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Why don't Polish women treat education seriously for themselves?


rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
28 Sep 2012 #31
Good education is handy most of the time, unless you go on the date with Zimmy;).

don't misrepresent Zimmy, he has no backwards ideas about not educating women, and his dream date would be Lisa from ice road truckers (maybe).

he is just 'what about the menz'? which is a different angle from usual.
a.k.
28 Sep 2012 #32
Physicist, I don't really agree with your sweeping generalisation, there are women who are career oriented and theose who are not. Everywhere in the world! It depends on an individual.

don't treat education seriously

Maybe because education is nowadays useless in Poland?

working in unskilled labor

They want to earn money, not spend it. I've just read a comment in some other thread by your fellow American on how American college graduatees these days cannot find any work pertinent to their qualifications.

they seem very satisfied with being a housewife

It's considered a soft option. It's very comfortable to be on husband's livelihood, not that men are very enthusiastic about the idea of being the only wage-earner in the family!

A recent study showed that western women are starting to become more likely to graduate from college

If you visit any Polish university barring technical ones, you'll see that the vast majority of students are females.

My girlfriend who is American is currently a Ph.D candidate in Biophysics

Do you think that there's no female Ph.D students in Poland?
If you're already dating an American girl why then do you inquire about Polish ones?

How does education create an incompetent welfare state?

Just look around. There is so many graduatees with mickey mouse degrees, who cannot find any work.

I believe that without feminism you would be barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen, unable to read or write.

She might mean that she doesn't like the modern feminism, which likes to speak on behalf of all women while not all women give them a right to speak on behalf of them.

To rid the world of stupidity once and for all.

Actually she has written something very intelligent below:

It doesn't, but when you spend resources on all the unwashed masses who are too stupid to ever make the resources spent on it worth it creates a bureacratic mess where you have to have a degree to do anything and it's just like a high school diploma, it doesn't mean anything.

Who dares to say she's not right with the above statement? That's what we have now in Poland.

it's about weirdos who hate men because they're men that put propoganda out there and think that if women aren't dominating men then there must be some evil conspiracy to oppress women.

High five from another woman, that is me! :)
I'm not from a conservative family. I can't cook, I ruined several clothes by washing them together with other colours, and genrally know nothing about running a house. And certainly I don't embrace the idea of women being tied to the house chores againts their wills, sitting home and bearing children, or not being equal in wages or jobs opportunities. However there's something about feminism today that makes me irk.

Even though we live in times of relative gender equality we hear from feminism activist that the world is still patriarch oriented and accusing men of bad intentions. Sometimes it verges on paranoia. For example I remember when in Poland some femisists accused the fact of targeting commmercials of washing powders and washing up liquids etc to women as a hidden sexism because it programmes little children into gender roles. How come I, despite being a child literally raised in front of the tv, didn't come up to the idea that the women's role is house chores?! Seriously I've never thought about it like that, or even be aware of that small detail! How can I support modern femisnism if I cannot relate to the problems they say exist?! I'm not against gender equality, but I'm against lack of common sense. After having some personal chats with some women who strongly associated themselves with femisism, I had an impression that there's really a grudge against men involved.

They would have taught you how to think.

Since when it is possible to teach thinking?

Richfilth, "Matka Polka" is associated with a martyred woman, not very appealing idea of life, isn't it?
kondzior 9 | 954
28 Sep 2012 #33
The problem now is the lowering of the standard to compensate for women's inferior ability. I really have no problem with women wanting to be a part of anything quite frankly, but the same expectations should apply, with the emphasis being on the subject's performance. Like for instance, in most military institutions, they have a strict set of requirements on male recruits, so simply being a male doesn't guarantee you a spot. However, you then have females coming in, who literally perform at a much lower level than even worst of the males, let alone the ones that truly qualify, and these women get the spot solely because of their sex. If anything, this reverses the inequality spectrum of the two sexes, putting men in a huge disadvantage here, for having to live up to a higher standard of expectations while getting the same amount of pay as women who get by with mediocrity. The rules for both sexes could be the same, but by no means is it to be achieved by dragging the measuring stick down and pussifying men, or babysitting women.

The social expectations for women are already decreasing. Men pay for far more in relationships than women do. Women have Title IX, Divorce Court, Family Court, traditional pressure, etc. in determining their outcome. Women (of every race) simply not scoring as high as their same race men do in SAT math scores is a rallying cry for state action.

Men are actively encouraged to be faggots; raise another man's child; and defer their masculinity to their wives. Gen X's are typical in this position. Men are "kitchen dwellers" in this generation.

Meanwhile marriage for Gen Y is wilting and may even die completely. The state will assume many daddy duties while encouraging the mother to get pregnant (especially more affluent and intelligent women).
NorthMancPolak 4 | 648
28 Sep 2012 #34
Men are actively encouraged to be faggots

Posters who believe such nonsense are actively encouraged to be ignored.
a.k.
28 Sep 2012 #35
simply not scoring as high as their same race men do in SAT math scores is a rallying cry for state action.

What?! You mean all women? kondzior of course there are women who are much more talented in math than an average male. That's for sure. Maybe there are less of them than men, but don't say that there is none.

As for the first part of your post, may you say what kind of military service women have the standards lowered? I can't think of women being unable of getting into military service unless very special units. I know a girl who initially wished to enter an army but (she changed her plans) and she would easy win in arm wrestling with you.

Of course women will always have a disadvantage of being less physically strong than men, I don't say otherwise. But other type of proffessions are absolutely in their reach.
kondzior 9 | 954
28 Sep 2012 #36
But see, the very idea one has to get a "job" stems entirely from the fact society has been completely feminized. Men aren't naturally inclined for jobs, they like to do work. Sure you can get a woman to do many of the things a man can do, but only in the way she was trained, and only under the conditions that are favorable to her. This breeds staleness and inefficiency, often removing the very thing that makes a job something more then mere drudgery.

So even the perspective here, the idea that individuals are nothing more then mere automata at the behest of a fixed and inflexible directive (the job in question) is a purely feminized notion. Only a woman thinks in terms of getting a "brilliant" career. A man just wants to get things done, whatever it is. So, sure, many women can become "brilliant" biologists, but only men can rock the field of biology with radical innovations and improvements. So why the hell even bother training women? What's the point of becoming a biologists, just for the sake of being a biologist? When the sole justification for entering a given field is to... enter said field, all other concerns become redundant. You are not studying biology to do biology, you are studying biology to be a biologist, which could mean a lot of things at any given moment, but mostly it means something that has nothing to do whatsoever with doing actual work in the field in question
pgtx 29 | 3,159
28 Sep 2012 #37
there are jobs only for women and there are jobs only for men. of course, both genders are more than welcome to do each others job.

but it does not mean than men are better than women and vice versa. they are just better at doing different things.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
28 Sep 2012 #38
So, sure, many women can become "brilliant" biologists, but only men can rock the field of biology with radical innovations and improvements. So why the hell even bother training women?

unbelievable.....
pgtx 29 | 3,159
28 Sep 2012 #39
...and also sad and backward.
kondzior 9 | 954
28 Sep 2012 #40
unbelievable.....

But true.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
28 Sep 2012 #41
it's not true it's backwards rubbish
kondzior 9 | 954
28 Sep 2012 #42
One got to wonder why my thoughtfull post got deleted, while all these one-liners... oh, one specimen was posted by a moderator... I see...
pgtx 29 | 3,159
28 Sep 2012 #43
no, kondzior, you do not SEE :)
if your post was thoughtful, it would be on topic.
a.k.
29 Sep 2012 #44
Sure you can get a woman to do many of the things a man can do, but only in the way she was trained, and only under the conditions that are favorable to her.

I have no idea from where you got that notion that women cannot be passionate in a stereotypically male jobs. Recently I've heard about a girl who drives trucks. She was proposed a work in an office of that logistic company but she refused and insisted on being a truck driver because she always wanted to drive a TIR. The boss is now praising her for being a good employee, she also earn respect from her fellow male truck drivers.

Also my English teacher was telling me about the group of female students at the technical university who study mechanics. They claimed that the study the technical schemas of vehicles for their hobbies.

So, sure, many women can become "brilliant" biologists, but only men can rock the field of biology with radical innovations and improvements. So why the hell even bother training women? What's the point of becoming a biologists, just for the sake of being a biologist?

I think you have a very vague idea of how a scientist work look like. Radical innovations in the field of biology? LOL

Do you say female biologists are not becoming scientists? I seriously have no idea how you come up with such beliefs
kondzior 9 | 954
29 Sep 2012 #45
a.k, give me an exapmle of great female scientist, someone on pair with Darwin, Einstein, Newton, etc (excluding Maria Sklodowska - an exception confirming the rule)

if your post was thoughtful, it would be on topic

I see, so instead trying to be thoughtful, I shold write somthing simple, something you can relate to...

Is this simple enough:

Men (patriarchal real men, not feral matriarchal enrichers) are grateful for ancient Greek, Chinese, and Arab astronomy and philosophy. Women aren't grateful for the rights men granted them not even a century ago. Their lack of respect and reverence for authority, and subsequent recognition solely of raw power, renders them completely unsuitable for civilized discourse. They don't deserve equal anything because they haven't earned it, and they never will.
pgtx 29 | 3,159
29 Sep 2012 #46
I see, so instead trying to be thoughtful, I shold write somthing simple, something you can relate to...

i guess, you also do not understand what ON TOPIC means.
a.k.
29 Sep 2012 #47
excluding Maria Sklodowska - an exception confirming the rule

For instance her daughter, also a Nobel prize laurelate

a.k, give me an exapmle of great female scientist, someone on pair with Darwin, Einstein, Newton, etc (excluding Maria Sklodowska - an exception confirming the rule)

have you managed to read my post in Polish? I aked you a question. What's your rocking achievements in the field of science?
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
29 Sep 2012 #48
a.k, give me an exapmle of great female scientist, someone on pair with Darwin, Einstein, Newton, etc (excluding Maria Sklodowska - an exception confirming the rule)

lol...
give me an example....oh no you can't have her!!
LOL
tigger76 - | 4
29 Sep 2012 #49
Well for my tupence worth most of the Polish females that I know are all very well educated...most have Honours if not Masters degrees in I.T. Economics, Finance and Accounting and trust me arent the type who just come to Britain and Ireland looking for a man to live off. In fact they seem to be just as independent as any women you will find here. Im not saying that there arent women who maybe only have a high school education and maybe followed husbands and boyfriends over here when their men came to work, but it is by no means the majority of the Polish women that I know....and I know quite a few. There is a language barrier to be overcome and many wont have the fluency in English to regard themselves as fit for employment in the Professions and thus go to work in coffee shops, retail outlets and factories but once they find their feet with the English language they have little trouble getting into the Professions. I am an Engineer and have worked with 2 Polish female Architects and 1 female Polish engineer (whom I have the good fortune to be dating). And they were easily as good at their job as any Irish person. And at least 75% of the professionally trained Polish women I know are all working in the fields in which they were professionally educated. In fact some banks, estate agents, finance companies etc find it an advantage to have a Polish person on their staff, as their are a lot of Polish people here in Ireland (and in Britain too) who feel more comfortable dealing with a person who at least speaks their language and can deal with their queries or needs effectively. Its a huge market that many employers are finding it advantageous to target.
boletus 30 | 1,366
29 Sep 2012 #50
give me an exapmle of great female scientist, someone on pair with Darwin, Einstein, Newton, etc (excluding Maria Sklodowska - an exception confirming the rule)

Women Nobel Price winners in Physiology or Medicine:
1947 Gerty Radnitz Cori, USA
1977 Rosalyn Sussman Yalow, USA
1983 Barbara McClintock, USA
1986 Rita Levi-Montalicini, Italy
1988 Gertrude Elion, USA
1995 Christiane Nüsslein-Volhard, Germany
2004, Linda Buck, USA
2008 Françoise Barré-Sinoussi, France
2009 Elizabeth H. Blackburn, USA
2009 Carol W. Greider, USA
kondzior 9 | 954
29 Sep 2012 #51
Boletus, I was asking about great scientists. If no woman got a Nobel, it would be considered sexist, and whatnot.

Let's face it, why do we have separate men's and women's events at the Olympic Games? Let's just put all the male and female contestants into the same contest and see who comes out on top. Of course, if you do that, all the men come out on top. And not *just* on top, but on top by a country mile. Women have never broken the 10 second barrier in the 100m sprint, for instance.

a.k., feel free to question my sporting achievements....

Watching these feministfrequency.com videos is interesting. It would appear that while men are out building sh!t and blowing sh!t up and gettin' sh!t done, women are making videos studying why they aren't doing what men are - and apparently it's all because Lego wasn't marketed to them when they were 12.

Yesss... That must be it.
pgtx 29 | 3,159
29 Sep 2012 #52
Let's face it, why do we have separate men's and women's events at the Olympic Games?

again. women are better at some stuff than men. men are better at some stuff than women.
it doesn't mean that men are better in general than women.

give me an exapmle of great female scientist, someone on pair with Darwin, Einstein, Newton, etc

boletus kindly gave you the list of women. you must remember that it was in times when women were not able to fully show off they intellectual side because of their social role assigned by men was in a kitchen and with children. only a few had proved themselves.

if everybody was thinking like you, kondzior, the civilization wouldn't be able to make a step forward.
a.k.
29 Sep 2012 #53
Let's face it, why do we have separate men's and women's events at the Olympic Games?

Beacause theye're physically weaker. And your point is?
I never put into discussion that nature made a man more adjusted to physical tasks. I'd need to take a testosterone injections to work in mines. That's why I think it's good to let men the whole unqualified physical labour jobs, isn't that what you do for living kondzior?

God obviously created you to carry sacks with sands on your back... and carry my suitaces and bags with shopping and moving the furniture. I'm never shy to ask men for help in such cases :)))
boletus 30 | 1,366
29 Sep 2012 #54
why do we have separate men's and women's events at the Olympic Games?

Fail again.
Think equestrian and sailing (in one event now). For example, 2012 US equestrian show jumping team consisted of two men and two women. Medals won by teammates Beezie Madden (woman) and McLain Ward (man) in the last two Olympics: two golds for each and a bronze for Beezie.

Tennis (in early Games in since 2012) and Badminton (since 1996) have mixed doubles events.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
29 Sep 2012 #55
so the logic goes, men and women are not physically equal, therefore educating women is a waste of time.
and I thought it was women who were supposed to be illogical!
strzyga 2 | 993
29 Sep 2012 #56
Women aren't grateful for the rights men granted them not even a century ago. Their lack of respect and reverence for authority, and subsequent recognition solely of raw power, renders them completely unsuitable for civilized discourse. They don't deserve equal anything because they haven't earned it, and they never will.

Kondzior, how much entry fee do I need to pay to see you with my own eyes? And where exactly are you exhibited?
delphiandomine 83 | 17,771
29 Sep 2012 #57
Let's face it, why do we have separate men's and women's events at the Olympic Games?

Women routinely beat men in some sports. For instance, once you get up to races of 100km duration, women are just as good as men.

Then again, I'm sure no woman can beat your woman hating racism.
Meathead 5 | 470
29 Sep 2012 #58
Just look around. There is so many graduatees with mickey mouse degrees, who cannot find any work.

Education isn't necessarily about getting a "job" it's about acquiring knowledge. There's no such thing as "mickey mouse" degrees. The opposite of Knowledge is ignorance and ... you're saying that people are better off being ignorant? Knowledge is never wasted.

Since when it is possible to teach thinking?

You obviously don't have an American University liberal arts education.

I'm not from a conservative family. I can't cook, I ruined several clothes by washing them together with other colours, and genrally know nothing about running a house. And certainly I don't embrace the idea of women being tied to the house chores againts their wills, sitting home and bearing children, or not being equal in wages or jobs opportunities.

Generally speaking Polish women are career women. Real workhorses. If you want a housewife marry English. They're better with the kids, they can cook and they're literate (they can hold a conversation).
a.k.
29 Sep 2012 #59
Knowledge is never wasted.

A university degree is not a guarantee of knowledge anymore.
Also knowledge can be wasted because after two years of not using it an average person forgets about 90% of it.

you're saying that people are better off being ignorant?

They can always study on their own, they don't need to enroll in a university course if that doesn't make them more attractive on the job market.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
29 Sep 2012 #60
Kondzior, how much entry fee do I need to pay to see you with my own eyes? And where exactly are you exhibited?

lol :):):):):)


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