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Poland marching for faith and freedom


polonius 54 | 420
27 Sep 2012  #1
Poland's media on Thursday reported that up to 200,000 demonstrators will converge on Warsaw on Saturday to march against the rurling Tusk clique. Backers of Soldiarity, which rid the world of communism, PiS, which is trying to clean up the country's

post-communist mess, and TV Trwam, teh voice of truth and common sense, will be joined by others who believe in media equality, oppose working till you die, Tuskite nepotism and oldboy rule as well as other ills afflicitng the Polish nation. Will you be there too?
TheOther 5 | 3,690
27 Sep 2012  #2
Backers of Soldiarity, which rid the world of communism

Cough, cough... :)
I'm sure that the people in Hungary, CSSR and East Germany will disagree with you. Solidarność started it (if we don't count 1956), but the work was finished by a lot more people than only the Polish.
Harry
27 Sep 2012  #3
Didn't somebody recently express some fairly strong views about non-Polish people involving themselves in Polish politics? I'm on my phone and so can't check but perhaps somebody could tell me who that was?
Wroclaw Boy
27 Sep 2012  #4
but perhaps somebody could tell me who that was?

I dont think Robins online at the moment.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #5
Didn't somebody recently express some fairly strong views about non-Polish people involving themselves in Polish politics? I'm on my phone and so can't check but perhaps somebody could tell me who that was?

I certainly can.

Aliens in Poland or anywhere else are guests and should nto try to take over. Those in Poland in refugee centres or working legally or illegally have no right to engage in Polish politics unless they acquire Polish citizenship.

Polish political circus

In other words, a bunch of bitter people who think that they should get the world without actually working for it.

I just wish to point out that the Solidarność of 2012 has nothing to do with Solidarność of 1980/1981.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #6
Invovling oneself in politics could mean joining a poltical party, speaking at or attending a political rally, standing for public office and the like. It does not mean simply observing the poltical scene and expressing one's views of it. There's a difference between participating in a march or rally from covering one.

ok
smurf 39 | 1,982
28 Sep 2012  #7
"Poland marching for freedom on Saturday"

Poland is a free country. I really really wish that the other Kaczynski brother had been on that plane.

PiS, which is trying to clean up the country's post-communist mess,

Ha! They long for the old ways, their entire economics policy is way over to the left, yet their social policy is extreme right, they're a party that don't know what to think. The blind leading the blind. Best thing that could happen to them is Chairman Jarek would step down like he promised to when he lost...how long has he been making that promise now? 6 or 8 elections? But I suppose it's better for Poland to have him as glorious leader of PiS since the silent majority wouldn't all ow the wee troll monster back into power.

TV Trwam, teh voice of truth and common sense

F*ck those c*nts, spreading their xenophobic fear and hatred, ripping off old biddies of their few shillings that they do get.
The great thing about radio maryja is that it's listenership is diminishing by the day, young people don't listen to such drivel and the old just keep getting closer to the grave. Give it 20 years and it's influence will be totally eliminated..... & good riddance and all.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #8
Or the political scene can be viewed as the crooked oldboy PO clique telling the people between the lines: if you play ball with us, give us free rein, let us force through increased retirement age and don't make too much fuss about Amber Gold, then maybe you'll get cut into the loot. Some Poles are saying of Kaczyński: Wracaj Jarku do koryta, lepszy bliźniak niż bandyta!
jon357 63 | 14,122
28 Sep 2012  #9
TV Trwam, teh voice of truth and common sense,

That's something I've never heard it called.

In other words, a bunch of bitter people who think that they should get the world without actually working for it.

I just wish to point out that the Solidarność of 2012 has nothing to do with Solidarność of 1980/1981.

Spot on.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #10
crooked oldboy PO clique

What was that about "blanket statements", Polonius?

Some Poles are saying of Kaczyński: Wracaj Jarku do koryta, lepszy bliźniak niż bandyta!

You mean the ones without education, work, etc. The polls don't lie - educated voters don't go near Kaczynski. There's a reason why he massively won among uneducated people who didn't even finish high school.

That's something I've never heard it called.

Me neither. Perhaps Polonius would like to give us some examples of where they've spoken "truth and common sense", and perhaps explain why he supports a TV station that refuses to open their accounts for public scrutiny?
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #11
Every decent economic policy must be people-orientated. It must first and foremost take into account the wellbring of the vast majority, not just the narrow interests of the upper echelons of tricky banksters and corrupt politicans.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #12
An economic policy that relies upon borrowing obscene amounts of money to "pay off" the voters is always going to lead to disaster. That's why PiS are in opposition, because we all know that they promote a spend, spend, spend economic policy to reward their voter base - who are economically unproductive.

The wellbeing of the country depends on not spending massive amounts of money that the country can't afford. Interesting that you think that Gierek's approach was the right one, however.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #13
Not spend for spending's sake. In general, frugality in spedning and lower taxes help the eocnomy, but the money transfers of foreign banks and retail chains should be taxed quite heavily. Perhaps a law should be enacted creating a minimum re-investment level, ie foeign

firms would be obliged to re-invest in Poland a set percnetage of their profits rather than channelling them all abroad. At presetn, they tend to invest only enough to keep their Poland-based operation going, but the bulk of the goodies gets sent to theri home bases.

Savings could be obtained by having state officials drive not pricey BMWs and Volvos buit less expensive vehicles half the price. In fact, all state services should use only vehicles buitl in Poland and giving jobs to Poles. The EU tries to itnerfere saying that's not competitive, so they woulkd have to offer a lower price which cars oprioduced otuside POland could not udnercut (those built in Slovakia and Hunagry might be the exception). Another important move is the confiscation of ill-gotten gains (hosues, cars, yachts, etc.) -- a perennial PiS demand. The judicial system needs cleaning up so the Judge Milewskis of this world do not bow to the telephone receiver if they think they've got a Tuskian emissary at the other end. Letting Plichta off the hook with suspended sentences or dfropping charges is downright outrageous.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #14
Not spend for spending's sake.

So you agree that spending over 50 billion zloty on totally unfunded proposals is a thoroughly bad idea?
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #15
Only if one believes high-living, luxophilic Rostowski who is not very credible in my books. His whole calculation appears to have had a single purpose: to demonstrate the 'correctness' of Tuskite policy and muzzle any criticism. Anything can be proved or disproved by juggling figures which the avergae person has no way of veryfying. And it is human history that elites in general, except those that have not lost the common touch, try to bamboozle their constituencies by every means possible.

.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #16
Only if one believes high-living, luxophilic Rostowski who is not very credible in my books.

Please illustrate to us how you think Jaroslaw Kaczynski, as leader, could fund the proposals for all these new apartments, jobs being created in educationally-backwards areas and so on. No matter what you think of Rostowski, these plans would cost a serious amount of money that the country doesn't have. I for one don't want to pay higher taxes and social insurance for a bunch of illiterate peasants from Eastern Poland - KRUS is enough of a subsidy, thank you!

Anything can be proved or disproved by juggling figures which the avergae person has no way of veryfying. And it is human history that elites in general, except those that have not lost the common touch, try to bamboozle their constituencies by every means possible.

Anyone with an ounce of common sense can see that Kaczynski is merely trying to be populist. The country doesn't have the money to pay for his plans - unless you can tell us where he intends to get the cash from?

The nurses haven't forgotten how he betrayed them.
Harry
28 Sep 2012  #17
Perhaps a law should be enacted creating a minimum re-investment level, ie foeign firms would be obliged to re-invest in Poland a set percnetage of their profits rather than channelling them all abroad.

I can tell you exactly what would happen if such a retarded law were to be introduced: foreign firms in Poland would make a profit of very close to zero. I used to work at a foreign-owned company which in the middle of December (i.e. a couple of weeks before the end of its financial year) would purchase some very very expensive software from a foreign company which was owned by the company which owned the Polish company. The software was supposedly needed in order for the Polish company to be able to operate effectively with the global systems of the parent company. The software didn't actually cost anything like as much as the Polish company paid for it: the cost was massively inflated in order to get funds back to the foreign company and get round the rules which Poland had in place at that time.

Savings could be obtained by having state officials drive not pricey BMWs and Volvos buit less expensive vehicles half the price.

You mean like that Maybach which was driven by the politician with a dog collar? BTW, you do know how much it costs to develop vehicle protection systems for new vehicles, don't you?

The EU tries to itnerfere saying that's not competitive,

I think you mean 'the EU enforces the EU law which Poland does so well out of'.

they woulkd have to offer a lower price which cars oprioduced otuside POland could not udnercut

So you want the entire Polish government to drive Dacias. What an excellent idea.

Another important move is the confiscation of ill-gotten gains (hosues, cars, yachts, etc.) -- a perennial PiS demand.

And back we come to that Maybach, or did dear Father Director buy that with money he found down the back of the sofa rather than with money extracted from the EU?
Zibi - | 336
28 Sep 2012  #18
There is actually a law on transfer prices which is meant to prevent such practices.
Harry
28 Sep 2012  #19
It was proprietary software and only a single seller of it. Another trick they used was getting consultants in from the mother country and pay them a very sizeable whack for doing very little.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #20
Another trick they used was getting consultants in from the mother country and pay them a very sizeable whack for doing very little.

Indeed. Very hard to put a price on (especially) software consultancy.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #21
What a leader of a private business, reglious order or other organisation drives may be regrettable (becuase the excess could have been spent on worthwhile charitable or social causes), but when public officials do so, they are using the taxpayer's hard-earned money. That is the difference.

Medium-sized Opels, VWs, Peugeots, Chervolets,Hyundais, Kias, etc. are also elegant looking and every bit as roomy as the pricey BMWs and Volvos at a fraction of the price, hence save the taxpayer's money. Never forget, the taxpayer is king. Wihtout them the VIPs would not be able to engage in high living and wallow in luxury. Unlike the elties who have all kinds of ways of getting out of paying their rightful share of taxes (tax shelters, trust funds, phoney exemptions and shrewd, pricey lawyers), ordinary peoplel do not.
Zibi - | 336
28 Sep 2012  #22
Another trick they used was getting consultants in from the mother country and pay them a very sizeable whack for doing very little.

T

The law stipulates you have to have specific analysis of such transactions including proof of services provided and how the prices have been arrived at, as far as I remember. Now, whether Tax Office execute the law and how, is another matter. But technically the law is there to remind everyone that they should not transgress it.
Harry
28 Sep 2012  #23
What a leader of a private business, reglious order or other organisation drives may be regrettable (becuase the excess could have been spent on worthwhile charitable or social causes), but when public officials do so, they are using the taxpayer's hard-earned money. That is the difference.

And how much tax does Father Director pay? Oh, sorry, I forgot Radio Maryja etc is tax-exempt, which is why Father Director has money to spare on things like Maybachs and helicopters.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #24
He is not a pulbic official. If he got a tax exemption he got it legally. SO you can a'onbly blame the officials that granted it to him. He didn't rob a bank.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
28 Sep 2012  #25
He didn't rob a bank.

No, he only robbed from his listeners.

Or have you chosen to conveniently forget about how they took the money "for the shipyards" only to somehow lose it mysteriously?
Harry
28 Sep 2012  #26
If he got a tax exemption he got it legally. SO you can a'onbly blame the officials that granted it to him.

There's nothing stopping him from paying tax if he chooses to. But he clearly prefers to spend the cash on things like Maybachs.

how they took the money "for the shipyards" only to somehow lose it mysteriously?

Bit of a pity that they don't have to open their books really.
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #27
I'm no rydzykologist and don't follow everything he does. If he committed a crime, she should be indicted. But re shipyards, I recall tricky Don promising the Polish people that he'd found a strategic investor for the failing yards...suppoaedly Arab capital. As with many of his promises (motorways, etc.) it turned out to be yet another a crock of BS:
Harry
28 Sep 2012  #28
As with many of his promises (motorways, etc.)

Even you must know about the Polish motorways, don't you?!
OP polonius 54 | 420
28 Sep 2012  #29
Yep, I know he reneged on hsi promise to have it all ready in tiem for the Euro. Sure, in typical Tuskite fashion he sought to shift the blame to the Chinese contractors and what not, but that's his problem and he bears full repsonsibility. You mean you still beleive the shifty-eyed PM after all his halftruths, untruths and manipulation?!?! Don't recall which, but yesterday one MP used those words to describe the government's mishandling of the molensk victims remains. Marshal of the Sejm Kopacz has a tognue as forked as the PM's. If something happens to Tusk, as second in command she will worthily carry on his tradition.
boletus 30 | 1,366
28 Sep 2012  #30
Poland's media on Thursday reported that up to 200,000 demonstrators will converge on Warsaw on Saturday to march against the rurling Tusk clique.

To do what? Agitate for going to barricades with bottles of gasoline, as this doting fool wants Poles to do, Polonius?

Statement of Jarosław Marek Rymkiewicz for the portal wPolityce.pl

Varsovians, Poles!

Join the march "Wake up Poland".

Unless you join the currently organized marches, which may change something in Poland, you will soon have to take to the streets with bottles of gasoline.

This regime needs to be changed. As soon as possible. Because the Polish State is dying. We can not allow it to die.

I repeat it once again: if you do not want to be forced to go to the barricades with the bottles of gasoline, then come now, and let us try to overthrow them in this way.


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