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GERMAN NEWSPAPER DEFENDS POLAND, KACZYNSKIS - BRAVO GERMANS!


Puzzler 9 | 1,089  
21 Jun 2007 /  #1
'It's the Poles who are saving Europe," writes Alan Posener in the German daily Die Welt on Thursday, 21 June. He regards as scandalous the German media attempts to isolate Poland. Poland and the Kaczynski brothers have been getting ridicule and mockery, writes Herr Posener. He mentions the cover of the latest edition of the Der Spiegel weekly with the headline: 'To Die for the Square Root - How the Poles are Grating on Europe's Nerves.' 'But one who is aware of what the game is about, must admit: the Poles are right,' Herr Posener asserts. 'The Poles refuse to watch silently the stripping them of any influence in the EU Council.... If the EU summmit turns into a fiasco, maybe historians will write one day of how the Poles saved Europe.'

Herr Posener considers it scandalous that although citizens of two important EU countries, France and Holland, have rejected the Constitution treaty, there still have been attempts to accept a EU Constitution. He thinks that Poland's objection to the system of weighing votes is absolutely legitimate. He thinks that 'the lowest' rhetorical tricks have been used to ridicule the Polish President and Prime Minister, such as 'to die for the square root,' which is supposed to be as amusing as 'the Polish cavalry attack against the German tanks in 1939.'

Herr Posener suspects that smaller EU countries sympathise with the Polish position, even though they have either ratified the Constitution treaty or are scared of a row with Germany.

He lists three reasons why the Germans should show understanding to the Poles. First, Germany has always acted as advocate of the smaller EU countries. Second, in relations with Warsaw, Berlin must repair the damage done by Gerhard Schroeder. The former Chancellor closed the German labour market for Polish workers, which was a 'senseless shortsighted political compromise with [German] populist protectionism.' Also, Schroeder's alliance with Russia as a counterbalance to America was a mistake. Third, when Turkey joins the EU in the future, the strong role of the population size in the process of decision-making will not be in Germany's interest. The Polish proposal shows a solution to the problem, Herr Posener asserts.

'Poland deserves thanks, not ridicule,' Herr Posener stresses, and adds: 'In the end, it may appear it's the new Europeans who are the better Europeans.'

(after Polish Press Agency PAP)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
21 Jun 2007 /  #2
I agree fully Puzzy....how I said in another thread the mess with Poland drove home the point that the EU can't stay like she is, that she has to change.

I somehow doubt that Poland will like that outcome but change we must! Congrats Poland, you made it clear to all that the EU has to split if she want's to function further.

And a split EU will be more able to work together and develop further than the stand still which rules now!

THANK YOU Poland (Germany will profit greatly from this development)

:)

PS: Do you think it democratic that 5 people could outvote 10 people?

Third, when Turkey joins the EU in the future, the strong role of the population size in the process of decision-making will not be in Germany's interest.

The Turkey will NEVER get into the EU!

A new aspiring member needs ALL votes to gain entry and even now as this question is still far away several member have already declared to ask their people in referenda and I think we can be sure how they will pan out.

So...the chance for the Turkey to become a member is lower than nil....
OP Puzzler 9 | 1,089  
21 Jun 2007 /  #3
I think Gerries should open their job market for the Poles as soon as possible.

This would be in our mutual great interest, as Herr Posner rightly suggests.

We'll get the hell out of and stop coming to crappy Britain...

Yeah, I think I would prefer Germany and Germans than ...
:)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
21 Jun 2007 /  #4
Yeah, I think I would prefer Germany and Germans than ...
:)

Wha????

:)
OP Puzzler 9 | 1,089  
21 Jun 2007 /  #5
Well, if the Gerries treated us with respect, and not like subhumans, then...sure... After all, for at least a thousand years we have been closely connected culturally, etc. In spite of the periods of hostility. It would be good for Gerries, us and Europe.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
21 Jun 2007 /  #6
I miss your "Krauts!"...."Gerries" is so....so....so.....english! :(
polishcanuck 7 | 462  
21 Jun 2007 /  #7
Posener?

Posener > Posen > Poznan ?

He's a Pole disguised as a kraut! lol:)
Crow 139 | 8,369  
22 Jun 2007 /  #8
I smiled when I sow this comment because I am not the only one who knows truth about Germans (on this I must generalize)- that they are Slavs in disguise.

When I think about Slavic politicians I`m sick and, German newspapers are happy. What`s going on?

Take for example Serbian president Boris Tadic, president of newly conquered protectorate of NATO/EU/Saudi Arabia axis. Tadic is very cooperative, almost real traitor. German newspapers are crazy about him. Every conference of his party DS is monitored from German supervisors.

Or, think about desperate Vladimir Putin- former KGB agent who likes to `fly`. We would probably see how he is great trader of Slavic interests (currently having in mind Kosovo situation and Baltic gas bypass around Poland).

Then there are Kaczynski twins who openly support separation of Kosovo from Serbia and suggest nuclear bases in Poland. Twins are happy, Germany is satisfy. God forbid.

I teling you... Slavic world is in deep sh**. Practically that we can say- BRAVO GERMANS!
ajgraham - | 121  
22 Jun 2007 /  #9
We'll get the hell out of and stop coming to crappy Britain...

You can always go home anytime you want Puzzler!!

The Turkey will NEVER get into the EU!

Lets all hope your right.......That would be the end of Europe!!
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163  
22 Jun 2007 /  #10
That would be the end of Europe!!

Europe ended long time ago, now It'a cricus full of faggots.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #11
New development...Poland is out!

Now Merkel asked the others 26 members....now it's "with or without" Poland!

Ooopsie!

spiegel.de
Crow 139 | 8,369  
22 Jun 2007 /  #12
cricus

Brate, you mean- circus?

URL

German langauage is so strange, so non-European
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #13
German langauage is so strange, so non-European

Your grasp on english is not that worse....(you do know that english is a germanic language, right?

:)

PS: What does the polish media say about the meeting?
Crow 139 | 8,369  
22 Jun 2007 /  #14
PS: What does the polish media say about the meeting?

meeting?
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #15
Newest development: Deal is done! WITH Poland!

....seems the threat to just leave them out worked....

(Actually the new voting system will just get used some years later as planned...)
ajgraham - | 121  
22 Jun 2007 /  #16
Europe ended long time ago, now It'a cricus full of faggots.

Why does everyone here keep refering to Europe?.....Why couldn't we all live happily ever after as independant Countries??....Apart from Europe??
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #17
Apart from Europe??

Apart from Europe?
I don't know about you but the last time I looked Germany was right in the middle of it!

:)
ajgraham - | 121  
22 Jun 2007 /  #18
No Bratwurst Boy....I mean why can't we all live with the traditions and culture of each Country in Europe??.......Without the ''Everything has to be the same mindset''......Thats what is scaring people off!
Meg 1 | 38  
22 Jun 2007 /  #19
It looks like Germany and Poland have agreed on a treaty blueprint . . . not on the new treaty per se . . . slight difference. In another report I saw, Presidents Sarkozy and Adamkus were very involved and influential in the Merkel-Kaczyński meetings.

eubusiness.com/news_live/1182553205.1 - EU strikes deal with Poland on treaty: Lithuania

22 June 2007, 23:00 CET

(BRUSSELS) - The European Union has reached agreement with Poland on a blueprint for a new treaty to replace the failed constitution, a spokesman for the Lithuanian delegation said at an EU summit here.

"The negotiations were successful," spokesman Jurgita Apanaviciute told AFP.

A Polish diplomat also said there were "good signs" of a possible compromise deal between Poland and its 26 EU partners over Warsaw's objections to the voting system in the proposed treaty.
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163  
22 Jun 2007 /  #20
will just get used some years later as planned

We will be sucking all the cash for next 10 years and then veto once again :)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #21
NEWS! "Dramatic hours in Brüssel"

Now 9 other countries are AGAINST this compromise between Germany and Poland!

No new deal right now...

We will be sucking all the cash for next 10 years and then veto once again :)

That is very shortsighted and dangerously naive Gregor...Poland needs the EU more than the other way around.
How loud will Polands voice be outside the EU in the upcoming fights with Russia or China or even the US? The world is changing..new powers are coming up...
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163  
22 Jun 2007 /  #22
That is very shortsighted and dangerously naive Gregor

I was joking but...

We definately are not going to fight against Yanks. Russia ? EU is sucking their dick and China is far away, so not our business.
Meg 1 | 38  
22 Jun 2007 /  #23
Braut (may I call you that?), here's a commentary from Polish Radio's English-language service:

polskieradio.pl/zagranica/gb/dokument.aspx?iid=54354 Weekly Commentary

Typical Polish good sense and humor. I especially liked the last paragraph:

"However, we shouldn’t listen just to our own arguments. Being tough doesn’t necessarily mean being stubborn. There is some space for compromise, no doubt about that. No matter if we win or lose the battle, we have to come across as a state fighting for our victory rather than for someone else’s defeat. There is a joke about a merchant saying that for him it’s not enough to be doing well; he wanted to be the only one winning and to see all the others lose. Not a good example to follow."

Also:
"By the way, I would love to know who on earth invented calling a new treaty ‘the European Constitution’. Perhaps someone just wanted the whole project to lose for it was impossible to believe that Britons would support any document called this way. But they didn’t have to look far because the French and the Dutch took care of that."

Heh, heh. :^)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #24
No matter if we win or lose the battle, we have to come across as a state fighting for our victory rather than for someone else’s defeat.

Fighting for the sake of the fight? Especially to deny the Germans a success?

I call that stupid!

I think it will have consequences for Poland...
Meg 1 | 38  
22 Jun 2007 /  #25
Fighting for the sake of the fight? Especially to deny the Germans a success?

But that's exactly the opposite of what the writer is saying. He's saying, we need to fight for this principle ("a state fighting for our victory") and not for the sake of fighting, being stubborn Poles ("rather than for someone else’s defeat" or what you might say "deny the Germans a success" from your point of view). Which is why compromise is possible and will come in the end.

The Poles and the Germans both seem to be fighting /negotiating for advantage AND principle - what is wrong with that?
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,436  
22 Jun 2007 /  #26
We Germans think the Poles (as in the Kaczinsky's) do everything they did and do not because of real concerns but out of Germanophobia...that's their main motivator.

Had the presidency belonged to someone else...maybe british or whoever it would had gone flawlessly.

Right now the sympathy for everything polish is down in the cellar in Germany.
Even if this summit is long gone, regardless the outcome, scars will stay and that will show...
Meg 1 | 38  
22 Jun 2007 /  #27
We Germans think the Poles (as in the Kaczinsky's) do everything they did and do not because of real concerns but out of Germanophobia...that's their main motivator.

I understand that that is your perception. I suppose time will tell - i.e., once the K's are out of office and so on.
OP Puzzler 9 | 1,089  
23 Jun 2007 /  #28
re: You can always go home anytime you want Puzzler!!

- Thanks for, ahem, inviting us out, track driva from Manchaster.

- For some time now, I've been persuading my countrymen to go back to Poland instantly, and I'm going to keep on doing it.

So that you can have a few truck-driving jobs entirely for yourself.

I've seen blood-curdling things in Europe, including, alas, Britain, as regards the treatment of the Polish people. I thought that after living in psychopathic racist Canada I wouldn't be shocked by anything in this respect. I was wrong.

Better to starve than to be treated like this.

And you watch out - maybe one day you'll be in our shoes.

In fact, looking at the state of your country today, I'm absolutely positive you will.

Remember us then.
:)

re: We Germans think the Poles (as in the Kaczinsky's) do everything they did and do not because of real concerns but out of Germanophobia...

- Do you mean that the Poles do everything out of Germanophobia? If yes, give specific evidence in this matter; prove that we do everything out of Germanophobia. Prove that Germanophobia is our 'main motivator' (sic). Don't you indulge in excessive self-flattery? By the way, the Polish President and PM's surname spells 'Kaczynski.'

re: Had the presidency belonged to someone else...maybe british or whoever it would had gone flawlessly.

- And how do you know what would have happened?? Are you some kind of fortune-teller?

re: Right now the sympathy for everything polish is down in the cellar in Germany.

- Who in Poland gives a damn about your 'sympathy'? And isn't the expression 'German sympathy towards the Poles' a kind of oxymoron?

If I were a German, I'd rather be concerned with the German image throughout Europe. The fact is nobody likes you there, even if they are scared you can screw them economically.

re: Even if this summit is long gone, regardless the outcome, scars will stay and that will show...

- Is it a threat?
Crow 139 | 8,369  
23 Jun 2007 /  #29
And you watch out - maybe one day you'll be in our shoes.

In fact, looking at the state of your country today, I'm absolutely positive you will.

Remember us then.
:)

true, well said
blossom  
23 Jun 2007 /  #30
czesc ... by seeing this a little bit from the outside i must say that is not easy to understand how can such hate can continue for so long ... just my opinion ...

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