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Crap parenting in our UK youth today (in Poland it's a little better)


WielkiPolak 58 | 1,034
23 Aug 2012  #1
Is it just me who sees an effect of crap parenting in our youth today? It is funny, so many people are so bright and good at what they do. They can make money and live luxurious lives, they have lots of achievements to boast about professionally, yet the one simple task of bringing up their children to be respectful adults is often beyond them. In shopping centres, in Church, on public transport etc. Screaming children with a parent who looks at them with that 'he/she is just a child so it is normal' look. No, what is normal is for you to explain to them why what they are doing is wrong. The worst part if if you say anything then you are the bad stranger who sticks their nose in, so you just have to sit there like a lemon and try to ignore it. I know a lot of parents want to be good to their children. I hear many explanations of how they were not treated well as a child and how their home was very strict and they do not want to be like that for their child, they want their child to know they love them. Well just letting them do what they want, when they want, is not love. If anything you harm them. You teach them that they can do what they want and get stuff if they make a little noise for a while. Despite this we wonder why so many youngsters today have absolutely no respect, just doing what they want. Sometimes I want to take some of the parents and shake them. You must have had it, you see a child misbehaving and you look at their parent, wondering if they will do anything, and often, they do nothing. I think in Poland it is a little better, although with many people now moving away and turning more liberal, it seems they go for the very softy soft approach as well.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,664
23 Aug 2012  #2
it's all very well, but as a parent, you will get slagged by someone for either not telling them off/telling them off too much/telling them off in the wrong way/whatever,

and suddenly you are public property where everyone under the sun feels they can tell you what's what,most often people who do not have their own children.

It's a tricky one.
My Polish ex told me that my problem with my kids was that 'I did not beat them enough'. I pointed out that it was illegal apart from anything else and parents have social services round at the drop of a hat, his rather predictable answer was that being beaten to a pulp by his mad violent dad 'had never done him any harm', (as he reached for the bottle).....

So unless someone has the experience of being responsible for children, their upkeep and behaviour 24/7 over many years, then,please,no comment is necessary.
OP WielkiPolak 58 | 1,034
23 Aug 2012  #3
To be honest for me it is common sense that there is a difference between hitting your child and beating them to a pulp. I am all for smacking your children if they misbehave and would not frown if I saw it in public. In fact some children I see need a good smack. Obviously if they get beat so hard they have to go to hospital, that is unacceptable, but a parent with common sense knows that and if they do not then they are not fit to be a parent. It is my belief [at least from personal experience] that the children who were in the strict households turn out to be better more respectful adults than the children who never got hit and could do what they wanted, as their parent would let them, because they 'love' them.
p3undone 8 | 1,135
23 Aug 2012  #4
WielkiPolak,Agreed and I believe the lack of that type of discipline has contributed to this "me generation".
pip 10 | 1,661
23 Aug 2012  #5
I agree with you totally. But---it is not about being strict or beating them. I have never hit either one of my kids. I constantly get compliments on how well behaved my kids are. They are 7 and 12. It has to do with actually being a parent and a role model. Not sitting in front of a tv or computer for hours at a time but actually sitting as a family and enjoying each others company.

It also has to do with respecting others. I see so many selfish whiney bratty kids that cry if they don't get what they want. There is nothing wrong with saying no to children.

And another thing- Polish kids eat way too much sugar. It is as addictive as crack and it alters behaviour- especially in boys. Food is not a reward for good behaviour- especially sugar.
p3undone 8 | 1,135
23 Aug 2012  #6
pip,I also agree that some children don't have to be spanked or smacked,but every case is different and I do believe that sometimes it's necessary.My brother can just give a stern stare and voice a quiet warning and his sons fall right back into line,It's not that he wouldn't spank his kids,but he has found it not to be necessary.And it's enough for them to know that he would.
rybnik 18 | 1,462
23 Aug 2012  #7
I have to share this story. When our 17 yo daughter was a toddler she began with the temper tantrums. Her favorite location to throw these fits were department stores in front of an audience (in our case sari-waering Indian babcias). One day, as my wife tells it, Stephie decides she wants something that is displayed at the cashier's line. Her mother says no and this sets off the tantrum. My wife had had it at this point so she left our daughter there on the floor, flailing her limps, screamingat the top of her lungs to the horror of our Punjabi neighbors. Despite the floor-show, my wife continues to look staright ahead waiting her turn to check out. Tens of brown, bindi-bejeweled faces are looking at my wife in disgust, at how mean and uncaring she apparently is to her daughter. By the time my wife checked out the hysteria had passed and Stephie never again threw another tantrum!............I don't think I would've been able to stand the stares myself. I was so proud of my wife that day.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,664
23 Aug 2012  #8
my point is that it is most often people with no children who are the 'experts' and the most critical.
Do you have your own children WP? Let me guess......no.
Oh and by the way it is illegal to 'give a child a good smack'.
Why do you use the word 'smack' and not 'hit'?
Anyway Pip is right, it's about good attention.
kaz200972 2 | 229
23 Aug 2012  #9
My Polish ex told me that my problem with my kids was that 'I did not beat them enough'

Agree with nearly all of your post here! beating kids to a pulp does not help them! I work with kids
who have been abused in many different ways and it does them no favours. I am not a liberal and in a few
limited circumstances I am not against physical punishment but only in very limited circumstances is it applicable!
far better that we spend time with and talk to our children!
My polish ex used to say the same thing about my children because I wouldn't let him bring his heavy drinking mates around the house, the kids were

worried by them, when he went back to drinking he was put out very rapidly!!!! My ex thought this wrong as he wasn't involved as such in their up bringing but

why would anyone want an alchi near their kids???
We need to put our kids first, this isn't spoiling them and explanations of what is right or wrong are far better than a slap.

Yes we need more discipline for children but it starts with us!!

I think in Poland it is a little better,

perhaps the children aren't so cheeky but I've seen some terrible cases of neglect amongst Polish immigrant families and must be some in Poland too.

I am well aware that this occurs in British families too, pointless comparing the two because both countries can be bad at parenting sometimes!
p3undone 8 | 1,135
23 Aug 2012  #10
Rybnik,I say good for her!She did the right thing.
SeanBM 35 | 5,808
23 Aug 2012  #11
Crap parenting

Have you got any kids WP?
kaz200972 2 | 229
23 Aug 2012  #12
Rybnik,I say good for her!She did the right thing.

Agree much better than slapping or shouting and the child learned something!
SeanBM 35 | 5,808
23 Aug 2012  #13
youtube.com/watch?v=vVGA-mij04I
p3undone 8 | 1,135
23 Aug 2012  #14
Kaz200972,I'm not a parent,but I do believe that talking and reasoning with children should definitely be the first approach,but they should know that you are willing to take harsher actions if need be.I completely agree with you.I often talk with my nephews if they act up and they are responsive to that.
rybnik 18 | 1,462
23 Aug 2012  #15
Rybnik,I say good for her!She did the right thing.

I agree. The jaja's of steel she had on that day! LOL
Wroclaw Boy
23 Aug 2012  #16
I am all for smacking your children if they misbehave and would not frown if I saw it in public.

You dont hit children, violence teaches violence.

In fact some children I see need a good smack.

You need a good smack, you need some sense smaked into you.

Obviously if they get beat so hard they have to go to hospital, that is unacceptable

Define what is acceptable - big red hand mark on bare ass or leg? bruises on body? smacking children leaves mental scars and as i said above teaches them first hand that violence is OK.

I have never nor will i ever smack/hit or use physical strength in a way that will physically hurt my children.
Lenka 2 | 1,282
23 Aug 2012  #17
common sense that there is a difference between hitting your child and beating them to a pulp.

My sister once during an argument was the only one that was against hitting.Everybody was against her and then sudenly one man said: oh,yeah,the last time I spank my four year old and the blood run from his nose...Everybody froze and there wasn't one person then that would say a good word for spanking.

Hitting a child is in 99% parent's frustration.People usually spank their children not methodically(and that's what upbringing should be-methodical and consequent dealing with the child) but when they are angry,scared e.t.c.You can deal with a child differently.

I wouldn't put in jail parents that spank their children(really spank not hit) but I think they should be informed that that's not the best way to deal with your child.I'm sick and tired of trying to explain that spanking is no method to upbring your child.
pip 10 | 1,661
23 Aug 2012  #18
I don't understand what situation would justify hitting a child?

If you are parenting your kids instead of the tv or computer- you don't need to hit them. If you set limits with concequences--there is no need to hit.

If parents hits their kids then the kids will hit other kids and once they become parents- they will hit.

There is nothing wrong with saying no to a child or telling a child their behaviour is unacceptable- go to your room--what justifies a spank, slap or hit?

I remember getting spanked when I was a kid. It hurt for 5 minutes but the slap across the face my mother gave me has left a lifetime scar. It takes away the trust and respect children have for their parents.
rybnik 18 | 1,462
23 Aug 2012  #19
but the slap across the face my mother gave me has left a lifetime scar. It takes away the trust and respect children have for their parents.

I too was slapped in the face by my father. It was humiliating. My father possibly saw the hurt in my eyes because he never, thankfully, hit me again anywhere.
p3undone 8 | 1,135
23 Aug 2012  #20
Lenka,but if that fails,I see absolutely nothing wrong with spanking your child so that they understand,and this can be done without anger and made clear so that the child understands that this is what the consequence will be.My brother never has to spank his children;it's enough that they know he will if he has to.He believes in talking things through with his children.
Lenka 2 | 1,282
23 Aug 2012  #21
.My brother never has to spank his children

That's the point.

made clear so that the child understands that this is what the consequence will be.

It's enough that the child knows that there will be some consequences.

.He believes in talking things through with his children.

That's actually great.

but if that fails,

We're adults and it's our job to find other ways.

I too was slapped in the face by my father. It was humiliating

In my family slapping someone in the face is the worst offense.My father did it once to my sister and afterwards he regretted it.There's something really humiliating about slapping someone in the face.
OP WielkiPolak 58 | 1,034
24 Aug 2012  #22
I have never nor will i ever smack/hit or use physical strength in a way that will physically hurt my children.

You are just twisting this in to something that makes me look bad so that you can prove your point. Common sense idiot! You do not hit a child in the legs, on the head or back or stomach, you usually give it a smack on the bum [it hurts but does no damage] or to a lesser extent a clip around the ear. That is what I mean by hitting a child. If hitting your child gets them to be proper decent respectful adults and they do the same with their children, no problem. As for me needing a smack, let me tell you I am the respectful person I am today, why is that? I was physically punished as a child, with a belt to the backside and it certainly taught me not to do the wrongs I did ever again. I can say as a fact that discipline has taught me so much good and the times where I did not fear any consequence I was not as good a person. You have to get it right, the aim is not to damage the child physically but to do enough so that it does not want to be hit again and often stops with the mere mentioning of a smack, as p3undone said. Sometimes when I see a parent explaining stuff to 4 year olds it makes me laugh. You know what the result is, they usually listen to what is said to them, then just do whatever wrong they were doing, anyway, since they are not able to understand the explanation. The punishment method is simple to understand, do this and you get this, be good and you get this [obviously you can reward for good behaviour as well, not just punish them].
Lenka 2 | 1,282
24 Aug 2012  #23
Sometimes when I see a parent explaining stuff to 4 year olds it makes me laugh.

Really?

You know what the result is, they usually listen to what is said to them, then just do whatever wrong they were doing, anyway

You say in simple words what you mean and say what the consequences will be.that's all.

they are not able to understand the explanation.

I met many childrens and if you keep it simple there is no reason they wouldn't understand.
pip 10 | 1,661
24 Aug 2012  #24
what makes me laugh is parents begging their children to stop doing something unacceptable.
like getting into a negotiation. there is no negotiation, i am the parent, i said no, end of conversation.

You are just twisting this in to something that makes me look bad so that you can prove your point.

everything about this is quite sad. there is no need to hit children if you know how to parent.
bullfrog 6 | 603
24 Aug 2012  #25
It is not only a matter of "knowing how to parent", but unfortunately also a function of the child's character. As parents, we all know that certain attitudes are effective with some children and not all with others. So while I agree on principle with you Pip, I agree on more practical terms with WP, sometimes a slap on the bum or a clip around the ear is necessary..
Wroclaw Boy
24 Aug 2012  #26
That is what I mean by hitting a child.

Is it really. The day you become a parent and you see that little life for the first time you may feel different about physical punishment.

The fact that you were smacked as a child proves nothing, everyone is different.

I agree with bullfrogs post though in that its easy for parents who dont have troublesome children to comment on not slapping. Personally i think the behavioural problems manifest long before slappings even a possibility. I dont know many responsible people with troublesome kids its usually the cackers.

Gender comes into play too, should a grown man physically punish a little girl?
delphiandomine 83 | 17,596
24 Aug 2012  #27
you usually give it a smack on the bum [it hurts but does no damage] or to a lesser extent a clip around the ear.

I assure you that a grown man is perfectly able to inflict damage with a "clip around the ear".

As someone who actually works with children, I can tell you that there is absolutely no basis for teaching children that violence is the answer - to anything!

If hitting your child gets them to be proper decent respectful adults and they do the same with their children, no problem.

No problem? No, no problem at all - they'll know that in future, if someone doesn't behave correctly, giving them a good smack is the answer. Violence breeds violence, after all.

As for me needing a smack, let me tell you I am the respectful person I am today, why is that? I was physically punished as a child, with a belt to the backside and it certainly taught me not to do the wrongs I did ever again.

Respectful? Ever considered that your unemployment woes might be actually linked to those beatings you received?

You have to get it right, the aim is not to damage the child physically but to do enough so that it does not want to be hit again and often stops with the mere mentioning of a smack,

Would you tolerate your boss at work bending you over and giving you such a smack? No? So why is it acceptable to beat a defenceless child?

The punishment method is simple to understand

Yes, it teaches all the basic requirements of a bully - only hit when you're much bigger, use your strength as a bully and so on.

There is only *one* justifiable circumstance to lay a hand on a child - and that's when the child is a danger to themselves or others and the situation must be resolved immediately. For instance, grabbing a child by the hair just as she's about to run onto a busy road.

But answer me this - why is it acceptable to beat a child but not an adult? Is it because, in reality, the adult would kick your ass?
pam
24 Aug 2012  #28
I was physically punished as a child, with a belt to the backside and it certainly taught me not to do the wrongs I did ever again. I can say as a fact that discipline has taught me so much good and the times where I did not fear any consequence I was not as good a person.

Physical punishment is certainly effective in that it teaches you not to do the thing wrong that you did again.It also taught me to be extremely wary around my father, who had a very short fuse.

Physical punishment serves no purpose, unless you want to instill a sense of fear into your child.
I have never hit my son because there are far more effective ways of disciplining a child. Admittedly, it is harder to reason with a toddler,but i think the key is consistency, whatever disciplinary approach is used. Stick to your guns otherwise children end up getting mixed messages. This is often easier said than done, but kids are pretty clued up and soon work out what is and what isn't acceptable behaviour.

If you have to resort to hitting a child, imo you are on the point of losing/having lost your temper.
Being physically punished might not have done you any harm WP, but every child is different.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,596
24 Aug 2012  #29
If you have to resort to hitting a child, imo you are on the point of losing/having lost your temper.

What frightens me is when people attack children in a controlled way. I can understand (just) losing your temper and whacking a child, but the ones who are calm enough to reach for the belt are psychopaths.
PlasticPole 7 | 2,649
24 Aug 2012  #30
Physical punishment is certainly effective in that it teaches you not to do the thing wrong that you did again.It also taught me to be extremely wary around my father, who had a very short fuse.
Physical punishment serves no purpose, unless you want to instill a sense of fear into your child.

That is so true. When parents hit too often, the child will become afraid of them and feel intimidated by them. The child will have a hard time communicating with them. Hitting just impedes the relationship between parents and their children.


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