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Schools in Poland to strike tomorrow


Lyzko 20 | 5,987    
10 Apr 2019  #31
I've known ever so many Polish English teachers, and frankly, their English skills can be questionable to say the least!
cms neuf - | 673    
10 Apr 2019  #32
Out of interest XTIII how many kids do you have ? Same number as Rich at a guess.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
11 Apr 2019  #33
XTIII, at least don't tell where they go to school or he may sign up there and set them back a couple of years in their mental development.
Ironside 47 | 9,394    
11 Apr 2019  #34
to think Ironside and other jokers on this board make idiot references to communists

So what you problem? What would putting money into an existing system achieve? Changing the system would be great. However teachers don't want those necessary changes. They ask for monies, which tell us all we need to know. Not support for that politically motived BS.

Should fire them, change the system - win - win!
jon357 65 | 14,419    
11 Apr 2019  #35
which tell us all we need to know

That they want a decent wage.
XT111    
11 Apr 2019  #36
@jon357

it seems you dont really understand what self-learning online is.
websites are Udemy are weird? MIT also has been publishing video lectures.
if you insist that the current model of short 45 min classes where most of the time is wasted on non-relevant things is effective then youre deluded.

currently vast majority of teachers just recite whats in the textbook,
exams are often ABCD and checking answers requires almost no engagement from them.

so i will stand by my opinion, teachers in public schools, universities are useless (or rather vast majority of them)

Spot on. We have the same problem here, in the US.

i havent been in the US but considering the widespread lunacy of PC culture and identity politics gripping the country its safe to assume that education in usa is dead.
cms neuf - | 673    
  11 Apr 2019  #37
Again sir, interested to know how many children you have ? How much time you have spent at home teaching them and how many discussions you have had with your own children's teachers ?

Perhaps then we could take your views into consideration as the product of bitter experience rather than some script you are reading.

BTW This discussion is about Poland tejachers strike not the US .
delphiandomine 85 | 17,470    
11 Apr 2019  #38
exams are often ABCD and checking answers requires almost no engagement from them.

That's simply not true.

I wonder why a guest poster would magically appear to denounce teachers.
mafketis 17 | 6,721    
11 Apr 2019  #39
it seems you dont really understand what self-learning online is.

Neither do you sperg brain. Public education has many more purposes than simply teaching children things.

It's a necessary aspect of socialization (for those whose brains work normally) so that when they become adults they will be able to hold down jobs and take part in normal social relations.

Those who don't have that experience (esp through home schooling) experience social trauma and have major problems in orienting themselves in society.

How is watching videos going to teach people how to follow instructions or learn to work with and compromise with others (along with many other things that schools give children)?

autodidacts who swallow ideas in an unstructured way from weird websites

Sounds like Dirk (without the autodidact part... he's clearly not learned much).
jon357 65 | 14,419    
  11 Apr 2019  #40
websites are Udemy are weird?

Pretty well yes. Education is a complex process, far from being passive.

Those who don't have that experience ... experience social trauma and have major problems in orienting themselves in society.

Very true, and of course more besides.

currently vast majority of teachers just recite whats in the textbook,

Looks like you were/are poorly educated.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
11 Apr 2019  #41
Hey, let's be honest, beside basics in math, what did we learn that is of any value to us now? How to dissect frogs? Or where is Peru?

What I got out of Polibuda was obsolete by the time that plane landed at Kennedy a year later - tubes and transistors right with it. While in Moscow, I learned how to forge and lie, but that is another story. At least that was useful and still is but has nothing to do with the K-12 teachers and their liberal propaganda.
Lyzko 20 | 5,987    
11 Apr 2019  #42
Rich, we don't speak in numbers thus far, do we?

Math aka arithmetic is surely important, but so are language arts, above all English, soon to become an endangered species in these United States, if it hasn't already!
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
11 Apr 2019  #43
Rich, we don't speak in numbers thus far, do we?

Well, almost. The way things are going, one day I love you will be 011001001010000101.

Speech is learned first and automatically. Spelling and writing later and even that is changing to accommodate the low end of the distribution curve. Today, nobody corrects a kid because it would hurt his feelings. When I tried - lovingly - to correct a school paper written by my 8-year-old gd, I got that look from her mom that made me quickly abandon the idea.
Lyzko 20 | 5,987    
11 Apr 2019  #44
...and because (almost) nobody sees fit to correct when correction is needed, this is but one of many reasons why we are in the holy mess we're in on this planet!!!

I still feel that the correction my generation went through when we were young enough to internalize it, to heck with whether or not we "appreciated" it, made us stronger, better people. When I blithely read a 'compostion' for lack of a more fitting word, in front of the other students in Mr. Outerbridge's 9th grade English class, before I even finished, this middle-aged, coiled-spring, George C. Scott-curse to the teaching profession, slammed his fist on the desk and yelled, 'Now what the hell does that mean, son?" The average person today until eighty??

In plain Appalachian "Y'ALL CAINT TELLS 'EM NOTHIN' NO MO'"
pawian 144 | 7,546    
  13 Apr 2019  #45
What I got out of Polibuda was obsolete by the time that plane landed at Kennedy a year later

But they taught you one priceless thing - the motivation and knowledge how to learn/study. Later you used it successfully in the USA.

Today is a similar situation - a lot of stuff that schools teach now will become outdated in a few years` time. That is why students are expected to learn HOW to learn so that they can take advantage of it in their future life. A traditional school is still a good place to develop such ability.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
13 Apr 2019  #46
Agreed. But, if that's the primary objective, it takes too long because too much useless stuff is taught.
The most useful ability - the ability to see through government lies - is not. Another one - my favorite - is how to deal with police. I submit that many would find it more valuable than how to dissect frogs.
pawian 144 | 7,546    
  13 Apr 2019  #47
You say it takes too long because too much useless stuff is taught. No. When young, I also thought so when they made us study and take exams in generative grammar (Chomsky) and other stupidities on the first year. We called our uni teachers really bad names but we didn`t give up and passed everything. Later, when I became a teacher, I understood that teaching even useless things is also beneficial - it forces you to think and in result develops your intelligence.

And with developed intelligence, you will be also able to start thinking on your own - to see through government`s lies, for example. :):)

Besides, you never know what is useful or not at the time of studying - you only become aware of it with the passage of time. Doesn`t it mean we should learn everything just in case? :):)
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
  13 Apr 2019  #48
You are right if the subject here and now is K-9. Later, teaching how to think is a moot point. We already know. Now we need the tools how to survive. The last thing anyone needs is how to dissect frogs and the first what to say and what not to say when pulled over, interrogated or arrested.

Did your teachers ever teach you that?
I actually prepared an eight-question survey on the subject of constitutional rights, took it to a community college and asked ten students to respond. Their answers were 90% wrong. But I am sure that all of them were taught how to put a condom on a banana.
pawian 144 | 7,546    
13 Apr 2019  #49
last thing anyone needs is how to dissect frogs and first what to say and what not to say when pulled over, interrogated or arrested.

What are you talking about? I thought it was enough to mention you need to contact your lawyer and refuse to say anything else.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
  13 Apr 2019  #50
Is you middle name Naive? This is what you and I know. Those students gave me the answers that made my head spin.

For example. I asked: during a routine traffic pull over, when a cop tells you to step outside of your car, are you required under law to comply? They all flunked like babies.

Another one: when the cops show up at your door without an arrest warrant and say, we want to you to come with us, can you legally refuse? Same outcome.

Right now, in the US prisons, there are 40 to 100 thousand people only because they were intimidated into a false confession. It's so because the schools didn't teach them what matters.

Are the schools in Poland any better? I doubt it.
delphiandomine 85 | 17,470    
13 Apr 2019  #51
Fortunately, we don't have to fear the police in Europe, nor do we have to act like clowns when the police stop us.

Polish schools can concentrate on academia without worrying about "lockdown" or other strange American concepts.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
13 Apr 2019  #52
If you want me to laugh, try harder.
pawian 144 | 7,546    
  13 Apr 2019  #53
during a routine traffic pull over, when a cop tells you to step outside of your car, are you required under law to comply?

Funny, never have I been asked by the police to step outside of the car in Poland. Only when it rained, they requested me to join them in the police car to avoid settling some details outside.
Rich Mazur 5 | 2,581    
14 Apr 2019  #54
Funny, never have I been asked by the police to step outside of the car in Poland.

So what? Who cares about your anecdotes? How is one man's experience relevant to the discussion? Guess what, genius, I never spent a day in prison. Does that mean that I can't speak about them and have an opinion?

The question I asked: Are you required to step out or not? You gave me that evasive crap answer because you are clueless about your rights. You just don't know, which is my point.
pawian 144 | 7,546    
  14 Apr 2019  #55
Who cares about your anecdotes? How is one man's experience relevant to the discussion?

It is fully relevant in the light of your suggestion that schools teach useless stuff instead of teaching how to deal with the overinquisitive police, among others. Here you are, your own words.

polishforums.com/news/poland-schools-strike-tomorrow-84736/2/#msg1685450

In response, I mentioned my own experience with the road police to let you know that I don`t agree with the notion that schools should replace frog anatomy with police handling rules. I don`t feel it is so vital because I don`t consider my contacts with the police a problem in Poland. If I was stopped by the police frequently and abused in any way, I would certainly try to include that in my teaching. So far, I don`t see a need for that.

question I asked: Are you required to step out or not? You gave me that evasive crap answer because you are clueless about your rights.

oops, you have had a bad day today because you certainly didn`t ask me that question so I never knew I should say what I know about my rights.
jon357 65 | 14,419    
14 Apr 2019  #56
I don`t agree with the notion that schools should replace frog anatomy with police handling rules

Why doesn't every country adopt 'rich mazur's' educational policy and teach kids how to deal with cops? Rather than something useless like science.

I'm sure that next time he goes to the doctor he'll be fine about seeing one that has never 'dissected a frog' yet knows precisely what to do if he gets a speeding ticket...
cms neuf - | 673    
14 Apr 2019  #57
In most countries with good education systems the method of dealing with the police is to say yes officer and receive the appropriate paperwork and pay a fine based on camera evidence

In Russia it is obviously to stuff a wad of rubles in the breast pocket of his badly ironed jacket
mafketis 17 | 6,721    
14 Apr 2019  #58
The question I asked

was completely off topic to the subject of the thread which is the ongoing teacher strike in Poland... just go away you useless fraud
terri 1 | 1,557    
14 Apr 2019  #59
I think that the teachers' strike may turn out to be the last straw that will break the camel's back. Resident doctors went on strike (even hunger strike) last year and although they signed agreements with the Government to this day they haven't got any of the promised money. The disabled occupied Polish Parliament for a few weeks and got nothing out of it. It seems that no one is important in the country anymore except blonde, long-legged secretaries with dubious experience who currently earn 65K pln gross per month, while a teacher gets say 4K pln per month.

The Government now wants a round-table discussions about the education system generally after they have introduced changes in the last 3 years which are now proving unworkable.

The general mantra of small in stature dictators has always been: divide and conquer, because if one sector is against the other (as in this case) the public are easier to manipulate and rule. If the whole country stands as one, the current Government will not survive.
mafketis 17 | 6,721    
14 Apr 2019  #60
the education system generally after they have introduced changes in the last 3 years which are now proving unworkable

just like everyone (except pis fanatics) knew and said at the time...

PiS is all about patronage (very PRL-ish) if you're part of their base they deliver goodies, if you're not then you're sh1t out of luck...


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