Return PolishForums LIVE   /   Archives [3]
  PolishForums Archive :
Archives - 2005-2009 / History  % width 138

Why we talk about Nazis not Germans


shopgirl  
28 Sep 2008 /  #61
Also, I find it hard to believe that a nation of mass murderers could be built so easily. It takes a certain type or EXCESSIVE propaganda.

A nation of mass murderers?

Don't you mean a special force within the regime?
Bratwurst Boy  
28 Sep 2008 /  #62
Oh, btw BB, what is ur opinion of Hitler?

Him personally I only know through witness reports...he must have had an incredible charisma (or it was just a real bad case of "power makes sexy")

I think he had some psychological problems but I believe he really believed in what he said, he was no opportunist.
He thought the cause, his cause, justified EVERY means, without scruples.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #63
Even at the expense of terminating life, the most heinous thing imaginable??

He certainly did have psychological problems, through art school rejection and snow sweeping.

No shopgirl, I was trying to get at £ukasz. I don't believe it but he was stating that Germans and Nazis were synonymous. I was trying to make the point, sarcastically, that u couldn't have such a scenario of those who condone killing and such brutality, being at large.

Read my previous posts and u'll see what I was hitting at.
Bratwurst Boy  
28 Sep 2008 /  #64
Even at the expense of terminating life, the most heinous thing imaginable??

At the end he even wished for all Germans to perish as they were not longer worthy of his cause, as they had disappointed him...
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #65
He was full of nonsense, a man filled with rage. I did a project on him, way back in secondary school mind you, but details like his tend to stick in the mind somewhere.

He wished the very thing that he praised dead. THEY WERE his cause. That showed how twisted he was. Disappointed him? Couldn't it be that the Allies were just superior and that he was fighting a losing battle?
shopgirl  
28 Sep 2008 /  #66
At the end he even wished for all Germans to perish as they were not longer worthy of his cause, as they had disappointed him...

Most people either don't know this BB, or choose to ignore it. Or maybe they just don't care.

Hitler only cared for his ideal, his vision. Nothing else mattered. If someone deviated from the ideal, they were eliminated.

Hitler at the end felt the German people failed because they were weak, and that they did not deserve to live as a result of being weak.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #67
And even here he was deluded. The SS WAS super efficient. German soldiers were very talented fighters. They were just outnumbered and outfoxed.

To call them weak was unfair. A sad little man in denial he was
shopgirl  
28 Sep 2008 /  #68
To call them weak was unfair. A sad little man in denial he was

Yup! He was a one-man freak show.
It is sad and frightening that he was able to hide his madness well enough to convince people to follow him.
OP Lukasz  
28 Sep 2008 /  #69
Besides arguments we see above and ealier contribution of this members to this forum.

I find it very interesting that the same members who like generalisations about for example muslims change their preception so quick when we talk about Germans. Now we look on per cents on election results, now we look on how charismatic Hitler was.

In ealier debates we had generalisations.

Indeed very interesting.

It tells a lot about some members of this forum.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #70
What's ur point £ukasz?
southern  
28 Sep 2008 /  #71
It is simple.Nazism could arise only in Germany as bolshekivism could arise only in Russia.However it was one possibility for Germany,it does not mean that Germany could not have followed another way.Instead Germans chose Hitler.

The ones who fought knew very well what they fought for and shared this vision deeply.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #72
And paid for it with their lives. No RIP for hateful minds!!
Somerled  
28 Sep 2008 /  #73
People are sheep. They will always stand on the sidelines and root for whichever team is currently winning.
southern  
28 Sep 2008 /  #74
In fact Germans always supported Hitler even when defeat was obvious.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #75
Not really Somerled. Teams at the bottom of any division still command support. Sheep don't root in that way, maybe in another ;)
Somerled  
28 Sep 2008 /  #76
I'd have to respectfully disagree.

Anyway, my point is this. People will support whoever can provide them, or promises to provide them, bread and circuses.
Seanus  
28 Sep 2008 /  #77
Well, ok, I swore I saw some supporters at Tottenham games, or whoever is propping up the rear these days.

Anyway, I know what u r trying to say and I respectully agree. In a political sense, yes.
Somerled  
28 Sep 2008 /  #78
You can't expect a yank like me to understand soccor...I mean football :)

In regards to why some Germans supported Hitler, being that I'm not a German nor was I alive in that period, I can't really comment. However I would suspect good old fashioned sheep complex. When most people see a throng of people chanting, they tend to want to be a part of the "cool crowd".
Switezianka  
28 Sep 2008 /  #79
'Cause not all nazis were Germans and not all Germans were nazis. Simple.
osiol  
28 Sep 2008 /  #80
We can all go home now after that, I think.
OP Lukasz  
28 Sep 2008 /  #81
My post was refering to some duble standarts ...

I think we make exception in case of Nazi regime. Ancient Romans had some allies and not all policies were suppored by all citizens but we talk about ancient Roman civilisation.
Switezianka  
28 Sep 2008 /  #82
Nazism could arise only in Germany

how about Italy?
OP Lukasz  
28 Sep 2008 /  #83
It was fascism
osiol  
28 Sep 2008 /  #84
But you do still count Nazism as a kind of fascism?
OP Lukasz  
28 Sep 2008 /  #85
There is huge difference Oszczymurku. In Italian fascism nation wasn't equal ethnic group.
osiol  
28 Sep 2008 /  #86
There is huge blah blah blah, I can't read...

niedołężny debilu.
Babinich  
28 Sep 2008 /  #87
Well...for many Germans he was the saviour! The situation after WWI was downright ****** for many, Hitler promised to make it right again...cut the drama!

Well said...

Remember that the General Staff, specifically Ludwig Beck opposed the expansionist polices of the Third Reich.

His only hope was that events turn against Germany. To his surprise the moves against the Rhineland and Austria were bloodless.

He retired some time in the fall of 1938 having failed to build a case to the people against the aggression shown by Hitler.
Lodz_The_Boat  
28 Sep 2008 /  #88
I find it very interesting that the same members who like generalisations about for example muslims change their preception so quick when we talk about Germans.

Yup! He was a one-man freak show.

Don't you mean a special force within the regime?

Now we go saying 'its wasnt even the entire regime... a force just...'

Some people never realise what Hitler means to some people Luk. Myself I didnt say that 'entire germany' followed him... but most of Germany certainly and most certainly did. At the end of this battle... youth volunteered... and according to their accounts (recorded even now) they volunteered willingly to realize their dream... to show themselves that they were knights of Germanica!

Plus... drawing parallels between Soviet and Nazis is naive. Soviet means to attract people and Nazi means were very different. Hitler was actually quite clear infact... while the soviet were those who showed the most promising dreams regarding economy. Actually the soviets were never (visibly) in favour of killings or racial prejudice. Its a long read.

My post was refering to some duble standarts ...

One of the aspects of humans which Hitler also used.

People like to weight different people differently...and themselves they always try to rescue. Maybe due to the German people being European... who knows... and ofcourse...themselves americans who had less than military losses in the war.

About Germans... they are obvious to explain that it was Hitler alone.

But then... where are we going with this argument...

Dont seem to go anywhere.

However, I disagree we shall call them German's instead of Nazis... this might not be helpful for the union of our future generation on path towards peace. But the history shouldnt be engineered for the sake of 'False Pride' of Europeanism, our whiteness, religion or any other reason.
Patrycja19  
29 Sep 2008 /  #89
At the end he even wished for all Germans to perish as they were not longer worthy of his cause, as they had disappointed him...

yes, my grandmother in law remembers how it was, she was there, she lived
thru it and she said how awful it was, the raids, bombs if you opposed hitler
you were one of them, so you had to be fully with him and do what was told
or else.

BTW.. long time since we brought up this german issue ;)

hello brat.. :)
Lodz_The_Boat  
29 Sep 2008 /  #90
long time since we brought up this german issue

Yea.... but do you think that Germans were not in support of Hitler's plans as he laid in his book?

Ofcourse those who didnt support him were not in comfortable situations... but there were alot more who supported him.

Your grandmother was Polish (probably?)?.

I have some history aswell about this war...

Archives - 2005-2009 / History / Why we talk about Nazis not GermansArchived