age is in their eyes an advantage.

enjoy : )

Love / Polish girls lying [193]

because he didn't feed them? or because they wanted to stay thin?

Love / Polish girls lying [193]

yes, they are hard as nails. so you must never ever let yr heart go soft with them. they will reduce you to their slave.


as OsiedleRuda knows ...
so are you still with them? how many wives did you have?

Love / Do not marry Polish woman [212]


? don't, actually, as live with 4 men, but hey.
and doesn't anyone just express their opinions here, rather than that of their whole sex? i wouldn't presume to speak for the rest of the world.

it was a bit of a joke, tornado. not sure if you realised that.


and i'm the only one on here that does that, right? : )


i guess my mind must have been clouded by too much exceptional quality sperm ; )
(darn it, they manage to wriggle everywhere)

Love / Help-my polish bf doesn't fancy me! [94]


would hope for no leakage.


don't worry - wouldn't give you a ford fiesta for your birthday