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Posts by vetala  

Joined: 10 Jul 2009 / Female ♀
Last Post: 22 Feb 2011
Threads: -
Posts: Total: 381 / In This Archive: 86

Speaks Polish?: yes

Displayed posts: 86 / page 1 of 3
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vetala   
10 Jul 2009
News / 14 year old rape victim from Warsaw denied abortion! [348]

I can certainly understand abortion in rape cases, or the woman's life is in danger. Those whose condom blew up, whose pills are seriously on the wrong side of the expiry date, or who had one too many and exercised an incorrect judgment are a different story.

And here's where your logic ends and your morals become double standards...
Since you already decided that fetuses are humans, what makes a fetus created throuth rape less worthy of life than the one created because of a blown-up condom? And if the life of a fetus is worth just as much as the life of a grown woman then who are YOU to decide which one should live and which one should die?

Personally I also used to support abortion "only in special cases". But since that argument is simply hypocritical, I now support abortion in every case when a woman simply doesn't wish to be a mother. And here's why:

Being a mother is not simply a matter of material costs but it's also a HUGE cultural, psychological and social burden. A woman cannot simply give birth to a child and then stop being a mother by giving it up. Even after rejecting the child she continues to be a mother. The only difference is that then she is a BAD mother. After the child is born a woman has two choices - to be a good mother or a bad mother. She can't choose not to be a mother at all. And if you think that it's somehow not a big deal then ask yourself - what is a difference between a person who's raped and a person who has sex willingly? Or between a man who has sex with a 19-ear-old girl and a man who has sex with a 12 year-old girl who just had her first period (a sign from nature that she's mature enough to breed). Physically there is no difference and someone raised in a culture that condones rape or pedophilia would probably also think that it's 'not a big deal'. And yet the difference exists, only it lays in social norms that are so deeply engraved in our mind that it can literally cripple a person.

To a woman, there is no bigger social pressure than that which stems from having given birth to a child. From that moment on woman's worth is judged through the prism of motherhood. Even the most successful woman is discredited the moment someone says 'she sacrificed her children for a career! She may be famous but she's a BAD MOTHER!'. Physically a woman is free, but mentally she becomes a slave for her children. Everything she does must result in their well-being, otherwise she ends with a label of a BAD mother.

For a 14-year-old child it's simply impossible to take on that pressure. It's also impossible for such child to stop being a mother and highly improbable to be a good mother. Therefore she automatically ends up with a label of a BAD mother=BAD woman=BAD person. That kind of stigma can never be washed off. If she keeps a child and is unable to give it proper care, she's a bad mother. If she gives a child up for adoption, she's a bad mother. If she decides to find her child once she's an adult then it is not seen as an act of good will on her part but rather as 'bad mother trying to pay back for her sins'

It's as if an act of giving birth was such a huge favour for a woman from the baby she gave birth to, that she now OWES something to that baby and must pay off that 'debt'.

In that aspect, an unwanted child really does become a mental parasite. Which is why it's so important that a woman chooses that responsibility willingly. Abortion is the only thing which society accepts as an act of actually stopping to be a mother. So the moral depth to abortion is not only a matter of whether the life of a brainless fetus is worth the same as life of a child with thoughts, dreams and feelings but also a matter of woman's mental stability.
vetala   
11 Jul 2009
News / 14 year old rape victim from Warsaw denied abortion! [348]

Huge difference. Someone who has sex willingly, in today day and age, and in the so called (somewhat) developed societies will certainly know the consequences of unprotected sex.

I was refering to the trauma of a rape victim, which from the biological point of view shouldn't exist, since nature couldn't care less if a woman is impregnated willingly or not. And apparently you understand this too:

From the biological standpoint the so called social pressure is irrelevant.

In other words rape shouldn't create trauma. And yet, it does. Why? Because of the cultural approach to unwilling sex. Same with motherhood.

Mattewoflv is right, your post has some good points, however you are both missing MY point.
If abortion is morally wrong, then how exactly? If it's morally wrong because of the woman's choices or their lack then that means fetus can be objectified and is not a real life which should be protected at all cost. In other words if you agree that a rape victim can get rid of a fetus, then that means that the life of this fetus is unimportant. And if that's the case, then a fetus consieved through simple carelessness is also not a real life that should be protected at all cost and is unimportant. So, if it's unimportant then why exactly shouldn't it be aborted? From the biological standpoint all fetuses are equal. The only difference in your eyes lies not in a fetus but in a WOMAN. You judge not a fetus, but a woman and her choices and you have no right to tell her whether she is morally worthy of abortion or not.

However there is another argument that abortion is morally wrong and that is the one about the sanctity of life. This one is even more hypocritical.

If you decide that a fetus consieved willingly is a sacred life that should be preserved but a fetus consieved unwillingly is somehow less sacred you are doing nothing other than judging a life in the strangest way - not by itself but by it's host. I could understand saying that a healthy fetus is a sacred life that should be preserved and a 'damaged' one is not but what kind of logic allows you to judge whether a fetus is worthy of life or not simply by the way a man decided to get it inside a woman. This is an act of evaluating a living being and declaring it's unequalness simply due to the choices of another living being.

That's why you need to decide - is a fetus (EVERY fetus) a life that should be protected or not? If it is, then that means abortion shouldn't be allowed in any case. If it's not, then abortion is okay no matter the circumstances.
vetala   
31 Jul 2009
History / 64th anniversary of the Warsaw Uprising [71]

It's in polish. Unfortunatelly, because of my poor english skills, I can't translate it to english.

Here's th translation:
warsawuprising.com/witness/schenk.htm
vetala   
2 Aug 2009
History / Polish Jews we are (Poles) proud of [30]

Shevah Weiss

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shevah_Weiss

Shevah Weiss (Hebrew: שבח וייס‎, Polish: Szejwach Weiss), is an Israeli political scientist and former politician. Weiss was born on July 5, 1935 in Borysław, Poland (now in Ukraine) in Polish Jewish family to Gienia and Meir Wolf Weiss. As a Holocaust survivor, he migrated to Palestine in 1947. He graduated from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem with a BA in International Relations in 1961, before doing an MA in political Science and contemporary Jewish studies and then a PhD. In 1975 he became a professor at the University of Haifa.

Black Madonna of Częstochowa
vetala   
6 Aug 2009
News / Rydzyk gets away with racism yet again [198]

I highly doubt that the joke was meant to offend, however Father Rydzyk, as a very important public figure, should resign from public appearances at least for the next few years. There are things that a random civilian can get away with but are highly inappropriate for a public figure. A public figure OUGHT to realize that his or her statements are not only affecting their immidiate surroundings but will form the image of the entire country abroad and therefore, for the good of the country, a person who's unable to control theselves, not just once but multiply times, should have the honour to step away from fame.
vetala   
6 Aug 2009
News / FEINSTEIN NEW us AMBASSADOR TO POLAND [47]

Shimon Peres say: 'Israel is doing quite well financially...We buy up Hungary, Poland, Romania, Manhattan...'

Yes, Israelis are investing in our coutry, making it richer, more modern and better-developed with each year for which we should be thankful. Furthermore Peres, during his visit on the anniversary of Ghetto Uprising (I think it was then, I can't remember what occasion this was) said something along the lines of 'It's difficult to stand here, NOT BECAUSE OF YOU, but because of what happened here' which, from what I've read on the jewish news portals, was interpreted as a statement, that Poles are not to be blamed for Holocaust. It's surely a good sign.
vetala   
12 Aug 2009
News / French and Poles [146]

MareGaea

In your tireless search for truth in Wikipedia you missed a few articles:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rescue_of_Jews_by_Poles_during_the_Holocaust
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Żegota
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Righteous_among_the_Nations
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irena_Sendler
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Karski
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koniuchy_massacre
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naliboki_massacre
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salomon_Morel
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Wolińska-Brus

Any more examples? Happy to provide!
vetala   
15 Aug 2009
History / Cud nad Wisla / Battle of Warsaw 1920 - Public Holiday [21]

Which were starved to death by Polish authorities in the concentration camps :-(((

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camps_for_Polish_prisoners_and_internees_in_Soviet_Union_and_Lithuania_(1919-1921)

About 20,000 out of about 51,000 Polish POWS died in Soviet and Lithuanian camps. Similar number of Soviet POWs - from 16,000 to 20,000 out of 80,000 - perished due to disease and poor conditions in Polish camps in that period.

Gee, I wonder in which camps conditions were worse...
vetala   
26 Aug 2009
News / Microsoft Poland whitens a black face in its advert [130]

Classic Polish debating skills!

Oh, I see you've learned them. Do you deny your prejudice toward Serbians?

Back to the topic - if it was about appealing to racists then the Asian would be edited out as well. Most racist people in Poland do not differentiate between the colours they dislike - as long as a person looks foreign, they're unacceptable. However nobody in Poland is racist enough that a change in the ad would be neccessary. After all, I can't seem to recall Will Smith coloured white in his movies and yet cinemas are full whenever one is shown. I think that whoever ordered the change aimed to better reflect the demography in Poland although it's pretty stupid considering that I've seen so many advertisments with black people in my life that I don't even notice them in the ads anymore.

But seriously, if all non-Asians were edited out in the advertisment shown in Singapore or Tokio, would people make a big deal out of it too?
vetala   
29 Aug 2009
History / US snubs Poland over WW II ceremony? [75]

Shopgirl, we're talking about the commemoration of the beginning of WWII. All other countries involved are sending their presidents and prime ministers, so it will be a a VERY important event internationally. The only ones who won't send anybody important are USA and Israel. One might think that those two countries somehow don't think WWII was an important event.

Also, I highly doubt that USA wouldn't held a commemoration for victims of 9/11 only because of some Senator who passed away or problems with economy.
vetala   
30 Aug 2009
History / US snubs Poland over WW II ceremony? [75]

Oh, we have lots of advertisements with black people. I've seen one just yesterday.
You're really out of arguments aren't you?
vetala   
30 Aug 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

To all of you people who wonder why Poland entered the alliance with Britain and France rather than the Soviets - you you really think Poles would consider Soviet Union a friendly state after they systematically tracked down and murdered Soviet Poles for the previous two years?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_operation_of_the_NKVD
vetala   
30 Aug 2009
History / US snubs Poland over WW II ceremony? [75]

1jola don't forget Eliza from the popular serial Rodzina Zastepcza. Or that lady from one of the tv game shows. And the black players in our soccer teams.
vetala   
31 Aug 2009
Life / Who is your favourite polish writer? [15]

I go for Tadeus Borowski.

So do I. And Andrzej Sapkowski. Both have this unique style and write about horrifying things in an almost humorous way.
vetala   
3 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

1) In what way did Britain betray Poland? Kindly quote the relevent parts of the relevent treaty.

Unfortunately my post seems to have been deleted, or maybe lost, but I'd advise you to carefully watch commercials of Ally Bank (fitting name!), particularly "Pony", "Truck" and "Hide". 'Even kids know that... you don't f*cking treat your allies this way'

2) If Poland was betrayed by her allies, given the way that Poland had treated her Ukranian allies some 18 years previously, did she deserve any better?

Ah, in that case I suppose German occupation of France was absolutely fair and so would be the occupation of Britain since both of these countries have history of colonialism.

4) Which British army units could have been sent to France and used to reinforce the British attack within the two weeks available until Poland was finished?

On September 1st GB had no idea that Poland would fall (NOT in two weeks, the last Polish forces capitulated on 6 October (see: Battle of Kock))

3) With which army units could the British have broken through the Siegfried line?

5) How could the British army have launched an attack on Germany from the soil belonging to nations which did not want such attack to take place?

Britain was the one to give us a guarantee, they should have been smarter than to promise us something which they knew was impossible. Had Britain said that they have no means to help us, we would look for more reliable allies.
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

Harry, you keep talking about 'Polish governent' but which government do you have in mind? The democratically, legally chosen by Poles Government-in-Exile or the puppet government Stalin made himself out of people he liked?

I'm almost certain that Polish G-i-E didn't agree for any parades, reparations, border changes or communism in Poland and never recieved as much respect and acknowledgment as Dalai Lama and the rest of Tibetan Government in Exile. Furthermore, Home Army which was officially supported by Polish G-i-E definitely WAS 'bothered to fight the Soviets'.
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

Just look at the results of the 1930, 1935 and 1938 elections!

Ah yes, you're right. But wait! How about YOU look at the 1945 elections! It seems that Poland didn't have a legal government up until 1989, therefore your statements about the 'Polish' Government are still invalid.

No it wasn't!

Yes, it was.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_the_NKVD_Camp_in_Rembertów
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

I described it as "official", as in 'recognised by the world as the government of Poland'.

So you mean that if Stalin made a government composed of a bunch of hobos or mental patients and the world recognized it and then that government 'decided' that Stalin has the right to exterminate every damn last Pole on Earth that would be perfectly fine, fair and legal?

Or could this be that this applies only to the governments in conflicts that Great Britain is not involved with?
You, who claim that General Government was an illegal state whose law was unacceptable.
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
History / Saturator in polish history [6]

Saturator was a trolley which sold sodas during the times of communist Poland. They used to be practically everywhere.
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

Could you perhaps quote the post in which I said that? I am entirely sure that you can not.

As a matter of fact I can. I was refering to our conversation in another thread concerning legality of homeless people buying houses whose owners are assumed dead. You said that transactions done in accordance with the law of General Government are illegal, because General Government did things that are morally questionable.

I suppose in your usual fashion you will now try to convince me that you meant something completely different even though we had a long conversation about the subject during which you did not suggest a different meaning of your words. However I notice that you do that a lot whenever someone quotes you or points out a flaw in your statements or double morality, after which you call them a liar without explaining which part of the statement is a deliberate untruth and then try to wriggle out of the subject by demanding a counterargument to every single thing you ever posted in the thread, even though you yourself don't do the same for arguments of other people.

By the way, well done for completely ignoring my request for your explanation of how an organisation which had ceased to exist more than five months earlier managed to attack an NKVD camp.

How about YOU explain it to ME? How did an organisation which didn't exist manage to attack an NKVD camp? Maybe because they never really cease to exist?
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

I look forward to you quoting the post in which I say that "the General Government was an illegal state whose law was unacceptable".

And pray tell me where did I say that it was your exact quote?

they were legally bought and paid for.

It is impossible to legally purchase stolen property; in fact it is actually a crime to buy stolen property.

Legally according to the law of the General Government.

Under those laws the holocaust was legal. Does that make it acceptable to you?

I look forward to you convincing me that you didn't mean by this that law of the General Government was unacceptable and things it did were illegal. You do lie so very well after all!

The attack was actually carried out by Delegatura Sił Zbrojnych na Kraj ("Armed Forces Delegation for Homeland") which was a sucessor organisation to NIE which was a structure of the AK which outlived the AK (it was disbanded on 7 May).

If it was a succesor and a structure of AK, then it makes no difference. AK soldiers were tracked down, arrested and sent off to Siberia years after the war so apparently they WERE considered enemies and danger to the Soviets.
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / What needs to happen in the world so that Poland and Russia form alliance? [297]

I was once laughed at in a humiliating manner when I asked a waiter in pizzeria in Italy to speak English and my grandmother, wishing to be helpful, pointed at us and said 'Polacco'. But I'm a polite, rather shy person so I didn't react. I should have left but my grandmother didn't know what was going on so I didn't want her to feel embarrassed. It did make me feel uneasy in the presence of Italians though...
vetala   
10 Sep 2009
News / The most spectacular errors in Polish politics. [264]

My challenge to you to quote any post in which I called the General Government any kind of state still stands.

Yet another lie!
You exact words were "I look forward to you quoting the post in which I say that "the General Government was an illegal state whose law was unacceptable"'

I pointed out to you that YOU DID INDEED say that the law of the general Government was unacceptable and implied that it's actions as well as actions in accordance to it's law were illegal.

oh Harry, isn't it ironic how you call people liars and in the next line clearly, unashamedly lie yourself? But then again, what should I expect from the Moral Guardian?

Delegatura Sił Zbrojnych na Kraj can not have been a structure of the AK because they did not exist at the same time.

You're the one who said that Delegatura was a succesor to the structure of AK. Your words, not mine.

Moreover, your original question WAS NOT ABOUT AK AT ALL. It was:

You couldn’t be bothered to fight the Soviets

And the link provided by me proved that 'we' as in 'Poles' WERE bothered to fight the Soviets. No matter how hard you try to pick at the wording and little details won't change that one fact.