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Czy jest pan or czy pan jest?


Crazy Toad 6 | 17  
27 Aug 2009 /  #1
Im getting these mixed up a lot!
Could someone please explain the difference and when I should use them
Thanks :)
krysia 23 | 3,058  
27 Aug 2009 /  #2
"czy jest pan pijany"? - "are you drunk, sir"?
more emphasis on "jest" - are YOU drunk, sir?

"czy pan jest pijany"?- "sir, are you drunk"?
more empahsish on "pan" - " SIR, are you drunk?"
OP Crazy Toad 6 | 17  
28 Aug 2009 /  #3
So neither is wrong then?

Also If I removed pan or pani would it still make sense,surely they only apply to talking to adults?
krysia 23 | 3,058  
28 Aug 2009 /  #4
you can only remove the "pan" or "pani" if you know the person or if it's a child
gumishu 12 | 6,103  
28 Aug 2009 /  #5
So neither is wrong then?

Also If I removed pan or pani would it still make sense,surely they only apply to talking to adults?

would make some sense but completely different to the one before chucking the Pan/i out

children are addressed to directly - meaning in second person and not third
benszymanski 8 | 465  
28 Aug 2009 /  #6
So neither is wrong then?

word order is much more flexible in Polish than in English. Often the order is changed to give emphasis in a different place as Krysia has said.

you can only remove the "pan" or "pani" if you know the person or if it's a child

just to be clear - you are not "removing" the Pan/Pani - i.e. you can't say "czy jest pijany" instead of "czy Pan jest pijany", but you can use the 2nd person instead of the 3rd person plus Pan/Pani construction to give "jesteś pijany" as gumishu mentions.

The 2nd person form of address is for people you know, children, animals or talking to God. [Although being a total atheist I haven't tested the God bit :-) ]
OP Crazy Toad 6 | 17  
28 Aug 2009 /  #7
benszymanski
but is "jesteś pijany" not "you're drunk"?
Which is more of a statement than a question,or is it meant to be said in the style of a question?
benszymanski 8 | 465  
29 Aug 2009 /  #8
yes you are correct - jesteś pijany = you're drunk

apologies - I didn't bother typing the "czy" which would have made it clearer.
SzwedwPolsce 11 | 1,595  
29 Aug 2009 /  #9
but is "jesteś pijany" not "you're drunk"?
Which is more of a statement than a question,or is it meant to be said in the style of a question?

It can be both a statement or a question depending on what "voice-melody" you use. Normally such a question should be with czy. Czy jesteś pijany? But it's common that people skip czy and use more melody to express that it's a question.

In English word order is very important to express who is the subject and who is the object. In Polish this is much more often determined by endings.

jesteś pijany = you're drunk

Or are you drunk? Just go out on the streets and listen how often people skip czy, and use more melody instead.
benszymanski 8 | 465  
29 Aug 2009 /  #10
yes that's right. It's normally called voice "intonation". I didn't want to over complicate the original question though....
OP Crazy Toad 6 | 17  
29 Aug 2009 /  #11
Ah I undersand that :)
So would "jesteś pijany" or "czy jesteś pijany" be more suitable to use with friends as opposed to adults or strangers?
benszymanski 8 | 465  
29 Aug 2009 /  #12
Yes - as metioned above - generally people you know, children, animals or talking to God. People you are on first name terms with.
Michal - | 1,865  
30 Aug 2009 /  #13
m getting these mixed up a lot!

Why? They are both equally correct.
SzwedwPolsce 11 | 1,595  
31 Aug 2009 /  #14
So would "jesteś pijany" or "czy jesteś pijany" be more suitable to use with friends as opposed to adults or strangers?

Ok, listen. To make it easy for you:

1. If you have a statement (not a question) never use 'czy'.
2. If you have a yes or no-question, always begin with 'czy'.

If you follow these 2 simple rules it will be correct, and you don't have to involve formal/informal considerations.
There are other possible options as well, but don't make it more difficult than it is.

voice "intonation".

Yes, that was the noun I was looking for.

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