Polish Integration with other Nationalities

Paddys would have been in this list just a few years ago.
So things can change?

Yes, and that shows the alleged harmony, doesn't it?
Now something from main stream media. Tell me what you find harmonious and uplifting about Swedish multiculturalism:




Never did I hear about racial riots or acts of violence in Poland before 1987. Do such acts happen now? If so, why?

swedish rape statistics (text in swedish based on facts collected 1997-2001)
bra.se/dynamaster/file_archive/051214/e7dae113eb493479665ffe649e0edf57/1brottslsveutland.pdf

Page 71 shows 41% of crime is by 1st or 2nd generation immigrants. This rises to 57% in the case of rape or attempted rape.

Using figures on page 27 and 41 of the Bra report:

3,273,856 people in the study (covering peopole aged between 15 and 51) had both parents born in Sweden. 0.04% of these are rapists: 1309

548,555 people with at least one parent born abroad, 0.08% of these are rapists: 439

574,781 people born abroad. 0.22% of these are rapists: 1276.

0.22% / 0.04% = 5.5 !! Migrants are 5.5 times more likely to be a rapist.

Total rapists: 1309+439+1276= 3024, of whom the Swedes, 1309, account for 43%.

There were more of you, but I can't remember all the names. The whole argument about multiculturalism got messy and incoherent. To make my position clear, if you care to know it, here it is.

1. Poland is mostly polish, and I'm happy about that. I wish it were more Polish. I came here hoping to live something different, only to find the same busy streets, ugly apartment buildings, huge commercial centers that superbound in my memories of home and other cities like Paris. So in a sense I feel robbed of an exciting experience, I wanted true Polish culture, but the streets, the TV, the people, look just like their counterparts in other big cities in the world. (I know there are true-blue polish parts, hopefully I'll have a look before I leave.

2. I get stared at a lot here, that bothers me, but it was to be expected, I'm
already getting over it.

-what wasn't to be expected was the number of mean-spirited bigots here, not
huge, but too much for comfort. And another worrisome trend is the skinhead,
hooligan culture among the youth that should just be dealt with somehow. Not
just for my sake, but for the sake of a peaceful football match for Christ's sake.

3. I support multiculturalism as long as its genuine, and it's not forced. In the US the tension between whites and blacks plays out mostly between whites and African-Americans, whose ancestors were forced there and mistreated up until recently. The black immigrants who migrated to the US during the 20th century are much better off.

4. I don't think Poland should be made into a multicultural haven, but immigration shouldn't be actively resisted. B!tch out your parliamentarians for tighter immigration rules, but don't B!tch out the people for finding your country appealing.

So this was just to make clear that I'm not against Poland being so completely homogenous. Perhaps instead of it being 98% polish, I think it could be 90% polish, 10% foreign, just so as to give a certain degree of representation to the minorities that will always be here no matter what.

things can change and they are changing as we speak. That is all I will add to this thread.The topic of this thread is very RACIST indeed.


excellent point, however, Poland has a long way to go and with mulsticulturalism come both: the good and the bad. Usually the majority (in this case Polish people) will feel treatened by the arrival of other nationalities, since they are not used to accomodating those people's needs and differances.

Looking at the examples of other countries where multicultaralism is present and growing, one needs to remember that it was a LONG way, before things started to be the way they are now. Eg. Canada's government just last week issued an official apology to Native people who were the victims of residencial schools. Therefore, the process takes time and in my opinion Poland is not ready for an official multiculturalism for many reasons. One on them may be that even though is it easy to say, it is more diffucult to implement it in a legal way and I think that most people have a problem with accepting multiculturalism laws, since they make other nationalities protected, which makes them equal or sometimes even privilidged in some cases.

miranda
But it seems as if lines are being drawn, those lines are constantly changing, so how do we know who is who and what is what?

This all reminds me of South Africa
On the one hand you have aparthide and on the other you have reverse racism, where uneducated blacks are picked over educated whites because they are black.

If you catch what I mean.
Also you have to kinda look at who you are letting in, refugees are refugees, (some are not but the screening policy needs to be tightened.) i know Sweden lets lots of refugees live there who would otherwise probably be hunted down and murdered, they are not right in the head after what they have been through.

But no one wants to be a minority in their own country, labelled racist if they show pride in their traditions and nation.
And yet again I was disgusted before leaving Dublin about how intolerant some loud Dubliners were about "all the F***ing refugees comin ere F***ing everything up" considering we are a nation of refugees, 3.5 million irish in Ireland 70 million Irish in the world,

It is a tight rope.


I think this thread is quite good and deserves to be discussed, the more insights the better.

I don't really think you can 'implement' multiculturalism. But I think the government here is trying to encourage it in some parts, like Warsaw, but mostly amon the business class of course. The Euro2012 is another factor, more foreigners will come through here than ever before! Wonder how that's gonna play out with Polish hooligans...

If you hadn't made it obvious you were black then you might not be having such a response to your posts from certain members of our community. Not that any of the named parties are racist or anything

Others ? If you didn't write "I'm black" (btw you aren't, you are brown) a hundred times in 60 posts and didn't make us watch your smiled brown selfness all the time then no one here would care what your race is.


An issue ? So damn bastards are staring at you ? Horrible. I'm sure in Nigeria or Japan they wouldn't stare at me.

Good point, masks98 should have told noone and then came out of the closet when he had everyone right where he wanted ? lol


It does seem that everyone is calling everyone else racist but saying they are not.
I also think some people are confused to what a racist is, not that I am an expert but I think we can all see it in each other?

The first time I saw a black person was as a 4 year old and near the university in Kraków, my dad said 'look a Muzyn' took me on his shoulders and pointed in the direction to look, then we went to the zoo, maybe thats why I remember this day - it is one of my first memories. I did see like 4 more until we left for germany 1988.

Quite right. Some of the more foolish posters on this forum confuse calling someone a silly knutt with racism. Oh well.

that's not racism. That's sexism ;)

Yup, all those -isms are often abused, but they appear to be handy to some for the lack of real arguments.

Instead of harping on about what you don't like, as well as setting quotas for the perfect Poland, why don't you tell us what you like and enjoy about the country.

I think masks98 likes walking down the street with his girlfriend and everyone supposedly looking at him. Some people get a buzz out of being different and we all have ego's with the exception of one. So maybe masks98 is telling us what he likes.

masks98 do you like being the only gay in the village ?(I hope you get the reference and do not think I am calling you gay, reference from a English comedy called "little britain")

I already did in other posts. I mentioned the hospitality of people here, everytime I've been in someone's home it's been a blast, abundant food. I like my students they're cool. I like the weather, my friends are all frying in New York while I'm prancing around in fair weather. I like my girlfriend, she's Polish. I like Zamosc, I like the old town there, I like the nature. I think the cemeteries look cool and scary.

No New Yorker likes being stared at, it's like capital offense number 1 in the street - don't stare, and when you get caught doing it, look away. The shocking thing here is that people continue staring even when you catch them, that's been mentioned by a few people on here, it's pretty funny

Visit them at night on November 1st. Then they are cool, scary and beautiful.

I was shocked when I first came here, that everyone goes out to the graveyards around Halloween (an Irish festival, most think it American) Although the meaning has changed to the dead rising, trick or treat etc...

They are beautiful.

No fool I'm talking about people in the streets of Poland making my race an issue. I can't halt them and have a reasoned debate with them. So I come here and vent about it, most ignore it, some respond, and so far I've learned a lot. So it was a rather good idea of mine.

And being stared at is annoying, but I'm getting over it. What's worse were when I was called Czarnuch or somethin glike that. Or another time when I was taunted for no reason. And the frowns when I hold my girlfriend's hand. I can complain

I was referring to how other people have handled the replies in this thread and it was a generalization on my part. Perhaps even laziness since I have clear views on race in general and everybody is equal to me. I can dislike somebody for their personality but never for the race because it is a theoretical concept. I rather reffer to people based on teir culture they grew up in, including thei rpersonal stories but never on their race.


I would not call this a revrse racism, but giving the opportunity to those who didn't have it in the past. We had some examples of that in Canada in the 80 when multiculturalism had to be implemented with the laws and the so called "reversed racism" came into play in hiring practices.


Yes and No. it really depends on the individual case. The truth is that when admitting refugees into the coutry, it is really hard to prove if their stories of abuse are true. I am not sure how it is done in Ireland, but I know that in Canada it is really hard to prove the thread if the country of origin is not violating the human rights of their citizens. Canada actually has a profile including the political situation in regards to human rights abuse and bases the entrances on those guidelines.


I am not familiar with their guideliness therefore I am not going to comment on that issue.


showing pride has nothing to do with RACSIM.


I don't think it is. It takes objectivity to resolve those issues and most people who are not in the field have partial info on how the immigrants effect their countries.

I would jus tlike to point out that there are several reasons for bringing the immigants into the country and one major one is a bug supply of cheap labour. If the labours want to have more than just work, but also life, which involves being part of the community , they need to feel welcomed, not being treaed like second category citizens.


I agree, but most Irish feel like part of the community they immigrated to, however it took a while to establish where they are now. They are an important make up of those countries. They would understand, but those who never immigrated cannot relate to immigrants and take an easy way out by saying that immigrants are to blame. It is an example of a scapegot situation.

i live in a city with more than 50% immigrant population and perhaps I am not really threatened by it. Actually, I am very OK witih it. Why wouldn't I be. Canada took me in as well.

Well, it is time to go out and experiance some more multiculturalism. The summer is here.

miranda
My point was really that their can not be a line if it is constantly changing. I meant, like the list earlier and the bad things "they" bring, Irish would definitely have been on that list years ago.


Is it the reverse part that the problem is? if one race gets something over another, is that not racist? My problem with that was the education part or lack there of.


Agreed, but my point is that refugees are asylum seekers. I think it has lost it's meaning to many people. And of course I mean the majority who are genuine.


I am also not familiar with Swedens guidelines, but I am Norway's. My ex-girlfriend was a refugee there, it was a good insight.


It really depends on where you are from, it can be manipulated. The orange men marching down the garvaghy road banging their drums is considered pride by some and provocation by others. I have seen St.Georges day being munipulated by the national front, to make England Ethnically clean.


Of course, a country would not allow people in if they did not need them, it would not make sence.
ha ha ha, I do not think you will find many business owners complaining.


I was amazed at the speed it happened, over night, Irish people got a few quid and forgot their history, I must again state it was a minority of very loud Dubliners. And And people will always find scapegoats.


Nice points, I thought you'd be a good contribution, thanks

you have a very small mind

Wtf???? Never mind Poland, you really NEED to visit the UK if that's what you think - you haven't seen anything yet!


Multi-ethnic, yes. Multi-racial... no.

When did Poland last have a significant Black population?
Or, for that matter, how many African countries have a significant White population?

And why isn't anyone encouraging multiculturalism in Africa? What's wrong with a few million whites moving to Africa and sleeping with your women? I bet you would display your "dissatisfaction" with that rather quickly. I bet you also have no problem with "homogeneity" in Black countries either.

How dare you express "dissatisfaction with Poland's ethnic composition" - if that's not racist, i don't know what is! Poland is Poland, and Poles are White, Slavic, Europeans - face it! I have no problem with the "ethnic composition" of Black African Zulu/Zhosa/Kikuyu etc regions, so how dare you insult MY motherland!!!!

Where on earth do you live? no offence but either you live in a town/city that is very secluded with 1 race only, in that case i suggest you should get out now and explore or you are blind, again, no offence.


the most stupidist reason not to mix, you get 2 examples which im guessing are just hearsay, youve never met these people, and you shouldnt speak for all Iranian men, thats wrong, especially if you are not Iranian yourself. Polish men use Polish women too and then marry a woman from another country, it doesnt matter what race or nationality you are, and FYI, HIV is WORLDWIDE GLOBAL, not just from Africa, dont believe everything you hear on the T.V love.

I think you will find that in little, old England... even with it's high population of non-whites, the ratio of black women - white men is very low. So it stands to reason that a mixed race child from such a relationship would also be rare.

We have spoken about this before on the forum.

Are you from England? If so which part? If you are in England, no matter if your in the small villages, you would be aware of interracial relationships, on t.v or something? lol, i guess where im from i see different races together everyday which is normal anyway, where one race really (human) just different eyes, hair types and skin lol :)

I'm in Poland, but well aware of events in England.

two questions: based on your friends in interracial relationships.

How many are black man - white woman ?
How many are black woman - white man ?

I think you will find that the ratio is not equal.

i know around 3


I know 2 black girls with Polish white men, i know 2 black girls that have been with Indians, and i know 1 Indian girl with a white english guy, 1 black girl and the list goes on not to mention my bulgarian friend with an english guy, i have friends who are white but from different nationalities. as i said before, where im from its not unusual, its everyday, my personal experiences and everday life

You don't quite answer my questions, but you do address the point above. I'm intrigued by your reply. thanx.

Don't demean a nation Mr S!