What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others?

The US entered the war at a time which was convenient for them. Britian had held off the onslaught indefinently. Germany had opened the second front against Russia. Hitler had been defeated in Stalingrad and the 6th army wiped out, the German war machine was beatable in its own back garden. Then Hitler declared war on USA. Finally when the US realised that Germany was at its weakest point since the outbreak they finally jumped in.

Hardly a courageous commitment when stripped down.

The Soviets killed seven out of ten Germans. The Soviets not only "held off" the Germans the Soviets destroyed the cream of the German forces.


Von Manstein stabilized the southern front using his famous 'Backhand Stroke'. The war in the East was hardly settled after Stalingrad.


Germany was weakest in February 1943 (Kasserine Pass)?


Though disgusted with Roosevelt the word "courage" is hardly appropriate when some 400,000+ Americans gave their lives in battle.

look it up yourself, better yet show the link where they were without.


With US money and 25% of Britain forces ally.

I'm not the one claiming betrayal, you are and you have just illustrated that you have no valid reason to think so.

Well done.

whatever, I see many links with Britain's planes so for this to be the reason, I guess if it makes you feel better. IMHO Britain as well as others betrayed Poland and worse played games with Polands peoples lives by pretending to be coming to help vs. just telling the truth. I don't know what was worse. Polish could have altered military options had they been privy to "real ally plans". Instead they bought what they were told, hook, line and sinker.

There were no allies in 1939 only different countries with there own agendas.

Why do you think Britain didnt invade Germany?

I would very much suggest that you get your foul lying excuse for a human down to Krakow and light candle at the following graves. These are only the names which start A to C. To find all the others you will need to go to

cwgc.org/search/cemetery_reports.aspx?cemetery=2016900&mode=1
and look for any member of the RAF who was shot down during the time of the Uprising and was in Squadron 31, 34, 148 or 178.

I don't see an issue with the condition of the graves as the photos show. Not all the ones buried here, died fighting in this location.


cwgc.org/search/cemetery_photos.aspx?cemetery=2016900&mode=1

Just because they were sent here, they were captured in many locations and transported to this location. Here is a sory of one man that was fighting in France.


I put this link because it has some great photo's.

prisonersofwar.info/my_granddad's_story.htm

Please stop with the lies Carol. The British bombing raids of 4 September 1939 have been mentioned repeatedly in this thread.


Quite right Carol: not all of them did. But some of them did.


As your own link shows, some of the graves do belong to British men who died in combat in Poland.


Check which squadrons those men flew in and check the dates that they died. On those dates those squadrons were taking part in the operation to supply the 1944 Wrsaw Uprising (sadly the RAF were in no position to get supplies to the 1943 Warsaw uprising, what was the excuse of the AK?).

US loan actually. The loan lease program.

You only say that because you know I make a valid point. I point the fingers at the ones who deserve it. The ones who did nothing. You say I am ignorant????? DID WORLD WAR II HAPPEN???? Oh, let me guess it's some media conspiracy, it never actually happened which is a crazy lie Europe wants the rest of the world to believe.

Why don't you address my questions about the Treaty Of Versailles and how Germany was allowed to violate it's "points".
I think they were allowed to do that so the Wehrmacht could become a formidable force against the Soviet military.

Something that more than one poster on this thread seems to be advocating as the best course of action.

Only to the sociopathic. The best course of action to everyone else would have been not allowing the wehrmacht to get as powerful as it became. Why not just admit the truth? Western Europe initially wanted the wehrmacht because of the Soviets and their huge numbers.

There was all kinds of talk about Bolshevikism and fear of that. Talk of communism and even more paranoia there. Western Europe was scared of the Soviet Union.

Britain and France miscalculated tho' , when they trusted Germany to be the one with the wehrmacht. They should have learned their lesson during WWI.

Obviously, Britain and France didn't calculate the aggression. Mistake on their parts that took many, many, lives and not just civilians. They put their own troops at much greater risk by trusting Germany. Originally, Britain thought it was just going to be Poland but Germany kept grabbing more.

The reason Poland was betrayed is because it was seen as a bubbling couldron of communism and bolshevikism. It was seen as unstable and unpredictable. Western Europe wasn't in the mood for any more revolutionaries, and wanted to eradicate which is exactly what happened.

I don't think Britain would have done anything at all if it weren't for international pressure and the threat of Germany. They miscalculated the aggression of Germany. Who knows, maybe they didn't think the Blitz would happen...I read somewheres that Germany didn't initially want a war with Britain and wanted to be allies.

Regardless, Britain was willing to sacrifice Poland, for reasons stated above, apparently.

Were the US party to the Treaty of Versailles? If so, why didn't they do anything about it?

Let me guess... it wasn't their duty? It was Britain's duty to ensure the balance of power in Europe.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but stop looking for someone to blame. It's boring.

Lets face it Poland fought after being shafted, trusting once more (silly Polish) in a promise of a free Poland at the end of the war. Betrayed by all once more.

Not entirely but Britain has responsibility. Britain and France were the closest to the situation. Back then, they were in the position to act much more quickly.

During the 1930s, rapid deployment of troops from far away(as in across the Atlantic Ocean...that kind of distance) was much more complicated! How can it be denied Britain and France, because of proximity, be the first responders?

America should have committed it's share after the ground invasion by Britain and France, or done it's part to enforce the points before. US failed there.

Actually Wilson pulled out after he thought it was agreed on his "14 points" (something the Germans agreed to too).
He thought the Treaty which later came to pass much to vindictive and plain stupid, not one to reconciliate and to ensure peace!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Points


The US are the least to blame here!

Haty seems just to be another polish big mouth with lots of demands, empty phrases and reproaches...but no viable alternatives!
Add to that a lacking of historical understanding and you have your typical mix...

And you seem like a typical sociopath.
I think the US are to blame as well but come on. Think of the distance! US is half way across the world Britain and France are in Germany's backyard. Of those three, who is obviously going to have an easier time acting quickly?


Without ratifying, how much responsibility does the US have?
One huge mistake with the treaty was Western Europe wanting to punish Germany financially instead of militarily. Would have been much better keeping them from having a navy and air force while allowing their economy to thrive.

Well, that's a compliment coming from our board idiot!


Our board idiot has spoken!

She's American, but apart from that you're spot on.


Are Poland to blame as well? I mean they did border Germany. Surely they would have been best placed to launch a land invasion? No?

You just saying that because you know I'm right. Truth hurts. I understand.


Blame Poland for the invasion of Poland. Hmm. stuff like this has happened before and was justified after a civil war or something occuring in the country being invaded.

Invading Poland over Gdańsk - entirely unjustified.

I would like to see statistics. I would bet a months wages that Polish children are more savvy in European history than average European.

I only see Amis here...oh and a half Greek...:)

Why would the truth hurt? Bratwurst is German!


Well done love. Yes Versailles was a shambles. Tell us something we don't know.

Hateful, you can get theat tiny violin out and play it as long as you like, it won't change the fact that you are an ignorant cretin.

I dunno...Poles still believe Kopernikus was a Pole! That they saved Europe countless times, that everybody is out to betray them and that the world owes them something.. :):):)

You mean Copernicus?

By the way, I'd like to notify you all that HatefulBunch is an American, not a Pole. She's a little bit on the ignorant side when it comes to European affairs.

~LOL.......Nope. only Germans think that, not Poles <they have more sense>but Germans still make nice BMW cars, so they have something to be proud of :)))

<grin>

I was actually referring to this:


Do keep up.

You are harping on about Britain's responsibility in regards to containing Germany. Surely POland could have done more?


Except she's American. I tell you what, I bet the average person with a history degree has a better understanding than the average plastic pole on a forum talking utter rubbish... just a theory of mine.

It was a shambles...but that isn't the entire story.


That sounds like something an American would say :D :D :D :D :D


You have to admit Poland is one country that hasn't got a good history of fighting and winning wars. What could Poland have done?

Perhaps not saved, but certainly provided a buffer zone against Mongols (Legnica) and later Tatar raiding, Battle of Vienna, Polish-Soviet War (with minimal French aid)...

Bratwurst, I don't see why you can't at least give Poland some due respect for these victories. (Legnica was more like a draw...)

I know it would be hard for a German to do such a thing...

Hell, we all know Germany was in no shape to repel the Soviets in 1921... they would probably welcome them with open arms!
These were not groundshaking victories, by any stretch of the imagination, but they were victories nontheless, that helped shape the European landscape.