Friend told "just allow your son to forget Polish" by school.

My mistake, but is English not the official language in the "UK"


Not just Polish but all those with the Slavic languages seem to grasp Englis quick and progress quickly. (this is what I was told off a teacher)


There wouldnt be and whilst you may knock teaching assistants they do have to have a certain degree of education and training these days and there are different levels and if it wasnt for them, schools would be much worse off, can you imagine one teacher in a class with 35 kids with 75% of the class no English?

No, you're not mistaken, you're quite right.


Yes but I know the child and I am saying he is not struggling. His English is good, better than his Polish. There is no issue with either language bothering him but his parents have been told to allow him to forget his Polish.

listen, whoever told his parents this is talking GUWNO, how can you tell a kid to "forget" his mother tongue? of course he will not struggle in school with two languages. Really she should talk to the head teacher!

Then tell the teacher to p!ss off and mind her own business.

Why was the teacher / teaching assistant involved if there is no real problem ?

Mr H if you cannot offer anything else other than this pre-adolescent reply, refrain from discussing any other matters with me please.

Lexi, I'm giving you my opinion, based on what's been said.

I'm sorry if you don't appreciate it or cannot at least see another person's point of view.

I may not agree with you, but you should at least allow me the courtesy of having an opinion.

Please refrain from discussing any futher matters with me if you can't engage in a debate.

That was my original point.

It was a routine parents meeting.


Ideally, you can't.

Okay.

1. The UK has the worst first language education system in Europe.

2. The UK has the worst foreign language education (for the local population) in Europe.

Obviously no one should listen to anything a teacher from England says about language learning.

There's every possibility that the kid in question will need Polish in the future (since he probably has family in Poland) and letting it deteriorate will not help him learn or speak English any better.

The parents should speak to him in Polish and make sure he can respond in Polish.

In short: Being bilingual will be good for him. Being just another monolingual English speaker will not be especially good for him.

ps: I'm a professional linguist, translator and language teacher if that makes difference.

I agree with you Mr H, this is a public forum and yes I should see another person view, and yes I should let you have the courtesy of an opionion. However I never got the impression that the child should" not be taught polish" this was purely your assumption.

A child naturally picks up a language, and has very little to do with osmosis.

Apologies, I must have missed that bit.


I don't think anyone is doubting the benefits of him being bilingual. The issue seems to be around which language should be given any kind of priority.


Thanks. Are you trying to be offensive ?

why are they talking in english to him at home and then get offended by this comment? seems on par with their way of raising this kid.

I never need to _try_ to be offensive.

Are just another monolingual English speaker? If so are you happy about it?

Back to this case, I wonder if maybe the teacher in question just felt they had to offer some kind of 'helpful' advice and just said the first thing that popped into their mind without thinking it through very well.

They thought they were helping him. They want him to be happy and successful here so boosted his English. No way did they encourage him to forget Polish or Poland. So they've every right to be offended that someone else suggest he forget Polish.

I don't know how offended they are of course, I think, like me, they think it's crazy.

isn't that essentially what the teacher wants?

Unless it is a private school of course.

I've never known a teacher who was happy with the level that a student was progressing to suggest forgetting a native language. So no, I don't believe that it was what the teacher wanted.

i'm sure there is more to this story. for some reason i have a funky feeling about the parents.

Your remarks about foreign language teaching and teachers wasn't exactly friendly.


To a certain extent in that the other languages I was taught at school (French, German and Spanish) has gone by the wayside somewhat as I've never really needed it.


I think that might be true. It's quite likely that the teacher involved may have been relieved that the parents were teaching the child English and wanted that encouraged.

I don't know what area of the country this is happening in, but in some places the sudden influx of foreign children into schools was something they were not expecting and given very little help or support with. It's perfectly possible that this person was just thinking on their feet and doesn't really know what to suggest.

Maybe try and see things from the teacher's point of view ?

From where did you acquire this date?

UK infant schools are excellent, although I only have first hand knowledge of Italian and Spanish primary schools, I can tell you they simply don't compare at all.

I'm sure there isn't. You can have whatever funky feeling you want. 5 year old boy with very good English. Parents told to forget his Polish. Hard facts.


Yes, fair enough and that's a good point. Of course, I accept that the teacher might have just said this without thinking about how it would come across. I'm sure parents evenings can be tedious. However, it's acceptable to ask for an explanation of something that has been said.

I did ask my friend if her son was talking in Polish with another Polish kid in the class but the answer to that is no. There is another Polish kid of the same age at the school but they are not in the same class and don't know each other too well.

perhaps the parents need some english lessons?

My most offensive comments (of which I mean every syllable and can absolutely defend) were about first language teaching.

A few years ago on Linguist List there was discussion comparing how first languages are taught worldwide (Danish to Danish kids, Korean to Korean kids etc) and the overwhelming consensus was that first language education in English speaking countries was terrible and that in that sorry company the UK was about the worst.

There are complex historical reasons for this (short story: the traditional models of grammar are awful and make no sense but for various political reasons can't be replaced). The effect is what it is.

I do have sympathy for the poor teachers trying to do a good job in the English school system, totally unprepared for the influx of non-anglophone kids and given no help or preparation.

And I know first hand how often teachers feel the need to offer (unwanted, unsolicited) advice (that will not generally be followed). I've found myself doing it though I try to keep it in check.

Just tried to send you a PM to apologise for being a moody git earlier, but your setting don't seem to allow for them, so I'm doing it this way instead.

Sorry !


I'm too tired to respond fully, so will have to pick up on this another time.

Night all x

Mafketis what is this rubbish you are feeding the members of this forum. Pray tell me what are the "traditional models of grammar which are so awful and make no sense "but for various political reasons!

Are you talking about the way expenses claims are interpreted, which make no sense but cannot be replaced because it is so advantageous to politicians for various political reasons

Most of what used to be taught as 'grammar'.

- Don't end sentences with prepositions. ("That's the house in which I live." instead of "That's the house I live in."

- Whom is the object form of who (say "Whom did you see?" and not "Who did you see?"

- Don't begin a sentence with "hopefully"

- Don't use lay as an intransitive verb (don't say "He was laying on the couch.")

- Don't use the 'accusative' after be (say "It's I." instead of "It's me.")

Not a single one of those 'rules' makes any sense for English.

Actually the grammar materials for those who learn English as a second language are ten times better than those for native speakers and the reason is that it was impossible to teach anyone to speak real English by using those rules.

But if you try to teach children the real rules that govern their language a bunch of dinosaurs will try to have you burned at the stake for being a witch.

hahah you're right! what rubbish those "rules" are!
you forgot.."Never never split an infinitive"

These rules were made by some elitist Latin taught establishment bods, God knows when, maybe in the 18th century. Maybe the problems that Uk has with grammar and languages is class based?

Mister H


Don't worry about it have a nice sleep. No problem.
Mafketis above, is giving everyone the Oxford Concise of life !!

When in Rome......

I had a friend in Hong Kong who grew up speaking 4 languages. His mum spoke to him in Cantonese, his grandma in Swatou, his housekeeper in Philipino and he had to use English at school. He was really fluent in all 4 and wasn't confused because he knew which person used which language and accepted that.

I think that if the people around him had mixed the languages up, like mum sometimes using English or maid sometimes used Cantonese it would have really confused him. But he was fine.

Maybe your friend should speak Polish to the child at home but let him use English at school.