You don't get it, do you? The past of the Muslim world has nothing to do with how it looks today (only in certain areas, of course). Same for Poland: if you were on the forefront of human rights in Europe 50 years ago or 500 years ago doesn't matter.
It does matter and I explained in full length why it matters - because of prejudices and stereotypes of Westerners about Poland and in smurf's case - about Catholic countries.
There is no difference between Poland and western Europe in this respect anymore.
Levi didn't write that there is. So, again - what was the point of your comment? You misunderstood him?
Here's Levi's comment:
"Very good point to remember that, Paulina. Sometimes people talk with a total unjustified tone about a traditional catholic country like Poland
, and forget that this same country was years ahead of all the "Progressive West Europe" in terms of human basic rights
Do you understand now why he wrote it?
Poland today is a traditionally Catholic country, but it also was a traditionally Catholic country in 1932.
And smurf wrote: "Sure, it wasn't so long ago that in Ireland rape couldn't be committed if it occurred within marriage. I'm pretty sure it was similar in other traditionally Catholic countries
This discussion developed because of this comment written by smurf.
What is negative about this?
I've explained how I interpreted what you wrote. And how probably Levi understood it too. If you didn't mean that then that's good, although I still don't know why you wrote that comment considering Levi didn't claim that Poland is now
at the forefront of human rights in Europe.
Stop being such a wuss, Paulina, really. Not every comment about Poland is meant negatively, not every criticism of Poland is anti-Polish. That's exactly the problem that you, some other Poles and a handful of nationalist Polonia nutters have: you take everything personal and far too serious. Jeez.
OK, TheOther, I will quote you on that next time Polonius3 or I or any other Pole will write that the over-representation of Jews among the MBP directors in 1944-1954 is a historical fact :) If you stop being such wussies and stop treating every comment about Jews and every criticism of Jews/Israel/Israelis as "Polish anti-Semitism" then I'll stop being "a wuss" too :) Because that's exactly the problem that you, some other Westerners and a handful of PF's nutters have: you take everything personal and far too serious. Jeez.
I'll tell you why its safe now...Its because all your drunks, druggies, junkies, criminals have all moved to the uk and not just yours the whole of eastern Europe
You see, another nice Westerner :)
Again, you can't speak without getting personal.
OMG xD Do I write Chinese here or something...
What's your point do you think I'm responsible for passing laws in Ireland? If so, you are mistaken.
My point is that I'm praising* your country - Ireland. Sorry for getting "personal" - I won't compliment your country ever again, I promise :))
I wrote that traditionally Catholic Ireland was ahead of Anglican England. It was a positive comment, smurf.
I wrote that because you're anti-Catholic.
You may not have read the full topic but if you do care to read it all I ever stated was that statistics are rarely as cut and dry as people think they are.
You know, smurf, somehow, on this forum, statistics are questioned only when they say something good about Poland vs the West. Meaning: Poland just can't be better in anything than the West according to Westerners here.
But I didn't take issue with what you wrote about statistics but about marital rape criminalization in Catholic countries.
"Not really"? Are you saying that I don't have the right to criticize people on this forum? Westerners have this right, but I don't? lol
it's a bit weird that you have so much hatred for foreigners who dare criticise this place we all call home.
I don't have hate for foreigners who criticise Poland. I only point out prejudices.
How TheOther put it? "Stop being such a wuss", smurf :)
You may need to read the topic again, I wasn't even criticising your precious homeland, just the way that the OP was presenting the statistics.
And I was criticising your comment about Catholic countries.
Well, how come I've found the answer?
You didn't even acknowledge that. You're welcome.
That wasn't an answer to what I was curious about. I was curious why there's such a difference between Sweden and Norway in this respect despite the fact that both are Scandinavian countries with similar culture and both traditionally Lutheran.
That Pole who lived in Sweden gave me the answer, you didn't.
That's a statement about it right there.
By "statement" I meant something like your comment about Catholic countries and marital rape: "I'm pretty sure". You accused me of being hypocritical but I didn't behave the way you did. All I wrote was that I'm curious and there's nothing wrong or prejudiced about being curious.
Anyway, any chance that you might get back on topic instead of just getting your knickers in a knot as per usual? *deep breaths, slow deep breaths
If it wasn't for your jab at Catholic countries we wouldn't be even having this conversation.
Funny that when Harry or any other Westerner is "getting his knickers in a knot as per usual" about some anti-Semitic/racist/etc. comment no Westerner (including you) is getting so patronising with him.
You lack objectivity.
If you'd like to have another full page of a off-topic rant maybe go to the off topic thread?
The moment when you write the same thing to Harry or any other Westerner when he or she will have full pages of an off-topic rant because of someone's anti-Semitic comment. OK? For the time being I'll write here, unless mods will move our discussion to the Random.
Perfectly sums up the situation.
You know, in the past when I was objecting to some unfair and generalising comments about Poles or Poland on this forum I was being called "oversensitive", "defensive", "thin-skinned" or at best I was being advised to "brush it off". There was absolutely no empathy or understanding shown by most of the Westerners here despite the fact that it was that really nasty period of PF when threads about "Polish sluts/wh0res" and God knows what esle were in abundance here.
I don't claim that "every comment about Poland is meant negatively" or that "every criticism of Poland is anti-Polish". But I do observe the patterns of behaviour of some Westerners on this forum and I make conclusions.
My conclusion was and still is: some Westerners here have a problem with Poles writing positive things about Poland or Polish history. It's as if it has to be met almost every time with retaliation - making some negative comment, digging up some dirt and there's even an example in this thread - Harry's comment about the name of the chapter in Polish law.
And look at rozumiemnic's comments on this page. Classic :)
There's also another phenomenon - writing that Poland is better in something than some Western countries or, God forbid, the UK :), is unacceptable here, at least if it's coming from a Pole.
Smurf, you think that you guys don't react when a Pole or someone else is writing, in your opinion, unfair or prejudiced comments about your countries/the West/your people? Of course that Westerners react. They're "getting their knickers in a knot", as you put it, too. I've seen it many times on this forum. You guys just aren't objective and emphatic enough to realise it, apparently.
As if no Pole living in the UK or USA would ever criticise where they live.
They do and some even did it here on PF and they were getting pretty aggressive reactions :)
If it is such a low crime society how come so many people advise you to not travel by train?
I've never been advised this - I've travelled by train quite a few times, including during nightime and nothing bad happened to me.
oh and the lock up car parks - is that because of the low crime too?
My dad's cars were always on a freely accessible car park and they were never stolen, no matter whether it was a communist "maluch" or a brand new car. I don't know, maybe it is more likely to have a car stolen in Poland than in... well... I don't know where... you probably mean the UK? :) However, perhaps Poland in general is a safer country, just as smurf wrote on page 1.
Why would you have a problem with Poland being a low crime country, roz? Would that somehow hurt you personally? Or maybe you had some terrible experiences in Poland or sth?