Poland has now 2 presidents?

So it seems Poland has now two Presidents? They just showed them on TV. On political forums and blogs they say one of them is a fake one (for security purposes) and only the real one does the job. I think it's smart - the former USSR did such tricks with Lenin and Stalin. I think the current US president has a look-alike too.

Forgot to attach pictures of them:

are you serious? do they really say such stuff on forums or just joke about it?
these two ducklings are bro's! but to make it funny, the other one is about to become the PM... or already has, I don't know.

Well, I support the Ducks, though I haven`t voted for them. It might be a little bit strange that the PM looks almost the same way as the President - but I find that judging people becaouse the way they look is quite primitive.

I guess I was kidding (sorry). But I was surprised the two most important VIPs in Poland are brothers... :)

well, I think that joking about these two is quite alright. after all they are public personas.
Wujek, please, do no confuse joking with judging, though the line might sometimes be very thin.

Ok - there is nothing wrong about joking - it`s just that a lot of the people in this country don`t respect public institutions - and I`m a little bit oversensitive about that issue.

I have to admit I'm one of those, who don't respect public institutions, perhaps because my feeling is that I'm not receiving the slightest respect as a citizen, from their side.

And what would you expect from the government that would make you feel respected ?

good question, so easy to answer, though
I guess, I'd expect the government to do its job for once, instead of boldly showing us a finger whenever something difficult comes accross. we pay big money for politicians good life, what we get back is a joke.

Why do you say that the government isn`t doing it`s job ?

because the polish government tends to works for itself, not for the population - that would be its job.

And the examples of that are ?

there is a good example.The polish poeple who work and live in uk have to pay the difference between taxes in uk and poland.Unfortunately the cost of living here is not taken into consideration.example?i pay for a single room 380£ a months *6 equals around 2000zloty.how much would i pay in poland?even if someone have worked in uk for lets say 5 years but owns a house in poland the difference in taxes must be paid.There are some exeptions from that but it is not clear and what decision is made depends only on a penpusher you talk to.i find it very, very unfair.our goverment had a lot of time to change the law but they did NOT do anything about that. with my earnings i would have to pay 12000zloty(2000&pound:) for each year spent in uk,so would have my fiancee(24000zl a year!!), but i am not going to give them even one penny.so even though i am very keen birdwatcher i would like to shoot the ducks

Yes - those are very good points and I agree with you fully. Though this situation is in existance since 2004 - and you can not blame it fully on the courrent government. People who are working abroad should pay taxes only according to the proper tax-level - so you`d pay only the difference to the 19% you`re paying here (and you`d have to pay some taxes here, cose otherwise I`m sure there would be a lot of people in Poland who would simply register that they are working in the UK and this would create another area for tax-evasion). I think that the situation is going to change in that direction over time.

But you can not say that the government isn`t doing anything - even for those who migrated to the UK - I`ve heard that over the next month the RPO is going to establish some kind of free service in the UK that is going to give migrants legal asistence and protect workers rights. So rafik - you can not say that our government isnt doing anything for you - it following you even to the UK and it is going even to build its beurocracy there :)

btw. What do you think about Marcinkiewicz ?

my dream is that our goverment(s) would let us do our fings on our own.
marcinkiewicz?well difficult to say i dont really now what to think about him.he has gone now.but to make things simple i reckon that he was a bit too independent,thats why he had to go.take our country's situation:unemployment is falling,foreign companies are begging to invest in poland,everything is getting better so why did they sack him?

It would be the best if it would be that way - but the way to that point is very long.

Marcinkiewicz had to go cose he was becoming too independant - and we all know who is controlling PiS - and on the one side it is bad that he and Gilowska are gone - but on the positive side of it - it`s going to be easier for the government to make decisions becaouse it is now being controlled directly by Kaczynski. Marcinkiewicz has been also rewarded for his loss - he`s now the commissary of Warsaw, soon he`s going to run for mayor - and when he`s going to become the mayor of Warsaw he`s going to have the presidency almost in his pocket ..and I think it would be good if he`d become president - cose this guy is a great communicator, he`s also quite bold and I have a feeling that he could easily move the masses.

Rafik[i][/i]

Could you explain why you pay taxes in england and poland when working in england

well its because the difference between the taxes.in poland we pay 19,30 and 42%(i am no sure if its correct) in england 22 and about 30%. 42 procent tax( in pl) is paid by people who earn about 40000zlotych a year(lets say it is 7000&pound:).if you earn 7000£ in uk you pay 22%. that is why the polish goverment want us to pay the difference between these two tax rates

That's apauling.....so you get landed with a tax bill when you go home?.....no wonder Polish people are deciding to settle here if that is case...

I thought our tax system was rubbish and a rip off..still hate VAT...I feel like I get taxed at every opportunity, I pay nearly £700 in tax and NI a month and then I go out for dinner and there it is VAT......

Polish citizens have to pay taxes in Poland - but the same thing goes other EU countries as well. In the EU if you`re a citizen of country A and you`re working in country B then you also have to pay the difference.


VAT is a tax that is being paid thruout most of the civilized world and in the EU - ALL countries are having that tax.

Ofcourse it would be good if there would be no taxes at all - but the state has to get its funds somewhere.

What has to do Lenin and Stalin with that ?Read little history...

And Wujek, what do you think about the moral standards the new government and the majority in the parliament are trying to impose on the Polish society? Should everybody be a catholic, listen to Radio Maryja and not be tolerant of gays...???

What kind of moral standards are you talking about ? What does this have to do with Radio Maryja and as a matter of fact with gays ?

Did this government - or the previous one - did ANYTHING or said ANYTHING about imposing some kind of moral standards or intolerance torwards gays ?

As far as I know Poland had a LOT to do with the former's Russia (so it had a lot to do with Lenin/Stalin too).

So how about problems with organising the gay parade in Warsaw a year ago when L. Kaczynski was the mayor of Warsaw (he's now the president but he comes from PiS) ? Or W. Wierzejski (from LPR which is now in coalition with PIS) comparing homosexuals with pedophiles or simply criminals (yep, he said it once) ???

I'm not lesbian or sth I am just trying to know what's THE PROBLEM? Cant we just live in a country where people are normal and tolerant???

I am not talking about concrete actions taken by the government or PiS and parties in coalition with PiS, I am just talking about the atmosphere they create and the opinions they express in the media, do you like it???

That was last year - and such parades were banned - becaouse of legal reasons in other cities as well - by mayours from other parties - just like the gay parade in Poznan that had been baned by a politician from SLD. Later on, as you remember, those parades took place anyway.

Besides - what does the baning of a parade of 1/2 naked men displaying their sexual practices in - public - has to do with gay discrimination ? The sexual orientation of each citizen of this country is his private thing - and as I understand - not allowing a bunch of 1/2 naked men to display their sexual practices in public dosn`t hinder them to live out their sexual preference in the privacy of their own homes, private parties or gay clubs.

A public place is a public place is a public place - a sexual orientation is a private isse and it`s private and it schould remain a private issue.

Or do you want to see in our country things like.. gay olympics, gay shops, gay fashion shows, gay schools (like i.e. in NY), gay sports teams ect. - like in some other countries.


No, he did not. He said something like: Everybody who defies law is a criminal, it dosn`t matter if he`s gay or not - and that what you`re saying has been brought into light out of context by the lefties press.

Wierzejski is not also a member of the government - he`s just a parliamentarian.


The problem is with the "old" Europe not with us.

Or do you see that it is normal that in some countries when you openly display your flag - you`re being called a facist.. that the police dosn`t want to intervene in some city areas in fear of being acused of racism.. that after the introduction of laws agains "homophobia" parliamentarians after saying during a parliamentary sesion that "the law against homophobia goes against freedom of speech" is being charged with a "hate crime" and and has to go to prison.. that the press would censor itself with the pourpose not to report about vile, savage acts of voilence comited by various ethnic groups - in the name of tolerance.. that our history books would be rewritten to be in line with official state policy.. ..that during historic battele recreations the opposing armies would be given names like "blue team" and "red team" instead of historic names to be politically correct.. ect. ect.

Do you really want to see that happening here ? - and I have to tell you that this isn`t "1984" - it is the reality in "old" Europe.


So we`re talking about atmosphere ? Atmosphere is something illusive - and as a matter of fact in this case fully subjective.

You`re seeing a bad atmosphere that has been largerly created by the leftiest media. But that what Gazeta Wyborcza is writing in its reports or what some lefties organizations, who haven`t managed, or baerly managed to get into Sejm, are doing and saying is independant from what PiS or LPR are actually doing.

Governing is about making decisions, influances, strategy and tactics - in other words about that what the government is actualy doing or saying - and you`re saying that you don`t have anything agains that - so what`s the problem ?