Polish-German Relations in the Present

Hmmm....growing up I never thought about that...they were quite normal, you know?
No...surnames with 'ski are definitely seen as german, not even as foreign anymore.
I only learned much later that 'ski names have often roots in the east....

Puzzki??? :)

I know though that surnames with 'ski were viewed mostly as proletarians whereas a "von" stood for aristocracy....
(But a "von 'ski" is possible too)

Here is a nice article in the german wiki about the origin of german surnames and the germanization of slavic ones.

de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Familienname#Herkunft_der_Familiennamen

"Beispiele: "ek" (slawisch/polnisch) zu "heck", "cz" (slawisch/polnisch) zu "tz", "kow" (slawisch) zu "hof", "ros" (baltisch) zu "roß", "šic" (slawisch) zu "schütz", "val" (französisch) zu "wall".

Fact is a "Jankowski" or a "Kowalski" or a "Koslowski" is seen as german as a "Müller" or a "Schmidt"....

PS: Interesting info....it seems that slavic surnames ending with 'cki (what would become a germanized 'ski) have their aristocratic history too...

(only in german too, sorry)

familie-woelky.de/ahnen/suffix.htm

It's answer to German tries to restore abandoned possesions after II WW and repatriations... I think that they are deluded and don't understand what it means... They are forgetting what they did to us Slavs (in this case, to Poles)... Poles has their home and they have to secure it!... and, Poles aren`t alone!...

Please, translate this for me, anyone (I have idea but, want to be sure in the meaning of text)...



Poland may demand $20 billion for Nazi destruction of art treasures

HERALD TRIBUNE

By Judy Dempsey Published: August 28, 2007

iht.com/articles/2007/08/28/europe/nazi.php

BERLIN: Poland's nationalist-conservative government could claim as much as $20 billion in compensation from Germany for the destruction of its art treasures during the Nazi occupation, in what is becoming a growing dispute between the countries as Polish parliamentary elections approach, officials in Warsaw said Tuesday.

Do any Scots want Cumbria back?
Does Norway want the Shetlands back?
Does the average UK citizen want any of the old British Empire back?

I thought not.
How about this idea: everyone, forget about the past. Learn from the past, live for the present, look to the future.

I wouldnt mind my great grandfathers old house in India back,from the photos it looked lovely :) though I could probably live without all the house wallahs

Could be kind of answer on your dilemma...

Jews' return boosts Poland

WARSAW | Fled Nazis, succeeded in U.S., now leading renaissance


It`s article of CHICAGO SUN-TIMES


suntimes/news/world/536450,CST-NWS-pol31.article

Try now

It is quite nice

Our friends again

In some parts of gremany they have 30 % support it is their TV spot

NPD has donations from government ... they are geting stronger and stroneger every year. There is big porpabilty they will get in eastern lands about 30 % votes ...

Climate in gremany changes, there are more and more Nazits ===> there are more and more violence with rasist backgroud.

What about German policy.

Polish governemnt several times was offering offical treaties betwen Poland and Germany. Poland wanted to chose "zero option" what means : We dont want anythinq form you, and Germans do the same. We just look into future, and try to cooperate in EU ... Polish offerts were rejected. the treaties are still on table

Any german will explain their governments line ? germans situation (NPD)

I m wainting ...

rzeczpospolita.pl/gazeta/wydanie_070913/swiat/swiat_a_4.html

Maybe they will take "zero option"


Yes they have donations, just because they are ligal organization with the representation in local parlaments, but they have to give back some money as the result of mistakes made in procedures...

In my opinion, Germans have made mistake trying to avoid real discussion, and trying to solve all problems by force like: medial attack, trying to isolate Poland in EU (France helped us) there are several examples of this silly policy ...

What do we have now, they just haven’t break us.... our relationships are lets say cold.
But it is really good, because pretending that everything is fine is worst. Now Germans realized that we have to talk, because we are not afraid, we don’t care about isolation or we can be shown as lets say funny...

We have our interests, like all nations in EU, and just saying: "You are new one, just sit down and be quiet" is so ridiculous. Germans should read some historical books, and check if anybody in history have broken our nation or made us submissive.

Now we have to sit and seriously talk, I think we have excellent situation for this talks. New elections doesn’t make any difference PO isn’t looking submissive.

We know we play in one European team but all tensions are just about our position.

Always "we have to", "we should", "we must", "we ought to"....bla-bla-bla....and where is a result?

1. Polanl little country
2. Poland has poor economy
3. Poland has poor finance
4. Poland has small population
5. Poland has no natural resources
6. Poland has small and uneffective army
and so on and so on....

What do you want, to sit at the same table as France, Germany, GB, US or RF?

Sorry me if I outraged Polish pride...

1. In is one of the bigest European countries 311 900 km UK has about 244 820 km2
2. Every year we are richer, this year it GDP will increase about 6-7% with the lowest inflation in EU
3.It is better and better too, just come to Warszawa, Krakow, Poznan and you will see.
4. 38 mln, 6 place in EU
5. We are one of the bigests exporterers of copper, we have a lot of coal (we just started to made petrol form it )
6. It isnt small, our aim is 150 000 now it is biger, our soldiers are expirenced (Irak, Afganistan) it is partly proffesional, and we modernise it every year, F-16 , rosomak, missilies ... i m sure that its quality is much biger than Russian.

I see Germans just become quiet, so their Russian friend tries to help ...

We talk now about EU table, last prime minister of Spain fighted for Spains interests all the time, and Spain has similar potential as we have.

Thats the idea of europe mate,(or ideal) no matter who you are,if your a member of the club your opinion counts.


The point of the EU is to move on from the times when our soldiers were shooting the crap out of each other.Frankly the latest rounds of so called political talks have been an embarresment for both your countries,both obsesing about the events of 70 years ago instead of focusing on the future. We are far from perfect,our leaders lied to take us into an ileagal war in iraq so Im not saying britain is perfect either.

so maybe i will quote General Italia, we offert Germans quite good solution :


I agree we must solve it... And we dont want to have "victory" it should be made in way when two sides will be just satisfied. In this case it is just so easy to achieve.

Oh sure it's very large! How many hours do you need to cross it from W. Podkarpakie to W. Zachodniopomorskie? I suppose about two or three?


Well, if you have nothing in your pocket, 1$ which was given by US and EU will give you 100% growth!!!
Sorry but your GDP is mainly EU merit, not your!!! You are living on dotations!!!


Thank you, in response, I can invite you to our nothern "Azure Coast", to Magadan on Okhotsk sea! It has 365 sunny days and pretty good temperature, about -40C


Something around two Moscows? I remembered that almost all young people escaped from Poland to West! So, I think that this figure is not quite correct, or it means 38 mil of the aged?


Ah Yes!!! Strategic stockpile: Copper (for bronze battle-axes), coal (for steam engines) and firewood to warm caves, nice set !!!


Oh, famous Polish squadrons of cavalry? Participation in the doomed wars will be a good expirience for you troops!!!

This is discusion about Polish - German relationship.

I have already noticed that you as ther Russian represent the part of your society which has real problem to understand demoracys idea, so I m not surprised you have problems in understanding the EU idea.

Your argumnets show your frustration and dont stick to the facts.

What is more I think you dont watch German TV, If you watched, you would noticed that last time your German friends try to stop beeing shown as an advocate of russian interest in EU especialy in relationships with Poland. So thank you ConstatninK for help ;)

To be honest i look on our relationships (German-Polish) in a positive way, I think both sides wants to solve problem, so it should happen.

Nothing positive will happen as long the crazy duo of yours is in power.
Should they win the coming votes again expect much more cooling of our relationship.
They build their whole campaign over hating Germany...wich is funny because it brings the image of a two headed snake to mind, one head spits and the other looks for help and money!

PS: I think Germany should forge closer ties with Russia....both sides would only profit.
A relationship with Poland brings Germany nothing....nothing positive at least!

last times Germany forged close relations with Russia was 1938 or so (Ribbentrop - Molotov pact), then you had DDR-USSR close relations, resulting in West Germany being forced to pumps millions of marks/euro in DDR's economy after the unification.

Indeed, all I can see is


but dream on, it's Germany's own problem, not ours

Another Pole living only in the past....*yawns*

Maybe you have some arguments for today?
Tell me! What positive things brings Poland to the party?

I'm not living in the past only, it was just a friendly remark for your great nation, but if you believe Russia has changed, then it's ok with me, really. Do as it pleases you.

Arguments for today? not all is gold that glitters
and I don't care what Poland brings to your party, if they bring something you don't appreciate, I won't be able to convince you of its values.

since now I havent seen any anty-german spot


I m not surprised by this post, thats why our "crazy twins" and if they lost, Tusk, will vote against all initiatives made by German governemnt in realtionships EU - Russia. It is just in our business, and having one EU line in those relationships is in European bussines. So we contribute sth to the party. We havent invented those rules, and we just dont care about your presure.

You know whole Europe noticed you (germany) want to be new leader of Europe, you dont want to pay, you want to use solidarity when you need, you have ambitions again... you just want to be yourself again.

But what can be interesting: how is your Tandem France-Germany ?? Have you noticed any changes ? As I know they dont want to be leaded by Germans, there are many other countries which just dont want to have in EU German domination, and it isnt about history, business is busines. so again: "How is your friend Sarkozy ?" Maybe your governemnt have noticed what you havent noticed. Your government tried to isolate Poland in EU, but other countries havent agreed ... you have inside problem : NPD, thats why, you have to be very nice for USA (you have just started) ,you society is one of the most anty-american one, but you just have to do again what you have been doing throught last 60 years. You are in some way funny, you always to much overbid ... you ambitions are just to big, EU dont want you being leader.

About living in teh past, why you government havent taken "zero option" ? or maybe something about NPD and their 30% support in eastern Germany. To be honest you look very Ostdeutscher/Neuelander so I wouldnt be surprised to see you there

So....WHAT does Poland bring??? Do they bring something at all? I only see takers....
ungrateful takers at such!

Go twins !

Lukasz? And your argument would be???

Maybe you will tell me what Poland brings to the EU-party???

Money. PL is one of the largest trading partners in the EU.

Some stats for that?
Being a big trading partner implies having money to buy stuff or have an industry for producing stuff to sell...both things Poland is not famous for...sorry!

Oh and Lukasz...just wading through your intellectual vomit....some questions arose:

"You know whole Europe noticed you (germany) want to be new leader of Europe, you dont want to pay, you want to use solidarity when you need, you have ambitions again... you just want to be yourself again."

Not wanting to pay, huh? That may be true...but nonetheless WE PAY!
We are called the pay master of Europe....lot's of the money Poland lives from is german money!
We want to be ourselves again? Ummm....yes....and?

<<"But what can be interesting: how is your Tandem France-Germany ?? Have you noticed any changes ? As I know they dont want to be leaded by Germans, there are many other countries which just dont want to have in EU German domination, and it isnt about history, business is busines. so again: "How is your friend Sarkozy ?">>

My friend Sarkozy??? I had no idea he was my friend....
The last I did read was that Mrs. Merkel can't stand his french hugs and kisses...it grates on her nerves.

>>"Maybe your governemnt have noticed what you havent noticed. Your government tried to isolate Poland in EU, but other countries havent agreed ... you have inside problem : NPD, thats why, you have to be very nice for USA (you have just started) ,you society is one of the most anty-american one, but you just have to do again what you have been doing throught last 60 years. You are in some way funny, you always to much overbid ... you ambitions are just to big, EU dont want you being leader."<<

Germany doesn't need to try to isolate Poland...that did your crazy twins all by themselves....not for nothing is Mrs. Merkel now called as the most powerful Leader the second time in a row and your twins are the laughingstock of Europe.

And the last I looked it were Poles sliming up the american ass and helping the US in their adventure not Germany.
Germany proved independent in a way Poland has still to learn yet.....

Yes we have ambitions...but at least we have to show something for our bid.
What do you have???

PS: When our NPD once will make german policy the way your PIS does THEN we can call it a problem....not before.

And who lives still in the past ... no comment. Just come to Poznan, Wrocław, Krakow, Warszawa, Gdańsk.

We have the strongest stock in new Europen countries, ukrainian slovakian czech hungarian blatick states companies are listed on our stock, you tried to do it but you just failed.

Our import and export, quite balanced, and on quite high level. Export and import increases about 23% one year ... so watch your back. And you should be nice and polite or we will stop buing your products... (I have already stoped buy german products just because)





And some EU leaders will try to change it, and it will not be our twins. You will see. Germans leading Europe :))) and England, France, Italy just folowing great Merkel and her country :))))

exports stats to the UK don't look so great, I guess all this Polish food/beer in UK stores are just a propaganda or it will show in 2007 stats

What's your problem with Germans leading Europe?

Germany has the biggest population, is the economical powerhouse...Germany pays lot's of your bills...without Germany you wouldn't even being in the EU....without Germany there wouldn't be an EU (at least a functioning one!)!

Your arguments are......?

What can be interesting, in the past Germany was one of the leaders of development, they had about 110% (or even more) of european GDP average. Now you have 100% of average (with new members) so you just middle one (per capita) so you goes down we go up, and everything is ok.

I think thats why you stooped opening service market in EU. It would be grate for whole europe, but germas have full trousers of S**T (mostly because of us :)) ) and they stooped it, because they are really afraid to competitive in open way :)))

am with us (Russia)

>>"so you goes down we go up, and everything is ok"<<

*snicker*...tell me more about that?

Tell me more about polish science and development, tell me more about polish industrial might, tell me more about the polish engineered high tech quality products Poland is famous for world wide...

You always seem to forget that without "sinking" german money there wouldn't even be an "up" Poland!

Rofl

Give some arguments boy, nobody is interested in your dreams!

You know you really annoy me. But just to show other what is the problem in our relationship.

Foreign investments in our country (mln EUR) 2007 will be simply the best ...
This money brought us companies which think we are good place for their investment.

What is more Hi- tech companies realized that our students are on the top in programing, informatics. Poles are inventive and are grate individualists. So We are just perfect for those companies.

For example, IBM ,Microsoft, Dell, Siemens decided to open research centers in our country because we have well educated specialists.

In some way we are similar to Ireland few years ago, so we decided to help for investors who want to open service centers in our country. It gives jobs for well educated economists and is quite good profitable.

Some example LODZ philips centre

tehre are a lot of that examples and this year will be simply the best.

Look here. Poznan "stary browar"

stary brow-
Warszawa
wawa-

You think thats all for your money, and EU specialists (they rather try to prove success of EU) thinks that only about 1% of our 6-7% grovt is just the resul of EU funds ...

So we are rather following Ireland than Greece. At the beginning Irish people were working everywhere, now we do it, but there are more and more laces in our country where we can use our education, and where we can earn quite good money.

So dont worry in the future we will give this money back ... (I hope for you)

I really don't count on it....but it sure would be nice! :)