Homosexuals in Poland / Hands off (PETITION)

thats what I would say too.. :) lol
I just thought I would keep your opinions straight :) you know me..

Love is another condition for a partnership, and it would to have to go first, even before the fertility test you propose. And you might apply that gays love eachothers as well, but I would say that those gays would be a bad example for anybody willing to fall in love with a hetro couple. Weak individuals would be rather tempted through their gay friends to go out on a date with a homo in a desperate situation. Imagine those ugly geniouses like Hawkings or Einstein would not merry and get children but date gay partners. In a few generations we would life in a world of Arnold Schwarzeneggers with wars between neighbouring villages.

haha..ok.... tell me about this love you mentioned...
being gay is not about weak and strong people...
rubbish...

It's not as black and white as to say that people are born gay. Contrary to what many have argued, there is a gay gene. Recent science has shown this. However, it is possible that gay feelings emerge from pyscho-social factors.

The raging debate was between Dean Hamer and Rice/Olbers. Ultimately, much hinged on chromosomes which tipped the scales towards the genes theory.

Given that social conditioning dissuades people from being gay, it is likely that it is more genetic. My friend fought his natural feelings, knowing that his family would disown him otherwise.

Others go through phases. I've known people who are heterosexual but have had a gay experience. Curiosity plays its part too.

*passes tomek brand new headwand*

i believe we've had a conversation about that a while ago...

Probably my friend, probably :)

Yeah that what the gay teachers would like to teach my children, but if you make yourself a picture, everyone is born without a sexual orientation and it develops throughout once childhood/youth. And I just hope none of the chinese or indians or someone with a lot of human resources would undertake the process of proving my point in an experiment, but it is as I tell it. If you show a boy a world of men holding hands and acting weak and without loveable women and examples of men caring for women, he would turn gay!


Damn I should have gotten my girl one of these genetest for christmas!

Going to bed, good night!

The science isn't concrete. There are many possible factors. Quite a compelling theory centres on Oestrogen levels in the womb. Either way, every gay person I have ever spoken to on the issue, has maintained that it was most certainly not a life choice. Most have indicted that they knew they were different from a very early age, and would never have chosen to be gay (not surprising considering the number of bigots out there). Most have gone suffered painful periods of denial during their early life.

But I guess you could only know the above if you actually spoke to a homosexual about their sexuality.

in some cases he is right, my ex bf brother ( admitted gay) but only after I seen him kissing his lover in the car one night by accident.

we dated the year before, but thats it, then I started to see his brother, the attraction wasnt there for me, I liked him as a friend, and we dated, but it felt awkward sorta.. after I said I was going with his brother ,he was so upset and mad wouldnt speak to me for a long time, then he started to, but started acting wierd.. thats when he told me ( after I seen the above) and I openly asked him

he then said yes... which I said ok, whatever .. but he jokingly said it was my fault that he turned gay.. because he loved me.. and I laughed with him, but then asked my friend ( his cousin) and she told me he told her this same thing, but wasnt laughing , was crying..

you dont know in life what things can happen.. he said he felt different as a young man, and says he often thought of men, but if he was to be with a woman it was only me he cared about. so its possible for some to be with women, I think sometimes its because men understand men more so theres a mental attraction right off the bat, just like women feel comfortable with women, there are things that the same sex has in common and things to talk about.. and I think its how comfortable a man can really feel around a woman that goes the same for a women around a man ... some are born this way. genetically more hormones of one or the other, but I think tomek has some valid points as well as you :)

Please stop it. It's as cringeworthy as watching David Brent.

I don't know how it works in Poland but we received 'Living and Growing' at the age of 10. That was our sex education. Homosexuality wasn't even introduced to my memory. If so, it didn't make an indelible imprint, hehehe.

Everyone gets it unless there is parental objection. Secondary school can be a telling phase. This is when hormones become rampant and relationships get tried out. It is possible that disillusionment can move a person from AC to DC but I think it needs a lot of inner convincing to make the change. There has to be the gay urge and some element of genetic input.

Men acting weak, Tomek? Better than meatheads in nightclubs.

I've had in-depth discussions with 3 gay men, all close friends. They poured out their heart to me and confirm what you said, Irons.

peterowen.com/pages/nonfic/borngay.htm
I'll buy you this book as a present, Greg.

Exactly. I remember an Israeli fella I knew at University doing the same to me. He was in denial for a long time, and spent time doing national service. The treatment of homosexuality in the Israeli army meant that he supressed his homosexuality and was feircly homophobic. On the plane over to Israel before he came out to his family, he saw American Beauty and broke down in tears. You can suppress your whole life but it wont change the fact that you are what you are. I believe you are far more likely to lead a fulfilled existance if you can accept it rather than living in denial.

lesbianlife.about.com/od/comingoutadvice/a/Causes.htm

Lesbians were fulfilled before they admitted it, LOL. Sorry, bad joke :(

Seriously tho, his family gave him so much strife that he had to move out. He found another job and was more liberated with a place of his own. The shackles were so inhibiting when he lived at home, poor guy.

I cannot really imagine what it feels like to be gay but I know how heart felt it is, judging by their inner turmoil when outlining parts of their lives.

then why run around showing society your gay by having marches?

why look a man up and down fully knowing he is heterosexual and wondering why these violent hate crimes happen..

I remember going out with my ex bf brother after we had broke up and we hung out at my bars.. he was looking at the men as I was.. it was not a good situation, he became drunk and I had to stop and intervene several times to tell guys he advanced at that he was just drunk and thought the man was someone else.

I realized I couldnt be his hangout buddie.. not in the bars I went to. so we just stopped hangin around for a long time. but it was very frustrating, because he cried on my shoulder many times, just wanting to find a true love and I comforted him.. we got along as good friends.. it was fun to dance and get drunk together until all that started happening.. but he was a victim of a hate crime one night when he went to a park where they gays frequent and a car load of guys got out because one winked at him and he thought he was gay, so the guys set him up

oops and forgot to say they beat him badly he was a mess.

and I told him to stop doing stupid dangerous things..

some things will never be fully accepted by people. and you cant make them.

To show that thay are proud of who they are. Why shouldn't they celebrate their sexuality in the same way that people celebrate their culture, religion, nationality etc?


I didn't realise that eyeing someone up in a bar was worthy of a lynching! I've seen guys eye up my girlfriend when I've been with her. Am I be entitled to carry out a violent hate crime?


I know. In the same way that some people are racist/xenophobic and wont be changed. Doesn't make it right though.

i knew you'd come up with that... please, show it on some research...

if people were willing to accept of course it would be fine, but again heterosexuals dont celebrate being heterosexuals by having national marches.

and just like religion, and cultures some of these are questioned in this very forum and not accepted but are discussed..


its not, but if your the only person able to help someone you care about to not get hurt, my feelings were that we were out together, his knowing this can happen why would you put your friends in danger? or yourself? its fact people dont accept it.. just because I did and his family did doesnt mean the whole world will!!

I was mad at him for doing that, we were in a straight bar, even other gays knows you cant just walk into a straight bar and expect good responses!!

especially if your acting out.. it was eye opening for me.. because I thought why dont people act more tolerant, but they dont its just the way it is!!


it dont and its not going to change any time soon. getting upset at people who dont accept it isnt going to change it either.. they have a right to feel the way they do as much as a homosexual does. thats why I had pointed out that in another thread.


ok heres where i agree with you.. lol

Gay doesn't actually mean weak. You will find quite a number of gay men amongst military, police, in the gym, ect. It does make sense you know. Strong, sweaty men fighting, wrestling, testosterone in the air, buttocks slapping and hitting the showers together afterwards. :)


If you think that teachers can have that big of a impact on young boys psyche, then judging by the numbers of women in the school system here in Poland,( I would estimate that 80% of all teachers are women) almost all young men in Poland should be very feminine these days.

I'm not upset, I just pity them. Some people really are that stupid, it's very sad.


Just as every KKK member has the right to hate blacks as much as black people have the right to be black?

Like I said, people can think what they want. If that makes them a bigoted moron, then so be it. I can't change anyone, although I can point out the above. If someone came on to PF and said ''I hate Polish people, I don't think they should have the same rights as other people, and it is my right to think so'', I'm sure they would receive a few abusive/indignant responses. Even though it is their right to believe it. No?

I wont argue that.. because we have had this ,, its a daily thing and as much as we tell them to deny some of the abusers rights to come in pf because of this, they are still here..

just like the kkk still exists, and nazis still exists <~ and I for one cant stand people like this.. and I would do everything in my power to protect those around me who would be subject to harm by people like this.. but again, my feelings are, I think that making a big deal out of being gay ( not saying they shouldnt be proud) but putting signs up fully knowing people are like this is asking for trouble..thats all I am saying.. we know its happened.. before this discussion, and it will continue to happen unfortunately.

at every march/rally someone will get hurt in the crowd.. stupidity knows no bounds, and they shouldnt be subjected to hate crimes, some innocently have been, but others have openly done/said things that caused something to happen and in society, fully knowing its not totally accepted by some, there should be some type of respect also given.. just like the incident with my ex BF brother who almost caused a problem..

I would like things to be calm to, but a straight man who feels very defensive towards his manhood will get highly upset if a gay man makes advance towards him and its intensified 20 times if the guys are making a joke of it.

so embarassment, and other emotional factors play a key role in how gay men are treated.. if you noticed, the only ones that you hear about performing these hate crimes are men.. women accept gay men and gay women.. if there are any women who have done something wrong to this nature, its few and far between.

nothingtoxic.com/media/1146749681/Test_Your_Gayness

a gayness tester. you need your speakers on for this.

So what you are basically saying is:

If you form part of some minority group (religious, ethnic, political, sexual orientation etc.), you should hide this fact in case it offends people? You should not visibly identify yourself with your group? Muslims shouldn't wear Muslim dress because there are many out there who disagree with Islam. Those who do are just asking to be attacked? Christians shouldn't wear a crucifix as Christianity offends some people, and makes them vulnerable to attacks? Black people should cover themselves in flour before they entire a white areas, as there are white people who hate them. How dare they show any visible signs of what they are! How dare they embrace who they are!!

A white supremacist may get very upset if a black man walks in to his local bar. Are you seriously suggesting this black man does not have a right to enter this bar? Are you suggesting that he 'gets what he deserves' if he does? Should we just accept this fact and say 'that's life'? Surely not?

And that bit about women accepting homosexuality is utter rubbish I'm afraid. That's like saying women aren't racist, as few women are involved in violent race hate crimes. I can assure you that there are many women who are homophobic.

Personally, I don't give a f*ck if a guy comes on to me in a bar (it has happened a number of times). It's exactly the same as if a women I am not interested in does the same (that is currently every women). If I am not attracted to them I will politely make it clear. If they continue to do so, I may get upset. This is no different to guys who constantly try it with girls (who are clearly not interested) in bars and clubs. Do you think a straight guy who eyes up a Lesbian in a gay club deserves a shoeing?

I'm sure that a great deal of homophobia is manifested through people's insecurity in regards to their own sexuality.

I dont run around saying I am polish and I have sex with a man on a daily basis... and I really dont think if I did say this, I would get to many dirty looks VS someone who says I am gay.. and I have sex with a man , or I am black and gay etc etc..

I didnt make this up, it really happens.

when interviewing for a job.. does the application on it have a place to put what gender you prefer?? they dont care, they just want you to do your job!!

when you walk into a coffee shop .does it say gays sit here and do the bathrooms have seperate places for them too??

does every gay person in the world say, I am gay, and I want you to know that I have sex with a man or women.. I really dont give a rats arse!!

just like my preference shouldnt be a big deal..

I am saying, stop drawing attention to yourself..

and as for the above ... all the rest you wrote, your taking what I said way over the top and out of context as to how I am feeling.. your making it sound like I am trying to surpress their way of life.. would you rather see a friend go to work in one piece whos gay and come home in one piece or would you rather he shout to the whole f-EN world, I am gay and someone take a pot shot at him??

I am done with this debate/conversation.. because I dont feel your catching my message and so with that I will agree and be done .

Youre saying its perfectly natural for men to go gallivanting around sticking their penises into other mens rectums.

I used to assume you were a brit with a Polish girlfriend now im beginning to think youre a brit with a Polish boyfriend.

lmao

Lol. And a smelly penis.

Education used to mean something. Now telling stories how a man sticks his penis in another man's anus is also education?

Truly, this world maybe reaching its end and we're all fvucked (pun unintended)

They've replaced God in schools with Gay over here.
Isn't that like one of the seven signs?

Looks like it's time for you guys to start "the homophobic thread." Most racists find homophobia to be an easy and natural transition (just supplant "black" with "gay").