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Posts by 1jola  

Joined: 23 Sep 2008 / Male ♂ 		Last Post: 20 Sep 2013
Threads: Total: 14 / In This Archive: 6
Posts: Total: 1,879 / In This Archive: 490 		From: Warsaw
Speaks Polish?: yes

Displayed posts: 496 / page 14 of 17
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1jola   
22 Mar 2009
History / Jewish love towards Poles [389]

It may be complicated to you but not to Elie Wiesel - The Holocaust survivor.

After seeing how consistently Mr. Madoff generated handsome returns buying fairly plain-vanilla securities -- "He bought 100 shares of Coca-Cola and sold 500 shares of Pfizer," Mr. Wiesel said, describing his understanding of the Madoff strategy

Poor Elie, and I mean poor. He lost all his money to the scheme. The suffering continues but there is hope:

Wiesel said he is planning legal action against Madoff but called for the federal government to bail out charities just as it has bailed out carmakers and banks.

"I think it would be a great gesture that the Obama administration should show, we really think of those who are helpless and who are doing with their money only good things."

You don't know the half of this WJC

You're wrong Joe. I don't know one tenth of one percent, but I have read Finkelstein describe the fleecing of the Swiss. Speaking of fleecing, read how the threats work in this example. The threats come at the end after a nice dose of insults.

jcpa.org/jl/vp412.htm
1jola   
16 Mar 2009
News / Germany seeks extadition of Sobibor death camp guard. [65]

First of all, Morel died two years ago in Israel.

Israel has a standard policy - no Jew can be a war criminal. Full stop. It is antisemitic to even suggest that.

Demianiuk has been shown to have lied about his past. He was exonorated of being the Ivan but he certainly was at Sobibor.

What should happen to a man like that? Unbelievably, his trial was cancelled because of his ill health. His name was Czesław Gęborski and the country which didn't think he should be tried was Poland. And yes I do mean post-communist Poland.

No Stalinist murderer has been prosecuted yet. None. The case of Gęborski was during the ex-neo-communist Kwasniewski's reign. You are still trying to grasp post-communist politics in relation to the myths you have believed, huh?
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Sjam,

What does Ringelblum say about the Jewish Police? I know you want to be objective. I'm looking forward to your research. For that matter, what do other memoirs say about the Blue Police vs the Jewish Police. You can even start a new thread so we can have some room.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

1. I disagree that most Jews aren't aware of the scale of Jewish collaboration.

They just don't talk about it outside the Jewish community. They prefer to talk about Polish collaboration. Yes, I know.

Non-Jews, at least outside the countries that were occupied, have less knowledge and education on this subject.

Yes, they get to hear the mantra about "Polish concentration camps."

2. You say that Jewish collaboration was devastating for the Jewish community.

I don't say; the Jewish chroniclers say this in the memoirs that you think I haven't read. Bits of those memoirs are offered in the theatre of Holocaust Education but not the parts that show thew real picture of Jewish collaboration.

most Jews did not collaborate

Small amount just like a small amount of Poles.

it is important to remember that what happened to the Jews would have happened with or without their collaboration

It is also important to remember that they didn't resist and hoped to sit out the war cooperating with the Germans. The deportations didn't start till 1942 and the Uprising in the Ghetto was in 1943 after 300,000 or so were sent o death with the help of the Jewish police not the Polish one.

Rigelblum wrote:

"Why didn’t we resist when they began to resettle 300,000 Jews from Warsaw? Why did we allow ourselves to be led like sheep to the slaughter? Why did everything come so easy to the enemy? Why didn’t the hangmen suffer a single casualty? Why could 50 S.S. men (some people say even fewer), with the help of a division of some 200 Ukrainian guards and an equal number of Letts [Latvians], carry the operation out so smoothly?"

I thought you might mention Shahak when we were talking about criticism. He wrote:

"In the Warsaw ghetto, even during the period of the first massive extermination (June to October 1942), one saw almost no German soldiers. Nearly all the work of administration, and later the work of transporting hundreds of thousands of Jews to their deaths, was carried out by Jewish collaborators. Before the outbreak of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising (the planning of which only started after the extermination of the majority of Jews in Warsaw), the Jewish underground killed, with perfect justification, every Jewish collaborator they could find. If they had not done so the Uprising could never have started. The majority of the population of the Ghetto hated the collaborators far more than the German Nazis. Every Jewish child was taught, and this saved the lives of some of them “if you enter a square from which there are three exits, one guarded by a German SS man, one by a Ukrainian and one by a Jewish policeman, then you should first try to pass the German, and then maybe the Ukrainian, but never the Jew.”

As I've mentioned before, collaboration, particularly Jewish collaboration, is an extremely complex and nuanced subject. It's important not to paint it as black and white.

The people in the ghetto weren't so understanding as you are. The Polish underground army wasn't either. They passed death sentences against collaborators.

Some of the books Sjam recommended on the subject are well worth a read. I haven't read them all, but I have read and would recommend.

Thank you. I have read most of them and some of the lesser know memoirs and archive documents.

Czerniakow's diary is particularly instructive.

I find his diary dry and he fails to record some of the important events involving himself.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

By the sound of it I'm not the only one that needs treatment ;-))

It is always a positive step when one recognizes the need for treatment. I wish you luck in your recovery.

Do you not elect your government or is it a dictatorship run by Polish Jews

You can't be that naive to think that just because a certain government is elected it does the will of the people. If you ask the people of Poland if their kids need anti-semitism education they would stare at you in disbelief.

We do have some communists very involved in the "struggle" however.

"Abraham H. Foxman, ADL National Director and a Holocaust survivor born in Poland, cited Kwasniewski's "inspired leadership" in promoting Holocaust education and his "strong, unequivocal denunciation of anti-Semitism" among Poles."

That was in 2005. Jump to 2008:

From Kwasniewski's website:

"Media have informed about the establishment by the European Jewish Congress of the European Council for Tolerance, which you are heading. What will the Council deal with?"

"I can assure you that the Council will have a lot to do also in Poland. There is no doubt that racism and anti-Semitism are the phenomena present in the Polish society. "

"Aren't you afraid of your compatriots' reaction that you accepted the "job" from the Jews? It can become some sort of a "problem" in a moment?

I do not regard myself as an excessively timid person or one always drifting with the current. I treat entrusting me with chairmanship as a great honour and not a problem."

A little clearer for you?

Here is that drunken communist at Katyn:

youtube.com/watch?v=d0S41AGoeYw

I assure you that you have no chance in understanding Polish politics, especially from distant England. Your understanding of Polish history is just as dismal. Case in point: you have asked me repeatedly why the stalinist prosecutors, judges, and other henchmen are living freely in Poland. Impress me and give your opinion as to why.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

I was just being sarcastic about the large population of Turks in present day Germany.

And before some yahoo jumps in saying Hitler just wanted to right the wrongs of the Versaille Treaty, he talks about that in Mein Kampf too. He says nonsense. We the super-race need real Leben, lebensraum and that has to be taken by the sword.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

so Hitler wanted to move in to Czech. Austria etc to secure Germany and open routes to Italy and the Med.

He moved on Austria to consolidate the German people. The rest was conquest that he felt the super-race deserved. He talks about this in Mein Kampf Volume II Ch.14.

" Without respect for 'tradition,' and without any preconceived
notions, the movement must find the courage to organize our national
forces and set them on the path which will lead them away from that
territorial restriction which is the bane of our national life to-day,
and win new territory for them."

He rambles sensesly a lot but his main point is:

"Only a sufficiently large space on this earth can assure the independent
existence of a people."

So, we need Lebensraum. We also need...

"Thus the German nation could assure its own future only by being a World
Power."

...to be a super-power. One more time:

"Without respect for 'tradition,' and without any preconceived
notions, the movement must find the courage to organize our national
forces and set them on the path which will lead them away from that
territorial restriction which is the bane of our national life to-day,
and win new territory for them."

He goes on to alliances and I like this part:

"Therefore the fact of forming an alliance with Russia would be the
signal for a new war. And the result of that would be the end of
Germany."

The idiot corporal predicted his own demise.

The ministry agree with that hoping that such things will make the Jewish media, NGO's etc. call us "anti-semitic" a bit less often.

lol
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Are the 5,000 Jews somehow discriminated against that calls for special anti-semitism education?

Well thank God I'm only half-Polish then at least the English half of me isn't stupid enough

The Polish are stupid? Split personality problem is treatable though.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Hmm, Hitler wanted Poland to join Germany in conquering Europe,

all he wanted was the Polish coridor to link up East Prussia with the rest of Germany

Let me guess, you learned that by reading Stormfront. Only complete idiots believe these lies. You have to go back to Mein Kampf to see what Hitler wanted. Written in 1924, it spells out Hitler's vision for the Thousand Year Reich. I know that neo-Nazis don't actually read Mein Kampf, but rather let some of their "leaders" tell them what Hitler wanted. Think, genius, if Hitler only wanted the coridor, then why did he invade Austria, Czechoslovakia, and all of Poland. Here is all he wanted:

"We National Socialists have to go still further. The right to territory may become a duty when a great nation seems destined to go under unless its territory be extended. And that is particularly true when the nation in question is not some little group of negro people but the Germanic mother of all the life which has given cultural shape to the modern world. Germany will either become a World Power or will not continue to exist at all. But in order to become a World Power it needs that territorial magnitude which gives it the necessary importance to-day andassures the existence of its citizens.

Therefore we National Socialists have purposely drawn a line through the line of conduct followed by pre-War Germany in foreign policy We put an end to the perpetual Germanic march towards the South and West of Europe and turn our eyes towards the lands of the East. We finally put a stopto the colonial and trade policy of pre-War times and pass over to the territorial policy of the future.

But when we speak of new territory in Europe to-day we must principally
think of Russia and the border States subject to her.

Destiny itself seems to wish to point out the way for us here."

Adolf Hitler - Mein Kampf 1924

Pictures of Hitler with children??? You're on a wrong forum, weirdo.
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Jola, you 'vicious anti-semite'...You criticize the morality and the fairness of the Jewish people?

I haven't touched Judaism at all. And I was so innocent before LF.

Unfortunately, yes - this country needs such education. The picture I took

Football "fans" don't pay attention to education. You will find silly graffitti in every country including Israel. Should the whole world have anti-semitism education? Years of holocaust classses haven't made people more sensitive to genocide going on in front of our eyes in Africa.

Jesus! So let me get this right. By saying "the Jews force it on everyone" you are actually implying that Polish non-Jews are so incapable of anything they let a group of maybe as few as 5,000 rule the education policy of a population of 40,000,000—this is a surprise to me but I will take your word for it.

Who is initiating it then and why? Because there is some graffitti?
1jola   
8 Mar 2009
History / Centre of Deported Polish Citizens, showing the WWII-era [10]

On April 17 there is a film " General Nil" coming out in Poland. Saw the preview and it looks really good. I hope it gets some exposure in the west and also stirs a debate why the beasts who murdered him are walking the streets. His daughter has led a fruitless campaign to get justice for years. So much for justice in "free" Poland. The old guard is firmly in charge. It's important to understand that the communists didn't give up power in 1989; they only shared power, but that's another thread.

from Pilcecki's giving himself up to be imprisoned in Auschwitz

Volunteering is a more acurate word, or better yet, the only volunteer for Auschwitz.

Do you think Hollywood producers read PF? It's got Auschwitz in it :)

and most Americans don't like sub-titles.

Do you know why Americans don't like foreign films? Because they are sooo foreign.
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
History / Centre of Deported Polish Citizens, showing the WWII-era [10]

a documentary about life of Capt. Witold Pilecki

Sjam, here is a TV/theatre about his trial. There are subtitles on this one.

rhetos.pl/index.php?s=karta&id=466

It can be seen on google video in Polish here:
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

you can't really believe the rubbish in this film.

I have presented irrefutable proof

How can I refute something irrefutable? That does end conversation.

I have already stated that I find this disgraceful, in fact I brought the issue up.

You did and no argument there.

I'm not sure what else there is to debate or say about it.

Poles do not write editorials in major English speaking papers accusing Jews of communist crimes. Jews write repeatadly lies about Poles with totat impunity. Any atempt to set he record straight meets with further accusations of antisemitism. That is their only weapon - to call someone an antisemite. There is no debate, it is a dirty trick that people are fed up with. Jews thus create resentment toward Jews.

I will dig out some books and names that may interest you regarding Jewish discussion about Jewish collaboration during the holocaust.

Thank you, I will gladly read them. You will agree that most Jews, or non-Jews have no idea of the extent of Jewish collaboration. It wasn't negligible and it was devastating to the Jewish community much more than any Polish collaboration. It is a dirty little secret that is kept away from the public view to maitain the myth of eternal victims. If you can find information on a Polish network of Gestapo agents as large as a Jewish Gestapo agents in Poland, please enlighten me. I don't want to hear that they wanted to survive; everyone wanted that. Jews ran the 400,000 member ghetto, Jews worked hard for the Reich, Jewish leaders were against resistance, Jews twarthed the efforts of a small number of Jews who did resist, Jews robbed other Jews, Jews turned in other Jews in hiding (here I will agree that there were bastard Poles too), and Jews basically loaded the trains heading for death. Tragedy all around, but today's discussion and brainwashing is how evil the Poles were and didn't help the Jews.

Jews should look in the mirror with shame first and than point fingers.

I find it ironic that they are saying they must fight anti-Semitism in a country

Anti-semitism, pogroms, holocaust. Now just keep repeating it. Good girl.

Why would Polish Ministry of Eduction feel the need to "introduce new teaching materials for Poland's middle schools on Thursday in an effort to combat anti-Semitism?" if anti-Semitism in Poland was not such an issue?

It is not an issue. The Jews force it on everyone. This in addition to the Holocaust studies. Notice there are no special classes in the systematic communist genocide. Everything must revolve around Jews. If you deny the Holocaust you will go to prison in Europe; you are free to deny communist crimes, and they were far greater than the Holocaust. Why?
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Junior high stories are nice and I feel for you that boys are not falling over you, but we are trying to have an adult discussion here. Start a thread somewhere else about personal problems.

I've noticed you keep writing German with a capital G, yet Polish with a small p. No need to answer and this thread is not about you. Be nice and stop whining that nobody likes you. We like you.
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

These are both lazy lies.

Are they? If you find disagreement with Encylopedia Judaica please write them.





It isn't something we learn at Church, as you suggested. It was learned when patriots were arrested, tortured, and murdered in secret. Spare me the bullshit. Jews are well represented among the executioners although they were supposedly holocausted.

No I don't, I mean mass collaboration, in Lithuania and Ukraine specifically.

At the moment I don't care what Jews say about them; I care that they call Poles collaborators in mainstream press, yet they make excuses for their own collaboration like:

I think collaboration is an extremely complex subject and an area that has to be trodden on carefully

They seem to apply that only to themselves. To Poles they are quite comfortable to just smear.

And, to speak straight to your point about lack of examination of Jewish collaboration with Germans in World War Two, you're incorrect. There has been much work and introspection on this subject by Jewish historians.

You and I and three other persons read books written by historians. The rest gets their history lesson from movies, bullshit articles in the dumbdowned press, and docudramas. How else do these opinions arise:

lipstadt.blogspot.com/2007/10/enduring-myth-poles-were-worse-than.html

Last week I was in Poland. While there I kept stressing to the people with whom I was travelling that it is wrong to depict Poland as a place of unending antisemitism or to fall prey to the absurd but, nonetheless, oft-heard comment made by Jews who visit the place, "The Poles were worse than the Nazis."

Many people, Jews primarily among them, believe the balderdash that the Germans put the death camps in Poland because the Poles would be happy to see the Jews killed. They ignore the fact that to the Germans Auschwitz was German territory and was to be the site of a major German settlement.

One person, who is well-informed and well read, found this notion of Polish non-complicity hard to grasp. He kept trying to find links:

Weren't they guards at Auschwitz? No, I said.

Well weren't they part of the Einsatzgruppen, the mobile killing units?

People get this "knowledge" from history books?

I'm happy to point you to valid books and papers.

Please do. Then we can discuss how the Jewish writers were roasted by the Jewish community for writing about taboo subjects ie. Jewish Nazi collaboration.

Better yet, point me to where this is talked about in the mainstream media. Sjam, when asked the same question could only dig up a 1987 New York times article about a Jewish kapo. You seem a lot smarter than he, so we'll see.

Well it was you that stated it 'It was similar in all the satellite states' and low and behold I prove in just one tiny example this is not true...

Ahha, you have no doubt won that argument then. Sit back and have a beer now. I will be more careful when talking to pedantic you.
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

You don't half write some utter garbage!

Just one example of a Soviet satellite state where it wasn't similar:

Latvia

If it's utter garbage keep naming those countries. So far you got one, and a very tiny one.
1jola   
7 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

to the number of Jews working in Poland's post-war communist security services. The numbers there are between 13% and 37% being Jewish, meaning 87% and 63% being Polish.

Peter, the 13% comes from Bierut. We can dismiss him as a reliable source. To be fair Jews only comprised about 2% of total security services, but at upper levels, they were well overrepresented. For about 1% of total population a 37% representation is significant, wouldn't you say. It was similar in all the satellite states and in the Soviet Union:

In 1934, according to published statistics, 38.5 percent of those holding the most senior posts in the Soviet security apparatuses were of Jewish origin. They too, of course, were gradually eliminated in the next purges. In a fascinating lecture at a Tel Aviv University convention this week, Dr. Halfin described the waves of soviet terror as a "carnival of mass murder," "fantasy of purges", and "essianism of evil." Turns out that Jews too, when they become captivated by messianic ideology, can become great murderers, among the greatest known by modern history

ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3342999,00.html

There has been a trend, one which is thankfully declining, in certain quarters of the Jewish press to present Poland as little more than the staging ground of the Holocaust and to overlook the fantastically rich life Jews had in Poland over hundreds of years. A life that brought great benefits to both communities. It would serve both better to celebrate this more,.

It is impossible to celabrate this shared history if the Jewish community doesn't stop spreading lies about the Poles. The ball is in their court.

There seems to be a creeping belief around the world that Poland collaborated with the Nazis.

These are the lies that I am talking about.

and Jewish complaints of collaboration, which are usually quite vaild

Do you mean the lack of Jewish complaints about Jewish collaboration with the Nazis? In that case I agree. There are only excuses but no self criticism. I stated this before, and I can back it up that the biggest threat to Jews in Poland were of course the Germans, followed by fellow Jews and then, and in that order, some unscrupulous Poles, who risked being killed by other Poles for doing harm to Jews. Doing harm to Jews most likely did harm to Poles who were helping Jews.

The ignorance of this subject is shocking.

As a side note, the Jewish community would be well advised to see what is happening in their own world before starting witch hunts against the Catholic bishops:
1jola   
6 Mar 2009
History / Russia to outlaw criticism of WWII tactics [57]

As much as it pains me, I have to say Harry is right on this one small detail.[feeling pain]. The murderous Soviets were on the other side of the river watching to Poles get slaughtered. The Soviets also made some supply drops; they were without parachutes.
1jola   
6 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

Can we stop the name calling

Harry is calling me a Jew because I wasn't interested in donating money to a soldier memorial in England for which he would donate...if it's tax deductible! In his mind all Jews are cheap. What ignorance.
1jola   
6 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

when I was in jr high school, a student with parents from Germany was in one of my classes and the teacher sat him behind me and he scooted his desk as far away as he could.

And that was because you have a Polish name. When you become of age, you can always change it.

Every jew I've met here has been nice to me.

Ask them what they think of Poland and report to us later.
1jola   
6 Mar 2009
History / Russia to outlaw criticism of WWII tactics [57]

you must be a liar.

Carol, he gets hung up like that on every thread. He takes some minute detail and holds his ground. Perhaps in this case his objective is to show the Soviets were good. He always has a motive.


  • .
1jola   
6 Mar 2009
News / Poland embraces new effort to fight anti-Semitism [138]

So you know what Jewish people say on their forum?

I do. I also know what neo-Nazis discuss. I'm sure in your limited capacity you will conclude that I must be a neo-Nazi.

how silly

There is nothing silly when old men act like children.