POLAND BEFORE 966

i remember from school that poland was christianed in this year,not a lot i know:)before this time our country was divided and there were a lot of pogan tribes who fought each other till someone united them(was it mieszko-the 1st king/prince of poland?). i just wonder if whose tribes were all slavic ore some were germanic/anglo-saxon/norman for example.have they lived there for ages or they came and settled in poland short time before 966.the question maybe silly,but if you know hungarians speak the language which is complitely different to any of european languages.i read somwhere that they are from india(?).another example-gipsies,there is a story about them that they was a nation/cast/tribe which lived in india but ran away from there cos some kind of problems.

anyone knows something about poland before 966?

Poland was huge back then, I'm sure..:)

i wouldn't be so sure.as i remember from history poland was divided between different tribes so our country did not not exist

Frankly, I think before 966 it's hard to refer to "Poland" since there was no specified border and no specified country as a result...

Did you know, that the original people that settled Poland, before it was Poland, came from region that was called Persia, currently Iran/Iraq, etc?

Here is map of Poland and Europe (but after 966) - in 1025:

Poland 1025

And here is a good explanation of en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistory_and_protohistory_of_Poland

Well, I had a very good history teacher - she was very excentric, but had a really great gift of telling about history, especially about things that weren`t mentioned in the schoolbooks. And as remember actually the whole lessons were about that, what hasn`t been mentioned in the schoolbooks, while that what was the actual programe we had to memorize from our books at home. But everything was made so interesting that I still remember many of the things we had to learn in liceum.


Actually the Slavic people didn`t came to Europe from anywhere. Our ancestors originated in Central Europe from a mix of the people who migrated to Europe from Asia (Persia, the Kaukasus ect), like the Sarmatians as well as people who were living in Europe, like the Veneds, who in 150 BC had left the nordern coas of the Adriatic Sea and settled in an area between today`s Poland and Germany.. as well as all of the rest of the inhabitants of Europe, who the Slavs had assimilated (like the people who were living in todays Poland since thousands of years BCE and those who migrated and are still migrating here.


I belive that even some of those tribes were Celtic.. and even some Romans were living here (which has been discovered only a couple of years ago), but those were only small groups and before Poland was colonized by the Slavs there weren`t many people living here. I belive the largest of them were the Vandals (who were living in Małopolska and Silesia, which were their homeland) and the Goths. Somewhere between the VII and VIII century all of the major tribes that formed Poland were Slavic.


Not quite. The Hungarians are in the cusins of the Estonians and the Finns - they all have a similar language. The ancestors of the Hungarians, Finns and Estonians are the same. They originated in the area between Europe and Asia in the Ural and are related to the Turks.


Mieszko was only the last leader who had only ended the unification of the tribes. When he had begun his rule he already ruled over c.a. 2000 settelments and had an army - but, beside legends there are no records how he came to this. This whole unification had probably begun some 2 or 3 generations before him - during the times of the beginning of the Piast dynasty - somewhere shortly after legend about Popiel and the mice ended (which probably, as all legends, has some truth in it) - which would be probably somewhere around the year 800.

Wujek_Dobra_Rada
the hole thing is very interesting cos a lot of people reckon that the poles as a nation are not really diverse.i myself have some ukrainian blood.i remember my grandma told me that her grand grand mother was ukrainian.my friend told me that his family came from kazahstan.our borders changed throughout centuries so did people.so the main idea of the EU(the right to travel and seetle in any country of the EU,free trade ect) started ages ago not in the 20th century:)

A also have Ukrainian roots. My grandfather changed his religion from Ortodox to Catholic to marry my grandmother.

lol it looks like germany did not exist at this time:)

LOL (I've just realized it too..).

Poland was a huge country in 17th century and if i remember correctly it streched from the baltic sea to the black sea

Iwona,

Your grandfather made the right choice.
I remember, when I was a kid, living in Poland, a priest told me that only Catholics will go to haven. :)

I am being facetious.

Well it didn't, Germany had autonomous states like America before it became the US.

The group of people you are thinking of when you say Celts was actually a pre-celtic group called the Scythians. They migrated through the area and finally semi-settled in Ireland.

They had a wonderful way with goldsmithing. They were also quite warlike. The more agricultural Pole groups were not a match for them, but they didn't stay in the area for long.

They were on a migration for some reason, and Poland didn't suit them.

Catholic church propaganda used to consider not christianed people wild, unhuman etc. The term "pogan" itself is not nice when spoken by catholics. Poland area in pre christianed times was to be laughed at rather then admire or researched. It all has its consequences in popular knowledge about hisotry.

The other important factor was our luck of independence (rozbiory!) in times of birth of modern history. First modern historians aside from being christian, for political reasons idolized polish state and disregarded pogans and their "organizations"

Comunists wanted to play on anty religion note but were also interested in rather strong "state" institiusion.
Lastly, first written records are dated from christian times and we simply have to rely on non written record to know something about Pogans

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_mythology

I didn't want to say that about the Catholic church for fear of offending anyone. The church has always been famous for making demons out of anything that wasn't of itself. Cultural genocide. It has been very hard for me to find much on myths and legends of Poland or the Slavic peoples. Thanks for posting the link. A question for you. Do you use the word pogan or pagan to describe someone who is of a non-christian faith? Does any pagan practise survive today in Poland that you know of? There is some in Estonia, but I never heard of any Polish pagans:) Any other links to this subject would be great. FYI, I am Polish/American and this subject has always interested me.

I have used "pagan" to describe someone of non-christian faith and I meant those living in pre christian Poland area. I didn't think of modern pagans but there are some.

rkp.w.activ.pl - Rodzimy Kosciol Polski

geocities.com/mabcosmic/polish/pantheon.html - pantheon

sourceryforge.org/w/Polish_Folk_Magic - Polish Folk Magic
:)


check out the Scythian princes treasures dig out near Krakow around 4 BC (pics on the left), nnow in

ma.krakow.pl/muzeum/zbiory/scytyjska_ksiezniczka_z_ryzanowki - Muzeum

Archeologiczne, Krakow

I finally got to look at those links you posted. Would you know anything else about what is called a Szeptem? This isn't in any of the books that I have. I would like to read further about this. It is the only original item that I have come across in a long time!

It got mine attention, too but I don't know much about it. :)

Look at History of Europe: the Periodical Historical Atlas, 1 to 1000.
You can search with GOOGLE or refer to

The first "slavic" ceramic and slavic artifacts (of so called "Prague-Style") are dated about VI-VII century. And the first ancient authors write about "slavic" tribes in VII century too. The word "Slaves" is the question at all, because slavonic nations were called Ants (eastern Slaves) and Sklavens (western Slaves) at the beginning.

The full reconstruction of migrations of Slaves is mipossible, because of very poor number of ancient documents.
I'm a profesional archeologist and today no one want to discuse about the origin of Slaves. But the first tribal countries we have here in VII/VIII century. Adam of Bremen bescribed the organisation of slavonic triebes, called them all and bescribed their strange (based on number of fortresses of each tribe).

At the end of the Bronze Age, (1330-400 B.C.) tribes lived here whose developed culture decisively influenced the lives of the agrarian tribes of the later Polish territories. This was the period of the so-called culture of Lausitz.

Between the territory of the Carpathians and the Baltic Sea in the first centuries A.D., a number of ethnic groups, (the Scythians, the Celts, the Goths, the Avars, etc.) appeared in the region. The majority of the sources date the appearance of the Slavic groups to the 5th century.

Most scholars agree that the original Slavic homeland lay within the boundaries of modern Poland in the Odera, (Oder), and Wisla, (Vistula), basins. The Slavs subsequently expanded to territories to the East, South and West, and became increasingly different by AD 800. Three main geographical and linguistic divisions had arisen: the East Slavs, inhabiting a large part of European Russia, the South Slavs, who settled in the Balkan Peninsula, and the West Slavs, who settled in what is now Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia and East Germany.

The West Slavs suffered different fates: the Lusatians and Veleti were absorbed by the German expansion, the Czechs and Moravians merged to form the nucleus of the Czech Kingdom, while the Slovaks became part of the Kingdom of Hungary. The remaining Polanie, Wislanie, Pormozanie and the Mazovians joined to form the Polish State.

testforces.net/eng/niv1.php?numMod=8&numSeg=1&ordre=2

Hello, just stumbled across this site. Very interesting on how Europe evolved over the years. I coming from America find this interesting. Having german,polish,irish ,english and dutch bacground find it cool how people try and research there history. Yes the Polish language looks slavic doesnt it. Hello to everyone.

Hi All! This is my first time in a chat room ever! I live in the U.S., was born in Pennsylvania, and am currently living in New Mexico. I'm in the process of researching my ancestry and am very interested in my tribal origins, so I've found this discussion fascinating! Personally, I have found the research slow-going because it seems there was so much migration and conquering that unless I know very specifically which of my ancestors lived where and when, it becomes very hard to know anything for sure.

One thing I can add to the discussion, however, is that "pagan" actually means "country dweller." It is sad how the Church demonized that word.

There is a prophecy that says something like: once the white race discovers its roots and embraces its ancient traditions, all the tribes can come together as equals.

I imagine there are still people who dance around the Maypole. That's definitely a tradition from pre-Christian times.
Thanks for this discussion!
Cindy

Me and my family live here in poland!!!!

Actually the first recorded groups of people to live/settle Poland were the Vandals (germanic tribe) and the Goths (originalyl Scandinavian but settled near Vistula).

The Vandals one day got a powerful King, travelled across Roman Soil into Spain, crossed the straight, took Carthage as their Capital, and made Rome shake in her skirt for 100 years. They were turned back eventually. The reason they left was due to other tribes pressing them from east.

The Goths usually fought with Rome against others, but then split - Visigoths and Ostrogoths. I forget which group did what, but one eventually joined the Huns against Rome, while the others helped Rome. The Huns were turned back and the Goths slowly took over the Italian peninsula until the Lombards (another Germanic tribe thought to come from modern day Polish lands) took it over. The slavs then took over all eastern europe and made Modern day Poland, Russia, etc.

I would continue but I am lazy. Look it up yo self :)

So in a way, we can say the "Original" Polish defeated the "mighty" Romans. This all occurred around 300s-400s AD. I don't know exact dates. :)

Hope this helped :)

By recorded I mean there are accurate accounts of them. I know nothing about the very first people to settle Poland. All I know is it happened very early in the B.C. era :)