History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


Exactly, we were beaten on every possible field. So what is hurting your ass now, pouring crocodile tears over our army? You can't lose like a normal country, you have to write books glorifying your "courage" and telling that other country's army was murdering your women and kids. Grow up, pu*s*-cat. Jee, I hate woosies. Golota-style.


Buy some tourist guide and voila. How do you travel to other countries - by visiting their forums? Not a bad idea, though. Try it.


Who compares them? UPA were fighting for Ukraine's independance and the other - for Polish. We have our heroes and you have yours. The only problem I see is cry-babying and whining on your side. Both sides committed atrocities during the war. The only difference is your constant Polish way of dealing with things - slobber incessantly. I would be more than happy not to see monuments of AK soldiers in Poland, but I have news for you - I don't give a crap about them because it is not my land. My recommendation on your pathology - get some treatment if you have problems with UPA monuments in Ukraine.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]

Who is making victims out of Ukrainians? You cry incessantly about Volyn' and monuments to our UPA soldiers. Do I care if you cover the whole Poland with Armija Krajowa leaders' monuments or those of Dmowski or Pilsudski? I don't give the slightest crap. Stop being whining pussies where English somehow betrayed you and Ukrainians killed you. I see many by now realized what kind of cry-babies you are.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]

Listen, Filios. You present that UPA, which was an army, were fighting with axes, scythes and sickles. Anything wrong with the picture? Why do you always mention literacy? Illiterate peasants and stuff? I never said that peasants or illiterate forces were killing Poles. I have no idea who were the people - professors, doctors, miners..., but they were not UPA soldiers. I don't deny anything. There is a possibility that some UPA units took part in it, but to accuse the whole organization is simply wrong.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


You know why? Because eastern parts of Ukraine were occupied by Russians for centuries and millions people died from hunger exactly in these regions, the rest were deported to Siberia concentration camps and resettled by Russians. Now it is actually a huge probrem in my country as eastern part political forces aim to do everything to undermine the country. Russians as you know hate UPA as much as you do for the very reason of Ukrainian Povstanska Armija fight for my country's independance. They killed many Russians in the WWII who came as occupants and killed, raped and tortured as Polish units did. That's why we have this monument in the Crimea. Did you ask yourself why is it in Crimea (thousand km from Volyn') and not in Volyn'?


Can you reconcile these two parts from the source of knowledge called Wiki?


I recommend you to do the same.


Come over and I'll house you. If you get out alive, we will have a beer and talk about friendship.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


Cool, I have some friends who graduated from this university.
I still don't get how is education involved in here. It completely bewilders me. But again UPA took no part in killings of Poles. All this is done by some pseudo historians trying to undermine Ukrainian-Polish relations.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


Where were they educated in Bereza Kartuska concentration camp?


I knew only of Paris and Vienna, but maybe, Krakow was there as well.


Fairy-tales for Polish kids. I can find you many things said, but completely other things done. Feed somebody else with this. UPA was the army who fought soldiers and not kids and women as you, Polish, always present. When we talk about Cossack victories you say that you were split, that Cossacks were brutal and ignorant robbers, that there were only three Poles with two horses with whooping-cough on the battlefield etc. With UPA you again try to do everything possible to undermine the army. Polish peasants were killed in Wolyn by angry mobs who lived through a lot and just couldn't keep it anymore. Was it wrong? Of, course, but there was no UPA army in it, no matter how hard you will try to smear our soldiers.

Love / Girl just interested, or a hooker? [30]

Hallucinations. It was an old lady asking for a direction to the nearest church. Stop playing with these mushrooms.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


What should I tell you a fairy-tale before you fall asleep? What? Keep on reading Polish war accounts and dream of saintly holy Polish warriors. Polish raped women and killed children, is it something new to you?


Of course, you worked together with Soviets. They paid you off, right?

I just gave you a simple example what sometimes happens when injustly dies one person, be it a kid, a woman or a man. I wasn't talking about UPA as they didn't kill civilians. I was talking about peasants who lived through hell.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


It is good you respect your veterans. I respect my veterans as well. UPA soldiers fought against German, Russian and Polish armies, because these forces occupied UKRAINIAN TERRITORY - not POLISH or RUSSIAN or GERMAN, but UKRAINIAN TERRITORY. There were peasants, no doubt, who went on a rampage after having lived through Polonization, Pacification, Bereza Kartuska concentration camp, burnt churches, closed school, killed and raped women and kids. Are you surprised? You wonder about the proportions of 60,000 Polish people (don't feed me with Davies' 200-500 thousands exact numbers). I'll tell you now - if Polish killed my only child - I am not sure how many of theirs I would kill. I might not stop until I am dead. Are you surprised? Is it something that goes out of the range for people who suffer under injustice, imprisonment, native language and religion prohibition, devastating war and at the end to have one's kid killed by those centennial oppressors? I don't defend such behavior, but I understand it absolutely. And now when some of you keep on drooling about UPA and Ukrainians, look deep into your past, put yourself at the place of these people and frankly say what you or better your ancestors do in their place.

I talked to one Pole who was saying to me that RP was a fore-runner of EU and how democratic Poles were along their history. I think some of you need to be hit hard into the dumb head so dormant brain cells could at last wake up.

Austrians who are neither our neighbors, nor Slavs had thousand times more decency and respect towards minorities of the Austrian empire than Poland would even in the boldest dreams ever be able to have.

History / UKRAINIAN GENOCIDE AGAINST POLES DOWNPLAYED [57]


I wouldn't like Ukrainians to start murdering Polish animals as a sweet retribution for their atrocities. Grow up, son. Don't start your childish marasm again like your ancestors did. Let's wipe up the milk from our lips and move ahead.


You can start with Armija Krajowa veterans and Polish stszelcy groups. But I would recommend you to stop, take a deep breath and start working on making sure that there is no hostility among the two nations. I made peace with history and our contradictions and dark sides of our relations in the past should evaporate in front of multiple positive things we are able to achieve working together.

History / Poland and Hungary in September 1939 [79]


Sokrates wants love, let him be. Eternal love. I haven't thought it would stir fear in his frightened soul so much. Don't be scared, love will be there, shhhh...(Sokrates closed his eye-lids with a smile and fell asleep)


Hey Receiving end field-runner, can you negate my statement which you are quoting? Do Poland and Hungary have common border? I like when you said "blatantly refused" ;) It sounds like they were not aware where they are and what they are doing.

History / Poland and Hungary in September 1939 [79]

Where are the Slovaks? I don't see them in between? Conquered by Hungarians? Buffer zone, you might say. It wasn't a border as such. It was territorires inhabited by the Slovaks, not Hungarians on one side and Poles - on the other, at least in considerable amount, so that it could have been considered a prevailing majority. Both sides were busy splitting territories to the east as well.

Torq, I am not jealous at all. I am happy that there is love in the world ;) But I agree with all I have quoted from BB. Everything is good till all is good.

Homo homini lupus est.

History / Poland and Hungary in September 1939 [79]

Nice point. I want to pinpoint one simple fact: Hungary and Poland have no common border. Poland (like most other countries in the world) had many territorial disputes and wars with all its neighbors: Slovakia, Chech, Germany, Lithuania and Bielorus' and Ukraine. No one was spared a war. If Hungary had a 1 km long border with Poland, we would add that country to the list of "non-eternal friends" as well :)

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]


"Visitors from abroad commented on the high level of literacy, even among commoners, in the Hetmanate. There was a higher number of elementary schools per population in the Hetmanate than in either neighboring Muscovy or Poland. In the 1740s, of 1,099 settlements within seven regimental districts, as many as 866 had primary schools.[1] The German vistitor to the Hetmanate, writing in 1720, commented on how the son of Hetman Danylo Apostol, who had never left Ukraine, was fluent in the Latin, Italian, French, German, Polish and Russian languages [2] Under Mazepa, the Kiev collegium was transformed into an Academyand attracted some of the leading scholars of the Orthodox world [3]. Mazepa established another Collegium in Chernihiv. Many of those trained in Kiev, such as Feofan Prokopovich (founder of the Russian Academy of Sciences) would later move to Moscow, so that Ivan Mazepa's patronage not only raised the level of culture in Ukraine but also in Moscow itself.[3] Amusical academy was established in 1737in the Hetmanate's then-capital of Hlukhiv". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cossack_Hetmanate

Ostroh Academy found in 1576- the 1st university in the Eastern Europe. Poland has an older one by 200 years - in Krakiw.
Kievan Rus', although sparsely populated compared to Western Europe [1], was not only the largest contemporary European state in terms of area but also culturally advanced.[8] Literacy in Kiev, Novgorod and other large cities was high.[9][10] As birch bark documents attest, they exchanged love letters and prepared cheat sheets for schools. Novgorod had a sewage system[11] and wood paving not often found in other cities at the time. The Russkaya Pravda confined punishments to fines and generally did not use capital punishment.[12] Certain inalienable rights were accorded to women, such as property and inheritance rights

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kievan_Rus'

It was a literate, civilized society of the 11th century.
Under Daniil's reign, Galicia-Volhynia was one of the most powerful states in east central Europe.[2] Literature flourished, producing the Galician-Volhynian Chronicle. Demographic growth was enhanced by immigration from the west and the south, including Germans and Armenians. Commerce developed due to trade routes linking the Black Sea with Poland, Germany and the Baltic basin. Major cities, which served as important economic and cultural centers, were among others: Lviv(where the royal seat would later be moved by Daniil's son) - this was in 12 century, hundred years before Polish invasion.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Galicia%E2%80%93Volhynia

This is all I demanded, Sokrates. If I ever need a big mouth for something else, I'll let you know. Otherwise, please, present the comparison I asked for. Don't play with words of heritage and culture and saying that you had culture and others don't. Why? Do you like waste your and my time on BS? Let's learn something together.

P.S. Will anyone answer my question here or not?

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]


I feel you don't want to answer my question here. You stuck on one example I gave in posts way before that, where the Polish property was bought out by Germans. But my question is above: SHOW WHERE GERMANS WERE HARSHER AND MORE BRUTAL IN EITHER KULTURKAMPF OR GERMANIZATION TOWARDS POLES AS COMPARED WITH POLISH POLONIZATION AND PACIFICATION IN THE EASTERN EUROPE. Is it hard to understand this sentence?

Btw., whatever your Chewbacca defense means, I use here more offense to test the truth. Right now I don't feel any defense on your side. :)

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]

PK, am I missing something? You said that Kulturkampf was more brutal or harsh than Polonization and Pacification, right? All I am asking, and you called it "cherry-picking", to show where Germans were more harsh than Poles. That's all. Read the first quote of what you have said and explain it, please. If you said something you didn't want to, I will understand. Thank you in advance for the explanation.

News / Petition the Prime Minister to Recognise the contribution of Polish Armed Forces [49]


Because you did. Should we keep silence just because you don't like the truth?
What are talking about? Britain declared the war on Germany right away. Nobody stabbed you in the back.

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]


That's what I said if I understand you correctly :) Though I have no idea what Malopolska is. Western Galicia? I am not claiming Peremyshel or other cities in Poland. I simply presented the answer to the PK statement:


Also there was a word "Kulturkampf", usage of which in comparison to Polonization and Pacification policy of Poland in Eastern Europe is preposterous. He refused to answer my question. If you want, please, draw comparison and tell me whether Poles behaved nicer than Germans in Kulturkampf.

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]

In 1848 Kraków and Lviv were centers of revolution against Austria, and in 1861 Galicia won limited autonomy, including representation in the Austrian parliament, where Galician deputies formed a powerful bloc. Polish, spoken in W Galicia, and Ukrainian, spoken in E Galicia, became official languages along with German;

answers.com/topic/galicia
Why is that? Because Ukrainians were the majority of the population in Eastern Galicia. As you can see from the map Eastern Galicia went deep into the present territory of Poland. Lviv is roughly 80 km from the border, so I added another 20km, but it was definately more according to the Austrian map.

According to the 1931 Polish Government Census, Poles numbered 198,212 (63.5%) of the population, with Jews numbering 75,316 (24.1%) and Ukrainians numbering 35,137 (11.3%). Polish population of the city spoke its distinct dialect.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lviv
Why is this discrapancy in population of the cities and suburbs, because of Polonization and Pacification Poland was waging on Ukrainians and not only, many minorities where prohibited from studying, publishing, forget about living within the city. Unless you forgot your language, culture, religion and sold oneself out.

Please, show me where I lied.

BB, what you said is something I remember studying in school. But I asked some of the posters to bring me comparison to what was done by Poles on Ukrainian lands and as far as I see, PK refused to answer. Sad. Because it is obviously can't even be compared.

• 
  This is a map of West and East Galicia in 18th century.
  

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]



Hi, there. But I asked you to provide the info on how it was more violent than what Poles did in Ukraine, Lithuania and Bielorus'. Regarding the forced buy-outs, they still were purchased and the owner got the money. Explain how Polish were comrising 60% of L'viv population in 1939, whereas all the territories around it, including 100 km in the direction of Poland were populated in majority by Ukrainians.

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]

Would you, please, expand on German Kulturkampf and how it was more violent than what Poles did in Ukraine, Bielorus' and Lithuania in 1920-1939. Just show some examples.

History / THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!! [67]

[quote=Torq]Maybe when you catch up with Angola (113th place - 13 places ABOVE Ukraine),
Why do you lie? Ukraine takes 45th place in the world's GDP ranking. Nothing to be proud of, but at least this is not a lie you are used to sell all the time. I don't understand why you picked Angola which is doing pretty good at 62nd place ahead of Slovenia, Bulgaria,Croatia. But we don't talk about GDP here, we are talking about Poland pretending it is an ally and caring of Ukraine and other BS, "nobody, but we care" diarrhea. Tell this somebody else, not me. Next time try a bit better with math. ;) My previous answer was as usually erased by PF admin. I am not surprised, though. I am not Polish. Yes and next time pick year 1945 instead of 2004, you will look even better ;)

Did you bother to read the red text in your moved post? It lists the reasons your post was moved. Nationality wasn't one of them.

History / THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!! [67]

Ok, I have to answer to all of you at the same time. Here you go. I never denied that UPA fought POlish, Russian and German occupants. Families died along the way the same way as Ukrainian families with kids and women were killed by Russians and Polish. I don't understand what we argue about. UPA fought communists between which were Ukrainians as well, so what is your point, Jola? If there wasn't UPA and Ukrainians who fought Polish occupation and politics of national annihilation, there would never be an independant country. Isn't it obvious? The only thing I didn't like in thebear's thread was that he said that they enjoyed cutting kids and murdering women. What a BS! I bet Polish AK and strzelcy liked to catch Ukrainians and suck their brains out and slowly pull the eyes out of the orbits. Haha. Retarded.


Listen, the only ally. You care about what? My existance? You tried to erase me from the surface of the world 70 years ago as well as centuries before that. You are an ally? Haha, you are a business partner at best. Poland is nobody in EU, as you know. And if Ukraine will ever decide to become a part of EU, it will do it not through help of a "friend", but through its own political and economical changes. It is your usual view of the world - "saviors of Europe and humanity". But who you are behind that facade of BS? You are a good barrier against German expansion as well. I think we can profit from each other's existance.

History / THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!! [67]

Ye, and AK soldiers are warriors of Jesus. Do you have monasteries of Armija Krajowa Lord Warriors along Brothers Carmelites? I wouldn't be surprised.

I am not gay, I have to disappoint you, Ironside. My arsenal is not for you ;), sorry...

History / Gdansk and it's history with Poland [116]


Or cities located on the shores of the same see or on the same planet - no.., there is no difference whatsoever. Actually right now I am writing in Polish with a Chinese accent, but everyone understands me - so.., not a big deal, it is the same.

History / Gdansk and it's history with Poland [116]


It is called "Polish history", not a lie. ;)

History / THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!! [67]

You read what? Albano-Polish porn books on history? Or you are interested in butchering in general and bring your fantasy here. Show me the source where you have read it. If you don't do it, I'll just understand who you are. And don't try to tell me more without source.

History / THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!! [67]


For Poles when they lose it is a massacre. Then you add there kids, women and old men. Smart idea to wind up oneself. Recall how many women, kids and old men you murdered on Ukrainian lands. I would say "I am sorry" if it happened in Poland and only if you did the same as you were murdering Ukrainians for centuries and in their home. UPA warriors were those who fought your AK army and strzelcy mfs, along the way some families were killed - it is a war. But you like to blow things up out of the proportion to put yourself in good light and be like f* angels. What is the worst you teach your kids that BS. Yes UPA soldiers are heros for me because they fought Polish, Russian and German occupants. Disapponting? Kiss my arsenal.

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]


I have never tried to persuade people attacking German tanks with horses or running from boxing ring in the 2nd round. It's useless.

History / "GANGING UP" ON POLAND? [99]


Like we are getting absurd with 1991 for Ukraine, but you won't see it - it needs more spiritual and intelectual power. Ukrainian People's Republic is not Ukraine, Rzeczpospolita Polska is Poland, hmm... interesting. ;)


I think you are constantly in a comatose state, but somehow able to speak here.


I can only imagine how it was difficult for you. Ukrainians flocked like crazy when pope Jan Pawel ll came to Ukraine, millions and millions of people. Do I have to mention it here as well to show our respect and honors? I don't do it because it is not a theme of the conversation. Even after I presented you the facts from Ukrainian history which you can check even in Polish books, you still keep on throwing BS like a Pharasee and say that you pay honors etc. You have trouble to recognize a fact - not Ukrainian, not Polish, but worldwide excepted truth and you think that rant of some honors (through heart-screeching) will prove your point. You are mistaken. Nobody needs your honors. Just have a decency to answer my post #36 and points which you don't agree instead of soaping everybody's eyes. Truly yours, Nathan.