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Should we use original name of Berlin - "Kopanica"


Prince 15 | 590  
6 Nov 2008 /  #1
Of course Germans are not going to change name on their maps but maybe we shoud be back to first name of their capital. Some of their citizens would start to think about their true origin.

Kopanica, part of Berlin is called Köpenick. First name of this city was comming form Slavic stronghold Kopanica.

Maybe we should be back to original name.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
6 Nov 2008 /  #2
Why not? And don't complain if it's Breslau and Danzig for us...:)

PS: Before Slavs came to settle there it was the home of the germanic tribe of the Semnoni before they packed their bags during the big migration period...(but i'm sure you knew that already)

koepenick.net/geschichte-lang.htm

Die frühzeitliche Besiedlung

Archäologische Ausgrabungen, welche Mitarbeiter der Akademie der Wissenschaften in den Jahren 1955 bis 1958 vornahmen, belegen, daß die oben beschriebene langgestreckte Insel (die heutige Schloßinsel, die damals noch mit der Altstadtinsel zusammenhing) erstmals am Ende der jüngeren Steinzeit besiedelt wurde. Dieser offenbar nicht allzu starken Besiedlung folgte eine dichtere in der jüngeren Bronze- und frühen Eisenzeit. Die Siedlung hatte eine Längsausdehnung von mindestens 400-500 m und eine Breite von 50-150 m, d.h., sie umfaßte nahezu die gesamte Köpenicker Insel. Später sollen sich auch die germanischen Semnonen in Köpenick für einige Jahrhunderte niedergelassen haben, ehe sie sich auf ihre Völkerwanderung begaben.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semnoni

The Semnoni (German: Semnonen) or Semnones were a Germanic tribe which was settled between the Elbe and the Oder in the 1st century when they were described by Tacitus in Germania:

OP Prince 15 | 590  
6 Nov 2008 /  #3
We don't want to push you...
We know that we live in free europe, Germans can move to Poland, Poles can move to Germany. It is beautiful. In my opinion many Germans don't know about their origin. We live in free europe maybe one day some Germans (nationality) will make such sign in their capital like other German citiznes have done in Lusatia.

FREE EUROPE. NO GERMANIZATION! NO PLONIZATION FREE CHOICE! I'D LIKE TO SEE CONCIOUS LOYAL GERMAN CITIZENS MAKING SIGN WITH TWO NAMES OF YOUR CAPITAL - BERLIN AND KOPANICA.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
6 Nov 2008 /  #4
In my opinion many Germans don't know about their origin.

Well...that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Doesn't make it true nonetheless.
(And I don't want to ask where you got that idea)

The Sorbs are a recognized minority in Germany as are the Danes in Schleswig-Holstein! The prime minister of Saxony is a Sorb, they have their own kindergartens, bi-langual schools, radio and TV etc.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanislaw_Tillich

But since Lusatia doesn't include Berlin I don't know why bi-langual signs should be
build there...

Maybe one day the Poles will recognize and accept the long german history in much of what is now western Poland. I think that is a much bigger problem for them...

How about german-polish signs in Danzig or Breslau???
That was only some 60 years back, not some 1000!
Lodz_The_Boat 32 | 1,535  
6 Nov 2008 /  #5
Bratwurst Boy

The Germans are coming...the Germans are coming....runnnn for your livvvvvvvves!!!
Piorun - | 658  
6 Nov 2008 /  #7
Before Slavs came to settle there it was the home of the germanic tribe of the Semnoni before they packed their bags during the big migration period...

They moved to Florida to be known as Seminole Indians where they still failed to establish any cities. You can find this information under “Lost Tribes of Germany”. (But I'm sure you knew that already) :))
OP Prince 15 | 590  
7 Nov 2008 /  #9
As to Vandalen:

(Vandalen)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vistula_Veneti

The Vistula Veneti (alternatively also called the Baltic Veneti) were an ancient Indo-European people living in contemporary Poland, along the rivers of Oder and the Vistula.

The Veneti were geographically and temporaly contiguous to the Proto-Germanic and Proto-Slavic peoples and were eventually assimilated by both groups, perhaps even more decisively by Proto-Slavs who later settled in the territory which erstwhile belonged to the Veneti. The Germanic peoples subsequently transferred the ethnonym Veneti to their new easterly neighbours, the Slavs. This tradition survived in German language where Slavs living in closest proximity to Germany were originally called Wenden or Winden (see Wends), while the people of the Austrian federal lands Styria and Carinthia referred to their Slavic neighbours as Windische. It should be emphasised, though, that Slavic peoples never used the ethnonym Veneti for themselves but were called thus only by the neighbouring Germanic peoples.

History of this region was mostly about living together not about pushing somebody.

The other fact is that Germans are not what you would like them to be ... as Poles are not what they imagine they are.
wildrover 98 | 4,451  
7 Nov 2008 /  #10
And we can call York in the UK Eboracum , which was the Roman name for it , and my home town of Scarborough can be renamed Skarthis berg , after the Viking ( skarthi ) who came and raped and plundered there many years ago....Bit of a pain having to buy lots of new maps tho.....
szarlotka 8 | 2,208  
7 Nov 2008 /  #11
And we can call York in the UK Eboracum

Good idea. Then places like Towcester (boring name) can revert to Lactodorum (vibrant name, something to do with breast feeding)
wildrover 98 | 4,451  
7 Nov 2008 /  #12
places like Towcester

Strange...is this where breasfeeding was invented then...? or is it just full of tits....?
szarlotka 8 | 2,208  
7 Nov 2008 /  #13
There are af ew tits there. I believe the official transaltion is Dairymen's Fort or something similar.

Bit heated on here today
Crow 152 | 9,787  
7 Nov 2008 /  #14
Should we use original name of Berlin - "Kopanica"

absolutely

i absolutely support increasing Polish national policy and strenghtening of Polish patriotic forces. After all, Lusatian question should be opened after Germany dared to took part in dissolution of Yugoslavia. Not to mention Kosovo situation.

BUT, my Polish sisters and brothers, listen what would Racowie say to you... It would be mistake if Poland rely only on USA support if choose to arise. All right, stay ok with them just Poland should also strenghten its flanks on South, supporting Serbians. Support to Serbians guaranty Polish interests in western Balkan and in the same time providing Russian support. Well, if not dirrect support then at least Russian understandings for particular Polish interests, no matter what it may be.

Support to Serbians isn`t play on Russian card. No, its dirrect play on factor which was always loyal to Poland. Same as Russians, Poles also has their traditional interests in the region. Then, Serbs don`t obey to Russians, simple... in this part of Europe Russia played positive role and Serbs and Russians cooperated. In the same time, Serbians never sold Polish interests in order to satisfy Russians. I must underline, as i know, Russians never demanded that we do something against Poland. Whenever Serbians presented Polish situation to them, Russians were full of understandings and were cooperative.

that i wanted to say on this, to you Poles
OP Prince 15 | 590  
7 Nov 2008 /  #16
Crow

I think is bad idea. Many Germans have slavic origin and it is good to see them being more and more concous of this fact. Maybe they will like Lusatians change name of their capital on Kopanica we all know that like Veneti havent been pushed by the "proto-Slavs" Later many Slavs in eastern Germany became German.

From the other hand I think I know why Nazis were looking for "Nordic" kids in Poland durring WWII. I have been always thinking why they have choosen Zamość (today: south east Poland) for this action ... It wasn't part of Prussia and it wasn't under German influence in the past... Now I know why they were kidnaping Polish kids and sending them to Germany to re-germanize them in German families.

Everything is clear.
OP Prince 15 | 590  
7 Nov 2008 /  #18
How about german-polish signs in Danzig or Breslau???

Why we should call it so. Poles have build this cities first names were Gdańsk and Wrocław (I think there was reason that this names weren't german...). Later Germans pushed Poles ... without checking color or Polish eyes (blue or brown) if you ask about details and believe in heritage coming from color of eyes !

Poles with blue eyes (like me) prefere it to be Gdańsk and Wrocław we are living in this country for thousends years !!!! Move on !!!

Kopanica has been first name of your capital and for some reasons they have called it KOPANICA not Berlin ...
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
7 Nov 2008 /  #19
Poles with blue eyes (like me) prefere it to be Gdańsk and Wrocław we are living in this country for thousends years !!!! Move on !!!

And before there lived Germans for much longer!

Ditto! :)

It were YOU calling for a remembrance to slavs settling here over 1000 years back!
What's good for the goose..
Be at least consistent in your demandings!

PS: Köpenick was NEVER the capital btw.!
z_darius 14 | 3,968  
7 Nov 2008 /  #20
Should we use original name of Berlin - "Kopanica"

No, we shouldn't, because this would be like asking if we should rename Krakow to Kielce.

Kopanica and Berlin were two different localities. The first name for Berlin on record is Berolina, established by Slavic tribes.
osiol 55 | 3,922  
7 Nov 2008 /  #21
Many things happened way back in the mists of time. Don't let that mist cloud your judgement about what is right for the here and now. You've got to live for today and for tomorrow and not in the past.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
7 Nov 2008 /  #22
He...and look what the returned Germans made of the town and the country!!!

Now let's see your portfolio...hmmm?
Piorun - | 658  
7 Nov 2008 /  #23
And before there lived Germans for much longer!

Where? In those two cities. Here’s a little trivia in case you don’t know your history.

Gdańsk was founded by Mieszko I by building first fortified settlement there around 975. First mentioned in the book “Żywot Św. Wojciecha” (Life of St. Adalbert) and bearing the name “Gyddanyzc”.

Wrocław is situated at a crossroads in this part of Europe and who founded the settlement is unknown but it bears the name of a Czech prince Wratysław. City was first mentioned during the reign of Bolesław Chrobry in the year 1000 when Pope has named Wrocław as a seat for a bishop, who in turn was a subject to the archbishop of Gniezno.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
7 Nov 2008 /  #24
Okay...let's see:

German tribes settled in this area first / doesn't count!

Poles founded the first settlement around 975/ counts!

Danzig had a population of around 98 % Germans before WW II/ doesn't count!


= polish

You know Piorun, you Poles are very selective in what facts are important and
count and which not...so...stuff it!

Reminds me about the discussion about Kopernikus...

german family, spoke and wrote latin and german...doesn't count!

chose the polish site against the order...counts threefold!

(As we all know political leanings can change a racial heritage anytime!)

= polish!

Crazy people!
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,161  
7 Nov 2008 /  #25
How about german-polish signs in Danzig or Breslau???

There are some in a few towns near Opole where Germanic minority is quite strong.
OP Prince 15 | 590  
7 Nov 2008 /  #26
And before there lived Germans for much longer!

They are Polish can't you face some basic facts ! Germans with blue and brown eyes pushed Poles with blue and brown eyes because they claimed Poland to be their ancient land ! some were living there for centuries some were living there for thousends years (I know that some Poles don't want to listen it) Nazis were looking for them in Poland that is why they were kidnaping kids in Zamość (south east Poland - their parents didn't knew about their origin)... I don't know whose eyes are blue or brown or whatever. The funniest thing is that we know that so many Germans when we talk about being Slavic/Germanic/Celtic and ancient tribes ... are Slavic that is why they gave such name for Kopanica we both know that they are living there. Lusatians are good example that it is very possible.
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
7 Nov 2008 /  #27
Well...Lukasz...you are one crazy guy!
I know you need all those fantasies of yours to leave your miserable real life behind.

I just hope that one tiny corner of your muddled brain knows and accepts that those fantasies of yours are just that, fantasies!

:)

PS: You just have to compare german/polish history and present to see how different we are! :)
Germans are DOers! :):):)
Piorun - | 658  
7 Nov 2008 /  #28
You know Piorun, you Poles are very selective in what facts are important and
count and which not...so...stuff it!

Selective the cities did not exist before this time so it’s impossible for the Germens to Live there. Besides German influence in Wrocław did not materialize till after the Mongol hordes swept the region in 1200’s, and contrary to your belief original Prussians were not German. Copernicus studied in Italy for 10years so he probably spoke Italian, does that make him Italian?
Bratwurst Boy 12 | 11,773  
7 Nov 2008 /  #29
Selective the cities did not exist before this time so it’s impossible for the Germens to Live there.

Oh pleeeeeaaaaaaaase....whole west Poland was german tribes territory! We surely didn't settle down to dig the earth, that wasn't our way in those times.

That doesn't mean they didn't live there!

And no Italian is claiming Kopernikus! :)

PS: You are writing in english, does that make you English/American? No, but I bet at home you speak polish! Well Kopernikus spoke and wrote German...there are no pieces found where he uses polish...curious, isn't it!
Piorun - | 658  
7 Nov 2008 /  #30
But you do on the basis of the language spoken.

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