Poland before WWII or Poland now what would you choose?

No sjam it is the Germans who payed money for wrong country. I am debating now about German compensations. Money should have been paid staright to Poland. It was compensation for Poland not for Soviet Union. It is good that thay haven't payed it for North Korea. LOL

Issue with Russia and other countries is much different subject.

Yeah...they did shove borders around as they saw fit also after WWI greatly contributing to destabilizing Europe and laying the seeds for WWII, and we pay even still today the consequences from their border-reshuffling in the ME...what generous people, weren't they!

How many millions died till now for their border shuffling in Europe and elsewhere? They should be hung!



Maybe you should start a club together with Crowie...you two are already the laughingstock!

I'm confused. "Salomon" was King David's son. "Nathan" was David's prophet. Am I listening to a discussion between two Jews here?

Lukasz discovered his jewish roots just recently..hence the new name of Salomon (and that he got thrown from the board before)...

They paid money for the correct country. That the money was apparently stolen by the Soviet Union is not the fault of Germany. When you whine about this theft here and to German, all you do is tell us all that you know there is no way you will ever get any cash from Russia (either for WWII or the communist era crimes) and so you want Germany to pay out a second time.


Precisely.

Why Soviet Union was Correct country ? Not Poland... using your logic they should pay compensatons for Vatican as long as majority of Poles are Catholic ... but why Soviets ?

The Germans paid compensation for Poland ($1.5 billion). The money was paid to the Soviet Union (as Poland had asked it to be). You seem unable to understand this very very simple fact.

Because Germany lost the war.
Poland was from the beginning on the side which won!
And you compare situation of Poland and Germany??????/
As for Ukraine there was no such a state before 1990 - never!
As for western part of Ukraine those territories belonged before a war to Poland and during the war great part of the locals which have seen themselves as a Ukrainians sided with Hitler and were doing ethnic cleanings or whatever is called now when on the given territory people are being murder only for being Polish( or other) .

These lands Poland lost to Soviet Union, while German lands were given to Poland.
Also in the middle ages most of the lands we are discussing were either part of Kingdom of Poland, were dependent vassals or had a rules of polish origins.

There were close ties till about 1530 with raise of Protestants, when local population (like BB ancestors more likely) began to absorb "German" culture!

Contrary to situation in western "Ukraine" were since 1360 were part of Polish Crown and nobody till 1848 ever heard about Ukrainians, before they were considered local peasant and anybody who had any education were thinking himself as a Pole.

It was like if highlanders started to believe they are not Polish but Highlandish!
Well, If they identify as Ukrainians - go ahead but don't forget about settle issue with Poles, they cannot simply talk about occupation, exploitation and ancient rights of Ukrainians because it is not truth!!!!

As for Germans I have not doubt they are conceiving plans to get back they lands when the opportunity arise!
And if Poland wont do it the same, we can end with prewar western border and postwar eastern border.
Anyway I see those drowning parallel between wester and estern Polish border - there none!
We were given German land just because it suited Stalin, same with eastern border!
If Poland were treated rightly as one of the main victors of the WWII we would have keep our prewar border in the east and had some addition in the north and west - not so radical as present border!

As for Lithuania we have no claim as such (means rights) but there were always majority of local population being Polish and if Lithuanian government will carry on its discriminations - there is always option !


sure tell it to Frederic the Great and also tell him not to take part in the partition of Poland- its all stared there, so stop blaming versatilities because in the east you have got a good deal!

If you talk about fair - contribution which France paid to youz in 1871 - pretty fair ????whiner!!)0))000

Nathan
Killing = killing - not true!
important are circumstances!
You know it! And if you don't you should know!
to be forgiven you have to first admit your guilt.>

Where ?

In Katyń forest ?

Potsdam actually.

I note that you no longer dispute that German did pay compensation for Poland.

I hate to tell you that but before 1989 everyone if ever then talked to Soviet Union and not to any of the satelite countries. Poland wasn't a free country.


Oh, now I understand your point, so when some country loses a war it also loses the right to be treated fair, right? If so then why do you claim your ex territories in Lithuania and Ukraine. Poland also kind of lost the WWII losing a big chunk of land to the Soviet Union so I guess your claims are invalid.


hate to tell you but only in your history books written by the Soviets or pro Soviets at least. Soviets were the winners but not Poland and that's why they took whatever they wanted and there was nothing you guys could do about it.

Also the compensations paid by the Germans went to the Soviets because they were the only, let's call it "free" country in the entire eastern block.

Poland a winner! Sure...:):):)


Well...how many millions were killed because and during the partitions? Wanna compare that and the later border shuffles by your friends the Brits???
Even today there are wars and tensions all over the world because of their border shuffling regardless of religious and ethnical facts...they should be hung!


Manno...look around you....no borders anymore....if there had been any plans for German domination and the possibility to settle where we want they came already true!

If you really think we are going to risk that you are so wrong.
Germany would nothing gain from any kerfuffle again...as it is right now it's good for us! :)


I blame Versailles, not versatilities! :)

I want to let you know that Ukraine regained its independance on August 24, 1991. Hope this year you will celebrate this day the way it is supposed to.

I fully agree with some guys about your laughingstockability syndrome. You don't even know the basics of history and claim that country never existed. It's pathetic. Grow up, kid. Westerns territories of Ukraine were occupied by Poland and now Ukraine rightfully possesses its old territories. Let's not talk about Peremyszel', which remained in Poland even though it belonged to Kijivska Rus'. Keep it. You are scared of Germans. It looks like as soon as something happens on your western border you will run in fear to the eastern to claim something in Ukraine. You will be met. As I've already told once, don't be afraid to bring horses, Ukraine won't use its new T-84 Oplot-M tanks the way your western neighbors did in WW1. ;)


You claim that Poland was a main victor and should have taken territories of Ukraine for that? What about Ukrainians, haven't they fought and died for their land? Ukrainians lost 1.4 million soldiers, while Poland - 240,000 soldiers. As a country we lost 7.5 millions people! So should Ukraine claim some of the Poland or Germany now? Have some respect to the fallen, victims of this fcuking war. Brainwashed like you start all the wars because they want more and more.

Live your life or groom your horses. We are ready.

and you're not even counting those 7 mln. Ukrainians who were ordered to hunger to death back in 1933 by the Soviets.

No, I didn't mention the deaths of murdered by hunger people where the last piece of bread was taken away. Let they rest in peace and we will never forget them.

its native citizens ... :)

Well, seem to me that you generally don't understand much do you?
Germany formally surrounded - unconditionally according to international law means that loser is on the mercy of the winner and when Allied power assumed the rights of German government they could do anything and is legal in the eyes of the international law.

So, German "rights" are groundless if we are talking about law.
On the other hand Polish government never surrendered, only one day its "allies" stopped to recognize Legal Polish Government - bastards!


exactly my point!0


you should start new thread !))))


Well, their were your friends as you were hand in hand were building New World Order in which Soviets and American were dividing the World at the expense of British Empire and Poland!


Did I said it?


You may as well blame versatilities for it was not main reason for war!
youtube.com/watch?v=LwsmzHxMktA

youtube.com/watch?v=KoclI1wGjss

no you don't understand much at all Ironside. You lost the war and the Soviets won it and yes, you were on the mercy of the winner. They gave Poland what they felt like giving, that's it. They took the cash from the Germans and took a big chunk of your land and gave you what didn't belong to them anyway. If the WWII wouldn't be such a huge tragedy, we would have more than just one reason to lough about it.

Soviets were never our friends but everyone was fed up with that damn war and we had to put an end to it even on cost of some agreements we shouldn't have done.

;)

Now, Nathan stop that sulking nonsense!
or tell me when there was an independent state called Ukrainian Duchy, Kingdom, Republic or other and was independent longer then one year.
And if you show me that such state had present territories - I'll agree with everything you say - otherwise you should stop talk rubbish !

yes aphrodisiac is probably looking in the mirror and keeps saying to himself "I'm smart and look at those two, they're stupid" hahaha

I'm glad I made your day :-)

It had a different name and it was called Kijevs'ka Rus' lX - Xlll centuries, then it was Hetmanate Ukraine XVl-XVll centuries, then it was Ukrainian People's Republic in 1918-1920, then it was Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic - 1922-1991. Now it is Ukraine. We have a long history, brother.

Well, you have asked about rights !!!
If we are talking about force there no need for any rights and our discussion is pointless!


The above is only PR!
There were your partners and you divided the World! Roosevelt and Stalin - hand in hand- imperialists!

no, I am thinking: those 2 have the energy to discuss things they have no control over. I just like to conserve my energy, that is all. Have it, use it:)

well, I don't think Poland has more rights than any other country to claim anything, this is my point.


Oh, so now they weren't your partners anymore Ironside? :-)

Long history - so be it!
But I asked :


?????????
Do you know what - independentmeans?


??????
I want facts Nathan not your interpretation.

you don't have control over something you don't have a damn idea about. Unless you mean those things have already happened and there's nothing we can do about it anymore. So we which one is it?

I do, Irony ;) I am waiting for you, my prince on a horse. Oh come, my love, I long your passion ;)