History / Poland war propaganda poster - can anyone explain this picture? [292]

A post-WWI propaganda poster directed at the lost Germans in Poland.
POLEN HAT KEINE GESETZLICHE ARBEITERSFURSORGE

Poland has no law for worker's relief

Anti-Polish propaganda around 1921

History / Panslavic vision of Poland. [32]

Interesting, I found a similar map published in 1942 but completed even before U.S entry into the WWII. Published in Philadelphia by unknown authors titled Post-War New World Map. It’s amazing how close to reality it was, post war period. Seems that geopolitical think tank in both camps have a totally different view of the world than people realize. Amazing how economic strategies of today’s politics still try to steer the world in this direction with few modifications of course. There’s no room for Slavs in either camp. Just make the map larger and read the footnotes, reach your own conclusion.

history.sandiego.edu/gen/maps/1900s/1942world4000.jpg

History / Trying to identify old military medals. Are they from Poland? [15]


I’ll say your translation as the Fifth “Dare-Devil” is damn good, no need to improve it. So the name would be; Fifth Infantry Regiment of the Józef Piłsudski Legions - Wilno, the “Dare-Devils”.


Sure they do, lots did and still do. For instance;
In US 1st Armored Division 1st Brigade Special Troops Battalion, is known as the "Black Knights" or 1st Armored Division 1st Battalion, 36th Infantry Regiment is known as the "Spartans".

Similarly British, besides the common name like; the Sussex regiment of foot, - 1st Infantry Division 3rd Infantry Brigade 2nd Battalion was known as “The Sherwood Foresters”, I believe and 3rd Battalion, Royal Regiment of Scotland was known as “the Black Watch”.

Here's a bit more about 5 Pułk Piechoty Legionów im. Józefa Piłsudskiego in Polish
nasz-czas.lt/508/czas.html

History / Trying to identify old military medals. Are they from Poland? [15]

Is this IT?
If so it's a military Lapel pin (badge) made between 1918-1939. This one is either a Genuine or replica based on 1929 design. So yes wz. Stands for "wzór"

For those that might have interest in Polish Military Badges, Lapel Pins. Here's a link to the images.

Language / Pan/Pani...usage changes for case distiction? [23]

Correction pomorzanin is right in Accusative: it should be Panią Elżbietę Nowak
Panią Małgosię Kowalską. I guess that’s why I’m not a teacher.

Language / Pan/Pani...usage changes for case distiction? [23]

Nominative (mianownik) (kto? Co?) (kto?) Pan Adam Burczak, Pan Marcin Kowalski, Pani Elżbieta Nowak, Pani Małgosia Kowalska

Genitive (dopełniacz) (kogo? Czego?) (kogo?) Pana Adama Burczaka, Pana Marcina Kowalskiego, Pani Elżbiety Nowak, Pani Małgosi Kowalskiej

Dative (celownik) (komu ?czemu?) (komu?) Panu Adamowi Burczakowi, Panu Marcinowi Kowalskiemu, Pani Elżbiecie Nowak, Pani Małgosi Kowalskiej

Accusative (biernik) (kogo? Czego?) (kogo?) Pana Adama Burczaka, Pana Marcina Kowalskiego, Pani Elżbiety Nowak, Pani Małgosi Kowalskiej

Instrumental (narzędnik) (z kim? z czym?) (z kim?) z Panem Adamem Burczakiem, z Panem Marcinem Kowalskim, z Panią Elżbietą Nowak, z Panią Małgosią Kowaską

Locative (miejscownik) (o kim? o czym?) (okim?) o Panu Adamie Burczaku, o Panu Marcinie Kowalskim, o Pani Elżbiecie Nowak, o Pani Małgosi Kowalskiej

Vocative (wołacz) (o!) o! Pan Adam Burczak, o! Pan Marcin Kowalski, o! Pani Elżbieta Nowak, o! Pani Małgosia Kowalska

History / Polish Anti-semitism - origins? [186]


There are plenty of examples of Jewish journalists making this statement; you just refuse to see it. By the way this is not about what one has said or not but the attitude behind such a statement and what is perceived as the truth. You yourself might hold this opinion but I’ll bet you are of older generation; the younger one has a totally different opinion than you, reflected by their action when they come and visit such places on a school field trip.

What was that, which Tamir have said to Kaczynski on his visit to Isreal? Tamir said that


Another word You are guilty by association, they died there therefore you are partially to blame.

It’s precisely those people who make this kind of statements in their journalistic careers, and it all stems from the attitude adapted by the Education Ministry. It’s not that they have thought them that directly but they have never corrected their misperception. When you look up the author of such article you will find him/her to be born around or after 1970.

Why do you think the Polish government made the request to change the name in writing to UNESCO? Because of uneducated hateful Jewish journalists. Why do you think that no self respecting journalists would dare to call the “Guantanamo” a “Cuban camp” could it be that because it could be perceived as guilty by association? Not to mention false!

News / Poland..wake up to a multicultural world [1059]


He’s a president of the U.S.A, not the world but I still wish him all the best and luck, he will most definitely need it. I’m watching the inauguration ceremony and can’t help it but I see a sea of people that in one year’s time will be very disappointed because of broken promises. Through no fault of his own he will be blamed for it and the illusion of change will disappear forever. I wish him all the best, but personally would not like to be in his shoes. If he stands his ground and will not let himself be led by others like his predecessor he might have a chance of restoring some dignity to the office if not the country he represents. It’s hard to be an optimist, when all you see is a career oriented people who will sell their own mother for the security of his own career. While you still see the color, that's the way I see it and you have audacity to preach to me about tolerance?

The statement made by you that I have quoted either shows your stupidity, arrogance or both. Since you have no Idea of whose president he might be, what do you know about Poland’s relationship with other cultures? Have you ever been to Poland? It’s very tiresome to hear the same old stereotypes repeated all over again and again by arrogant half wits who think he’s the president of the world. My a**.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Do you really have to ask this question or are you so stubborn and refuse to see this issue in any other light? Perhaps you are incapable of understanding or admitting and that’s why you accuse everyone else of it? (Just thinking out loud) before you have a chance to accuse me of bigotry again.


Make up your mind. I accept you either way, so there.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


What do you expect me to do? Give a detail description of the technical capability of the aircraft at that time? Don’t be ridicules and give credit to the reader, most know.


This we know only too well look up Tehran Conference.


Sure call me a bigot because I mention a forbidden word “Jew”. You yourself have admitted to be a Jew last time we were debating. What’s the matter ashamed? Well you shouldn’t be, just stop being so anti everything that’s not Jewish.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Sjam provided you with some, now read them carefully and please absorb the details.


I did not specify why. I assume that the reader has enough knowledge on the subject and common sense that every little detail doesn’t have to be spelled out or defined in great detail. If you really don’t know but want to, just ask no need to be sarcastic about it.


As they say proof is in the pudding. Bringing up the correspondence as your proof brings little to this debate, for one it does not show the intent and that’s what you want to prove so desperately here. On contrary it shows otherwise. I would venture even further and say it shows little cowardness on your part, my big brother told me NO so that’s that, but that’s my opinion so let’s not go there either.


I know Harry but I still like to think I’m having this discussion with a Brit. Otherwise I would have to think it’s Jewish Polonophobia now wouldn’t I?

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


This particular mission was strictly on the voluntary basis, look it up and then preach.


Which part of my statement


you don’t get?


None – because the agreement on the final division of Europe has been reached at Teheran already and that was the Soviet cut. Therefore Soviets were exercising their right given to them by guess who? But since there was internal pressure put on you by Polish Government in Exile ……….


It’s kind of self evident isn’t it? Besides I’m having this discussion with a Brit not a Yank.


Yalta was just crossing the t’s and dotting the i’s on the previous agreements. If I would have said Teheran conference would it make it more plausible for you? Although most people do not have a clue to what Teheran conference is therefore I used the term Yalta because it was just finalizing the agreements reached at Teheran and the division of Europe have already taken place.


Why do you try so hard to skew the debate to go some other route? First you bring U.S into this and now Ukraine, running out of arguments and concrete evidence to back up your statements already? Like I said before, I’m having this discussion with a Brit therefore I’m discussing the events from this perspective. I don’t see any Ukrainians or Yanks here discussing these events in history from their point of view. There would be no one disputing my claims and defending the honor of their country, so please don’t even go there.


Oh yeah I forgot to mention that calling this a lie strictly on technicality because the dates don’t jive, just shows your ignorance on the subject. I can’t dispute the facts on the merit therefore I’ll dismiss it on technicality is that it Harry? I thought you are more of a man than that but then again you will do anything to discredit Poland now won’t you?

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Here we go again Harry and his lies. Must be nice when you can pick and choose, which statistics I will use to prove my point? You are comparing orange to apples here. Polish pilots participating in the Battle of Britain had hundreds of hours of flying time, had been well trained before the war, they had well developed fighting tactics and were flying in loose formations. Most of all they were fighter pilots flying fighter planes, while British and Polish volunteer pilots who flew few missions to aid Warsaw Uprising from Italy (suicide missions in my opinion), were bomber pilots flying heavy bomber planes. Flying deep into occupied territories without escort and overloaded with supplies. The route taken was heavily defended by the enemy. There were 14 planes participating in this mission 7 of them were British and 7 were Polish. The result was predictable, only 4 planes reached the drop zone and 5 planes all British crews were lost. This was a disaster so the operations were suspended. The Poles were continuing to exhort the pressure on the British to do something about this and it was decided that Polish RAF crews would resume the flights. As a result 7 more flights were made all Polish crews. On August 12th British finally repeal their decision not to let their own crews participate. For this we are grateful to all the brave pilots of RAF.

This was a case of too little too late and only done so to be used as propaganda tool and to show that it’s impossible for the Allies to have any kind of success but we give it a go anyway. It is all the fault of the Soviets you see; after all they refused to grant us the right to use their air fields. As for the uprising itself, well Allied troops were breaking through the Normandy defenses and the Red Army stops short of Praga (twelve miles short), the suburb on Warsaw's right bank. The Soviet air force abandons the skies over Warsaw to the Luftwaffe, for obvious reasons. The decisions made by both Allies and Soviets regarding the Warsaw Uprising (whether to help or not) was not guided by reason but by politics.

The Soviet refusal regarding the use of the air fields by the Allies for the purpose of providing aid to AK orchestrating the Warsaw uprising was the first time that global politics was being played between Soviets and western Allies to test whether or not the western Allies would keep their part of the bargain reached at Yalta conference. By doing so Stalin was not taking a huge risk (after all what could Allies possibly do to him at this point of the game), but knowing exact reaction of the Allies to the Soviet opposition proved to be priceless to Soviets. This turned out to be a lethal combination working against us Poles. It’s precisely this that prevented Allies from providing much needed support. Soviet governments’ refusal to use their air fields was just that, a test to see if Allies will uphold their part of the bargain reached at Yalta, which btw Allies seemed to pass with flying colors.

So you see, it’s not that you had “no obligation to defend Poland against the Russia” as you have put it, but you had obligation to Russia which you chose to uphold that prevented you from demanding the concessions from the Soviets to use the air fields and aid the city in its hour of need. You see Harry there was no will on your part to do anything about it, case closed.

History / Help Needed Unlocking Polish History. [6]


Your doubt is unfounded, even though your grandfather was not a part of original “Anders Army” it is precisely this army that grew in numbers due to the large influx of Poles serving in Wermacht that either deserted and switched sides or were captured and switched sides. These were the Poles mainly from Silesia, Greater Poland and Pomerania that were forced to serve in the German Army as conscripts. These were the parts of Poland that were directly incorporated into Germany.


I can’t help you solving this mystery; I simply have no clue as to what it might be. Perhaps if you made a picture of it and posted a link to it here someone might be willing to translate the hand writing.

This might be of some use in your research. Polish II Corps under General Anders was part of British 8th army. When it was formed II Corps consisted of two Infantry divisions, one panzer brigade, one independent altirely unit and couple more smaller units. Since it was growing in numbers throughout the campaign, mainly because the former Wermancht soldiers were joining the ranks, new units were established as part of II Corps. These were; 3rd brigades in both of the original infantry divisions (this most likely is the place where your grandfather served, so search for either one of them), created few more units of altirely, 2nd Panzer division became much larger and renamed as 2nd Warsaw Panzer division due to the new recruits and creation of a new 14th Greater Poland Panzer brigade

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Wow VaFunkoolo finely read something that he can actually understand, so he had to speak out.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


No thanks I’ll pass.


I never said “Jewish bigotry” I said “bigotry”, be it American or British or whatever but if you’re Jewish and take it as such that’s OK too really a bigot is a bigot, it does not matter if he’s American, British or Jewish.


If you did not claim that then it must be one big misunderstanding and few pages of needless discussion. Since the very first page of this tread you are doing everything in your power to put Poland and anything that has to do with Poland down, you will resort to any trick in a book, no matter how ridicules it might sound to discredit Poland. For instance, on Page 1 Post 9 of this very thread, you did not like the statement that Poland was the first country to fight the Germans and fought to the very last day of the War.


Now there is no way one could misinterpret to what the OP means when he said “Poland was first to fight” but you did not like that little but very significant word “first” in that statement did you Harry? So you go on and you make up this ridicules argument to what it actually means first to fight. FYI the statement you tried so hard to disprove is still valid because in order to have a fight you have to have someone to fight back otherwise it’s known as beating. If you wanted to be technical about it you would have said that Germany “initiated” the fight and Poland was first country to oppose it, but this would not do since it would still make Poland “first” to fight back. So like I said before you twist the things around, they became half truths, omitting a word here and there, in this case “initiate” and bending the facts to fit your point of view. For this statement you called me a liar. (You do that quiet often it seems). You do this throughout this thread and as a matter of fact throughout this Forum. So my question to you still stands, BTW you never did answer it. What is your shtick? What is your motivation for this since you live in Poland, If not just pure hatred and bigotry?

If you hate it so much GTFO.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

For those of you who still insist on changing the facts.

An invitation was extended to 25 Polish airmen who took part in the Battle of Britain and only to those men. Needless to say with the political situation such as it was they refused to attend on the grounds that they could not be a part of a ceremony from which Polish Army (loyal to the legitimate Polish government in Exile) was excluded. This was a slap on the face if you will for those brave men who fought for free democratic and independent Poland loyal to Legitimate Polish government in Exile. This was a bitter sweet victory for them with a new Political reality for the Central and Eastern Europe forced on them by their Allies.

There is a great book about this subject “A Question of Honor”. There you will find personal stories of the Kosciuszko Squadron pilots, their lives after the war and why they refused to go to the Parade.


Celinski you don’t see history differently they are just pathetically bad liars. The Illustrated London News - Victory Parade Number, issued June 15, 1946 has a long list of countries represented in the Victory parade at the end of which it states “Apart from the USSR, only Poland and Yugoslavia were not represented among our Allies". But I’m sure they will dispute this article on the grounds that the reporter did not have his contact lenses on at the time or has taken a bathroom break when the Poles marched by.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Why do you insist on moving on to what if debate? Strictly speaking about the facts, were you asked to do anything about it? NO you were not, by this time the circumstances have drastically changed effectively nullifying any military agreement previously signed. The fact remains you signed the document at Yalta and you had no right to do so concerning the points dealing with Eastern Europe without even consulting with the owner or have him represented there and let him fight his own battles with Stalin. That’s not what business partners do, as you have stated before “You have to be in possession of something in order to give it away.”

Doing something to someone behind someone’s back is not only a cowardly act but also an act of betrayal. You wanted to have it both ways; keep Stalin happy and Polish Government in Exile happy so you did and now when it is pointed out to you, you try to change the debate “we could not do anything about it”. YES you could, simply do not take your pen out and sign off on something that does not concern you or belong to you. This is what any business partner would have done; tell Stalin this is none of my business you negotiate with Polish Government in Exile yourself. But no, you have to skew the debate or give cheap excuses like “we were in no position”, “what could have we done more”. Yes it’s an eyesore for you I know, the sooner you acknowledge this fact the better for all of us. We can simply move on and forget about it.


I couldn’t agree with you more, and here we can start fun debates; what would have happened if this or this was the case?

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Harry

Poland put too much faith in Churchill and the Allies, and it is no secret that he personally was not very fond of Poles one might even say he despised them (like you Harry). That was our mistake of which young Poles are well aware of and I don’t think we will make the same mistake in the future. When General Anders protested the agreement reached at Yalta to Churchill and told him few choice words of what he thought about it; Churchill’s reply was and I quote “I don’t need Polish troops anymore”. At that very conference our allies gave away our eastern territories to Stalin just as Hitler had done so previously. Furthermore western powers have withdrawn their recognition of Polish Government in Exile in favor of new regime formed at Lublin which was acceptable to Stalin. Poland did not fight just to capitulate to USSR but they were forced to do so by their allies. As General Bor so eloquently put it “Yalta was most painful blow of them all.”

Many western politicians at that time were of the opinion that if there was a conservative regime in Poland (read Catholic) in their view the Poles were practically like the Nazis. This view is upheld by the likes of you even today. They chose to support Stalin and did everything in their power to give in to every demand of his, for which we all paid dearly. FDR’s envoy Harry Hopkins personally told Stalin and I quote “We had no desire to support in any way the Polish government in London.” These are historical facts that you can find in official document and policies adapted by the great powers at that time. It is for the very same reason that Polish Government in Exile was not invited to the United Nation Conference of 1945.

It is not my mission to change the opinion of anyone reading this thread including you and I will not debate you. As I have stated before you “lack comprehension skills”. Which part of the “Poles are not seeking financial compensation” you do not understand, perhaps I can clarify it for you and try to be more precise next time, so even a simpleton like yourself can understand.

What if debates are fun and should be taken with a grain of salt. This is appropriate forum to discuss such matters but you should keep in mind they are only an opinion of the author. If I’m not mistaken you write articles for various publications therefore it is my opinion that you should be held to a higher standard than the average poster here. Please take your time when reading so there’s no confusion as to what actually have been said when quoting someone, state the facts as facts and your opinions as such.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Harry the more I read your posts the more convinced I am that you lack comprehension skills. You read the words which seem to pass you by or you seem to draw your own conclusion because you so desperately want to believe your truth. No wonder Britain back then had a likes of Chamberlain or perhaps Chamberlain new exactly how bad of a shape Britain was in and could not act otherwise.

Events in a nutshell.
Beginning of the war, Hitler and Stalin the bosom bodies both taking part in attacking and partitioning Poland. Summer and autumn of 1940 The Battle of Britain, Hitler and Stalin still bosom bodies. Summer 1940 Hitler orders preliminary planning for the land invasion of Britain. July 1940 Hitler orders 13 divisions moved in preparation for first wave of invasion. (Meanwhile the Battle of Britain is not going as well as Hitler thought it would). September 1940 invasion postponed in the belief that Luftwaffe attacks would bring about English surrender. End of September 1940 Hitler orders troops assembled for invasion dispersed. (Of course after the war Field Marshal von Runstedt said that this invasion business was a bluff). During his visit to Berlin in November 1940, Molotov pressed the Nazis to honor their treaty obligation to distance themselves from Finland but Hitler dropped implied suggestions to look towards Asia and not Europe for the expansion of Soviet interests and power. (The fallout between the bosom bodies accrues; Britain can bread easier but does not know it yet. As Hitler himself has said “The whole world took a deep breath”). December 1940 Hitler orders to plan for 1941 invasion of Russia. 1941, The Invasion of Russia by Germany, Britain gains a new ally, Russia.

At this point Britain is still is in no shape to seriously engage Germany so they rely on Russia to keep Hitler at bay. Since Stalin’s requests for the Second Front, kept falling on the deaf ears of his new found Allies, he knew that Churchill and Roosevelt will be more than willing to compensate him with piece of Poland. At Tehran, Stalin put the map of Europe on table and with sharp red pencil delineated the new borders between USSR and Poland after the war. There is nothing more rewarding than nice piece of real estate. Churchill relating the Tehran Conference in the House of Commons have said; “Russian’s demands were right and just". Churchill and Roosevelt were very generous indeed. As the Red Army marched further and further west, Stalin’s appetite only increased for he seen how willing and weak his adversaries were. One conference after another, every single time his demands were approved by Churchill and Roosevelt. Half of Poland was already granted to him, but in order to reach Berlin he knew he could have all of it because he will be there first. Poland was going to be sovereign, independent and democratic, but just a little bit red, according to Stalin’s vision of the region finalized by the big 3 at Yalta Conference. At least that's what the western powers thought.

On July 5th, Great Britain and USA recognized the communist regime in Poland. Since Britain was a host to Polish government in exile and Polish soldiers refused to recognize the communist government as the legit government of Poland plus it was still loyal to the government in exile, this was an eye sore for Stalin and a communist government of Poland. The communist demanded that its boys the last soldiers, airmen and sailors in west return home. After all the question of Europe has been settled and it was time for Britain to salvage what was left of the Empire. Fearing communist demands it was decided to leave them out of London victory parade since they would be represented by the legit government of Poland at the Moscow victory parade and here was a great dilemma for the British Government, Polish soldiers; whose country was "free, independent and democratic", and most important recognized by British government decided to stay in Britain. They were not discouraged by the misfortune of the events and the treatment of the democratic west or the cry of many like you: "Polacks go home! We don’t want you here!” For many of them it was still better then to live in communist Eden. Eventually they moved on with their lives. They adapted to their new circumstances and new found motherland, wherever it might be. Poles are not seeking financial compensation, pity or even understanding by the likes of you, just a simple recognition of the events that have transpired so long ago. No matter how hard you try to twist and distort those facts, you cannot hide the truth.

I see that the spirit of those days is still alive in you Harry. Not only that you are lacking knowledge of European history, especially WWII era, refusing to recognize the truth, but keeping in step with the bigots of this world you still cry "Polacks go home! We don’t want you here!” Yet you move to Poland why?

History / WW2 Arm bands. [11]

Picture 2 5th from the left

I believe it says In Dienst der Deutschen Wehrmacht
"In Service of the German Armed Forces"
This armband was worn by non-German civilians serving the Armed Forces and Russian Auxiliaries when not in uniform.

There were a variety of civilian armbands that identified non-military personnel performing specific duties or functions for the Armed Forces. As the war progressed additional armbands became necessary as a means to identify the growing number of non-uniformed, and often non-German civilian personnel serving in a military capacity with all branches of the armed forces. As a result, a large selection of identifying armbands were introduced.

History / WW2 Arm bands. [11]

The biggest one Picture 1 with black swastika and white emblem inside.

TeNo Personnel Armband (Technical Emergency Aid). This was a civil volunteer organization comprised of skilled personnel who maintained and repaired essential public services in the event of an emergency or natural disaster. In 1939 it was part of Polizei which in turn was controlled by the SS. As the war progressed the TeNo became more of a paramilitary group run by officials who were increasingly controlled by the Waffen-SS.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Face it Harry Britain was scared shitless of what Stalin might think of Poles participating in the victory parade. Britain could not act otherwise because of the agreements made between the big 3 at Yalta conference settling the final division of Europe. The 303 squadron was the only Polish unit invited despite your claim. It was a token of appreciation extended to the Poles by the British government feeling confident enough that this action will not antagonize Soviets. The free Polish Armed Forces in the West served in all branches of armed forces. Men of 303 showed respect to the rest of their countryman by declining this invitation if you can even call it that (note neither did the men of 303 nor most of the people today perceive this as an invitation). Britain could not afford to piss Stalin off and inviting the free Poles could be misinterpreted by the Soviets as an official support of the Polish Government in exile despite the agreements signed and commitments made.

Keeping this in mind; I extend my invitation to you Harry for New Year party which will be held at my house and celebrated by all of my friends who for the most part are Polish. As you have said since most of the Plastic Poles that will attend this party misunderstand your action back then they would be deeply offended by your presents there. To keep the peace I can't seat you over at the main table with the rest of the guests, but there will be a place set for you at the kitchen table. You will still be served the same dishes as my other guests and enjoy same drinks so you can celebrate the arrival of the New Year in a proper manner as the rest of us. BTW this invitation is only given to you and you alone, the rest of your family can't come (this might further offend my other guests). I'm looking forward seeing you there, I'm sure you will have a great time, Please join us.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

So do I, It’s easy to present argument but harder to understand where the other side is coming from. As they say know thy enemy.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


Whoever said they do? The purpose of this thread is to exchange the point of view not some compensation. You might not agree with what I have to say and vice versa, that’s the point.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


No, it’s the German mentality and humiliation that brought this on. Pride is a powerful force and frankly I don’t blame them for this as you seem to blame it all on that treaty, it’s just hogwash.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


You don’t really believe that do you? It’s the German people who democratically elected him to the government and give him a status of a God. Blaming Poles for this is just ridicules. I can understand the resentment of the German people to the treaty of Versailles but to put it in the same basket is just little out there wouldn’t you agree.


What do you think will happen when Americans finally withdraw? Will they blindly follow every policy set by them, even if it’s their puppet government in place?

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


All those examples are in a little puny insecure mind of yours period. You constantly post half truth omitting a word here and there and bending the facts to fit your point of view. Looking for a specific example would be a waste of time and needles argument.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


That’s exactly what Poland did not want to do, government bowing to the Germans.


We were overrun in 5 weeks not conquered there is a difference, modern day example would be Iraq; they were overrun but are they really conquered?


Installing puppet government is not the same as collaboration; having few people in place protecting their own position (carriers if you will because they do not necessarily share your view of the world) and bowing to the masters is not the same as whole population blindly following some ideology. Could it happen? I’m sure it could have and as a matter of fact it did when the communists took over after the war. Finding few people that would sell their own mother for a carrier is not that big of an achievement, it happens every day in corporate world today and you find them in every culture, Poland is not immune to this phenomena. As Crow would have put it Nazi or Communist ideology is not compatible with Slavic Soul, therefore vast majority of the population would never be on your side and assimilate to the German way. The trick to conquer any people is to assimilate them into your own society and wiping off any notion of independence. That would never happen in Poland.


That’s exactly what most of the posters are doing by replying to you posts.


Realistically, not a thing. Britain was spent as an Empire by then, only keeping up the appearance of one. The question of betrayal is not what happen in 1945 but what happened in 1939.

News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]


So you agree and I didn’t even have to put my helmet on. NICE