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French and Poles


Matowy - | 295  
12 Aug 2009 /  #91
Like most liberals you're full of shyt and lying to justify these fanatics, France has an estimated 6-10% Muslim pop, at this point im starting to think we could dump you guys on the same ship with the pakis, if you enjoy honor murders so much go live with them in their countries.

He didn't say anything about honour murders at all. Looks like you're getting a tad hysterical.

In a 2003 poll 41% of the respondents said that the existence of God was "excluded" or "unlikely". 33% declared that "atheist" described them rather or very well, and 51% for "Christian". When questioned about their religion, 62% answered Roman Catholic, 6% Muslim, 2% Protestant, 1% Jewish, 2% "other religions" (except for Orthodox or Buddhist, which were negligible), 26% "no religion" and 1% declined to answer. The discrepancy between the number of "atheists" (33%) and the number of with "no religion" (26%) may be attributed to people who feel culturally close to a religion, follow its moral values and traditions, but do not believe in God.

A January 2007 poll found that 51% of the French population describe themselves as Catholics (and only half of those said they believed in God), 31% as atheists, 4% as Muslims, 3% as Protestants and 1% as Jews.

Not only is it that religion is on the decline in general, but the Muslim population of France has actually gone down from 2003-2007.
aphrodisiac 11 | 2,441  
12 Aug 2009 /  #92
Looks like you're getting a tad hysterical.

that usually seem to cloud the judgement:)

Not only is it that religion is on the decline in general, but the Muslim population of France has actually gone down from 2003-2007.
Matowy
Member
Threads: 1
Posts: 162
Joined: Jul 4, 09

oh, there we go. So there is no need to be so panicky then. SO I was right all along. Great feeling.
Sokrates 8 | 3,346  
12 Aug 2009 /  #93
Not only is it that religion is on the decline in general, but the Muslim population of France has actually gone down from 2003-2007.

islamicpopulation.com/Europe/europe_islam.html

Apparently it did not.
brookings.edu/opinions/2003/03middleeast_taspinar.aspx?p=1

By 2050 20% of all Euro population will be muslim. In other words in 41 years we will see a 13% increase, by the same prognosis by the turn of the century we will become a minority on our own continent.

I'm sorry i have no wish for my great grandchildren to get hanged for infidelity or whipped publicly for kissing.

And stuff is bound to happen in our lifetime too, i mean 1/5th of population is about to become backwards apes by 2050, you think they wont have any leverage as to how our policies go?

I'm panicking yeah, i'm panicking because we invited backwards cavemen who breed like rabbits and act like animals, and they're outbreeding us in our home.

Oh there's also the fun parts.

nospeedbumps.com/?p=1119

Countries like Germany will have 15%-20% muslim pop by themselves earlier, possibly higher which means that rapists and religious fascist get a voice in the most powerfull European states.

Seriously we should pack them and everyone who supports them on the same boat.
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #94
Hm, maybe all my professors in University were wrong then? And maybe all the documention and literature is wrong and you are the only in this whole world that is right on this point?

Somehow I doubt you paid very much attention to your professors, read the documentation and literature, and gathered the informed opinions on everyone else in the world, especially given that your knowledge of the subject appears to revolve around the Kielce pogrom (which you apparently don't even know the name of, let alone the circumstances behind).

I mean, you don't even seem to register that for centuries, Jews from all around Europe flocked to live in Poland(/Lithuanian Commonwealth). And last I checked, masochism isn't part of the Jewish culture/religion, so the reason obviously isn't because they were persecuted so much harder there. That leaves option... what?

I knew you were bluffing. I asked you to give me a few names of historians you read and you refused. How low is that? I don't need books written by UPA veterans or any Ukrainian historian. I didn't ask for that. Anyhow, PK, I wasn't expecting much anyway from you ;)

Fine. Since I have such a soft heart and you come across so disappointed, I'll toss you the bone I'm sure you were waiting for: Norman Davies. Bring it.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #95
Somehow I doubt you paid very much attention to your professors

Hm, somehow I managed to get two Master's of which one with honors. But that doesn't matter right now. I pretty much summed up the circumstances: young boy claims to be kidnapped by Jews, drinking baby's blood, etc. Reasons: the deep rooted hatred of Poles agains Jews. There has been never found any proof by POLISH investigators during the 90's that the Sovjets were behind it.

I mean, you don't even seem to register that for centuries, Jews from all around Europe flocked to live in Poland(/Lithuanian Commonwealth). And last I checked, masochism isn't part of the Jewish culture/religion, so the reason obviously isn't because they were persecuted so much harder there. That leaves option... what?

Perhaps you just simply skip the fact that most of the Polish art, literature, intellect, music, science, etc. was Jewish? Jewes have contributed to all societies they were in. They have added value to any society they are part of. Too bad that the non-Jews nearly always are looking for scapegoats for their own failures.

M-G (bored)
Magdalena 3 | 1,837  
12 Aug 2009 /  #96
that most of the Polish art, literature, intellect, music, science, etc. was Jewish

That's what you like to believe. I prefer to think that a certain percentage of Jews in Poland stopped thinking of themselves as Jewish only, and became Poles of Jewish extraction. Much like in the US nobody claims that American art, literature, intellect, music, science is in fact "Jewish, Chinese, German, French, Polish, British, Indian [insert any immigrant nationality]". I hope you get my drift.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #97
One of the reasons for Polish Anti-Semitism I found was "the fear of Poles that Jews would take up positions in Polish society that should have been taken up by the Poles themselves, thus deterring Poles to fulfil those tasks in their own country".

My reaction to that would be: in my opinion it should be always the right man at the right place at any given time. If a Jew happens to be better at a certain position than an Pole, the Jew should be there, if he lives in Poland. If at the time there are no Poles suitable, they should not hate the Jew who is able to do so for doing it. All will benefit in the long run from it. By the time there is a Pole suitable to perform in the position, he can apply for it and if he gets it, he will be in the position.

M-G (seems logic, though)
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 12,063  
12 Aug 2009 /  #98
How about starting making babies instead of wasting time then.

To what for? Going into a babymaking-competition with the mass breeders from the third world?
As if our Earth has not already to many hungry mouth to feed?

Is that your only solution??? More babies???

I can't f'ucking believe it!

The only solace I have is that you multikulti softie liberals will be the first to be slaughtered and caged and opressed by the coming fanatics. You are so easy game for them...even seen as supporters!

(The downside is I will be probably to much concerned with my own opression already..

big time, too much time on their hands.

I would really, really, really gladly admit every paranoia under the sun if I could be proven wrong...really!

I'm sorry i have no wish for my great grandchildren to get hanged for infidelity or whipped publicly for kissing.

*nods*

I'm panicking yeah, i'm panicking because we invited backwards cavemen who breed like rabbits and act like animals, and they're outbreeding us in our home.

*nods*

Countries like Germany will have 15%-20% muslim pop by themselves earlier, possibly higher which means that rapists and religious fascist get a voice in the most powerfull European states.

Most of us Germans are still xenophobic and "Ausländerfeindlich" by heart! (Not only in the East).
I still have hopes that we just don't fall over and show our belly to them...we are no frenchies or dutchies!
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #99
Hm, somehow I managed to get two Master's of which one with honors.

In History? So, in Holland, a statement that can (literally) be summed up in "Well, I don't really know much about the topic, but I heard about these Poles killing some fourty Jews for no good reason once and that sounds pretty bad so yeah I think Poles must all hate Jews a lot more than everyone else does" without losing any value whatsoever counts for something?

Unless you got them in something else... like English, in which case I won't ask how much they cost you.

But that doesn't matter right now. I pretty much summed up the circumstances: young boy claims to be kidnapped by Jews, drinking baby's blood, etc. Reasons: the deep rooted hatred of Poles agains Jews.

You perhaps summed up the circumstances of a single staged pogrom. I hope you don't believe you just summed up the circumstances of centuries of Polish history.

Perhaps you just simply skip the fact that most of the Polish art, literature, intellect, music, science, etc. was Jewish?

A) That's really funny. Give me the "most famous" names (from Poland) in each of those fields, and tell me whether or not they were Jewish. Or do you not actually know enough on the topic to do this?

B) I "skipped" no such "fact". Please address the original point, and do not answer again with laughable non-sequiters.

And here's a present for you:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_Poland

Please address.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 12,063  
12 Aug 2009 /  #100
euro-islam.info/country-profiles/germany/

That's good news:

Approximately 3.0 to 3.5 million Muslims live in Germany, and 80% of them do not have German citizenship;

We can still get rid of at least 80 percent of them legally and peacefully! :)

....reading the whole summary it seems the muslims are so not happy with Germany...to f'ucking bad!

...A survey conducted in December 2003 found that sixty-five percent of Germans claim that Islam could not fit with the West and that the majority opposes any new immigration and would feel uncomfortable living in a neighborhood with Muslims...

Something will have to give then..

...German survey respondents indicated much more negative views about Muslims than survey respondents in France, Spain, or the United Kingdom...

As I said...no pushovers here in Germany!
aphrodisiac 11 | 2,441  
12 Aug 2009 /  #101
....reading the whole summary it seems the muslims are so not happy with Germany...to f'ucking bad!

As I said...no pushovers here in Germany!

stating the obvious here BB?
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 12,063  
12 Aug 2009 /  #102
Not so obvious I think as media and lefties have a history of bending over and taking it backwards...
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #103
Poland was one of the most tolerant countries in Europe.

A fact that also led to their demise in the 16th and 17th century.

And indeed, Polish history is, besides a few points, not important within the European history, at least not more important than any other given mediocre state in any other period of time. I know the Polish history globally, as, like said, any more indepth research of it would be irrelevant for non-Poles within the global European context. The fact that Poland used to be the most tolerant countries in Europe at the time (from the High Middle Ages to the Renaissance) is annilihated by their later hatred of Judaism and the Jews.

And as usually is the case with Poland and its history: wrong time, wrong place. Just tough luck. Get over it and enjoy the position you have now: a tolerated and in due time respected member of the European family. But it should stop (or at least your president should) blaming other countries for your mishap. It does the Polish case certainly no good when you keep doing that.

And true, I have a Master's in History (with honors), but that does not necessarily mean that I have to know everything about Polish history. To be honest, I wasn't interested in Polish history, culture and society until I got a Polish girlfriend. And even then it was more out of curiosity than out of real interest. Because for non-Polish ppl Polish history is generally not interesting at all except as example of how you do things wrongly at the wrong time and place.

What do you know, for example about Dutch history? Do you know anything about that? Get my point? Probably not as you are so full of yourself and self-righteous that you most likely will not see anything else than your own points. The Low Countries were at one point in history the strongest country in the world. We don't nag about that 300 years on. The richest in Europe we have always been, that's the only general thing in Dutch existance and lots of other countries have always been jealous of that, unfortunately.

The importance of the Kielce pogrom is the timing. Slightly a year after the biggest mass murder on a single ppl had ended a couple of idiots go and do it all over again. And the fact that they took away all hopes and wishes of the Jews of starting anew in their former home country. That is the importance of the incident. The Polish government in the 90's declared it a national shame and they didn't do that for nothing. And nowadays when you talk to Poles it's still there, this latent hatred. Oh, they like me, but you can hear that they are doing their utmost to hide the resent they feel for the Jews. And for most other minorities for that matter.

M-G (cheerio)
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #105
goof post MG

Goof?

M-G (hm, typo?)
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #106
And indeed, Polish history is, besides a few points, not important within the European history, at least not more important than any other given mediocre state in any other period of time.

Vienna, Grunwald, largest state in Europe... forget it. Not even worth pursuing.

The fact that Poland used to be the most tolerant countries in Europe at the time (from the High Middle Ages to the Renaissance) is annilihated by their later hatred of Judaism and the Jews.

Which you can't show any better than a single event that happened post-WWII. There's a difference between opinion, and reasoning, y'know.

What do you know, for example about Dutch history? Do you know anything about that? Get my point? Probably not as you are so full of yourself and self-righteous that you most likely will not see anything else than your own points.

No I don't get your point because I never made any silly claims about or concerning my knowledge of Dutch history. Freely bring this up when I start talking out of my arse concerning the Dutch.

The importance of the Kielce pogrom is the timing. Slightly a year after the biggest mass murder on a single ppl had ended a couple of idiots go and do it all over again.

Native Americans? Eskimos?

And the fact that they took away all hopes and wishes of the Jews of starting anew in their former home country. That is the importance of the incident.

Did they? Okay, list current laws passed to repress/discriminate against Jews in Poland.
aphrodisiac 11 | 2,441  
12 Aug 2009 /  #107
MareGaea

Goof?

no, no, no ......GOOD:)

I must have been thinking about Kazimierz
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #108
Vienna, Grunwald, largest state in Europe

Largest perhaps, yet insignificant.

Which you can't show any better than a single event that happened post-WWII.

Oh and there is nothing between the Renaissance and post war Europe? Think again.

No I don't get your point because I never made any silly claims about or concerning my knowledge of Dutch history. Freely bring this up when I start talking out of my arse concerning the Dutch.

Where exactly do I claim that I have knowledge of Polish history? I have a global knowledge of Polish history, which is more than enough for any non-Pole to know. Face it, Poland is a state of lesser importance within the European context. This might be hard to swallow for any Pole as they think their state is just the about the most important state in Europe, but Poland is nothing but a poor Central European country. Nothing more, nothing less. All the so-called achievements of the Polish in history might be nice and significant, however, the amount of Polish contributions is nothing more or of more importance than any other mediocre state in Europe.

Native Americans? Eskimos?

Don't make yourself ridiculous.

Did they? Okay, list current laws passed to repress/discriminate against Jews in Poland.

Ah, I thought you were so against taking parts of text and sentenses out of their context? You didn't get the point, indeed and I doubt you ever will as you are so convinced of your own correctness.

M-G (starts to be slightly annoyed)
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #109
Oh and there is nothing between the Renaissance and post war Europe? Think again.

Nothing else that you've mentioned, no. Other than general, unsubstantiated and vague accusations of hatred. You may have typed a lot, but I only look for two things: point, and reasoning/factual basis.

Where exactly do I claim that I have knowledge of Polish history?

Guess I missed a couple of commas or something. Perhaps the original sentence here should read: "about, or concerning my knowledge of, Dutch history". You have made statements about Polish history multiple times already that were quite off the mark. I have made none whatsoever concerning Dutch history.

Face it, Poland is a state of lesser importance within the European context. This might be hard to swallow for any Pole as they think their state is just the about the most important state in Europe, but Poland is nothing but a poor Central European country. Nothing more, nothing less. All the so-called achievements of the Polish in history might be nice and significant, however, the amount of Polish contributions is nothing more or of more importance than any other mediocre state in Europe.

This is your opinion and you are welcome to it. However, it is also a non-sequiter, and attacking my country's standing in the world does not actually strengthen your original point. That being: 'Poland was never tolerant towards minorities like the West'.

Don't make yourself ridiculous.

Take a quick look at your posts first. You mentioned 'the worst mass-murder of a people in history', and I brought up the first-ever recorded genocide to utilize biological warfare. And that one succeeded.

Ah, I thought you were so against taking parts of text and sentenses out of their context? You didn't get the point, indeed and I doubt you ever will as you are so convinced of your own correctness.

I have no idea what you're talking about, but I will remain convinced of my own correctness until you are able to show me why I should not be. We're on the subject of how modern-day Poland (never was and still) isn't as tolerant towards Jews as the West 'is trying to be'. Fine; show me how Poland does things differently, making her less tolerant.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #110
Nothing else that you've mentioned, no. Other than general, unsubstantiated and vague accusations of hatred. You may have typed a lot, but I only look for two things: point, and reasoning/factual basis.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Jewish_violence_in_Poland,_1944-1946
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krak%C3%B3w_pogrom
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kielce_pogrom_(1918)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinsk_massacre
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bialystok_pogrom
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lw%C3%B3w_pogrom_(1918)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear:_Anti-Semitism_in_Poland_after_Auschwitz

Just a handful of examples from before and after WW2. For the rest I am not going to discuss about this topic with you anymore. You are so convinced of yourself and so stupified in your own opinion that no normal discussion (read with any opinion other than your own) is pssbl. And that kinda annoys me.

M-G (any more examples? Happy to provide)
Sokrates 8 | 3,346  
12 Aug 2009 /  #111
M-G get the f*ck out, seriously make a new topic "i'm a jew starving attention you killed jewz in Kielce!!!!" or something, just dont turn this board into another circus, i'm still not sure how jews are different from Pakis, your religion is similar, you're just as fanatical.
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #112
*stuff*
Just a handful of examples from before and after WW2.

All of which were no doubt covered in the article I provided for you. You remember the beginning. Now compare:

The first written records of Jewish settlement in England date from the time of the Norman Conquest, mentioning Jews who arrived with William the Conqueror in 1066 although it is believed that there were Jews present in Great Britain since Roman times[citation needed]. The Jewish population lived in England from the Norman Conquest until they were expelled in 1290 by a decree of King Edward I. England had no official Jewish presence, save for isolated individuals who practised Judaism secretly, until the reign of Oliver Cromwell. While Cromwell never officially readmitted Jews to Britain, the small colony of Sephardic Jews living in London was unmasked in 1656, and, because of Cromwell's need of their financial assistance, they were allowed to stay.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_England

So tell me... which sounds better? You may have a point on the last several decades alone, but your original point included the word "never".

For the rest I am not going to discuss about this topic with you anymore. You are so convinced of yourself and so stupified in your own opinion that no normal discussion (read with any opinion other than your own) is pssbl. And that kinda annoys me.

I discourage 'normal discussion', so that's probably a good thing. I'm here to debate, instead.
BTW last I checked, wasn't Luxembourg wealthier than you guys per capita?
vetala - | 382  
12 Aug 2009 /  #113
MareGaea

In your tireless search for truth in Wikipedia you missed a few articles:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rescue_of_Jews_by_Poles_during_the_Holocaust
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Żegota
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Righteous_among_the_Nations
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irena_Sendler
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Karski
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koniuchy_massacre
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naliboki_massacre
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salomon_Morel
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Wolińska-Brus

Any more examples? Happy to provide!
MareGaea 29 | 2,752  
12 Aug 2009 /  #114
Any more examples? Happy to provide!

Yes do :) I used Wiki for time-reasons. I am still at work and even though I type pretty quickly, I don't have time to check other resources than this one.

Oh ghee, did I tread on some sensitive toes here? OF COURSE there are ppl who helped the Jews, no nation exists entirely of idiots and barbarians. It's just not that -as usually stated here- the Poles were oh-so good towards the Jews, which they were not only. There always is a balance. Some are good, some are bad. Everywhere. I just cannot stand this glorification of your own ppl as being so good to everybody and being so badly treated by everybody else. I cannot stand that from every country, not only Poland. Only Poland has it a little more than others.

M-G get the f*ck out, seriously make a new topic "i'm a jew starving attention you killed jewz in Kielce!!!!" or something, just dont turn this board into another circus, i'm still not sure how jews are different from Pakis, your religion is similar, you're just as fanatical.

You obviously don't have a clue. And your naming of different ppl says enough about how you think. It's hard when ppl don't say that the Poles are such a noble ppl and that the big bad world has done nothing but treat them bad, isn't it? Good, we both can make a new thread here. I will make one named like you mentioned and you will make one called "I am a retard soul who likes to be an idiot and publicly display myself like that."

M-G (creative)
Pan Kazimierz 1 | 195  
12 Aug 2009 /  #115
Oh ghee, did I tread on some sensitive toes here? OF COURSE there are ppl who helped the Jews, no nation exists entirely of idiots and barbarians.

Yeah, I absolutely agree. And that is therefore why using the exact same tactics of showing a few incidents as proof of a mentality that lasted centuries is not a good tactic. i.e: "Of COURSE there were people who didn't like Jews; no nation consists entirely of saints and martyrs."
Sokrates 8 | 3,346  
12 Aug 2009 /  #116
You obviously don't have a clue.

No i'm just tired of provocative twats hijacking discussions, you want to spread your word do so in a separate thread.

says enough about how you think

You'd have no idea mate but you are apparently fixed on how Poles are to the point where you will lie to get your point across so there's nothing to discuss really, especially when you ignore Kazimierzs arguments which is why i dont bother to add to them.

You're just another Harry, here to prove a point you think you have regardless of historical proof so debating is pointless all i ask is that you get the fvck out of the thread and make a new one or that the mods merge your useless rants with an existing jew thread.

As I said...no pushovers here in Germany!

If that was the case you wouldnt have 80% illegals, it seems you contracted the British political correctness virus.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 12,063  
12 Aug 2009 /  #117
I don't think they are illegals...they just have no citizenship.
Illegals are another case altogether...

They get the boot the moment the Ausländerbehörde finds them...
Matowy - | 295  
12 Aug 2009 /  #118
M-G get the f*ck out, seriously make a new topic "i'm a jew starving attention you killed jewz in Kielce!!!!" or something, just dont turn this board into another circus, i'm still not sure how jews are different from Pakis, your religion is similar, you're just as fanatical.

Wow. I was just about to draw parallels between your Islam paranoia and pre-WWII German sentiment towards Jews. Looks like I needn't bother.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 12,063  
12 Aug 2009 /  #119
Oh please...the Jews belong to the most threatened groups by the Islamists.
They would Israel and every Jew wipe off the map if they could. Once the muslims take over foreign policy in Europe and even influence the US who will support plucky little Israel then anymore? Might get really uncomfortable for them here in Europe too!

Nothing paranoid about it...

But appeasement about a looming danger, ignorance, denial..now that you can compare!
Matowy - | 295  
12 Aug 2009 /  #120
I'm not comparing Muslims to Jews, I'm comparing YOUR attitude to Muslims as being pretty much identical to that of 20'th Century anti-Semitism. "They're growing in numbers!!! By X date they'll outumber us!!!! They're trying to take over our politics!!! They're eating away at our culture from the inside!!!! They're devious, insidious parasites, hell-bent on the destruction and assimilation of everything that isn't already theirs!!!" - THIS is what you sound like. You don't sound like a voice of reason, nor a saviour of the European people. You just sound like a typical moronic bigot with more emotion than brains. I pity people like you who find no purpose in life unless they have something to hate.

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