News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]

Apologies, I didn't intend to come across as hostile mate.

Its just considering the Polish history and in particular with Eastern Poland/Western Ukraine, Poles should know better than to try to impose their will on another nation, or try to steal land.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]

First, it seems bizzare that Poles should be making decisions as to the fate of Kaliningrad and its people.
Is it not a bit like Stalin & Churchill giving Lwow to Ukraine?
What authority does Poland have to do this?

Second, I don't understand why they should let Poland own the area. It makes the least possible sense.
The Poles are hostile toward Russia and pro-American/pro-Nato.
President Kennedy wasn't too pleased about Kruschev have missiles in Cuba, if you recall, lol.

Poland have absolutely zero rights and zero territorial claim over Kaliningrad.
Poland has failed to develop the vast territory it already does own.
If Kaliningrad were to be "given" to anyone, it should be given to a smaller country, with similar market and economic conditions, similar language, geographically linked etc. etc.

Third, its up to the people of Kaliningrad to decide what happens with Kaliningrad. Those whole topic is really becoming quite bizzare, lol.

What do you think the Americans would say if the Mexicans started discussing Texas and determining its future and why it should be given back to Mexico?

There happens to be 25 million Texans who speak English or Spanish and consider themselves strictly American, lol.

Also,
What about France "giving" French Guiana back to Brazil?
What about USA "giving" South Korea back to North Korea?
What about USA "giving" Alaska back to Russia?
What about UK "giving" Falklands back to Argentina?

Literally hundreds of examples of this, could be here all day

==========

Borrka, much better post this time, thanks for that.
I will respond this evening as I'm at work at the moment.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]

Nathan,
If you have read my previous posts, you would understand that this is precisely what my accounts are based on.
I have been to Lithuania numerous times, I have many Lithuanian and Latvian friends and a few Estonian ones. I have friends from Belarus, from Ukraine & used to be friendly with many Georgians, although I find them hard work.

I work with Slovakians, Hungarians, Romanians.

My partner is Russian, her family are from Smolensk, however she grew up in Lithuania.
Russia is too vast to understand the country, however, I understand Poland and Lithuania and I understand the mentality of the people.
Last summer, I rented a car in Kaunas and drove across the whole of Lithuania and into other countries. It was an excellent experience.
I have been to Russian nightclubs in Lithuania such as "Metelica", I never saw anything like this in Poland (although I did see a few Irish pubs)

Kaunas is the most Lithuanian city, with the smallest percentage of Russian people.
Its also probably the most hostile city in Lithuania.
People from other cities are far more friendly.
In my house, we have Russian Satellite Television, which also carries Polish and Lithuanian channels.
I'm not sure how many Eastern European citizens you have in Canada, but I can assure you, we have many different cultures and nationalities here in Ireland.

Of course, it was a big shock for me to see the truth about Lithuania, as I had heard such wild lies from the Polish. They Polish seem to think they are 'untermensch'.

Later, I learned that the Poles seem to think everyone is 'untermensch', LOL.

In truth, my Irish friends are those I know from childhood.
Otherwise, all of the people I met on a daily basis are immigrants, including my partner and my best friends (1 from Warsaw, 1 from Klaipeda).

I imagine its very difficult to understand if you've never been to this country, but I guess you could equate it to New York........a melting pot.

Its not as easy for other Irish people as it is for me, this is because I love to learn languages, so I speak some Russian and some Polish, and small bits of other languages.

The only languages you actually need to know are Russian and English.
I wouldn't have wasted my time learning Polish in the past if I had understood the importance and usefulness of Russian.
But it is also useful to know what Poles are saying about you and you get better service from Polish women when they hear you speak Polish (not so true with the men, who sometimes find it intimidating, as they have lost their advantage, however, the men always appreciate my size and my strength and ask me what do I think of Mariusz Pudzianowski, and some of the men find it amusing to hear an Irishman speak Polish - most usually ask what city I am from in Poland, HAHAHA)

The picture is something like this - the citizens of former soviet countries stick together, Russians, Latvians, Lithuanians, Estonians, Ukranians and even the Georgians (many have Lithuanian passports) because many can speak Russian, frequently, many of them have a Russian grandfather or grandmother. They also mix with Irish. Hungarians and Romanians also mix with these groups.

The Western European nations like Spain, France, Italy stick together. And of course they mix with Irish. Sometimes they mix with other groups, but much less so.

The Poles mix with nobody except the Irish.
The Russians don't like to mix with them, the Lithuanians don't like to mix with them.........generally it is only the Irish who mix with them.

Its not the rule in all cases, but it is the rule in the majority of cases.

The Poles are like the outsiders in this society in a sense. The difference is that there are so many Poles here, it doesn't really matter, because a Pole can go through a whole day here not needing to speak English.

e.g. Go to a polish shop, go to the gym with Polish friends, speak Polish with friends at work, girl in shopping centre and Petrol station will be Polish, we even have a few Polish Police now.

I do my best to change this, I am friends with both Poles and former Soviets, so I always introduce them to each other at the gym and we train together.

Once people sweat and experience pain together, they are less suspicious of each other.
Both sides have they pre-conceptions about the other, but they always throw them in the bin quickly once they met people and speak with them.

Most people are good if you give them a chance.


Not holdng a certificate, nor have an expert qualification does not exclude one from participating in a subject.
Otherwise,.............. how would would one become an expert? ;-)

I'm more than comfortable to share my opinions and experiences, regardless of what you say, as I believe I have far more realistic impression of the reality of the situation than you have.

I have been free to form impressions and understand the truth, without any emotional or nationalist attachment.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


Shea, Is ea e Gaeilge, ana mhaith ar fad.
An dtuigeann tu Gaeilge freisin?

Very good Borrka, enjoy your trip.
While you are away, you should think about these statements and then we will have a proper discussion when you return instead of bickering.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


Borrka, have you ever spoken to a psychiatrist?
There are people who can help you.
I've just forwarded the url of this thread to a colleague, and he thinks you are psychologically ill.

I wonder, have you ever had an argument with a wall?

Its now rather apparent why the Russians dislike you, no doubt you lambasted them for being Chinese.


Quite simple indeed.
You're all fluff and no substance.
And you wildly jump from point to point without ever making a conclusive statement on anything.


Please don't be so foolish, condescending or arrogant as to assume you can determine what is and what is not relevant to a debate. Even if you had the intellectual capacity, you do not have any authority.

Q. If one were to exclude personal experience from this debate - what is left to offer ?
A. Propaganda & rehashed biased historical accounts.

Borrka, I am actually laughing out loud now, HAHAHA :)


Didn't you just say personal experiences & commentary are off the discussion table?
Gasp! Again contradicting yourself.


No, I don't speak Gaelic, as you said. Gaelic is from Scotland.
I speak Gaeilge (Irish).


Did you think it was a ridiculous statement? Why?
(Sweet Jesus, its feels as though I've encountered the PolishForums AI simulator)

Do you know how to contradict a statement Borrka?
Are you capable of giving anything other than a binary answer?


Hello Borrka, my name is Dan.
Hello Borrka, my name is Dan.
Hello Borrka, my name is Dan.

Honest question, do you have alzheimer's?
Refer to your previous comment about how I have an expert certification in Eastern European studies among my peers in Irish Pubs.


So Software is the field which I have studied, academically.
I'm never claimed to be an expert on Eastern Europe, and I didn't study EE politics or history in University, my degree is in Computer Science, not EE Studies.


Lol, diffuse lectures.
Do you suffer from Attention Deficit disorder?.

Since you have cherry picked statements from my accounts, it is you who has determined the discussion here, you simpleton.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

HAHAHA!
Let me get this straight.
You have just asked me to prove..............that YOU do NOT hate Russians?

This is the most moronic thing I have ever heard in my life.

Borrka, go back to sleep.


I fear you are correct about this.
Even if God blessed me with temporary insanity in order to try and understand you, it still wouldn't be sufficient.

You are like a black hole of insanity - you suck in all common sense and logic and exterminate it.

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]

LOL, Jay, you're correct mate, I had also forgotten about Daniel O'Connells reply.

Cheers for that :)

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]



Sweet Lord, give me patience.
Borrka, you have a brain like a sieve.
You still continue to contradict yourself at every given opportunity.
I would rather not repeat your bigoted spiel, but view posts #36, #38, #40, #103

A lecture on eristics would be wasted on you, first you would need to comprehend logic.


Yet you again fail to explain why.
Yawn.........

Have you considered a career in international espionage?
Trying to extract a coherent answer from you from you is as futile as attempting to draw blood from a rock.


Your message is clear as crystal:
1) You cannot answer a question directly
2) Your comprehensive skills in written English need work
3) You are bigoted against Russia and the Russian people but you cannot explain why.
4) You are afraid to elaborate on the simplistic generalisations which you have offered.
5) You cannot hold a debate.

Continue, please.
If Germans had understood the mindset of Hitler, who hated without reason, perhaps there would have been no War.
If non-Russians understand the mentality of those who hate Russians without reason, the world will ultimately be a safe place.

Perhaps, in your own manic method, you are doing a great service to humanity?


I suspect you've never asked anyone a question in your life.

You were born both omnipotent and omniscient, correct?
The chip on your shoulder was not innate however, that was acquired.


Amazingly enough, I'm Irish and don't drink any alcohol at all.
I can't remember the last time I was in a pub other than to work in a 2nd job.
I am interested in bodybuilding and far prefer it to alcohol.
You can click on my profile and check my 2nd picture if you don't believe me.

As for my expert certification, my field is Software, not tinpot dictatorship.
I don't claim to have any expert or correct opinion on anyone or anything.
I do however, consider myself an open minded individual and am more than willing to give anybody the benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise.


How nice of you giving me the chance to express my opinion?
Oh wait, you didn't, I'm arrogant for doing so of course.
And I don't expect any revenge in Irish.


As a matter of fact, your English is not bad.
Its your comprehensive skills which are poor and your inability to make coherent points.
You don't seem to understand how to interpret any of the points I am making.

I recongise your style of reasoning very well, as I was in a relationship with a Polish woman for 3 years. The Emperor has no clothes.

I make a point, then you disagree with me by reiterating the same point.(??lol)
Or else I make a point, and you disagree with a different point which I have not even made(lol).
In either case, you don't explain why you are disagreeing, simply that you are disagreeing and throw in a few weak quips, an attack on Russians and a feather in your cap about what an expert you are.


You answered a question!!!!!
If you could do this for all the other questions, we may actually get a discussion going.

In conclusion, I plead with you, enlighten me.
Elaborate on your earlier comments about the herd mentality etc.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


You have just reiterated my last point.
I think we have a communication problem before we even reach a difference of opinion.
Either that or you are a few sandwiches short of a picnic.


LOL, well, luckily for me and unluckily for you, we have democracy and freedom of speech.

Can you really not see the irony in all these things you are saying?
Its like the pot calling the kettle black.
i.e. there is one rule for you and a different rule for the Russians.


If someone says "Irish are a kind of Englishmen" - thats fine by me.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
All I would ask of a person who said that is:

1. how is this so?
2. why do you believe this to be true?
Do you understand me?

You're entitled to your opinion, but unless you qualify it with proof or experience i.e. unless you give some type of reasoning, they it remains just an opinion, and a worthless one in my view because its no different to the standard Polish dogma.


If you cannot see the connection, then why are you tackling a much larger issue i.e. Polish/Russian relations

You should learn to crawl before you try to run Borrka.


I could equally say, if you don't know how to use English adequately, you should hardly attempt to write it/speak it - but I haven't said that to you.

I tolerate your grammatical and syntax errors because I can read between the lines and guess where necessary.

The same cannot be said of your opinion. Unless you justify it, it simply sounds like mindless, bigoted propaganda.
As for my knowledge on this subject, lol, I have already demonstrated my knowledge in depth and specifically, whereas your last two posts have been simply a facade about how knowledgeable you are, yet the most direct and conclusive statement you have offered is "Russians tend to live in collectives driven by herd instinct".

All fluff & no substance.

What is it that makes your opinion of Russia so valid?
As far as I understand, you speak Russian............and thats it.
I met a Chineseman once who spoke Irish, but had never visited Ireland.

I honestly doubt I could learn anything from you, because you mindless recite your brainwashed propaganda like a zombiefied North Korean, and when I ask you to qualify the propaganda, you give a spiel about how qualified you are. LOL.

However, I would love to have a discussion on the subject, rather than the emperor's lack of clothes.

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Wellesley,_1st_Duke_of_Wellington

Wellington said "Being born in a stable, doesn't make you a horse".
Referring to Jesus Christ.

Wellington was born in Ireland, but claimed to be British (English I think).
This was before the Act of Union in 1801.

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]


He has lived in America during his formative years, been educated in America, practises American customs, experienced American culture (probably has an America accent) and probably calls Florida home.

I don't see how he cannot be considered American.


In that scenario, you would be Anglo-Irish.
I should have known you had Irish heritage, you're too logical to be anything else unlike the rest of these maniacs ;)

P.S. Do you remember what Wellington said? ;-)

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


Quite correct, I don't understand you at all.

You said originally,


You focused on a range of topics of similarity between the Dutch and Germans.

and now:



The linguistic issues, while still being equally relevant, were merely an aside.
You were originally focusing on the mentalities, not languages.


Do you understand the definition of the word arrogant?

You have suggested that I am arrogant for giving my opinion?
You should also research the word "irony".

While not expert, I also have knowledge of German, Polish, and Russian (and French and Irish).


Yet you don't share their skill in debate or logical reasoning??
A tragedy.


I disagree.
You made a broad, sweeping, innacurate, stereotypical generalisation. A.K.A Nonsense.


I have qualified all of my statements with reasoning or experience.
You have yet to qualify any.
If you need clarification on any point I have raised or opinion I have offered, I am more than willing.

This is the nature of debate.
If you can't handle a debate without throwing your toys out of the pram, you shouldn't make baseless assertions.

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]


I guess we differ here Shelly girl, I would say he was American and not Polish.

Part of my family came to Ireland from Somerset 400 years ago during the Munster plantations, but I am Irish, of Anglo-Irish extraction.

My GF would be Russo-Lithuanian, ethnic Russian.

If you grew up in America, you are American.
If you grew up in America, and are of Irish/Polish/African ethnicity, then you are Irish-American, Polish-American, African-American.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


You still missed my point, but anyway............

Dutch is Low Franconian as opposed to Modern German.
Same Family, different Branch.
Same situation as Western Slavic Polish & Eastern Slavic Russian.
Same Family, different Branch.

I speak German (not very well anymore) and I cannot understand Dutch .
My brother in law is a German native, lives in Germany with my sister.
They do not understand Dutch, although he can understand some Dutch text, despite the many false cognates.

On the other hand, when I spoke Polish reasonablly well, I could understand and communicate to a limited degree with Russians, before I actually learned Russian.

Linguistically, Polish and Russian are closer than German and Dutch, and share more cognates.

Germans can understand some Dutch text, but not Dutch speech.
Poles can understand some Russian speech (choose/pretend not to tho), but not Russian text (unless they can read cyrillic, in which case, they could decipher a lot)

You are incorrect about the other points. Historically & Democratically, Holland is closer to England than Germany.
The Dutch founded New Amsterdam (A.K.A New York).
The Dutch had an empire, a strong navy, William of Orange etc.
Most of the German Empire was in Africa and European conquest.
Germany didn't even exist until very recently anyway.

In terms of democratic values and social system and ideology, they share some traits with Germany, but share equally many with France and England.


This is textbook propaganda and a very blind study.
It would be foolish to assert that Orthodoxy has not influenced Russia, of course it has, but don't forget religion was illegal in Russia for 3 generations.

There are many known problems between Vladivostock and Moscow, or Moscow and other cities, who feel they shouldn't be compelled to listen to Moscow for direction.

Same is true of New York, Los Angeles & Washington.
Or London, Paris, Berlin, Rome & Brussels


This is complete nonsense.
Russia is the largest country on Earth, across 2 continents, among the most diverse nations and has over 150 million people.

Many of the Poles here are law abiding, some liberal, some authoritarian.
Many young poles are far from individualist, they are very trendy and up to date with the latest fashions and subscribe to all the MTV non-individualist things that Russians subscribe to.


This is true of some people, equally untrue of many other people.
I can say the exact same of some Republicans and some Unionists in Ireland.
Nothing is so black and white.


You must offer some facts with evidence, or share some specific experiences.
Otherwise, you are just repeating the same Polish propaganda I learned to ignore a long time ago, broad sweeping generalisations.


I don't even understand this sentence.
What does it mean?


I don't believe you are stone age creatures, I am trying to kill this myth..........of both Russia and Poland.
If you want to see stone age creatures, visit Somalia or Sudan.

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]

To be fair, I've not been to Poland in a few years, so perhaps the other person is right.
A lot of the truth on this forum happens off the board, not on it.

Ethnic Pole is someone of Polish lineage, A Polish national would be like someone who grew up in the country.
I just wasn't clear on your perspective.

Your an ethnic-Polish American, so it shows you probably don't know what to expect, as opposed to a Polish National who grew up there, knows the country and is wondering what peoples opinions are.

(Like a Pole asking you about Florida - if you understand me)

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]

Are you a Polish national or ethnic Polish?

I think you should go bro, I don't think you'll have any problems.

USA, Canada / Polish stuff vs. American stuff [107]

You cannot really compare.
The USA is not just a country, but virtually a continent.

You will find more diversity in two American states e.g. Texas, NY, California, New England, than you will find in the entire country of Poland.

Indeed, you will find more diversity in either California or NY than you will find in a large chunk of Eastern Europe.

Equally, as larger European countries go, Poland is rather uniform.

Love / Where did you meet your Polish other half? [33]

There was a burning building.
I heard a young child crying out, but no one was there to help just a bunch of panicing women and some girly-men.

I knew only I could fix this situation.
I ripped off my t-shirt and selflessy ran into the burning building.
There was a big metal door, which I tore down with my bare hands. Then there was a backdraft.
Flames belched forth and licked my eyebrows clean off.
I put my own safety last and ran to the baby.
A pillar collapsed behind me and my exit was blocked, so I grabbed the baby and hurled it forth from the window, into a deep pond. The baby was saved.

My exit was blocked and with nowhere to run, I collapsed from all the Carbon Monoxide and nearly died from smoke inhalation.

She was the paramedic in the ambulance that treated me.
She was the first sight I saw when I came back to consciousness.
I thought she must be an Angel!

(Caveat Emptor: Nobody told me about the part where Angels try to rob large quantities of money from your bank account)

Love / POLISH GUY AND BLACK GIRL! [52]

To the OP,
in truth, it could be 50/50, it could really go either way.
The only place I ever saw a dark skinned woman in Poland was at the airport.

You could go through the whole of Warsaw, without seeing a non-white person.
In the rural regions, this would be normal, but I thought this was strange in the big cities.
I've heard its changed a bit nowadays tho.

Even tho I'm Irish, I look like I am from Spain/Turkey and I am big because I enjoy bodybuilding.
There were many people who nearly tripped over themselves staring at me. Not just women, but lots of older men too.
You would think they were homosexual, they stared that much.
So all I can say is to be prepared for lots of staring.

But in truth, despite the staring, everybody was really friendly.
I think I was one of the first Irish people they had ever met and I was half decent at Polish so they were probably excited/proud. Many of them were really happy that I could identify with them, like talking about Pudzianowski, they thought this was brilliant that foreigners had heard about a contemporary Pole.

Sometimes when I am in Lithuania, I try to keep my voice lowered or speak only Russian if there are young guys around, its the safest option at times. In the summer, you can tell I am not Eastern European from the first glance, although many people think I am Russian when my skin returns to a lighter colour.

I don't know why, but I feel like Polish people are more accepting from the outset than Lithuanians for example. Lithuanian people really shocked me at how rude they were and how suspicious they are. They are far nicer when you know them personally, but when the people don't know you on the street, they simply see you as competition. Its normal to stand on people to get to the bus first.

Polish manners and customs are a lot closer to us in reality.

As for family, well, my ex-girlfriends family couldn't have been nicer.
Her grandparents may aswell have been Irish only for the fact that they spoke Polish.
Her whole family were really nice people, but I got on the best with her mother.
Even today, sometimes I still miss speaking with her mom, lol.

So anyway, some people will probably admire your black beauty, and others will be scared of you, but most people should be ok. Just expect a little staring.

And make sure that he tells his mother in advance that you are black.
I made sure for my GF to tell her mother in advance I was Irish.

My mother has no problems with any of my girlfriends and gets on great with all of them, but she still secretly wishes I had an Irish girlfriend, even tho thats not what I want.

Same for Polish parents.
Probably the same for your parents too I guess.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]

Southern, this is the truth :)

I had to explain to a group of people that Poles have computers and houses.
They believed that the Poles lived in caves because they didn't have money to build houses.

Many people are completely ignorant of Poland and still believe the propaganda from the Cold War.

UK, Ireland / POLES SUPERIOR TO BRITS? [260]

LOL, at least you guys have a sense of humour anyway, hahaha :D
Cheers

@Piorun, Ana mhaith ar fad, ach cheapim go bhful an uisce bheatha ufasach, an firsceal, ni maith liom aon alcol
(Bardzo dobry, ale mysle, ze whisky jest straszne, rzeczywiscie, ja nie lubie alkoholu )

UK, Ireland / POLES SUPERIOR TO BRITS? [260]


Nicely summarised, imo.

Matyjasz, I didn't take the thread seriously, its just that sometimes it feels so nice to give some of the more arrogant Poles a taste of their own medicine :)

Sometimes, this is how I see Polish people:
Irishman: God, I love orange juice
Englishman: Me too, I love orange juice and I like apple juice
American: Yea, I love apple juice, don't love OJ tho
Australian: I don't like either, but I enjoy cranberry juice
French: I like all 3
German: I love all 3!
Polish: POLAND HAS THE BEST JUICE IN THE WORLD, RA RA RA. ALL OTHER JUICE IS SH1T COMPARED TO POLAND, RA RA RA. WHEN YOU DRINK POLISH JUICE, YOUR WHOLE BODY HAS NINE ORGASIMS, AND IF YOU DRINK NON-POLISH JUICE, YOUR TEETH ROT AND YOU SH1T YOURSELF INVOLUNTARILY, RA RA RA

;)

UK, Ireland / POLES SUPERIOR TO BRITS? [260]

I've a better idea Ironside, why don't you explain why Poland is superior to Britain?
Is it because you cannot? :-)

I read the thread and it was the usual misinformed Polish tripe about how the Brits sold them out (ignoring the fact that the Soviet Union had the biggest strongest army in the world which was already mobilised), the Brits never attacked Hitler (ignoring Chamberlin and Dunkirk), the Brits only defended Poland to protect her empire (even though she lost her empire in said defence of Poland).

Poles seem to forget the Molotov/Ribbentrop pact & the fact that Hitler wanted to preserve the British Empire initially (read it in Mein Kampf if you doubt).

The British did not actually have to fight at all.
Hitler believed they were true aryan people and wanted them as his allies.

Poles conveniently tend to forget that the Soviet Union was the superpower in this side of the world, what exactly did they expect Britain to do?

If it was so easy, why didn't the Poles just not surrender to Hitler in the first place - then we would never had this mess!?

Poles are so ignorant of the facts, they don't even realise that FDR & Stalin were on good terms and Churchill was simply the third wheel.

I have had this conversation with many Poles, and the one common theme is that they never acknowledge the true facts, but instead twist them in order to alleviate themselves of their national shame and defer the blame to someone else.

You need to read about Poland's aggressive movement post 1918 to get the full picture.

The most bizzare issue is the fact that Poland has her own completely independent history of the war, which doesn't correlate with any Allied or Axis accounts.

When we learn history in school, we are taught that the Russians defeated Hitler in Europe, the British defeated Hitler in Africa, and the Americans liberated Western Europe and beat the Japanese.

The Poles have a mere mention in similar terms as the French resistance.

Yet, when you discuss this history with a Pole, they would have you believe that the Poles actually defeated Hitler and the Russians simply arrived in time to kill their scholars.

If the Poles were so virile, why didn't they just defeat the Russians too?

UK, Ireland / POLES SUPERIOR TO BRITS? [260]

Poles superior to Brits?
Lets see....................

Language:
English is the global language, language of science, aviation and computing.
Fail.

Science:
Britain led the scientific world for 2-300 years and still at the forefront
Fail.

Empire:
Britain had the largest empire the world has ever seen
Fail.

Wealth:
Britain is one of the wealthiest countries in the World
Fail.

Industry:
Britain was the first industrialised country in history and led the industrial revolution.
Fail

Music:
Britian had the highest proportion of successful recording artists in the 20th century, and little know acts such as The Beatles, The Stones, Pink Floyd.

Fail.

Military:
Britain is one of the 5 SEC Cardholders on the UN council, one of the first members of the nuclear club, and one of the higest military budgets in the world.

Fail.

War:
Britain was on the winning side in 2 World Wars and held out against Hitler by themselves until Russia crippled the Germans.
Fail.

Global cities:
London is one of the five global Cities.
Fail.

Legacy:
Former British colonies such as Canada, Australia, the United States are the among the most progressive countries in the world.
Fail.

Its clear, the British are a drastic failure.
(Sad state of affairs when an Irishman has to stick up for the Brits ;)

History / Territories of eastern Germany should rightfully belong to Poland? [161]

Not sure if the OP is a troll, but just wondering if the OP is aware that Lithuania was at one stage the biggest country in Europe?

Austro-Hungarian Empire?

How about giving Poland and France back to Germany?
Or to Russia?
French Empire under Napoleon?
Persia?
The British Empire was the biggest Empire the world has ever seen, why not put it back together too?

The only people who determine what rightfully belongs to where are, the democratic majority or the people with the biggest guns.

News / EU regulations cost Poland 27,8 bilions euros so far [7]


canada-poland.com/files/EUStructuralFundsInfoForCompanies.pdf

Poland's National Convergence Strategy for 2007-2013. Under the current convergence
policy, 85.5 billion Euro has been earmarked for Poland; which includes 67.3 billion Euro from the EU budget - the remaining 18.2 billion will come from the Polish state budget

Complete non-issue in my opinion.
It is easy to take a very narrow view with a limited amount of information.

Poland has gained so much via EU Membership, its ridiculous to even consider Poland outside of the European Union.

Is there any viable alternative for Poland?
(FYI, I never met a Polish person in my entire life before November 11 2004, much less heard their language)

If Poland were a net contributor rather than a benefactor, such as Germany or Sweden, there may be an issue for debate. People who consider Ireland or Poland outside of the European Union have failed to ever give a solid rational reason why this should occur.

Its true that there is a lot of bureaucracy in the EU, and not are not terribly efficient.
However, local governments are even more inefficient.
I would be in favour of reform, equally I am certain that any country planning a future outside of the EU, without a valuable natural resource such as oil, may as well go join Iceland and prepare for catastrophe.

UK, Ireland / Poles flee N. Irleand homes after World Cup riots [70]

I would like to know how many of these people fleeing recently became unemployed.
There is always a deeper issue.
The media always over-sensationalise and twist every topic.

I'm not saying all, but I'm pretty sure some of them are simply taking advantage of an opportunity to end their tenancy early with a legitimate excuse.

Or some have moved for other reasons.
Certainly wouldn't be the first time I've seen this type of thing.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


Borrka, I'm not sure as to the level of your proficiency in English, but if you concluded that my point was that Polish & Russian people are one and the same, then you have badly misinterpreted everything I have written.

I suggest you revise my comments - starting with the point where I correlated the superficial similarities of Dutch & German with Polish & Russian, only in order to refute it.


I'm not sure as to where you were joking or what the joke is.
Regardless, your 'jokes' are simply stereotypes, which some Russians may find offensive.
Personally, I don't find them offensive as I don't believe in Nationalisim, I believe in individualisim, but I do find them irrational and somewhat pointless.

If you fail yet to comprehend why some Russians may dislike you, yet you persist with those opinions, then you should be empathic enough to reverse the situation and imagine that a Russian person is claiming that 70% of Poles are alcoholic, car thieves who eat sausages and drink everyday before noon.

Both you and I knew this is a nonsensical stereotype, so why allow it to subsist.

Many of my friends were frustrated with the opinions that Westerners had about their country, especially after Kaczynski made his remarks at the conference with Tony Blair about all emmigrant Poles being 'life failures, toilet cleaners' etc.

This was at the same conference where he made the highly controversial comments about homosexuals if you recall, prior to Tusk.

Perhaps the most poigniant issue is that the lies and misconceptions which you have re-iterated here about Russia and Russians, are precisely the same misconceptions which many Western Europeans hold about Poland.

If you knew how many times I had to fight ignorance and stereotypes about Eastern Europe. How many times I had to explain to people that Poles have electricity, computers, they live in houses and not caves, they are highly educated etc. etc. etc......

You probably believe from this forum that all Westerners know Poland is a civilised country. This is because all people who come to this forum have an interest in Poland, such as a business or a girlfriend.

But that is only a tiny percentage of the population.

In reality, many of the older generations in the West would have difficulty to point out Poland on a map, & they imagine parts of Poland to resemble a picture similar to what you would see in Stalingrad in WW2, or else to the Red Square in Moscow.

Many people can barely discern the difference between Poles & Russians, other than the fact that the Russians tend to be more orderly and quiet, and Poles are louder and more excitable (and their 'Kurwa' siren).


I don't understand why you are leaving the conversation, you haven't yet offered anything for discussion.
I would like to know where you developed your opinions on Russia and Russians?
Why do you perceive Kaliningrad to be a threat?

You may call it a lecture if you wish.
As I stated, I was just sharing my experiences based on reality, rather than opinions obtained from biased propaganda or an opinion shaped by mistrust, hatred or jealousy.


First, I should clarify that I don't take any personal offence to comments about Russians or Russia, and especially not because my partner is Russian.

My sole aim is to tackle some of the frequent lies and generalisations I hear spouted on a regular basis, frequently by people who really don't know what they are talking about.

Is it true to say that all Russians are warm, friendly, non-politicised, non-militant individuals?
No, of course not. But the vast majority of those I have met would be.

Many of the Poles I met had a deep set hatred in Russia, but didn't know why.
Ironically, these were the young people who neither spoke Russian nor had ever visited the country.
As a matter of fact, many of the older generation were beyond hatred, and were simply apathetic. They had a severe dislike of Germany however.

I am confused by your final comment I'm afraid.
The Poles are notorious for their euphemisims and romanticisim about Poland, it is well known that Poles believe they are the political centre of the Universe, as opposed to simply desiring to be so.

However, the Russians frequently have been and occassionally still are. Not in the same manner as the United States is today, but they were one of the two world powers for over half a century.

Perhaps it is jealousy on behalf of many Poles?

In closing, as I have clearly elaborated, my opinions haven't been acquired from another individual, especially my partner (in truth I hate to hear her talk about Russia, as my former Polish gilfriend practically used to write Poetry about how fantastic Poland was - so I have developed a potent dislike of such romanticisim)

My opinions are based on personal experiences, with my own eyes, my own feet and my own body.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]

I make no secret of my hatred for Romany Gypsies.
I despise them.
They come to this country to steal, to beg and to live off of us.
They never contribute anything to society.
If they approach me on the streets, I tell them go back to their own country..... I am neither violent nor aggressive, but I am assertive, and I tell them to go back to Romania.

They won't do this of course, unless the Irish government pay them, as they did in 2007 i.e. extorted money in order to return to Romania.

I don't work in nightclubs anymore, I became tired of it but when I used to, I often did this.
I was tired of seeing them indiscriminately rob Irish, English, Polish, Lithuanian, American, African, whoever...
It is normal for all doormen and many of the regular people on the street to shout abuse at them when the see them.

At first, I was idealistic, I thought they should be treated no differently than anyone else because of their dress or their beliefs.
Then of course, I saw the reality and learned why they so adequately deserve the reputation they have garnered.

I wouldn't expect you to understand and I'm sure I've already invoked Godwin's law and you already have already labelled me a fascist.

But I'm confident that when you visit this country or the UK, then then you yourself will begin to understand, and until then you will be forming opinions on issues of which you have no knowledge or experience.

Lets ignore the credit card scams and the bank machine card copying, I have seen a number of things done by Romany gypsies which genuinely shocked me.

I have seen them rob the homeless & the people who have nothing on the coldest winter nights.
I saw them rob a man who was hit by a car & later died, not concerned with calling an ambulance, simply in relieving him of his posessions.

I have seen them rob mobile phones from young boys and girls who learn to hate them from an early age.

My opinion is that anyone who wants to come to this country and this society to work and to contribute, should be allowed to do so, regardless of their religion, their skin colour or their nationality.

I have yet to see a Romany Gypsy contribute anything other than misery.
They are a plague upon us.

Lastly, I suggest you speak to a Romanian citizen about Romany Gypsies.
They are by far the most vehement in their hatred of the Romany Gypsies.
People see the Romany Gypsies on the street and immediately associate them with Romania.
Would it surprise you to learn that many Romanian people are ashamed to admit their nationality when they come to this country?


I assume you know the image of the Polish guy I'm speaking of.
The young 'blokars'/'kilar'/'biznezmen'.
Wearing their hoodies and their leather jackets.
Their chains.
All driving in black Bmws or Audis, with the windows tinted black.
Often drunk or on amphetamines.
Selling jobs, taking protection money from other Poles, selling cigarettes and doing 'Biznez' i.e. making profit from friends.
In truth you hear them long before you see them - the string of 'Kurwa', 'jebana sukiensyn' etc. etc.
These guys manage to use the word Kurwa as a verb, noun, adjective, adverb, preposition, conjuction etc. etc.
The most aggrivating thing is the Polish favour system - this drove me to the brink of insanity. Polish guys always wanting favours, but never paying them back, or else trying to make a profit from you if they do pay you back.

.....this is not to say all Polish people are like this - far from it.
Many Polish women are among the most decent human beings I have encountered.
In truth, many Polish men don't deserve the women they have. But many of the Polish men who came to this country in the begining, 2004, were the genuine lowlifes who weren't wanted in Poland.

The one thing that struck me unlike any other country was the difference between the Polish in Ireland and the Poles in Poland.
The Poles in Poland were some of the nicest, genuine, decent people I ever had the pleasure to meet.
The Poles in Ireland were .............sharks.

Of course, things changed, after 2004 we had many good Poles arrive.
Many of the bad ones have moved on, because they have used up the good will or their lies are no longer believed.
But still, this crisscrossed American/Russian gangster seems to persist among young Polish guys.

I spoke about this to my ex-girlfriends father and brother.
They told me in simple terms:
These guys are from deep, dark villages - they have probably never seen money before, they come here, they get a job, they finally have money and they don't know how to behave.

They make me ill, lol.

Poland is an amazing country, with an amazing history and one of the toughest breeds of people in the world. I just find it a shame that these guys disguise their identity so much and are so superficial, that they are almost ashamed of being Polish.

Instead they adpot the faux Italian/Russia Gangster with a dash of Eminem thrown in.
(before anyone tries to say this is like any other country - its not!)

Lord spare me!


What makes you believe that Russian people are primitive?
If you are referring to the villagers in Central Asia, then I guess some of them could be.

But if you have met a Muscovite for example, I often think Irish people are primitive in comparison to the Russians.
In Moscow, you need a degree just to work in a sweet shop, lol.

St.Petersburg, incredible history/architecture, highly educated and cultured people.

I have to disagree with this comment:
"Russians and Poles prefer the same places for vaccations,drink the same and leave the same impressions."

I can't speak for Poland now as I don't have much contact with the nation anymore, other than my friends here, but many of the Poles in Ireland and the UK visit the same destinations as us. The only barriers are economic.

Personally, I don't drink alcohol, but I worked as a bouncer for many years so I have a pretty good idea about this country.

Poles generally don't like to go to pubs/nightclubs in this country.
They prefer to go to house parties and drink/use drugs in the company of other Poles.

It is quite rare to see a Polish man drinking in a pub, however, they frequently buy large amounts of the cheapest beer. That is not an criticisim by the way, just an observation.

I woudn't think to criticise Polish men for not wanting to participate in Irish night life.
There is a massive difference in Polish and Irish nightlife, everything from opening times to closing times and all that goes in between.

Many women are way of Polish men because so many of them were lying about being married and were having affairs here.
Polish women do go out from time to time, but other in the company of other females.
It is quite rare to see a Polish men and women together in a venue unless it is a social even for their job or something.

I hope I'm not coming across as derogatory to Polish men here, I don't intend to be.
I am simply sharing my experiences.
I have seen a number of good Polish friends get used by Polish women. Often they are treated as commodities. Some of them can be quite cold hearted and use men as ladders, jumping from one ladder to a better ladder when they see an opportunity to climb higher.


My partner is Russian, as are her family.
I speak the Russian language reasonably well, I have visited the country and met a great number of Russian people and former Soviet Satellites.
Russians, Lithuanians and Poles living in Ireland are among some of my best friends.
I have travelled throughout Eastern Europe, but most heavily in Poland, Lithuania and Russia.

I used to speak Polish quite well, but have forgotten a large portion now as its not very useful outside of Poland and many Polish friends have left Ireland during the economic crisis.

Russian is an extremely useful language and somewhat easier to learn than Polish, as it is more standardised. All international languages have to be standarised for non-natives to learn.

You may label my opinions as superficial if you wish, I don't mind. I'm simply sharing my experiences which I believe to be the truth.

As for the point which I have missed, what point is that?
I haven't seen you offer any points to be refuted, not even conjecture, so I'm not quite sure it is what I am supposed to be missing.

I know it is often a bitter pill for the uber-patriotic North Korean.......sorry, I mean uber-patriotic Poles to swallow. That is the bitter pill of truth that they are not the greatest people on the planet, and that other nations and other cultures also have many admirable qualities and triumphs.

All I have seen you offer is simply mildly offensive stereotype about 70% of Russians being pro-communist and drinking vodka on October days in their summer houses.

I believe it is actually you who is likely ignorant of the truth.
(Also for your information, somewhat ironically, many of the Poles I met in Central Poland commented to me that they missed the communist times when life was easier and they had a 13th paycheck at Xmas and there was less crime etc.

In constrast, only a small portion of the Russians have wished for the old communist days back, as they offset of financial trouble would not be compensated adequately by the loss of liberties)

Believe me, I used to share these opinions of the Russians in the old days, when my only opinions were obtained from Poles.
But then a funny thing happened.......I grew up.

Many years ago, I used to believe the English were demons with horns..........and now funnily enough, probably my favourite people on the planet are English.

Because I got out there and met English people, I rejected the propaganda and saw what fantastic people the English really are.

Times change and people move on.
It is your job to sift through the propaganda and discover the truth.
If you take your opinions from magazines and gym locker talk and biased media & political commentary, you will never know who you hate or why you hate them.

You will simply recite generalised abstract nonsense, with no experience of your own.

The only way to do this is. Get out there and meet people of the nationality it is you claim are so bad.

Lastly, allow me to return the question:
What is your knowledge of Russians based on ?


Western European does not equal 'more cultured'.
Allow me to simplify.

I defy anyone to visit Prague or Budapest and then tell me that Warsaw or Vilnius or Riga are more highly cultured.
Prague is quite a fascinating place with an atmosphere not unlike Rome.

Personally, I love Warsaw, but it could never equal Prague.
The only place in Poland that comes close (of which I am aware) is Krakow in the summer & possibly Zakopane during the high season - incredible atmosphere.

The Western European implication only intended to imply that they are the most Western European of the Slavic community.

I doubt anyone could argue they are the most progressive.
Poland is still locked in a power struggle, as are many of the larger countries.

My comment as regards progressive was in technical excellence.
I have heard a million sob stories from Poles about how highly skilled they are, the best in Europe etc. etc.
Or I often heard how over-qualified so many of the Poles were, yet when I learned to speak their language, their friends will laugh at the lies they told.

The reality is that many of these guys claim to have degrees coming out their arses when they are in this country because they are inexplicably ashamed of whatever it is they do, yet when they are back in Poland, many of them admit the truth that they no qualifications.

To be fair, this is likely a characteristic of the immigrant society as opposed to Polish society as a whole.
In my office, there are 9 Eastern European workers in high skilled software jobs and exactly 0 of them are Polish.

If these guys ears worked as well as their mouths, they may start to get somewhere.

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


I think many of the above listed characteristics are quite individual, so it is very difficult to generalise about those features on a wide scale based on nationality, equally many of those characteristics apply to non-Slavic people(s) as much as they apply to Slavic people.

To be honest, I think on the surface, Russians and Poles probably seem similar much like German and Dutch, but underneath, there is a world of difference.

Czechs/Slovaks & Poles share some visible similarities, but Czechs and Slovaks are by far the most Western European slavic nation, the mort progressive, most open, most cultured and most worldly.

Poland while gradually moving more west, is still quite isolated in reality. While there are many brilliant Poles, there are still a great number of people with the faux-gangster villager mentality which damages the Polish image frequently.

This will change in time, but Poland seems to be still searching for its image.
Polish people often strike as as unsure wheter they wish to be respected for their talent and intelligence, or for their image/coolness and reputation.

Possibly the funniest thing I have found is that Warsawvians have the worst reputation in Poland, but they are easily the nicest and most friendly.

The people from Poznan and Lodz, all of those I've met, I would like to put them on a big space ship and sent them to a different galaxy.

They are by far the least useful, least friendly Poles and very frequently are involved in crime over here.

Lithuanians, Latvians, Estonians are somewhat closer to the Russian mentality while but most definitely moving in the opposite direction. (Lithuanian people are nice once you get to know them but appear quite rude if you do not know them).

Ukranian are closer again to the Russian mentality but Western Ukraine is moving in the opposite direction i.e. toward Berlin, Eastern Ukraine becoming increasingly pro-Russian and moving toward Moscow.

Belarus are very close and move toward unison with Russia, probably one of the only European countries which is actually moving into the Russian sphere of influence, mostly due to poverty.

It would appear that the Central Asian nations are very pro-Russian, but this is not unexpected considering the rise of China.

Then there is Georgia. A truely strange country.
They are a very small ship in a very big sea.
The tail wags the dog.
The men are anti-muslim, but as close culturally to Islam as one can get without actually being Islamic.
As a Western European, I often find their views on women very disturbing.
I have found them to be racist and xenophobic, but in truth I have only met their least educated people so it would probably not be fair to comment any more on them.

Then there is Hungary. Geographically it is in Eastern Europe, but they are totally Western European, they remind me of the Norwegians. Very nice people, many highly educated.

I utterly detest Romany gypsies, but find Romanian people quite friendly and a very different mentality from the slavs..

And so we come to Russia and Russian people.
The immediate thing that is apparent about anyone who has ever had a Russian partner or speaks the Russian language or knows their country, history and culture is that it is a land of polar opposites.

They have the richest and the poorest of people.
They have the smartest and the least educated of people.
They have the warmest and the coldest of people.
It strikes me as quite similar to the United States in this way.

The difference is that in the United States, a large number of people fall into the extreme categories, while in Russia, a large number of people fall into the middling and lower categories with only a tiny fraction at the top.

If we took societies such as the UK, France, Germany - these societies are generally well balanced in terms of class and very stable.
Russia is very unbalanced, and seems to be constantly fluctuating.
Change in Russia is inexorable.

Many Russian people are very warm and open and welcoming.
When I learned to speak Polish, many Poles would often laugh at me, try to belittle me or see my ability to understand them as a threat.

In general, Russians are quite encouraging and proud of the fact that you have chosen to learn Russian and seek to help you as much as possible.

It is a lie to say Russians are not family orientated. They are very highly family orientated.
So are Poles.
One of the most striking differences between Poland and Russia or Poalnd & Europe is the strength of Religion in Poland. I was truely amazed to see how seriously the young Polish took their religion, how many attended church services etc.

For someone who grew up during the biggest transition in Irish history which religion is now essentially defunct, it was quite a eye opener and give me insight into what Ireland must have been like 30 years ago.

All in all, I would say Russian people are the most friendly in Eastern Europe, although many of the least educated are patriotic to the point of nausea.

Poles and other Western Slavs would be a close second behind Russia in terms of friendliness, but Polish are generally the most provocative and most patriotic -somewhat understandably- as they feel the need to assert themselves, given their recent history.

If nationalitisim is a tool for brainwashing individuals and building armies, then Poland is civilian army.

The most frustrating thing about Poles for me is that they constantly need to assert themselves. They need to be the best at everything and Poland needs to have the best of everything. They are quite similar to the United States in this way, quite uni-lateral and arrogant/isolated. This is why it can be quite tiring speaking with a Polish man.

Polish women are generally more balanced to be fair.

It is quite ironic that Poles do not understand the mentality of the Russian diaspora.
The Russian mentality is quite similar to the Irish, in that, no matter what country you live in, you will always love the Motherland and always identify with it.

Poles mistake this for aggressive patriotism, but this is not true.
Only the least educated Russians are so openly provocative.
I think most Russians realise that their home country cannot support them and while they love and miss their home and their culture, it is now quite Russian to have 2 countries i.e. Russia and the adoptive country.

==

For the person who asked what territorial claim Russia has over Kaliningrad, you must read about the Potsdam conference.

You also need to understand the buffer which central and Eastern Europe was supposed to provide against future attacks on Russia.
Russia lost 28million people in World War 2, nearly 14% of it population.

Only Poland suffered more with 16% losses, and of course Lithuania which suffered the most and lost an estimated 20% of its population (a large percentage of these murders were committed by Russian communists)

News / Kaliningrad. Problem, Threat or Opportunity for Poland? [185]


There is no Lithuanian federation.

I assume you know what a federation is, so the easiest explanation I can give you is to have a brief study of the Swiss Federation and compare like for like.

Effectively, Kaliningrad would become a 'canton'.

This is also the proposed political system for Ireland when it will be united with the North of Ireland. It is successful in giving regions a large amount of autonomy, while still maintaining unity.

Of course, language and cultural barriers will always be a problem, as we have seen Belgium has been rocked to the core in recent years.

This is the primary reason why it would not be returned to Prussia/Germany or joined with Poland - i.e. you can still speak Russian in most Lithuanian cities with the exception of Kaunas.

Then of course, the issues with geography and shared past. i.e. the Russian Diaspora.

Ultimately of course, this is mental chewing gum at the moment.
Geo-politics would exempt any such scenario until there is normalisation of relations between the Baltic and Russia...................which could be some time away.

I think the biggest issue at the moment in Russia's eyes, is a potentially impending civil war in the Ukraine, between the Western Nationalists and the South Eastern Pro-Russian communities.